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ieddyi

10/06/04 3:55 PM

#71377 RE: harrypothead #71374

I just love it when the libs whine about media bias. It's not considered bias when the whole media complex , with the exception of talk radio and Fox, has given up all pretense of objectivity this election- see rather, nytimes, la times - on and on. It's not bias because the llibs are RIGHT and the 50% of the country is just too stupid to realize it.
How about PBS, which is supported by my tax dollars, whcih doesn't even make a pretense of fairness? Somehow that never gets mentioned. They don't realize that 50% of the country doesn't share their views, and theya re cutting their own throats. Fox is filling a market need, a niche that has been neglected for years. The "mind control" perpetrated by the MSM in their consistent stance against Bush, is different becuase they're RIGHT( as in correct) People that express a conservative view of the world are "easily lead". People that parrot Mccaulifs fantastic garbage are keen observers of the political landscape. I think Fox does a better job of attempting to report news objectively than the MSM. Their commentary is clearly labeled as such, where in the MSM, their approcah is more insidious as they present biased positions as fact.
Fox is not the cause of the growth of conservatism, it's a symptom of the change going on. The growth of the blogs are another sign of the impending implosion of the MSM news. They have helped hold the MSM accoountable so that the biases are becoming harder to hide

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OrangeFluffyCat

10/06/04 5:49 PM

#71417 RE: harrypothead #71374

You watch Fox News

Well actually.......
The first time I ever watched was this year.
Fox has been kicking around since the mid-80s?
I made it a long time:-)
I knew Murdoch from Australia/UK.
He was garbage press in Australia, garbage press in UK, it was a given he'd be garbage here...
I tuned in a few hours a day for a few months this year after seeing people posting, acting as though it was real. Tried to see what could possibly lead them to believe that...
I can only take so much of it, it's not like you learn anything, and it is monotonous to an extreme. You know what they are going to say before they say it, day in/day out. And if you are looking for news, or to learn something, you know it's a waste of time to be with Fox.


and clearly you know they are trying to tell people what to think. Call it "mind control," I don't know?

Murdoch has been open about it, he doesn't believe media has any obligation to be truthful, fair, balance, etc. It's a product -- to be sold to make money, not a public service, and he has no moral obligations to truth etc. Plus he is a corporatist politically, and he believes he owns Fox and it's his right to use it for his interests, damn the public interest. Catering to a political party in exchange for favors, in exchange for what's good for his pocketbook.
His ways are a good fit for Coors/Weyrich/Scaife etal/their faux-religious arm gang (the "liberal media" etc myth came from them -- most intentionally -- this is the gang that got the Fairness doctrine trashed under Reagan and stuck Limbaugh on the airwaves to start indoctrinating a generation). Convenient for him -- gives him viewers. Not that he was ever going to, but if he competed with mainstream press he was only ever going to pull a small part of them. He can only get numbers with the gang he's tied in with. It's a political fit for him, economically good for him, and he gets favors from pols for it.

Yeah, it's "mind control" to the extent the kind attracted to it have minds. The "leaders" in the gangs that make up his leadership encourage their sheep to "watch Fox/nothing else".
America reached the low point of its entire history with both Bush and Cheney appearing on tv, seperately, within the same week to "let slip" they "only watch Fox/nothing else". There's your official government stamp on the official propaganda network. They were lieing when they said it, but hey, not like that's a first, and not the point. Payback for Rupert, and another nice push to keep their minions attention where they want it.


But if ever there was a pro-FCC, anti-monopoly argument, it is Rupert Murdoch.

Yep, and the Republicans are against it.
Same as they've blocked for decades investigation of Moon, or requiring the WT to be properly registered as everyone else in the country is required to be.


The sad part is that they are succeeding in influencing thinking.

More than sad. Sick, pathetic, and fascist.


You see it here. Pro-Bushie posters reiterate Murdoch's position, and it becomes their own. Some people cannot think for themselves. Some people are easily lead.

True.
Once upon a time surprising to me.
Still is, in a sense, but I can't ignore the reality.
If it weren't so, if this were a healthy country, Bush would never have stood a chance for nomination, much less election, neither would Reagan. 2004 and mankind might as well be chiseling in stone, tooling around on the back of a dinosaur for all the real progress that's been made when you do have such a sizable percentage that falls in with the madness.


