The Free Zone Board

[QuasimodoJones]

MEME re: gun control

The only difference that I see is that the sole intent of gun ownership is to shoot something or someone. While a car can injure or kill, the primary intent {of ownership) is transportation.

I have to agree with what WEAC has already said to at least some degree: you're splitting a mighty fine hair, here. In any event, I can assure you that that sole "intent" of gun ownership is NOT to shoot something or someone. For several years (until the police burst in, pointed machines guns at me, and took them) I owned a Beretta Model 92 and a Charter Arms .38 Police Undercover for home and self defense. Except for using the .38 for qualifying for a concealed-carry permit, I never fired it. I never fired the Beretta at all. Just didn't have the opportunity arise to get somewhere out in the country to try it out. (However, I was confident that it would have fired if I had needed it to, which is why it stayed on the table next to my bed).

However, Dennis, I also would not go so far as to say that a gun's legal reason for being is self-defense. Guns are used legally for sport and for hunting, and, yes, also for killing people.

Well, naturally sporting and hunting can be included, but I really didn't think I needed to be quite that punctilious with you. You can shoot cans, or deer, or someone trying to harm you or someone else, and that -- without a doubt -- is a firearm's primary legal reason for being.

Geez, guys, you both saw my photos on PI ALT. Didn't either of you notice the enormous German Shepard? Dogs like him have discouraged home-invaders far more than guns ever have. Statistics show that homes with dogs are avoided by criminals.

You bet I saw your photos -- however, dear Lady, I also made note that Kaiser, your German Shepherd had passed away about two years ago. I know how, when a beloved pet dies, there's a certain period of mourning when the thought of getting a replacement for a family member who's essentially irreplaceable is really unthinkable -- but when you're relying on that family member to be your first and only real line of defense against attack, I'm afraid the minimum should be the maximum. Your assertion that dogs have discouraged more home-invaders than guns is, I'm afraid, just that. You have some real statistics, or is that just an intuition?

When I was faced with home invasion, it wasn't just by one guy, but two. You might be surprised just how rapidly even a loyal Shepherd can be dispatched with a club, or a can of Mace, or a gun for that matter, by Assailant 'A' while 'B' strides right past.

Further, a dog shouts a warning for both your family and the intruder, but intruders don't know ahead of time if you have a gun.

Only, Meme, ya know whut? Once the dog is dispatched, that's the end of your warning AND your significant means of defense. And the fact that intruders don't know ahead of time if you have a gun happens to be what works in your favor. Also, ask yourself if, over the years, each time the dog suddenly started to bark in warning, did it turn out to really be justified, or did it turn out to be a false alarm -- and you've become possibly complacent because of that?

Gun ownership doesn't discourage invaders from the attempt, a Shepard quickly will.

Again, you've made an unsupported assertion based only on what "seems" a logical conclusion to you. I personally think the decisive factor is: just how determined are the attackers to get at you and what they think you have that they want? A dog may make a home invader plan more carefully, but that doesn't necessarily mean they'll be dissuaded. The sight of a firearm, as demonstrated by statistics, definitely does, and is often the only thing necessary, even without being used:

http://www.guncite.com/gun_control_gcdgeff.html

Nor do you have to worry about hiding your Shepard from your children, finding bullets to load him, all the while trying to keep it ready in case of an unknown time of assault.

Well, a lot of your argument depends on how well you know and train your dog as opposed to how well you know and train your child{ren} about guns. You don't have to feed your gun every day, take it to the vet, license it every year or so, worry about it biting a stranger who happens to stray on your property, etc.

My next door neighbor owns a gun. You wouldn't believe how many times he's told me how thrilled he was to have our German Shepard patrolling the grounds. He said, nobody's going to mess with our homes, and in 20 years nobody ever has.

YET. "Nobody's gonna mess with our homes..." After what's happened, don't those words sound just a little hollow?

However, his gun ownership doesn't make me feel any safer. He's a nice enough guy, but a major drunk. <VBG>

A nasty drunk, or a happy drunk? It could make a lot of difference. However, I'd just like to point out that, gun or not, when he gets into his car to drive away drunk, he's still armed...