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carolna,
You are right in that the time for this stock and for treasure hunting companies in general has probably past. real estate is geting hot, as you said. It is tough to see what is happening in the industry though, since there are so few companies that are public. And the ones that are seem to be run by people who are not doing a good job (Is that a nice way of putting it? LOL) ORRV has no boat, no crew, no equipment and no permit. Tough to be a good stock when you have nothing. The parent of ORRV has a boat and a good captain, but a man a the helm that has been a problem for a long time. I hear he is on the way out though, which is good. And his mentor and the company they used to get into the DR is having problems too. So bad companies in a good field is the problem. Incuding ORRV, in my opinion. These companies seem strong in the beginning and then falter as time goes on. ORRV DID have a boat. they DID have a crew. they WERE diving Woman's Key. But over time they didn't find anything of value, they didn't have resources,and things went bad. the emeralds? I discount those, as I have from the beginning (And you know that, from posts in the past) They own 5.21% of a company, not of the emeralds. A company that will have bills, expenses, and problems of their own. By time the gross number becomes a net number, that 5.21% will be small, if anything. I've been proven right on that so far, and on the trial. Coast, I really DO know what I was talking about on that. So I hold out little hope here. Oh, and I'm GLAD the pump and dump is over. I know some said they were happy to see green, no matter why, but the people who came in here were only for the VERY short term, no matter what. that doesn' thelp a company, and when they leave it is normally as low or lower than when they started. In fact, if you watched the trading, although they blamed longs for holding the price down, I imagine the volume (And the sell side OF that volume) was done by THEM, not those of us warning about them. they were puymping it to get new buyers in while THEY were selling at the SAME time. that's how the game is played. I know. I used to play WITH them on a few. I wasn't part of them, but I used their pumps to try to make some money. I decided I couldn't do it, as it was too stressful plus it leaves (other) people with bad feelings for the comapny, bad new shareholders looking for ways out, and it jsut is a mess overall. I'm glad that they are not posting today, which means they are probably gone. But I digress.
As you said, I too think ORRV is done. However, if something good comes from the emeralds in the future, it could have a short term play. Enough to get some good people out I hope. As for me, although I am here, and love the industry (I was on a land treasure hunting exploration trip just last week)I only own ONE treasure hunting company stock right now. It's not ORRV. Not even Oddessey. I just own Global Marine Exploriatoin, and I can mention it because it is private and not traded (til this fall.) So it's not a company with a board even here on Ihub, since it is not public yet. But I won them, and someone should looka t owning ANY treasure hunting comapny , for the basic reasons. theones we SHOULD look at when trying it invest our hard earned dollars into a company. They ARE working on active sites with shipwrecks in the DR, they ARE funded with enough money to go for a while, they DO have a plan to SELL the items theyare bringing up, as opposed to some comapnies who held onto their treasure, and they seem (At this point) to me to be honest. A rarity in the field. that is what one should looka t before investing in ORRV too. If the comapny gets a boat, gets a crew back, gets some permits, gets some funding and starts out again, the stock would probably be higher than what it is at now, but THEN I'd be a buyer. even at the higher price. Because it has something to HOPE on. right now, they have nothing but the emeralds. Not enough (for me).
That's my thoghts on ORRV overall. And lots of other things too. Good luck to you, and the ohters here. I'll keep lurking, and I post form time ot time. PLus I posted against the pumpers. But that was agasint what they DO, not against the comapny here or the stock. If it went a little higher on green, it would have meant more people being sucked in, and then after the pumpers bailed more people hating the company, and a further fall. I'm not against the stock going up. Just not wanting ot see it for a three day period followed by a drop for the next six months! And pumpers making money off honest investors.
My babblings for the day.
trader - tell me the "merits' of this company. Please. Enlighten me.
Pump,pump, pump. Keep your pumping UP.
As for your boasts of getting so many more shares at .0003. Let's see. It's traded 24,995 dhares so far today. if you bought ALL of them, you'd have invested a total of .... $7.50. WOW. I guess you ARE cornering the market on this stock.
And as for you and the others saying a little birdie told you that good news was about to be released, or that something is up and you heard it alreadey. If it is not true, then you are just pumping. If it IS true, then you are trading ("I bought more") on information you have that is not public yet, and that is insider information and illegal. So which is it? Are you trading illegal, or just lying?
Amazing what these guys will say to try to get others to buy the stock, so they can then sell and make a profit on OTHER people's hard earned money!
Ahh. that was from two years ago. they lost most of that since then. Sorry.
Look at the news for their main boat, the Deep Scan, if I remember that name right. taken. And the crew? It shows 5 employees as of 12/2010. they left. took some stuff for payment.
take a look at some of the posts from about 6 months ago. it isn't hard, since there are more posts today than in a normal month. LOL. It talks about hat they had and what they have now. They have a small percentage of another comapny that found some emeralds. that could turn into something, but that company may have lied about the emeralds, so it is up in the air. But ORRV? they have pretty much nothing left. true. Check out the past posts and you'll see.
gotta go. Night.
Pitbull.
Others made that mistake after the other company put our a release. I think it was determined that ORR is not the same company as ORRV by some that looked into it. Same name (I don't know how that could happen) but different comnpany.
Check it out and let me know if you see it that way too.
pumping this one on numerous boards, to get as many suckers as possible...
