len, re: LTFD and "wasting your time" on them, one of my favorite books is 'one up on wall street' by peter lynch. in it he has an entire chapter about how much he likes companies that do boring and mundane things, but do them profitably. i've been accumulating a good sized chunk of LTFD the last month and it's one of my favorite stocks, the fact that they do bingo to me isn't a concern. to me, LTFD offers a good combination of growth and value and i really like their prospects the next few years. we'll see how it goes.