Replies to post #316540 on Tornado Alley (PROG)

[blackhawks]

“‘Nobel Prize in stupidity’: Trump should be removed from the WH; he's spreading anti-Semitism, hatred and stupidity,”

There, now it conforms to reality.

Goose, gander? Pot, kettle? How about flaming fucking hypocrisy and double standards?

The Hypocrisy Of Trump Saying Rep. Ilhan Omar Should Resign Over Anti-Semitism

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/trump-ilhan-omar-anti-semitism-hypocrisy_n_5c63358de4b08da0ec7fbfd1

Trump’s criticism ignores his own insensitivities to Jewish people.

He used a Jewish Star of David to call Hillary Clinton corrupt

During his 2016 campaign, Trump tweeted a blatantly anti-Semitic image featuring a picture of Hillary Clinton pasted over a backdrop of $100 bills with a six-pointed star — the Jewish Star of David — alongside her face.



Critics quickly raised alarm over the image. Using the symbol over a pile of money, they said, is blatantly anti-Semitic and reinforces hateful stereotypes of Jewish greed.

Though Trump insisted that the photo was harmless and was supposed to be seen as a sheriff’s badge not the star that Nazis forced Jews to sew onto their clothing during World War II. Some internet sleuthing by Mic revealed that the image was actually created by white supremacists and had appeared on a neo-Nazi forum shortly before Trump tweeted it.

He mocked Jews as greedy businesspeople

On the campaign trail in 2015, Trump attempted to relate to members of the Republican Jewish Coalition by invoking the stereotype of Jews as greedy, cunning businesspeople.

“I’m a negotiator, like you folks,” Trump told the crowd.

“Is there anyone who doesn’t renegotiate deals in this room?” Trump continued. “Perhaps more than any room I’ve spoken to.”

He also implied during that event that he didn’t expect to win support from the Jewish Republican group because he couldn’t be swayed by campaign donations


He hesitated to denounce white supremacy in Charlottesville

After a massive white supremacist rally in Charlottesville, Virginia, left one counter-protester dead in August 2017, Trump took more than 48 hours to denounce the violence and initially said there was an “egregious display of hatred, bigotry and violence on many sides.”

White supremacists celebrated Trump’s reaction as a victory. On The Daily Stormer, a neo-Nazi website, users wrote that “Trump comments were good” and claimed he “said he loves us all.”

Trump’s hesitant response was no surprise given how long it took him to denounce the support of his presidential candidacy by former Ku Klux Klan Grand Wizard David Duke, an admitted anti-Semite.

[hookrider]

conix:"A badly beaten Mosberg had nearly lost the will to live by the time he was liberated by American troops. “I didn’t want to leave,” he recalled. “I didn’t know where to go.” He spent months in an Italian hospital before immigrating to the US with his wife, also a survivor, in 1951. They settled in Harlem, and he eventually became a real estate developer. He still wears a camp prisoner’s uniform during lectures “so people remember,” Mosberg said."

There conix is the big deference. In today's Trump's world he would be met at the board and if he is not the right color and of the right religion, he would be told to pound sand and get the hell out. By people like you!!!

[Dale C]

Everybody wants to shock to get the most bang for their bandwidth, including Mosberg. Internment camp & concentration camp are interchangeable.

[fuagf]

conix, Your jumping on hot conservative talking points without nary a thought to even
the most minor research continues to have you looking like a sorry bumpletrumpskin.

This to complement Dale C's reply that internment camps and concentration camps have much in common ..
https://investorshub.advfn.com/boards/read_msg.aspx?message_id=149675671 .

AOC Wasn't Wrong About Concentration Camps

Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez’s remarks were intended to be inflammatory, but she usefully highlighted an important historical truth.

By Leonid Bershidsky
June 21, 2019, 10:30 PM GMT+10

https://assets.bwbx.io/images/users/iqjWHBFdfxIU/iWAMs1cwKIuU/v1/1000x-1.jpg
Did she take the analogy too far? Photographer: Saul Loeb/Getty Images

Leonid Bershidsky is Bloomberg Opinion's Europe columnist. He was the founding editor of the Russian business daily Vedomosti and founded the opinion website Slon.ru.

Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, the progressive member of the U.S. Congress, has likened ..

This administration has established concentration camps on the southern border of the United States for immigrants, where they are being brutalized with dehumanizing conditions and dying.

This is not hyperbole. It is the conclusion of expert analysis ⬇️https://t.co/2dWHxb7UuL

— Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez (@AOC) June 18, 2019

.. the U.S. government’s immigrant detention facilities on the Mexican border to concentration camps and is unapologetic ..

DHS ripped 1000s of children from their parents & put them in cages w inhumane conditions.

They call their cells “dog pounds” & “freezers.”

I will never apologize for calling these camps what they are.

If that makes you uncomfortable, fight the camps - not the nomenclature. https://t.co/eJpJWeYiot

— Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez (@AOC) June 19, 2019

.. about it even in the face of a reprimand ..

.@AOC Concentration camps assured a slave labor supply to help in the Nazi war effort, even as the brutality of life inside the camps helped assure the ultimate goal of "extermination through labor."

Learn about concentration camps https://t.co/oBPQsjf6FC#Holocaust #History pic.twitter.com/nmc9As2nlO

— Yad Vashem (@yadvashem) June 19, 2019

.. from Yad Vashem, the Holocaust research center. Her remarks were clearly meant to provoke; but were they entirely wrong? AOC, as Ocasio-Cortez is called, provides a reminder that concentration camps have been more common in history than many think.

In the modern consciousness, the term “concentration camp” is firmly linked to the Nazis. Their practice, of course, was geared toward hard labor, torture and extermination. These were often explicit goals. Comparing U.S. immigration detention to the Nazi camps would be an impossible and unconscionable stretch, as anyone who’s ever been to Nazi concentration camp sites will attest.

But as British historian Dan Stone wrote in his 2017 book, “Concentration Camps: A Short History,” “The term ‘concentration camp’, like any other concept, means different things over time.” Though the U.S. facilities have nothing in common with the Nazi camps, they share important features with other concentration camps throughout history, including – perhaps uncomfortably for socialist Ocasio-Cortez – the ones established by Lenin in post-revolutionary Russia.

The term itself is of Spanish origin, born of the effort by the Spanish colonial authorities in Cuba in 1896 and 1897 to “reconcentrate” rural workers from areas controlled by Maximo Gomez’s rebels to those under Spanish control. Some 10,000 people died in “concentration centers.” The basic idea of the early concentration camps – the Cuban ones, those set up by the U.S. in the Philippines and the ones formed by the British army in South Africa, which came to be known as “concentration camps” after 1901 – was to deprive the opposite side in a war of supplies and local support. These camps were part of scorched-earth tactics in which the suffering of local civilians – to which colonial authorities were largely indifferent – was collateral damage.

The only element of that early practice that’s similar to U.S. immigration detention is the racial aspect. The early concentration camp inmates overwhelmingly had skin of a different color than that of their tormentors. That’s not enough to justify AOC’s simile.

But then, there have been plenty of other types of concentration camps throughout history. “Concentration camps can very aptly be divided into three types corresponding to three basic Western conceptions of a life after death: Hades, Purgatory, and Hell,” Hannah Arendt, the political philosopher, wrote in “The Origins of Totalitarianism”:

---
To Hades correspond those relatively mild forms, once popular even in non-totalitarian countries, for getting undesirable elements of all sorts – refugees, stateless persons, the asocial, and the unemployed – out of the way; as DP camps, which are nothing other than camps for persons who have become superfluous and bothersome, they have survived the war. Purgatory is represented by the Soviet Union's labor camps, where neglect is combined with chaotic forced labor. Hell in the most literal sense was embodied by those types of camp perfected by the Nazis, in which the whole of life was thoroughly and systematically organized with a view to the greatest possible torment.
---

The U.S. immigration detention facilities are the Hades type of concentration camp. They are expressly designed to keep “superfluous and bothersome people,” as Arendt called them, out of the way. The conditions in them can be intensely uncomfortable .. https://www.oig.dhs.gov/sites/default/files/assets/2019-05/OIG-19-46-May19.pdf , but tormenting inmates isn’t the primary goal, and there’s certainly no hard labor.