He says buy ORRV. A treasure company. they had their boat repossessed. Their crew left for lack of payment. they TOOK the equipment, like the tanks and that, when they left. they have no office. the stock has been on the bottom about as long as a treasure ship. they have no PERMITS to dive ANY wrecks any more. Now? Now a bunch of pump and dumpers all hit the board just today. Moved it on their volume, and they are pumping it to get others into it. Can it sustain this move up? Well, since the company has NOTHING, probably not at this time. But THEY will sell out in a week and move on to the next stock. And the stock will go back down. if you buy, based on the hype they are putting into it, you are then STUCK with a stock of a comapny that has nothing going on at the moment. A treasure hunting company without a boat and without a crew. So yes, by all means, you should jump on this one FAST, as it has SOOO many reasons to go up.
The ONLY reason it might go up (And it might) is because of the PUMP and the HYPE these people are putting into it! trusting they get others into it AFTER they get into it and then cause those people to lose money to THEM.
What a way to make a living!
Don't get caught up in it, as it is too hard to figure when they will DUMP it. Ask him about the company. What he knows of it. Other than "its charts look good (Becuse we bought stock today, and before today it was trading basically zero volume)" and "It is going to the moon. get on board the momentum train NOW" That is called HYPE people. Not a reason to buy a stock! That's my humble opinion. You've been warned.
Bullish alert? Basedon what? YOur team buying today, making a dead stock have volume and go up for one day?
Yep. He says buy ORRV. A treasure company. they had their boat repossessed. Their crew left for lack of payment. they TOOK the equipment, like the tanks and that, when they left. they have no office. the stock has been on the bottom about as long as a treasure ship. they have no PERMITS to dive ANY wrecks any more. Now? Now a bunch of pump and dumpers all hit the board just today. Moved it on their volume, and they are pumping it to get others into it. Can it sustain this move up? Well, since the company has NOTHING, probably not at this time. But THEY will sell out in a week and move on to the next stock. And the stock will go back down. if you buy, based on the hype they are putting into it, you are then STUCK with a stock of a comapny that has nothing going on at the moment. A treasure hunting company without a boat and without a crew. So yes, by all means, you should jump on this one FAST, as it has SOOO many reasons to go up.
The ONLY reason it might go up (And it might) is because of the PUMP and the HYPE these people are putting into it! trusting they get others into it AFTER they get into it and then cause those people to lose money to THEM.
What a way to make a living!
Don't get caught up in it, as it is too hard to figure when they will DUMP it. Ask him about the company. What he knows of it. Other than "its charts look good (Becuse we bought stock today, and before today it was trading basically zero volume)" and "It is going to the moon. get on board the momentum train NOW" That is called HYPE people. Not a reason to buy a stock! That's my humble opinion. You've been warned.
gee, on this board he comes closer to flat out lying. "Multiple projects in the works"? NONE. they have no boat, no crew, no equipment and no permits to dive on ANY wreck.
So where are the multiple projects?
the website was updated to show OTHER people finding treasure. Some in the seas, and some on land. One thing in common though. NONE of the articles listed on the website have ANYTHING to do with ORRV. Fortunately they don't pretend they do. Just treasure finding stories for feel good, but that doesn't change the fact that their boat was repossessed, their crew left, and they have no equipment. PLus no permits.
Buy a stock if you like the company. Don't buy based on a PUMP though!
Yep. He says buy ORRV. A treasure company. they had their boat repossessed. Their crew left for lack of payment. they TOOK the equipment, like the tanks and that, when they left. they have no office. the stock has been on the bottom about as long as a treasure ship. they have no PERMITS to dive ANY wrecks any more. Now? Now a bunch of pump and dumpers all hit the board just today. Moved it on their volume, and they are pumping it to get others into it. Can it sustain this move up? Well, since the company has NOTHING, probably not at this time. But THEY will sell out in a week and move on to the next stock. And the stock will go back down. if you buy, based on the hype they are putting into it, you are then STUCK with a stock of a comapny that has nothing going on at the moment. A treasure hunting company without a boat and without a crew. So yes, by all means, you should jump on this one FAST, as it has SOOO many reasons to go up.
The ONLY reason it might go up (And it might) is because of the PUMP and the HYPE these people are putting into it! trusting they get others into it AFTER they get into it and then cause those people to lose money to THEM.
What a way to make a living!
Don't get caught up in it, as it is too hard to figure when they will DUMP it. Ask him about the company. What he knows of it. Other than "its charts look good (Becuse we bought stock today, and before today it was trading basically zero volume)" and "It is going to the moon. get on board the momentum train NOW" That is called HYPE people. Not a reason to buy a stock! That's my humble opinion. You've been warned.
Okay, once again I have to state the same thing, since it is not sinking in.
NOPE, ORRV will NOT receive 5.21% of the value of the emeralds. instead, ORRV has received 5.21% ownership in a company set up by Jay called JTR Enterprises. BIIIG difference. let me again show why.
If the Emeralds are worth $1,000 (Not a real number, I know! Just using this as a manageable and round number for illustrataion. It's minus a few zeros, but still - only an illustration) then saying ORRV will get $52.10, which is 5.21%, is wrong. Instead, that company (JTR) would have $1,000 in an asset, minus maybe $300 in expenses for the recoverery which have not been paid for yet, minus court costs and attorney fees, minus corporate expenses, minus working capital, etc. What is left over would be the net profit to the company. That might be $110 of the $1,000. ORRV would own 5.21% of THAT number, which is about $6. Instead of $52. See the difference? And when you drop $%2 to $6 and put it for the real number, it is still a huge drop. Let me show it a different way too.