I guess it's always been that way,

To a degree yes, or we would have straighted our government out decades ago. We never would have been vulnerable to this junk. I guess we've shown our real colors.
The Coors/Weyrich/Scaife/faux-religious gang, with their avowed goal of a one-party America for all time even -- would never have gotten off the ground had we been healthy. They sprung up with the passing of Civil Rights Acts, and extending to women's rights movement. Instead of rascism and bigotry being stamped out, it put its money together, and quietly worked away, chiseling at all that it hated, moving towards making over a country that would for all time live according to its dictates. Reagan was their figurehead, Heritage and Federalist Society etc made 70% of his "policy". He was a 60s rascist himself. Random interruptions by Democrats holding office are used to harrass and obstruct whoever is in office, and spin as much demonizing propaganda as possible -- along with things like Scaife's many millions going into looking for all kinds of non-existant blah, from drugs to murder -- all a part of "demonize the party you want, and must destroy if you are to succeed in creating a one-party country" routine.
Their obstruction of policy has insured that much of what they gained in the past remained, and as we've seen, they promptly build on it with the next figurehead. Bush's affect on the courts has been outright hideous and evil, and we know what 4 more years will cause -- that's been their stated goal for decades. The've built and funded somewhere around 500 organizations to do their deeds. (And they complain about Soros:-) The "right" spends their money for fascism. The wealthy left historically puts it into medical research, education, arts, general philanthropy. They don't have the organized 100s of foundations to fight the "right". Scaife's mother was evidently disfunctional alcoholic, but she financed the cure for polio. Once upon time that family used its money for worthwhile things.


it works very well for Murdoch in the here and now. How does the hawkish age of neo/theoconservatism not end badly?

The Murdochs of the world will continue to thrive until our government is revamped. Until the neocon/right wing dies once and for all.

It can't help but end badly.
It's already been thoroughly, and soley, destructive.
We have a massive propaganda network, tv, radio, print, and the highest officeholders in the land are pumping them to the masses, and providing them political favor.
80% of the world, or so, was rooting for us, now that much is against us, and understandably so.
The goal of the neocon/right is perpetual war.
Their doctrine dictates money should be spent for those wars, and no money should be spent on any social programs, including public education. A one-party government, no environmental protection, minimal to no consumer protection, no social security, no labor protection laws, ultimately no minimum wage laws even, no civil rights on the basis of gender, nationality, race, age -- anything. Corporate rule. All part of their platform. There's no good to come from that nonsense.

The only questions are how much lower do we sink, and how much more damage is sustained, until the turn -- and what triggers the turn?

It's been a few hundred years since the American people really stood up for their existance. It takes something of that magnitude to wipe out the right once and for all. That, or an act of God.

A 60s 70s style movement only buys time.
Something has to happen that wipes out the the root of the right movement. The money, the "leaders" that galvanize the sheep to do their will in sufficient numbers. We've proven it's too much to ask that people get over themselves. Accept that people have different skin colors, different religions, genders, sexual persuasions even. We've proven we can't progress to the point we understand higher profit margins can't be bought by poisoning the land and it's people. Waiting for people to become civilized is no answer. We have to have it legislated so firmly it can't be broken by future administrations, by any movement.


God hasn't shown up to save countries, and people far worse off than we are, or will be -- even though we may well be entrenched in poverty and as oppressed as any dictatorship. Betting on that kind of thing hasn't paid off in previous generations.

It would definitely be worth the price of a ticket to see though. I don't know too many people willing to bet if he showed up tommorrow it would be to announce how pleased he is with the politicians, corporatists, warmongers, and faux-religious bigots & hypocrites that took the liberty of involving him & his crucified son in their lies, power/money games, poisoning of their own, and fiddling while millions starved on the planet.

Whatever, in the real end of what we are seeing happen to us, the American people have to come out of it with the final recognition of the truth. We were given much more than most, squandered it, and made all manner of ugliness of things. We will never again in history be able to claim any superiority --not of morality, principles, much less of governemnt and world view. It is not, never was, and never will be, America the superior. We wouldn't be what we are today if we were healthy, much less superior...

No nation, or race, was ever meant to be superior.

The good never claim to be...






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brainlessone

10/06/04 5:56 PM

#71418 RE: harrypothead #71374

why do you and others beleive in a giant conspiracy theory which has "bad values" and at the same time beleive that only your morals and judgments are sound and good.

"His is the fascists, the "haves and have mores" and the idiots. Bush gang has a whole play book centered around taking advantage of the latter. Spinning them so they think he's the opposite of what he is, and the opposition are the enemy. Never was it more clear how Germany took their historical turn.

Plain and simple, Iraq is more open to terrorists since he invaded it than before. And it will remain that way (and worse) unless we are going to park a couple million troops there for many, many years.

Bushies don't live in the real world.
Not re Iraq, or his "no child left behind" scam, or rampant pollution made legal, or smoke and mirror tax cuts, corporatist and rascist judges, the media, or anything else.
They refuse to read, study, investigate anything that doesn't parrot the line they've been sold to swallow, or that fulfills their bigotry..."