In many important ways, the U.S. practice is similar to the displaced persons camps that emerged in Europe after World War I (and then again after World War II). In his book, Stone quotes German sociologist Klaus Muehlhahn as saying these displaced persons (DP) camps, with their suspension of the proper legal process, contributed to the conditions that “facilitated the emergence of concentration camps on the European continent.”

Like many of the DP camps, the U.S. facilities hold foreigners rather than domestic enemies. The undocumented immigrants have no right to due process, and though they are allowed to retain lawyers, many of them don’t have the money and other resources necessary to obtain help.

One can argue whether DP camps were concentration camps in the full sense of the word. Arendt, at any rate, clearly thought so. But there’s an element of the U.S. migrant detention practice that put it in the “Purgatory” category rather than the “Hades” one. It was the separation of families, which the Trump administration introduced and then had to end under intense political pressure last year. Its idea was to deter undocumented immigration, so it was essentially a hostage-taking practice: The children were held to put pressure on the adults.

Some of the first Communist concentration camps, set up under Vladimir Lenin in Russia, were created with similar ideas in mind. Lenin was one of the first politicians to use the term “concentration camp” for an ad-hoc internment facility in Europe rather than the colonies. He (and Leon Trotsky) ordered .. http://www.polithistory.ru/upload/iblock/e40/e40b8027adbc9ab6e984144d280b1b88.pdf .. the camps set up as part of the traditional scorched-earth tactic during the Russian civil war which followed the 1917 revolution. But there was a peculiarly Bolshevik twist to the practice. Some 10% of the inmates were hostages, including the family members of active adversaries – and even of officers and professionals who had gone over to the Bolshevik side, to prevent them from engaging in sabotage.

While the U.S. family separation policy was scrapped, it's still unclear how many families it affected and whether they’ve all been reunited. That remaining uncertainty takes the U.S. practice under Donald Trump beyond Hades territory and into Purgatory. The use of family separation as an immigration deterrent is what makes AOC’s concentration camp remarks largely justified rather than merely speculative.

Whether or not AOC is familiar with this history, she certainly knew exactly the power her words held; if it were not for the Nazis, the very term “concentration camp” would not fill us with quite the same horror. But there’s no need to be as evil as the Nazis to go down in concentration camp history. Several U.S. administrations have gone down this inglorious road, but Trump’s may have crossed an important line, and AOC was right to call it out.

https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2019-06-21/aoc-wasn-t-wrong-about-concentration-camps

So there you have a concrete (apologies to the interned children) tie to the animal you voted for and the authoritarian Lenin.

[fuagf]

conix, excerpt - Because the victims were children, however, it was easy to ignore one reality: New as all this may have seemed, it actually wasn’t. Dehumanized, traumatized, and scared, those children—their predicament—shocked many Americans who insisted, along with former first lady Laura Bush, that this was truly un-American. As she wrote in The Washington Post:

---
Americans pride ourselves on being a moral nation, on being the nation that sends humanitarian relief to places devastated by natural disasters or famine or war. We pride ourselves on believing that people should be seen for the content of their character, not the color of their skin. We pride ourselves on acceptance. If we are truly that country, then it is our obligation to reunite these detained children with their parents—and to stop separating parents and children in the first place.
---

Her essay essentially asked one question: Who have we become? Former CIA director Michael Hayden, tweeting out a picture of the Birkenau concentration camp over the words “Other governments have separated women and children,” suggested an answer: We were planting the seeds that could make us the new Nazi Germany.

Out of - Trump’s Border: Gitmo for Kids
https://investorshub.advfn.com/boards/read_msg.aspx?message_id=149680720

You have been told before, a number of times, that you shouldn't post anything from that Murdoch rag without researching it first.