Let's say you buy 5% of ORRV. You buy stock on the open market. They then get (ahem) $10 in cash. Do you get money? ANY money? Do you get 5% of that money since you own 5% of the company? No, of course not. UNless the company declares a dividend, you don't get "money". instead, you get a higher (theoretically) value on your stock, since the company has some money. the stock goes up. But the company would take that money they got and USE it to do further exploring. Shoot, in the case of ORRV, they woud use it to buy a BOAT, something considered important for a supposed treasure diving company. Or air tanks for the divers they don't have hired either. Or a side scanner (now we're getting into more sophisticated things. Let's just see if they can get a boat first!) But they would USE the money for ongoing expenses. true? Well ... JTR will do the SAME thing. Maybe with all the money, maybe with a portion of it, but I know they are not going to distribute ALL the money out. If they did, the company would no longer exist. Jay wants to continue to exist! Certain expenses, including a large attorney bill, need to be paid from any proceeds of selling any emeralds. So JTR would pay those expenses. What is left over after ALL expenses is the NET. Of the net, then would Jay give ORRV 5.21% of THAT number? Again, probably not, as they would USE that money, or a portion of it, to fund their OWN work. JTR also needs to buy things. To get organized if they want to continue to exist. As ALL corporations do. They get revenue and then they use that revenue to fund the existing businesss and expand to new business. It's how it is done.
So saying ORRV would get 5.21% of the GROSS? Not realistic in ANY way. Saying they would get 5.21% of the NET? Still not realistic. I still say that JTR keeps amost ALL the money and what is given ORRV will be low and "maybe" they distribute $1 (Of that hypothetical $1,000 they sold the emeralds for) to the owners of JTR stock, which include themselves and ORRV.
My opinion is that if things go well for Jay (Almost not a given) and to the best potential for Jay, I think ORRV gets less than .5% of the actual selling price. Because of the corporate structure I mentioned above. So if they sell for $1,000,000 (who knows. The appraiseals have said they are worthless, but then we hear they are worth a lot) then ORRV gets literally $5,000. Which is then promptly used to pay back salary owed to THEIR employees (meaning themselves) and ORRV ends with nothing left for business.
That's corporate structure reality for this specific find of emeralds.
X.
really? < I find it very interesting the ship left port on Saturday with a full complement of crew and Captain and a film crew> Wow. If that is true, that is BIG news. A few questions, if you know the answers.
If they left to go somewhere, WHERE did they go? Meaning ... does that mean the contract was renewed and they are back on one of the existing sites?? Again - if that is true that would be huge news. And you said with a captain. Was that Captain Billy? Do you know? I know he was owed a lot of money, so if he is back on board that also would be good news. Lastly, what about this film crew. Is that something DPBE is paying for, or is that something they are getting paid for?
I'd like to hear those answers, if you have them. thanks.
On that last point, I definitely agree with you. the shareholders took it the worst. Although I think many of them were arrogant in their defense of Wilf. When he lied and it was easily shown that he lied, many of these shareholders weren't objective investors, but subjective in their loyalty to Wilf. That "being married to the stock" cost them bigger losses. They would not listen to people saying things were wrong. yes, including yourself, although your attacks were more personal at times, and some investors ignored you because of that. But many of your points were correct. Shareholders would not listen though, as they had their minds made up. I see it (With someof the same investors even) on the spin off company board too, where that company has no boat, no crew, no equipment, and no hope, but they continue to hang on to what has pretty much been proven to be a lie of some OTHER company finding some emeralds. These investors are just not objective enough with their investments (IMHO)
And now it is too late, at least at DPBE. The only hope is the investor/angel buy-out that may or may not happen, but is looking less likely today than it was two weeks ago. If the contract expires, that is the final nail in the coffin, and they might as well stop trading the symbol.
Hey, on the positive side, if there are still some good shipwrecks to be had on this contract, maybe the other company that is SUCCESSFULLY diving in the DR WITh contracts from the government will get THIS contract TOO, and then we'll get to see what is under the water here. About the only positive I see.
X,
I don't know about the crew down in the DR. Might be upstanding people, might not be. I really don't know, so I have no opinionon them. The only one I know is Billy, and that is only through the board, the forum and emails. But I think he worked his butt off for us down there for years, doing his job. When Wilf made him a director, that was a mistake, and BIlly should have just stayed as the captain of the boat. That is what he says he then did when he realized that he was a director and not just the VP of diving. He says he removed himself from that position. I believe him, since his name then disappeared as a director. Guess I'm saying although I despise what WIlf has done, and got out a long time ago at a much higher price, as documented here at that time, I still support Billy. Captain BIlly, the diver who has found things for years in SPITE of WIlf.
So - I hope BIlly gets a job with that other company that has not only a great lease with the DR government but also a second sub lease down there. Yep, two of the four leases given out are being searched by the same company., and it is NOT DPBE OR Burt And they are FINDING things. Yes, I hope billy gets a job with that other firm, and can continue to dive. he can leave WIlf behind, and continue to do what he loves to do. I don't know if you know him personally or not, but he seems like the tyupe of guy one would want diving down there. Regardless of his involvement with WIlf and Wilf's issues. Just my opinion. I know POnder disagrees, and has painted a much wider brush of guilt, but I put most of that guilt on Wilf and think he manipulated people, from randy to Billy to even people on this board who support him in spite of what he has done.
