Replies to post #1394 on Zeev's Turnips Talk Politics (ZTTP)

[goodluck]

Brainlessone,
I agree that pounding on the US can go too far. It can even become ridiculous. But, so does the chest thumping that passes for patriotism, especially in the Republican Party. You asked, "Saddam started the bioweapons program in the early eighties. How did our rhetoric start him to do so?" It wasn't our "rhetoric" that helped him, it was our actions. Back in late Sept, early Oct, Senator Robert Byrd recently waved some documents at Rumsfeld in Senate hearings, saying that they showed how the US helped Saddam back in the 80s get biological and chemical weapons. Rumsfeld said he didn't know anything about them. Byrd said, well, will you do an investigation into the matter and get back to this committee on the extent of US involvement in Iraqi affairs in the 80s. Rumsfeld said yes, of course.

Now that the Republicans have control over what hearings get held in the Senate, I somehow doubt that this investigation will take place. If any investigation takes place, it will likely be a prelude to a paper shredding party, not to further hearings. And they have the nerve to say Clinton was/is a "hypocrite". Just another of the silent tragedies that the election will allow. There will be many of them, I fear.

We need someone with the courage and access of Daniel Ellsburg more than ever now.

[jbennett53]

brainlessone, You said, "I dont agree with you that being nice will help. Every time its been tried its failed. Every time not being nice has been tried it too has failed." I do not think that I have said being nice will solve our problems. We essentially totally destroyed Germany and Japan and then helped them rebuild. That seems to have worked to some degree or another depending on your perspective. Yes, greed is at the root of the world's problems and I certainly can't answer the question of that.
I may have intimated we are the cause of many of these problems we currently face but that may be misleading. A friend of my wife is dying. I would guess that the death certificate will state cardiac arrythmia as the cause of death. Will that really be the cause? The woman is 100 lbs. overweight, diabetic, has cancer and recently caught some sort of bacterial infection for which she did not seek immediate care. With her immune system weakened by chemo the infection did severe internal organ damage. If by our actions we help create the medium for an Osama to grow are we also the cause of his evil in the first place? No. What I have been trying to say is that we should live a good life attempting to do no harm and at times providing assistance to those in need.
You mention the spread of knowledge which will enable terrible weapons to be available to small groups. Is there any defense against that except a brutal police state that would make Stalin tremble? Do you want that?
Our rhetoric had nothing to do with Saddam's bioweapons programs, we and the Europeans helped him start that.
Although one can often draw parrallels by using a movie this game is much more serious and the biggest gun does not neccessaily give any guarantee of victory. I would add that in war there are no winners only degrees of losers.