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mikeyk

12/09/08 3:01 PM

#22084 RE: brodyterrier #22082

The first round of financing involved all the naked shorting and short covering. The point mimurray was making was that somehow Raley has convinced someone to put up another $777K of financing, not due for 2 years. I agree that either this person is stupid beyond belief, or that this person knows something that we don't know, and believes the company will still be around in 2 years, and that they will be able to recover their $777K plus some profit for their investment. This simple act of financing shows that something must lie ahead for the company besides bankruptcy or going into default.
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assassin17

12/09/08 7:17 PM

#22105 RE: brodyterrier #22082

If I owned a Convertible Debenture which was freely convertible to stock I am not sure that I would agree that if I sold stock prior to converting that I would be naked shorting. That would seem to me to be more like the old "short vrs. the box"

I don't think it's anything like that. Admittedly, I hadn't heard of "short against the box" until reading your message. :) But it looks like short-vs-box is just a way for an investor to lock in their long gains but postpone their tax liabilities. It's a hedge of sorts, because every $1 lost by their long position is $1 gained by their short position (and vice versa). In other words, you hold one short position for each long position.

In contrast, the case with the naked-shorting CD holder isn't really a hedge. They're using their "long position" in the convertible note to murder the stock. Being long in the note doesn't counterbalance being short in the stock; it amplifies the hell out of it. Unlike with "short against the box", it's not a 1:1 short:long position ratio. It's more like X:1, where X is some indeterminately large number that can be increased by creating phantom shares.

This is insanely corrupt, imho, and is hardly a valid form of hedging. Hedging is supposed to protect against a stock decline. This hanky panky causes a stock decline. If the CD holder wanted to protect themself against UVSE's failure, they'd just initiate a legitimate short position. That way, if the company tanked, the note holder would recoup some of their losses via the stock.
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Dr. King Schultz

12/10/08 7:01 AM

#22110 RE: brodyterrier #22082

brody, 80% of BID, not ASK:

OK the quote is .0001 bid / .0002 ask. If you assume the price on which the conversion is based is 80% of .0002 then my $700,000 in debentures is convertible into approximately

From the last 10-Q:
"...through the issuance of shares of our common stock, based on a price per share equal to 80% of the lowest three (3) closing bid prices of the common stock over the 20 trading days immediately preceding the date of such payment."


So, if we have three closing bids of 0.0001, they convert for 0.00008.
Yesterday was the first day of 0.0001 bid close....