this is his master plan. now he has alot of used cars to help deliver all the pizzas he plans to sell.lol

yes i would like that too but if he is out looking at used car companies to merge with how much time do you think he is spending working on adding franchises and other expansion companies.
So are we invested in a venture capital fund or a pizza retailer?

yea when i read it the entire company and story just screams "Boiler Room". NO one expects this thing to fly overnight but atleast put somethings in place to grow over the next couple years. A New Jersey company buys this canadian pizza company and now the CEO is merging with used car company? A serious explanation from Deros is needed before everyone i know dumps all there shares.

Kuwl-- you follow this much more then most so i have a question for you. Why in the world would a pizza company who is allegedly in the process of bottling pizza for Walmart, looking to expand franchises into the US, and open additional locations merge with a used car company. This makes absolutely no sense. If they need capital they would get it from an investor or from a selling additional shares.

Has anyone contacted Deros to see why this occured and what is his plan?

if you think something leaked on a 10% increase you are clearly clueless.
A leak would be at minimum a 1000% increase with a halt.

this is worthless. it is talking about an employee overtime lawsuit. this has nothing to do with the case. There are prolly around 25-30 lawsuits on various things. the only ones we care about are deleware, texas and dc. the rest mean nothing.

register your shares. Dont rely on your broker. this is completely seperate..

very easy and simple. they are trying to determine how many shares are being held. This may eventually become a shareholder lawsuit so your information will be useful to the group. If you have extra cash to pledge if this is needed do so but if not just fill out this information.



http://wamuequitygroup.org/index.php

very ironic considering FBRC has been buying up lots of shares with NITE. I always see them on level two and here it seems like they feel it will take time but that JPM is going to be paying a lot more then they thought. Of course some of this is losses attributed to the mortgage assets they bought but the rest if they are going to pay up for the assets they stole.

i read that the liabilites dropped signifacantly. I am pretty sure they won the liability case against IRS and 10b owed in taxes or soemthing like that. I can dig further when time allows.

I feel either they get a fair settlement and sell or emerge and conduct business as a new entity. I just dont see them going away quietly like you suggest. You like many know alot of facts in the case. I dont understand how you can appear so knowledgable and think there will not be some kind of settlement. NO judge is going to rule with JPM or the FDIC in this case especially since many of the facts are clear as day.
The only question is that is the settlement in 3 months or 5 years IMO.

we need soem buys at the ask. .01 is so cheap on this stock. thats crazy.

yes but this lawsuit is from american insurance group as the plantiff. dont really understand all the suits but this one is clearly not from Wamus lawyers.

maybe someone with law background can interpret this a little better

wamuq buy some..

steph-----
this is a lottery ticket with good odds for everyone. There is abolsutely no guarantee of any kind of settlement here. The WAMUQ shares could very much be worth nothing one day.

There is a lot of optimism around this board and others and it is well received. The facts are laid out and are strongly in WAMU's favor. I have studies everything written and asked lawyers for several interpretations. WE HAVE AN excellent case here and the best legal team going.

It is up to the great legal team to fight it out. Everyone hopes that JPM will accept defeat and step up and settle on a price to acquire all of us but who knows. this could happen any day , week, month or this process could take 5-7 years. No one knows. I am heavily invested here, much more then most but it is money i can afford to lose. I dont want people thinking this is automatic riches cause its not.... Bet with what you can afford to lose and we will all celebrate when we get a favorable outcome.

My personal opinion is i see this between $8-32 a share.. My time frame is early quarter 2010.. These are just my personal guesses.

Where can i find a statement that TPG converted there preferreds to commons? People keep mentioning this and i have been looking for it.

especially when direct players of this case are probably invested in the funds which indirectly puts money in there pocket with less people knowing about it...

GO WAMU....

the biggest difference on the surface between WAMU and Lehman is the enormous debt levels Lehman has. It could take many years to figure it out and some estimate it at 100b. If it is that high there will be little to nothing left over regardless of a settlement outcome.

