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downsideup

02/12/10 11:25 PM

#34461 RE: my evil twin #34458

"I do not know if the damages of having lost money in selling the stock at a loss can be separately pinned on the same perpetrator for the same criminal actions."

Civil damages and civil process... not "criminal" process ? No double jeopardy issues there in terms of the various damages caused to different parties by the same acts ?

IANAL, etc., but I think the right answer is that the same actions that violate you, that also violate me, aren't actually the "same"... as one action damages you, while another damages me, etc., and we also have different rights in interest, as we don't own the same number of shares, bought them at different times, and so have differing degrees of damage done... all just showing we are not the same...

Jimmy is probably a shareholder, too... and so was Dalton... but they can't claim they were damaged by Daic's actions in the same way that we were... given they were beneficiaries of the damage being done to others rather than the victims of it ??? Again... just pointing out we are different... and that the acts that were done to us also vary by virtue of our differences in circumstances, too. Maybe Dalton and Jimmy et al will claim they were totally ignorant of what was going on, and it was all just Drago... they were just along for the ride ? LOL!!! Right.

I think the courts try to resolve the bulk of that sort of conflict in differences in terms of a shareholder suit in favor of economy, as in others, by aggregating the damaged parties into a group or class... and defining periods of time in which the primary impacts of the acts are aggregated, etc., but, you also don't NEED to volunteer or agree to be a member of the class, and can generally proceed with a separate suit if you want to... maybe, as if you are in Texas, and it happens that I am in living in Alabama, and would rather proceed here ? Venue matters, too, still ? Still, generally, I think the economy argument works.

Guessing... ? I don't think that what the company does in opting to settle their disputes with Daic will in any way prejudice any of the separate rights of the shareholders to proceed with doing whatever it is that they find is in their best interest to pursue... where and when ever they decide to do that...

For myself... I expect I'd rather focus first on helping the new board with "putting things to rights" in the company... and help in that as well as I can. Once things do seem they are settled enough and clearly on the right track... I think it is worth looking at the separate interests that shareholders have... and that certainly is a right. If the facts presented in the course of the process reveal that the obvious facts will make them into suitable targets... I'm sure there WILL be lawyers rolling in on them, filing suits left and right... after that is made obvious.

As a current shareholder, I'd still rather consider the if, what, or when, etc., in how any pursuit of any particular individual action that might be taken, in parallel, could do more to help the process going on now, while making some timely contributions to the larger effort...

When you get to the point where the lawyers are falling all over themselves to work for free by filing class action suits... all the real work has already been done. We're not there yet.

As this does get there, I STILL don't think any of this is very likely going to escape the notice of the authorities, either. I've noted before that I'd prefer that private actions... led by the company and/or the shareholders... get first crack at them... so that damages won will go to pay those who were damaged, rather than going to pay the government for the service of providing the public the benefit of justice...

I think that too often, the "public" interest is served at the clear expense of the victims every bit as much as the criminals interest is being served at the private expense of the victims...

I don't think that means there won't be charges filed when the processes in the civil courts are wrapped up... sort of reversing the sequence of events in the OJ trial... Maybe if they'd just done the civil suit first... nobody would have bought that a dried up glove that had been soaked in blood, that didn't fit over top of another one already being worn, meant anything ?

Anyway, I'd much rather have Drago, Jimmy, Dalton, Patton et al, along with the various back benchers, each lose every dime they have in the various civil proceedings... and not go to jail... then have them be convicted and sent away, or slapped on the wrists, without their ill gotten $$$ being attached and allocated back to those who were wronged. But, that is just a preference based on my personal sense of justice... not necessarily what I think the "public" interest in justice should or will require.

I do think that the public interest will still be well enough served by a criminal case handed to the proper prosecutors after the fact, on a silver platter, as a necessary result of the various civil court processes.

I think the RICO potential is interesting, too... but, I doubt that Daic et al, Williamson et al, and DE Wine et al will have anywhere near enough money to pay for treble damages all by themselves... unless... you know... there was someone else behind the effort in obstruction, who might have even deeper pockets ?

Just another reason to proceed apace with the various private actions... rather than count on or rely on any bit of the public processes... IMO.