Do you know if the lease expires this week? Or do you, DMike?
Congratulations Ed. Keep us updated on how the finds are coming.
Line,
Yep. I didn't know what you meant. Now i do. thanks.
It looks like that is a totally different comapny. As for the similar name., I guess that if they want to attraact attention they need a name that is close to the topic at ahnd. research for lost treasure and then recovering or salvaging it. There are a few other comapnies out there with similar names too. We just haven't heard of them. I have a few small companies. I had to research the names with the state to see if I coul duse those names. there are many similar names. As in this case.
So someone else is new on the block. I wish them well, as that could only make the entire industry look better.
Why would it be crap? I tseems like someone put the wrong name, and the new comapny is Oceanic research and Salvage, not Oceanice Research and recovery. So there is a new player on the block, just formed, with different people.
I don't see why you write "Does anyone know if there is any legal recourse if this is the case?"
??
What legal recourse? that someone new wants to enter in this business? No one new is allowed? Or the ocean is off limits to new people? Seriously, I don't know why you ask about legal recourse. On what grounds??
Line
It doesn't go to .001 after that. It will go to .0007. Why? Because the only real player on the stock is showing their lowest ask. that is .0006 right now. When that is gone, then they will show their next lowest ask, which is .0007. OTHER mm's may not have anyone on the ask until .001, but that doesn't mean anything in this case. the ask was 2 million or so at .0007, and then someone came in with that small order at .0006. So that is lower, and that became what the MM will now show.
Not saying I'm bullish or bearish and this post is not to be positive or negative on the company. Just giving information on the L2 levels and how they work. Hope that helps some.
It is late in the day. Any news from the courtroom????
scambuster.
really hate to disagree with you, but you are reading it wrong.
Yes, it says Wilf can not ... well see it here
acting as an employee, officer, director, member of an advisory board, investment adviser or depositor of, or principal underwriter for, a registered investment company or affiliated person of such investment adviser, depositor, or principal underwriter
But look again. It is NOT meaning he can not be an employee of DPBE or even raise money for DPBE. (Other paragraphs talk about that ability. Just focusing on this paragraph, since you use it incorrectly). It is definitely stating ONLY about being an employee or working with a REGISTERED INVESTMENT COMPANY, or working for an INVESTMENT ADVISER, DEPOSITOR OR PRINCIPAL UNDERWRITER.
So WIlf will not be getting a job at Merrill Lynch OR at Alex LIndale as an underwriter. That's all that means.
NOT defending Wilf, and not bullish, but still trying to at least keep the facts of that charge as they are. WIlf has been barred from working as an underwriter. the reason for that ban is because ALex. LIndale WAS acting as an underwriter. So he has been barred from that type activity in the future. That specific paragraph does not bar him from anything else, like you and ponder are implying it does.
FYI
It can't mean he is actually barred from raising money. After all - he is raising money RIGHT NOW for DPBE in London. Randy, the CEO, wouldn't let him DO that if he were truly "barred".
WOuld he?
The SEC gets the fines. Never goes to the SH if it is a fine. Only if it is a class action suit does it go (After attorneys take toomuch) to the SH.
I heard he only has to pay $1 per month or something like that. Literally. It's really stupid, since in this caes he GOT the money, and it isn't comeing from him as much as disgorging what he illegally took.
Hope that helps.
true,
Agreed.
Always appreciate your posts. Agree with some, don't on some, but that's how life is at times. HA! I also agree with your statement of "nothing is cut in stone yet and I for one will wait and see what all turns up. " As for me, I'm waiting to see while on the outside, because I feel if they lose the case OR if the case is tied up for a few more years than ORRV shall fail. Not that it can go down much more form here. But even from this price, if it goes out of business, that is a 100% loss from here. So I"m on the oustide. If they win, and it looks like ORRV will get something, I will jump in early. Early because I think there are only a FEW people who are really paying attention tothis stock, and even if it went up 400% and then I bought (Missing that 400% gain) that is still only where we were a few months ago, and that would still be a wonderful place to get in. If things fall into place, this will go a lot higher, as waiting has stated. So I'm wqilling ot jump in AFTER the fact, pay a little more for a lot less risk than currently on the table, and then ride the second and third and fourth wave of the run, instead of catching the first wave. I just think the risk is still to o high - for ME. I see discoveries made by other people, and how they do it, and they DOCUMENT it EVERY STEP of tyhe way. Looka teven our other disaster - Wilfie's company. They do all osrts of documenting on every item they bring up. ARS does the same thing. they document it all. Even OMEX and the Fisher's have documented all the finds wstep by step. yet Jay supposedly has done 80 - 100 dives and has never had an archeologist? never documented what came from where, or marked spots where things were found in any manner? It just doesn't seem "right". SO, personally, and speaking fo rme, I think something is amiss, and until some of those questions are answers OR this court case is closer to settled, I'll wait on the outside. I just sleep better at night waiting for the chance to pounce if it gets good news rather than waiting and hoping it doesn't get bad news and take my money. But I wish you good luck on this, and hope you get the return you want on it. I think IF it happens for the positive, I'll be on baord about the same price as many others on here anyway, as many bought a lot higher than it is now, but I'll catch it on the way UP instead of on the way down, and with less risk.
