Replies to post #243169 on Plastic2Oil Inc (PTOI)

[jaxstraw]

Bullshit. There is vast amounts of information available that any Processor built so far has not been proven commercially viable yet.

Every 10q and 10k has shown this to date.

Buying parts for future processors based on that is a gamble only that the company only 'hopes' will pay off.

But in JBII land where blowing millions of dollars of other peoples money is the norm it makes perfect sense to just roll the dice on a maybe.

After all, it's not like they ever actually earned any of the $55 million they have spent.

Come up with an example of a company ordering multiple car chassis when they have no idea if the engine will make it 5 miles down the road and then you have a perfect example of what JBI is doing.

[loanranger]

"With the limited information available I don't believe its fair to question fiscal responsibility in regards to purchasing parts to plan for the 4th and 5th processors. For all we know JBI is purchasing parts they're confident they'll need regardless of what happens with the 3rd processor and even if work is required these parts may be required and may take time to arrive so why not pre order to be in a ready state for additional future revenue creating processors?"

We were provided with this "limited information" in the last 10-Q:
"The kilns for the fourth and fifth processors have been completed, tested and prepared for shipment. In addition, the towers for these two processors are nearing completion, as well, with certain internal components remaining to be installed. The production data we are gathering on processor #3 is critical to decisions to be made regarding timing of assembly and implementation of these two additional processors. As previously discussed, we have an agreement with RockTenn Company to place these two processors at their location in Jacksonville, Florida."


Obviously it's not just the timing of assembly and implementation of 4&5 that are issues...it's the functionality of #3. At this point 4&5 HAVE to go SOMEWHERE because there's no place to put, or completely assemble, them in Niagara Falls. I suspect that RKT is going to need some proof that the prototype...#3...is less of an experiment than #1, then #2, turned out to be. However, the use of HTF in #3 suggests it's still in the experimental stage....there better be a handy source of the stuff near Jacksonville and it better be able to process amenably with raggertail, a feedstock that, as far as I know, has yet to climb the conveyer to #3's entryway.

[the big guy]

The difficulty with what you are saying is that that is just not the waythat these capital projects are done. I know, because I have worked on them, done Cost Control on them.

The way they are done is:
- the Engineers analyze it, including financial projections and costing out all of the equipment
- a Go/ No go decision is made
- the timing of the Go/ No Go decision is partially based on the timing of long-lead items. It can take up to a year or 2 to procure complex custom expensive items.
- if you decide to Go, ordering Long Lead items is usually one of he first thing you do. That then becomes part of the Committed Cost for the project.

Any other way IS fiscally irresponsible. I don't buy a windshield for my car because it might get smashed by a stone... that would be irresponsible of me.

The automitive sector is different. Cars are not Custom one-off items designed by an engineering supplier, like the type that supplies JBI with their big equipment tiems.

[Zorax]

"My point is that we don't know what they're buying and if the parts they're buying have already been determined to be must have parts regardless of potential design changes if there will be any design changes."

That is a valid point if only using JBII. Your use of the automotive industry analogy is totally illogical, although I understand where you're going with it. One can not compare JBII to a dynamic assembly line company whatsoever. Auto factories can not just buy some chassis and make them fit an assembly line. Doesn't work that way.

Your final comment is more correct if one thinks johny will buy tanks, piping or electrical boxes and such that would fit any p2o machine. But, the point of debate is WHY would jbii buy any new parts when #3 isn't even proven to be commercially viable yet.

The feeling here is, well we're really not sure no #3 is really going to do that great, so I gotta keep trying something else and I need to buy stuff for that. People can build cars faster than johhny can get one machine complete at the same time. The mass production part is one of the biggest lies as well. 30 days running ain't shit.