WAMU has much less debt and a real case here. They are both risky as there is no certain outcome in either but i would bet much more on Wamu then lehman for sure..

WAMU is going to get paid..

serious question for people who know alot about the current situation.

Here is a document about the whole situation from WIKIpedia.iscusses that Washington Mutual has an IRS tax liability of over 12 billion. they asked for some relief but who knows if this was granted. It is hard to determine exactly how many liabilites they have which is incredibly important. Even if there is a settlement -- How are we to know how big of a settlement is needed to pay off debt and all these other intangibles.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Washington_Mutual

billiam one question.

thanks for taking teh time out to post that. very helpful.

You subtracted out 11b for other classes of stock.

In this calculation you are assuming no other liabilites for the company? Is there a way to find out the exact number of liabilites. What is owed to creditors, bond holders etc//

So if there is a settlement i imagine commons are last to be paid but was wondering how much is needed in the settlement to net out to the commons this amount.

Sorry if this is not a good question but i am confused./

GO WAMU

Bloomberg News

Buildings are reflected in the window of a Washington Mutual ATM in New York in September.
But at least part of the deal is getting a second look, as Delaware Judge Mary Walrath on Friday granted a motion from the thrift’s parent, Washington Mutual Inc., to examine J.P. Morgan’s books.

At issue is $4 billion of depository accounts at the holding company that both J.P. Morgan and WaMu Inc. claim ownership of. In court documents, J.P. Morgan said it assumed that when it bought WaMu from the FDIC, it took on all the thrift’s assets and liabilities. (It acquired more than $180 billion of deposits in the deal.) J.P. Morgan “expressly assumes…and agrees to pay, perform, and discharge, all of the liabilities of [Washington Mutual Bank]…including the Assumed Deposits…,” court documents stated.

WaMu attorneys said “the Deposits were property of the Debtors estates” and “would be used to fund distributions to creditors.”

The brouhaha is somewhat reminiscent of the recent Lehman Brothers attempt to revisit its September sale of assets to Barclays, which Deal Journal wrote about here. There a judge agreed to allow Lehman to probe Barclays books, saying the extraordinary speed of the deal, days after Lehman failed, warranted review. “It’s conceivable mistakes were made. The notion that there may have been a misunderstanding or even an innocent misrepresentation, as opposed to a willful one, is entirely possible” that the speed of the September sale of the Lehman operations out of bankruptcy-court proceedings, the judge ruled. (The FDIC sold WaMu within a day after seizing the assets.)

In the granting the WaMu motion, Judge Walrath said that giving WaMu Inc. access to J.P. Morgan documents was appropriate because the examinations would be “discovering assets, examining transactions and determining whether wrongdoing has occurred.” The judge also said “JP Morgan had misapplied the pending proceeding rule since WaMu’s motion did not seek evidence related to the bank’s adversary proceeding.” (WaMu previously sued the FDIC for selling the WaMu assets its seized in September too cheaply to J.P. Morgan.)

Tax refunds, intellectual property and contractual rights, assets associated with the old Washington Mutual, push the total value at stake to more than $10 billion, according to an attorney for WaMu. “WaMu will be left with nothing to pay off the creditors if the dispute is not properly settled,” said Rafael X. Zahralddin-Aravena, attorney from Elliott Greenleaf, which is representing WaMu. “The grant allows us to investigate further.”

J.P. Morgan’s attorneys couldn’t be reached for comment.

J.P. Morgan over the weekend filed a motion for reconsideration, according to people familiar with the matter. WaMu plans to respond to the motion in the coming weeks. J.P. Morgan also said in last Wednesday’s hearing that it planned to file an Interlocutory Appeal to ask the court to allow the issue to be heard by a higher court.

this is very important to know if there is a lot of debt that people are not accounting for. Can someone with financial know take a look at the proper docs and give an exact calcualtion sometime this weekend. if there is 20b that needs to be paid out this make this stock far less interesting. not saying to dump it but there needs to be a large settlemetn for commons to see anything if this is the case.

thanks

question

In your calculations you are only counting the comon shares. What about the prefereds and the other liabilites?