Blue,
"The one thing that isn't exactly correct is that your post is not mentioning it is a trial about ALLEGED fraud. Not a fraud trial"
It is ALWAYS an "alleged" crime, not a crime. Even when that lunatic shot the congresswoman here in Arizona, the trial was for the alleged shooter to go to trial. People saw him do it, video was all over showing him do it, they caught him at the scene within seconds, they tackled him right there as he did it, and yet he was the alleged shooter until he was convicted. THEN he became the shooter.
I think it is stupid, as the rights of criminals is protected so well nowadays that we can't even in the paper call him the shooter, but must use the word "alleged", but it is the way it is. So it will ALWAYS be an alleged criminal count, and they will always be alleged fraudsters, until a conviction (IF one is obtained). by the way, it is only in the last 10 - 20 years that papers and others had to start using the words alleged before a trial. there was a shooter of Ronald Reagan, a shooter of John Lennon, a shooter of MLK, and an alleged shooter of congresswoman Giffords. It's a new change in the legal system to now take what is in the court (innocent until proven guilty) and expound it in the papers and elsewhere when talking about the shooter.
Just the way the legal system goes. So I don't think you can make much of the difference between a fraud trial and an an alleged fraud trial. they are the same thing. It is a fraud trial where they are going to review and rule on the allegations of fraud. That makes it an alleged trial AND a trial both one and the same. Make sense?
No word yet from WIlf on the funding?
It is sad what is happening to this company. If we ran the company right, we could be doing SO much better than we are. yes hindsight is 20/20, but MANY people have said since the begining that we needed to sell the artifacts. WILF said we would sell them and fund our future with them. then he said they would go in the museum instead,and THAT woulkd fund us. Then they were to be sold again, but they were used for loans. And so on and so on. Just ... sad. If we sold some of the artifacts when we did our earlier divisions, we could have used that money to keep us going for future finds, and future divisions. Instead, we sit, broke, and not diving. Neb - love your pictures ... but they are no longer the truth. We are NOT bringing up that kind of treasure. Because we are not diving. We haven't for MONTHS. And Wilf recently saying that it is not only because of the finances, but the WEATHER? What an excuse THAT is! Why is a different cpompany diving then in the DR, and the weather is not affected THEM? Yes, while we say we have no money and bad weather affecting us, a competitor that is ALSO working in the DR, and on a lease we USED to own, is bringing up all SORTS of good things. While we say we have not done the division yet with the government that we were "going to do shortly" MONTHS ago, they did TWO divisions in October. one for each lease area they are on. they got old silver coins, just like we did. No mayan artifacts for them, but those haven't helped us anyway! They bought a new boat, with a blower. We sold a boat to pay expenses, and are told we can't have blowers down there. They dove almost 2/3 of all days this summer. We dove zero days. they are going to hold an open house for their new international headquarters in Florida early next year. We were evicted (sorry blue, but it is true, even without having paper that shows it as proof. The company confirmed that they were behind on payments and left the building. they didn't use the work evicted, but it amounts to the same thing)
Wilf, waht will it take for you to finally see that you are not doing things like others who are SUCCESSFUL, and CHANGE your ways or LEAVE the company and let someone more competent run the show? Oh yea, you stepped down as CEO. LOLOL. Everyone knows you are still running the show, even without the title (or the liability of the decisions you make, since the CEO is legally responsible for the decisions of a company if they commit fraud. NICE of you!)
I just saw so much potential a few years ago, and now? now I see others DOING the work, and DPBE NOT doing the work. Stranding our FINE captain (Sorry ponder. I disagree with you on this one) without pay or food, not selling the artifacts that could FUND us for a few more months, not getting the division we were supposed to get so we could fund ourselves further, and not doing this in a professional manner.
Time to move on I guess to the ones WORKING and DIVING and DOING what DPBE originally was supposed to do. Sadly, DPBE is no longer the best play in treasure hunting, even WITH the artifacts and coins we have already found (Most of which I think were given away, collaterialized or in some other way disposed of without as much benefit to the company as they should have been.) Shoot, not even the best play in the DR! Wasted potential. And now we sit ans wait for one last chance to get in the water, where we probably will have to give the majority of any profits from items found to the new investors and so even if we Do find something of value (IF we get London funding) the company won't benefit from it. We have to give the government their split, then London their split from our split. then the LP partners their split. By time you take all the toxic funding that has been put in place into account, we have to find the motherlode or we will get close to NOTHING. The little finds we keep finding? If not for the toxic funding, they could help us fund for the future. instead, if we find 20 coins (I use that because I see that other comapny just got 20 silver coins fromone of their splits this October) we end up with ... maybe ONE? I don't know what London will get (again - IF we get that money and get bck in the water) but that is probably not far from the truth. If we find the motherlode, we would be fine, but little finds would be eaten up by the previous decisions. And leave us with nothing for fuel or food. Nope, I think we are too far down the road, too much in on book and off book liabilities, and sadly in a death spiral. Just my opinion, but one I Do say sadly.
Wilf, any way to stop this spiral??
X,
Didn't capt Scooby TAKE that second picture?? I thought he took it. Or is that his hand IN the picture? Capt - are you the taker or the "takee" on that picture? Inquiring minds want to know.
I find Wilf amazing. He writes "Billy and the guys in the DR are suffering as are those of us here in the states."
