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Pink

10/25/11 7:00 PM

#13425 RE: Planopenny #13424

Agreed, this is not MM games this is a trader.
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SurgeGuy2.0

10/25/11 9:22 PM

#13428 RE: Planopenny #13424

Agreed on that one
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ForReal

10/25/11 11:46 PM

#13431 RE: Planopenny #13424

AUTO.....
If you go to www.pinksheets, you can find out about who is trading this stock. There is a market maker participant directory.
AUTO is : Automated Trading Desk Financial Services and ATDB is :
Automated Trading Desk Brokerage Services. Both are located at 11e Wall St., Mt. Pleasant S.C.
Now that we know we are dealing with a company, rather than a trader, we know that there are several things a broker dealer does in the market place. He can accumulate an inventory for himself to trade. Highly unlikely with AUTO, because Pink Sheets also tells you what these particpants are holding as market makers. AUTO has no holdings or noted interests in STTN. I also checked the brokerage arm of this company and again they hold no inventory or interests in STTN.
Now comes where you can speculate if you choose to. A trader/broker/dealer can take orders for a private investor (whether they be buy or sell) and execute those trades for that investor without showing an inventory (interest) in the stock by either the investor or the brokerage. This is how guys like Ichan raid corporations. Rumors may fly, but there is no evidence of who is accumulating stock in a company.
If you go to your L2 and copy a list of market makers, you can then go to Pink Sheets. com and look up these market participants to find out their interests (inventory and/or sales) of any particular stock they are trading in.
About 300 share trades.I hear talk of signal trades here. That is called market manipulation and if we are smart enough to figure that out, so is the SEC. Market manipulation is a big No No! What generally you are seeing is dealer to dealer trading to balance their books or to close out a market order rather than be short a hundred or three hundred shares (whatever the case may be). I have seen trades of 52 shares (for example) of stocks at .05. Sometimes MM's will get an odd lot (not full hundreds). He will then sell a full lot and needs an odd number of shares or a couple of hundred to fill out the trade. He will then go to a market maker and buy what he needs. Much like coin dealers, traders can buy from each other "wholesale" rather than "retail".
I hope this clears up some of the speculation as to what you see on L2. I was friends with a maket maker dealer in Las Vegas in the 80's, when blind pools were the rage. He pretty much laughed at all the speculation about what market makers do. If a market maker were to manipulate a stock it would be to the upside he told me. And as evidence he said to look up all the fraud cases against market makers. In every instance they ran stocks up, not down. There is no interest in a stock headed down. And again, market makers love volume. Initially, you may see some large spreads to protect themselves from momo players. But once a stock has shown that there is a true interest, that closes up. He told me that there was enough money to be made trading active stocks, without having to manipulate any. And he told me that he would not gamble his broker/dealer license for a few bucks, that could be easily made honestly. I could go on and on here, but I just want to add one more thing here that he told me.
With regard to stock manipulation, it is mostly company insiders who run up a stock to dump on unsuspecting shareholders. Insiders will generally try to get a small/failing broker dealer to help them accomplsh this. Again, he told me to research that out and I did. Traders like NITE, Etrade, etc., make their money through trade volume. Check out on Pink Sheets the dollar amount of trades these guys do. Then do the math of spread percentage (markup) between bid and ask. You will then realize what these guys do in a day. They have no reason to manipulate a stock that trades 10,000 shares a day. It isn't worth their time. Am I getting thru here? This stock needs interest to create volume and demand. That is the CEO's job. Unfortunately, many small company CEO's (entrepeneurs) are very good business men, but poor promoters in the stock market. Their field of expertise is their business and have very little knowledge of promoting their company to prospective shareholders. They are too busy promoting their company to potential customers. There is a big difference there. And generally, they are bean counters or rely on them when it comes time to choose a promoter for there stock in the market place of investors. That means they try to do it on the "cheap" and fail miserably.
So, what we have here, for us, is a small dilema. The company is busy getting customers, while we wait for shareholder interest to build. When the CEO feels the time is right to promote the stock, we can only hope he gets someone good and not just someone cheap. How long that will take to reveal itself is anyone's guess.
But be prepared to hold for a long time here (as I am) and hope for the best. It is not going to happen with a 10Q or an 8K or even a PR, but with the concentrated effort of whoever Bonar chooses to promote the stock, if and when he chooses to do so.