Just curious and thanks for the effort.

one of the best news articles i have seen written on this subject.

http://www.kvi.com/younews/60792647.html

go WAMU.. justice needs to be served..

the 4b people keep mentioning.

i hope people realize that at chap 11 filing the company listed 8 billion in debt. the first 8 billion recivered goes to pay this off. if there is money left over it goes down the chain. so even if JPM forfeits the 4billion deposit , there is very small chance any trickles down to shareholders especially commons.

i was happy to be able to buy another 50k at .25

this is not for the faint at heart and not for everyone.

who knows exactly what is happening. lots of speculation.

it could be nothing. it could be manipulating the market to get people to sell ahead of a deal. it could be yesterdays run up was false information leak..

everyone can speculate. yesterday was good but today sucks.. we are in this for the deal. not a 20 cent run up or downturn..

make it happen lawyers. earn your money..

i am heavily invested in Wamu (200k shares) as most of you but dont get overboard with thinking there is a golden light ahead.

Some of these prices you are mentioning are just fantasy world.

I spoke to a friends father who is a partner at one of the many firms representing WAMU in both there suits, Ch 11, and FDIC... I am not willing to mention any names or even the firm he represents but will summarize what i was told in confidence. He is not specifically working on the case but spoke with another partner about this situation.

1st... Suing the FDIC is a no win battle. When you sue them it needs to go in front of the Supreme Court and that would take years. Could be 8-10 years so really thats not a realisitc option. In addition even if there is wrongdoing which is really hard to prove there will likley be little left after law claims. The FDIC lawyers are on salary and there goal is to extend it as far out and as long and grueling as possible. WAMU etc is represented by multiple firms billing as much as 600-800 an hour and you can only imagine the bill for 8 years worth of work. This is not really something to get excited about no matter how crooked or not things happened. Everything i read says there was wrong doing and shady stuff that happened in the last stages of WAMU but proving that in court is very tough.

2nd... The best hope is for an outright settlement by JPM with them deciding that they want to assume all WAMU's assets at a specific price. They conceed the certain price to take over full control of the holding company and all assets associated with the firm. The prices some people are throwing out are not even close. In most cases it would be around the last day of trading. If it went to a full jury or court they would have big trouble getting JPM to pay more then the firm could have been bought for. More then the investors (shareholders believed the firm was worth). I dont have handy the last price but i believe it was a 1.00 or a little over before the FDIC came in and swooped them up. So that is one of the best outcomes if this were to go through full trial. In addition there would be a lot of expenses associated with this and it could be carried out and delayed several years. Best case is the judge decides ona certain mutliple of the last day's trading price. He cited another example of a case where this happened with a bank about 10 years ago. They were taken over and they felt they were more and they got a judgement of there last trading day. JPM is trying to get this as cheap as possible. With enough pressure on Dixon and board they will decide to settle this and move on. IN my opinion they know they stole this company and feel there is no proof of it.

3rd.. As you know commons are last priority. We are all hopefull there will be money left over to pay us but we never know. This is a risk everyone involved is willing to take.

So overall there is an uphill fight with all this. I am hopeful we will get a settlement sometime but i dont have a timeframe on it. I just want to be realistic to those who think 12-24 a share and tell them there is no chance of this happening. If we get a 1.50 a share settlement that will be a hell of a return on your investment. Lets cross our fingers and hope for more.

If anyone has specific questions I am happy to ask. I dont know how much he will tell me on anything though.

there is a major difference between Lehman and WMI that people are failing to think about. Lehman has 100b in debt so even if there is money left the chance of it coming down to common shareholders is slim. WMI does not have this same issue and with a settlement there will be plenty of money to properly pay shareholders. The fact remains that this company did not have to be seized and was stolen from the shareholders for the good of JPM.

Go Wamu...Pay us our money...

you are forgetting the currency conversion.