Are you trying to tell me that YOU are suffering LIKE BILLY? You have left Billy with no money, no food, in a different part of the world, and no way to even buy food or diapers for his baby. Are you suffering the same as that WIlf?? I think you are insulting the crew you have ABANDONED when you try to put yourself in the same situation as they are!
"We have not been very successful at raising $ and I can tell you lots of reason for that, but the real bottom line is that times are hard. And people with money are hanging on to it with both hands"
NO, WIlf it is because you are a LIAR. As proof of that, I recently invested money in your COMPETITION down there in the DR. But NOT in DPBE, because you LIED about ME. And about DPBE and what was happening there. And about the finances. And about the timing. And about other things. Wilf, investors don't want to open their pockets up when they are LIED to. You don't see that as a reason? Why is it the other comapnies ARE getting money in these hard times, but DPBE is not? Because you have lied to people and burned bridges. I DO feel sorry for Billy AND the crew. I do NOT feel sorry for YOU. You are not in the same situation as he is, and you are there in part because of your own lies!
"But we will be in a lot better place than we are right now and with enough funds to run the company for many months." So - we are down to months now, instead of the two years you said previously from this funding? THAT is the kind of stuff I am talking about. You say things, and then it changes. Shoot Wilf, this is even BEFORE the money comes in, and ALREADY you are changing how long it will last! I repeat - THAT is why you are having trouble finding funding!
"Our crew though hurting is still loyal and we are all doing what we can to stay positive, keep ready and prepared to move as soon as we can. " really? What about those through time that have LEFT because of wages NOT paid? You may have one or a few people still loyal, but to say in general that the crew is loyal? No - the crew has turned over a time or two, due to not being paid what they were promised. And even when you GET money, you say you will pay them, and then you do NOT. Where is YOUR loyalty? OH yeah, you are having it tough there TOO. Disgusting!
Wilf - I would have a LOT more faith in DPBE if you LEFT and just let Randy and BIlly take care of business. KEEP your shares, but LEAVE the company, and take all the lies and negativity with you. that's MY opinion. WHich I have backed with funding ELSEWHERE! And I would probably buy back into DPBE if I knew you were gone.
Tired of the lies and gray areas! This is the strongest comment I have ever made about Wilf, but his actions just disgust me at times. I hope London comes through. I also hope wilf goes away!
And the ping pong ball goes back the other way again. what a tangled web this is!!
"JTR has recently provided an example of the activity which Motivation sought to guard
against, i.e. an appraisal dated December 9, 2010 [Doc. 131-8], that depicted 23 emeralds (both
rough and faceted), that were not present for inspection by Manuel Marcial on August 14, 2012.
Motivation believes there are many other such emeralds in the possession or control of Jay
Miscovich, Steve Elschlepp and others."
This part bothered me earlier, and is included hee again. I worry that Jay gave Marcial some ugly emeralds that were worthless, like Marcial said, but held back the GOOD emerlads and Marcial never appriased them. And that is a problem.
I hope Jay isn't being influenced by Steve Elschlepp to hide some emeralds form the Fishers, since Steve is (or was.. Can anyone answer that question) a project manager for ORRV. IN fact, the only two project managers for ORRV were listed as this Steve guy and then Gerry. Isn't Gerry the felon they said was a bad guy now? Are both the old preject managers for ORRV now bad guys? Does Steve or Gerry still work for ORRV? I have asked the comapny, but gotten no responses. Anyone know if EITHER of them work for ORRV?
Yes, when we see only the files by JTR filed, it looks pretty good. W ehn Ed posts a filing from the other side though, it still scares me.
ANyone have Jay's direct phone number? (YOu can PM it to me if you'd be willing ot do that, on Friday during the 1 hour free PM time if you don' thave that ability 24/7) Thanks.
Line,
Just an FYI for you. Not a positive or a negative, just information.
"but there is only 5,000 shares in between .0005 and .001. If someone just spends $2.50 to take out those shares the next ask is .001. "
Not true. The ask currently at .0008 is showing that market makers lowest ask. So it may show 5,000 at .0008. But if he has 3 million at .0009, none of that is showing, since the .0008 is lower and only HIS lowest shows at one time. If a different MM has a low ask of .001, then you see that one too, and think the amount needed to go from .0008 to .001 is only 5,000 shares, but the first MM may have lots more in betwen that is not showing.
Secondly, - and this shouldn't be this way but it is, many times they just put 5,000 up on the bid or the ask, and that means when someone wants to buy that they call that MM to say "I have a buyer at .0008. You show 5,000. I would like them. What else do you have?" and they answer "We have another 2 million at .0008". It is not showing, but since they are the ony market maker at that level anyway they know they will get called, so they hold it in their hand but not on the screen.
It only happens that way on thinner traded stocks. On the better traded stocks they are afraid to do that because someopne may call their competition and do a deal and they don't get the trade. here it can happen though.
So although level 2 helps in many ways, it is not a complete picture. the first situation occurs in all stocks, if the MM has more orders behind the first one, and the second situation only occurs in thin traded stocks like this.
Hope that helps some.
