Replies to post #113974 on Zeev's Turnips Talk Politics (ZTTP)

[Fred Langford]

mlsoft,

I've been meaning to ask you, since I watched the mini-series Revelations.
I've ask before why God allows Satan to exist at all, now I'm even more confused. It seems Satan's followers are 'religious' as well. What's that about?
If they were 'non believers' that would make sense. But if they are believers it makes no sense at all unless all his followers are psychopaths. Is it a church of psychopaths?
Why does God allow this 'contest' to exist at all?

Fred

[harrypothead]

edit: mlsoft, No one says Saddam was not a bad guy. But he was just one of way too many dictators, and the Iraqi people were one of many oppressed people. Our regime would like to paint Saddam as a little Hitler or Stalin but there are way too many despots like Saddam, and Saddam was not the worst. Hell, we call Saudi Arabia, Pakistan and Egypt "allies," and those regimes are every bit as bad if not worse than Saddam. Don't kid yourself, Iraq was not about liberation, and it was not a humanitarian mission. Look what's going on in Darfur.

Iran and No.Korea are damn close to being nuclear, if not already so. Iraq was chosen because they were weak. After 12 years of sanctions, Iraq was "do-able," and Cheney, Rummie and Wolfie, in their myopic war planning, really believe in the "calkwalk."

Baghdad's mayor makes threat to quit
http://edinburghnews.scotsman.com/international.cfm?id=724302005

Iraq: Baghdad's mayor condemned the capital's crumbling infrastructure and its inability to supply enough clean water, threatening to resign if more money was not provided.

Alaa Mahmoud al-Timimi said: "It's useless for any official to stay in office without the means to accomplish his job."

Kyrgyztan: Former president Askar Akayev has accused the United States of engineering his downfall in the march to expand its clout in Central Asia.

He warned the regime change could encourage Islamic radicals to overthrow secular governments in the ex-Soviet region.

[seabass]

>>>but had all the world intelligence organizations, all the world leaders, including all the democratic leaders, including all the leaders of the Clinton administration been correct, then the alternative to a preemptive attack would be to wait until after we suffered a possibly horrendous attack upon ourselves.<<<


This excuse is getting incredibly tiresome. "Everybody else thought he had the weapons so why pick on Bush"? Because.........everybody BUT Bush also had doubts with respect to the actual threat. Strong enough doubts where they could not bring themselves to support a preemptive invasion.

It's ridiculous to use the "everybody else" excuse when everybody else was trying to tell Bush his paranoia was misguided and everybody else were exactly right and Bush was wrong.

[harrypothead]

Water Plant Fire Deepens Misery in Baghdad

Friday July 1, 2005 9:46 PM
By MARIAM FAM

Associated Press Writer

BAGHDAD, Iraq (AP) - A mortar attack sparked a fire Friday that forced authorities to shut down a water plant, leaving millions of weary Baghdad residents with dry taps in 100-degree heat, Iraqi officials said.

Just a day earlier, the mayor of the capital threatened to quit because of mounting infrastructure problems - including a lack of clean drinking water.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/worldlatest/story/0,1280,-5112696,00.html

The water shortage added to the misery of Baghdad's estimated 6.5 million people, who face frequent electricity outages, erratic fuel supplies, congested traffic, diminished public services and the ever present threat of kidnappings and car bombings.
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With conditions like this, how long before Iraq erupts into full blown civil war, and what right did we have to do this in Iraq?
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Last update: July 1, 2005 at 10:00 PM
Shiite leader's top aide gunned down
Andy Mosher, Washington Post
July 2, 2005 IRAQ0702


BAGHDAD -- Gunmen assassinated the top aide to the Grand Ayatollah Ali al-Sistani, Iraq's most prominent Shiite Muslim cleric, on a street in central Baghdad on Friday, according to Iraqi security officials. The killing prompted Muslim preachers to use sermons at Friday prayer services to call for an end to violence.

Police said Kamaleddin Ghuraifi, Al-Sistani's Baghdad representative, was gunned down on his way to Friday prayers at Al-Doreen Mosque on Haifa Street, a dangerous area where Iraqi and U.S. officials say order is gradually being restored by Iraqi security forces.

http://www.startribune.com/stories/484/5487456.html

[SoxFan]

Well we may not know the truth about WMD if we like to keep our mind closed like you. Of course we know about WMD - the UN disposed of close to 95% of the WMD's through 1998 (actually by the end of 1991 with the inspectors. We were looking for 5% which was nothing compared to what was destroyed. As records were not kept they could have destroyed much more or in the time the weapons were degraded.

As for the pea shooters trying to shot our planes down PLEASE don't be stupid. Since 1991 we and the British were bombing Iraq. They have not shot 1 plane down. It was a joke!

As for Saddam having the will? Logic, which I believe you are bereft of using, flies on the face of your assumptions. Ask yourself if Saddam had these weapons why didn't he use them before? We defeated him and he never used them. I believe you have no clue about chemical and biologic weapons but are will ing to believe anything you god fearing CIC will tell you. Pathetic.