Thursday, February 15, 2007 10:32:23 AM
Re: I think the new santa rosa will be a very good platform - no
question, but all the "new" features you listed could be done
on a AMD book too. 11n Wireless - from the major players Intel
is nearly the last which supports this spec. So you could buy
it for AMD already if the OEMs wanted - e.g. via Broadcom.
The Robson NAND disk cache will imho be a very good feature,
but again, I really don't know, why AMD books couldn't have
this too?
My impression is that Intel is slightly ahead in delivering these technologies in volume. This is part of their work in improving the platform as a whole. While this has an eventual consequence of "rising all boats" (in other words, giving AMD the ability to leverage Intel's work eventually), there is no question that Intel will be first to market with things like Robson disk cache. As for 802.11n, some stories that I have read suggest that Intel has reached this milestone before competitors such as Broadcom. While Broadcom has often pushed technology before it is "ready" (they conform to draft specs, for instance), I have been led to believe that Intel is in the lead in having the final draft spec.
Re: What I wanted to say here is, that the differen-
tiation possibilities for Intel getting smaller and smaller.
In the past it was weight or screen size or possible OS or
battery choice (time), but now you could buy AMD books with
nearly all features which we all could buy for Intel. You will
have a greater choice for Intel books, thats very clear and
thats good for Intel, but the great benefits from the past
are mainly gone. I think you have to agree here.
I think you are confusing "diminished" with "gone". I think Intel needs to continue pushing towards smaller form factors and leveraging their performance/watt capabilities, because AMD is certainly capable of catching up. Today, I don't think Turion laptops come close to performance/watt of today's Napa64 laptops, let alone the upcoming Santa Rosa.
Re: Second, you
mentioned the EE for Notebooks. When I talk about new AMD
products I focus only to products with 35W TDP, the main
choice for the modern form factors - in the end, AMD could
also rise the BIN, if they could rise TDP too. So this "bene-
fit" is not a Intel only one ... In the end, we compare now
2,33G Merom with a 2,2G X2. Intel will rise to 2,4G this year,
(35W) and I see the possibility that AMD goes beyond this.
There's a lot of speculation in this statement. Intel is only on their very first bin of Conroe micro-architecture. AMD is not the only company capable of ramping frequency on a given process.
Re: We could now discuss the end-user performance, but thats not
the key message from me, the message is clear, the existing
Intel lead gets smaller and if the 65nm AMD process makes
good progress (nobodys from outside knows this), it COULD be,
that we equal Intel in performance.
Well, if Intel stands still and AMD moves forward, then they will catch up. This statement is obvious. But as I said earlier, Intel will not be standing still. They will further their lead with Santa Rosa, which offers new frequency bins as well as higher IPC (through the faster FSB). It also offers more compelling features at the platform level. AMD may be moving forward, but will they move fast enough to surpass Santa Rosa? I think they will need their new micro-architecture to touch Santa Rosa in performance/watt. I don't think any Brisbane derivatives will improve AMD's performance/watt all that much.
Re: Keep in mind, that AMDs new IGPs are very
good, especially when you look at the TDP. Look at the Intel
90nm chipset side and you will notice, that Intel has a "pro-
blem"
Actually, the current reviews have shown Intel's integrated graphics to be on par with ATI's and nVidia's. Many are also expecting Intel to improve performance through driver upgrades to enable features that have been turned off due to late validation issues. I don't think Intel will have a problem competing in integrated graphics.
question, but all the "new" features you listed could be done
on a AMD book too. 11n Wireless - from the major players Intel
is nearly the last which supports this spec. So you could buy
it for AMD already if the OEMs wanted - e.g. via Broadcom.
The Robson NAND disk cache will imho be a very good feature,
but again, I really don't know, why AMD books couldn't have
this too?
My impression is that Intel is slightly ahead in delivering these technologies in volume. This is part of their work in improving the platform as a whole. While this has an eventual consequence of "rising all boats" (in other words, giving AMD the ability to leverage Intel's work eventually), there is no question that Intel will be first to market with things like Robson disk cache. As for 802.11n, some stories that I have read suggest that Intel has reached this milestone before competitors such as Broadcom. While Broadcom has often pushed technology before it is "ready" (they conform to draft specs, for instance), I have been led to believe that Intel is in the lead in having the final draft spec.
Re: What I wanted to say here is, that the differen-
tiation possibilities for Intel getting smaller and smaller.
In the past it was weight or screen size or possible OS or
battery choice (time), but now you could buy AMD books with
nearly all features which we all could buy for Intel. You will
have a greater choice for Intel books, thats very clear and
thats good for Intel, but the great benefits from the past
are mainly gone. I think you have to agree here.
I think you are confusing "diminished" with "gone". I think Intel needs to continue pushing towards smaller form factors and leveraging their performance/watt capabilities, because AMD is certainly capable of catching up. Today, I don't think Turion laptops come close to performance/watt of today's Napa64 laptops, let alone the upcoming Santa Rosa.
Re: Second, you
mentioned the EE for Notebooks. When I talk about new AMD
products I focus only to products with 35W TDP, the main
choice for the modern form factors - in the end, AMD could
also rise the BIN, if they could rise TDP too. So this "bene-
fit" is not a Intel only one ... In the end, we compare now
2,33G Merom with a 2,2G X2. Intel will rise to 2,4G this year,
(35W) and I see the possibility that AMD goes beyond this.
There's a lot of speculation in this statement. Intel is only on their very first bin of Conroe micro-architecture. AMD is not the only company capable of ramping frequency on a given process.
Re: We could now discuss the end-user performance, but thats not
the key message from me, the message is clear, the existing
Intel lead gets smaller and if the 65nm AMD process makes
good progress (nobodys from outside knows this), it COULD be,
that we equal Intel in performance.
Well, if Intel stands still and AMD moves forward, then they will catch up. This statement is obvious. But as I said earlier, Intel will not be standing still. They will further their lead with Santa Rosa, which offers new frequency bins as well as higher IPC (through the faster FSB). It also offers more compelling features at the platform level. AMD may be moving forward, but will they move fast enough to surpass Santa Rosa? I think they will need their new micro-architecture to touch Santa Rosa in performance/watt. I don't think any Brisbane derivatives will improve AMD's performance/watt all that much.
Re: Keep in mind, that AMDs new IGPs are very
good, especially when you look at the TDP. Look at the Intel
90nm chipset side and you will notice, that Intel has a "pro-
blem"
Actually, the current reviews have shown Intel's integrated graphics to be on par with ATI's and nVidia's. Many are also expecting Intel to improve performance through driver upgrades to enable features that have been turned off due to late validation issues. I don't think Intel will have a problem competing in integrated graphics.
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