Actually, "Can you imagine if you were asked to invest in Jay prior to the find?" I would rather invest in Jay than in ORRV. ORRV scares me more than Jay does. Jay has a find. Jay has emeralds. Jay has more diving to do. ORRV? They hvae 5% Of that find, but that is ownership in Jay's company, not in the emeralds directly. I've written about it before, but not many care or want to pay attention to the reality of that differfence for ORRV. But there is nothing that says Jay will give ORRV 5% in CASH of the sales. Once JTR sells the emeralds, or some of them, that money can be used by JTR Enterprises to fund the next dives. If that happens, Jay has more money, JTR becomes a bigger company, and ORRV owns a 5% interest in stock of a good comapny. But that doesn't give ORRV any cash to do their own diving! And JTR than has expenses, which will be paid from teh sales BEFORe any is distributed tothe shareholders of JTR. You agree? IF there is a dividend to the shareholders of JTR, THEN ORRV gets 5.21% of that dividend. But there is nothing that says he HAS to give one out, as opposed to giving ORRV and the rest of the shareholders of JTR a valauble investment in his company. And ORRV? I have heard they had their boat taken for lack of payment. So they have no boat. They had their equipment taken by an ex-employee for back pay. If that is true, then they have no equipment. No crew. No boat. No equipment. they are not a company. LOTS of debts, including back pay and liens. they are hanging on to JAY'S company. Granted, that WILl give ORRV something if Jay wins. But to say they are 100% dependent upon soneone ELSE'S find, and they have no control over whether that money will be distributed to them or NOT; that is scary.
Yes, I would rather invest in Jay than ORRV. As an accredited investor that buys private placements, I'm bummed that I didn't know of Jay when he was raising money before. I might have thrown some his way, as a flyer. (But that was at the pre-find prices, not the post-find prices. now JTR is <probably> way too high to buy into as an Angel Investor/Venture Capitalist.) And you mention Blum. WOw, what a guy. I used to own a LOT of that company, but sold when I asked legitimate questions about the finances and Randy ASKED me to take it off the board, I did, and then Blum went on the radio and said I was asking about what happened to 5X the money what I actually asked about. Made my letter sound unreasonable and irrational. Randy later CALLED me to APOLOGIZE for Wilf doing that, but it was too late. I sold, for a MONTH, and the price dropped on every sale. I had over 17 million shares. Now I own a minority percentage in ANOTHER company that is working the DR with TWO leases and finding some pretty good stuff. they are not public "yet", but hopes are good for next summer or fall. So yes I am an investor in the industry, which is why I say I wish I knew of Jay's quest for financing before the find. Yes, I might have invested in Jay before he found the emeralds. But ORRV doesn't HAVE anything, and they are already public and that is scary. Not even the emerald find. Only a portion of the company that does have the emeralds. Makes me not want to be involved in their stock. yet.
Let's see what Jay does when and if he wins this thing. And if he needs another round of a raise, maybe I'll look into JTR directly at that time. LOL. I think it still might be better to own JTR than to own ORRV, in my opinion. If that is ever possible.
Yes, what "they" (ORRV) do with the proceeds will mean a lot. "Clearly, ORRV will get a significant cash infusion from this deal probably within the next year. What they plan on doing with it (is) the answer on where this stock goes. Do they get a new ship/ re purchase the old and head to the Philippines? Are they taking the money and investing it into Project X, and letting the ORRV shareholders be a more significant part of that project?"
Do YOU have any thoughts on what they should do with the money when they get it? As an informed investor, what do you think they should do, and do you have any guesses what they WILL do?
If they go to the Philipines, who would be the operations manager of that deal you think? Think they would use the Caribbean Operations manager they have, or is that guy(Steve Elchlepp) gone? I figure the latin american operations manager (Gerry Edwards) MUST be gone, since he is persona non-grata it seems. Or would Scott manage it himself? You seem to know a lot,so I ask if you have any thoughts on that.
Brez,
Sounds like ORRV owns the 5.21% stake in JTR, not scott personally. That is a good thing for shareholders here.
But was it scott who worked with Jay to do this find? Or was it an employee of ORRV that did the work.
I saw on the 60 minutes video a picture of Steve Elschlepp diving, didn't I? And Steve is (or was?) the Operations manager of ORRV for the Caribbean Operations. I see that on the ORRV press releases. But then I see that Steve is shown as the opeations manager of RS Operations. And then in post 8863 CaptEd says this same guy is the partner of Jay from JTR.
I dn't get it. This Steve Elschepp seems to be part of ORRV, part of JTR and part of RS Operations? Is he the reason ORRV owns 5.21% of the deal? If so, great. Did he bring Scott in? Does anyone know?? And who does he work for now, and which side is he on? Does he work for Jay, as Jay's partner, or does he work for ORRV, as operations manager? I know he is an intragel part of the case, but it seems he is shown as on the ORRV side, the JTR side and the RS Ops side. Anyone know?
Am I reading this right?
"Like the first grouping seen at attorney Horan’s office, this second grouping also offered no outward sign or evidence of
marine immersion. In contrast, however, to the first grouping, which as shown in the CBS documentary were all found
resting on the top layer of the sea bottom surface, Mr. Siracusa offered that he had to use the undersea scooter’s propeller
blades to fan the sea bottom, thus finding the emeralds some six to twelve inches under the top sand layer. This time
difference between their first recovery and the second coincides with the approximate amount of time, i.e. several months,
for ocean currents, wave action and storms to sink the emeralds into the sand."
So ... since those emeralds were in the water a couple of MONTHS longer than the first ones, they SANK into the sand six to twelve inches. BUT - the ones that were in the water for a few HUNDRED YEARS, were found on TOP of the sand? Those are some pretty amazing emeralds!! They stayed on top of the sand for all those years, and then when some were lifted up, the others began to sink miraculously, probably by some force to try to hide them so they wouldn't be taken also.
