auroradude, I was just getting caught up on posts and saw yours about "ALL THINGS - follow some sort of organized patterns." I agree, and have taken some interest in that philosophy. Sorry if you have covered this before, but I am the new guy here. http://mathforum.org/dr.math/faq/faq.golden.ratio.html upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/6/6b/Mona_Lisa_Golden_Ratio.jpg http://www.mathsisfun.com/numbers/images/parthenon-golden-ratio.jpg jwilson.coe.uga.edu/emt668/emt668.student.folders/meredith/meredith/goldenratio/goldenspiral.gif blog.world-mysteries.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/nautilus_spiral.jpg Its a great topic to discuss. IMO and FWIW.