And this bothers me with the emeralds too.
"I picked out at random one of the rough emeralds, a piece I
calculate of about eight to ten carats, and gave it a gentle squeeze, whereupon it disintegrated into a flurry of tiny pieces"
I see it now in my head. "Your 200 emeralds are worth $200 million dollars. Oops. I mean your now 800 emeralds are worth $50 million doll ... oops. I mean your 1,500 emeralds are worth $1 million dollars. Oh nevermind, your 22,850 emeralds are all chips, and worth about $75 total." AAAUGH!
I want to blieve this story, but so many things just don't add up. Someone tell me how they were on top of the sand for all that time, and then sank 6 - 12 inches in the months that followed??
All these opinions as to what Wilf can or can not do.
Why can't one person go to the DPBE board and ASK him. He says he will answer questions. I don't know if everyone will BELIEVE him (OKay, I know some will and some will NOT believe him) but let's at least ask the question. Why not ask instead of all these guesses?
I would ask myself, but no one ever replies on the DPBE board to give passwords to new members. Probably because no one is working at the comapny right now. But I KNOW some people HERE absolutely DO have member staus there, so can't one of you ASK Wilf??
No one took my question from my last post and posted it on DPBE's site for Wilf to answer?
No one wants to know if the money raised in London is legally raised or not?? Just let it be that it is raised? (If it is. Until the money is in, it is always still not a done deal)
No one who supports this company and has access to the restricted DPBE site cares to ask if Wilf raising money for DPBE, a penny stock, is against the settlement with the SEC where Wilf promised to ... never raise money for a penny stock?
I would think this is of UTMOST importance to almost ALL shareholders. Is this going to be the saving grace for DPBE, or is this tainted money that will cause the SEC to destroy DPBE. And yes, although many don't believe a word wilf has to say, I DO want to know HIS thoughts on that. Just because the settlement seems so definite in barring him, and this seems to go against that so much. If he can confirm that it is not a problem, and say a little of why, I am going to get a lot more bullish on DPBE than I was two days ago. But I, at least for MY own DD, want to make sure there is not a problem here.
Everyone says all the time that Wilf will answer any question someone wants to ask him. NO one who has access wants to ask that question?????
I think you might be a little confused here. "For the life of me i can’t understand why ORRV isn’t acquiring and searching for investors (private or public) and getting the boats ready to go after more emeralds. Who wouldn’t be? "
1) ORRV doesn't HAVE any baots. Jay does (Although I think someone said it is being held for a repair bill?) but he IS NOT ORRV. I think many people are starting to think ORRV is Jay, and the emeralds are an ORRV find. NOt true. ORRV is a SMALL minoity owner (5%) in a company that found the emeralds.
2) ORRV doesn't even have a uarentee that they shalL EVER go after the emeralds. Yes, they own 5% of JTR. But if JTR gets the millions talked aabout, they will probably buy their OWN boats and not use anything from ORRV to find more emeralds.
Doesn't that make more sense?
You didn't think it was ORRV that found the meeralds, did you? that's what it sems like from your post ...
I have a qustions for Wilf. And since I can't post on the DPBE site, I'll ask it here. SOmeone can paste it there if you want, but i"ll ask it here.
Wilf - since you have been banned from raising money for a penny stock company ever again, by the SEC, HOW is it that you are raising this money for DPBE, a penny stock company, and not breaking your agreement with the SEC? London AND in the USA, with meetings you have today and Monday.
"Look forward to a good presentation today and two more on Monday. Life is going on, and it is hard right now for all of us but more so for those in the DR as they relie 100% on my efforts up here. Needless to say I'm very aware of the needs and we will soon have them met. "
You are admitting that the company is relyng on YOU to raise the money. You also say you are the one working with the UK people. In fact, teh CEO knows very little about the details of this money raising. So, how can you raise the money and not violate the SEC ban?
If you can answer this, I'll actually buy some shares, so i AM asking in earnest. But I don't want to buy shares if at some point here in the near future the SEC is potentially going to step in and shut the whole thing down because you are violating their settlement with you.
You say you will answer all questions. Please answer this one. thank you.
Can someone post that over there on that "funds and such" catagory in the forum, to see if this is great news, or if this is an illegal money raising event? Obviously it will make a MAJOR difference in the future of DPBE, and is part of my DD before I buy in any more shares (if I do at all).
the tack in the shoe used to work on older lie detectors. I hear it does not on the newer versions. I also hear they are VERY reliable, and "almost" impossible to beat. even professionals hvae tried and failed to beat it (Whatever that means).
I assume some can beat it, somehow, but don't think anyone involved in this cae could beat it. on either side.
Just an FYI.
butch,
Because somebody likes you? lol.
No ... seriously, sometimes trading companies put certain stocks, mostly pennies, on a restricted trading list. DPBE has hit that list for certain houses numerous times. Probably on one there at your brokerage now. You can sometimes call in and do the trade, even if you could not complete it online. Other times, you just need to do it with a different firm or not get the trade done.
Hope that helps.
"Words like; in position ... as soon as this summer and now dealing with two nations, are very interesting and informative to me as an investor" So since we are now past labor Day ... how did the "this summer" part work out?
Did ORRV do Anything this summer? Anyone know? Or was another season spent on the sidelines doing nothing, with no boat, no crew and no equipment?