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I am wondering if the paint has dried here yet? Nothing more fascinating to watch than drying paint!
This (CO2 emissions trading in the EU) was in the news today"
I am wondering what happened to out friend (poster) Captain Canada?
Today's closing volume on ABAT shares was off the charts with a roughly 5.5 million share spike in the last 3 minutes of trade, with little price change (went from 1.04 to 1.09 then 1.07).
That means an MM or MM/broker was buying (or selling?) all day for a huge single order for somebody. Since the price was nearly flat on the day tell the close, I think it might have been a huge short that covered today. But it could have been a new short selling all the rally attempts in anticipation of a new short seller article this weekend?
Last data I have showed 10% of the shares in institutional hands, with 42% owned by the ABAT CEO, and 10% of OS shares were short, leaving only 38% to cover shorts. The OS is about 92 million shares, so a 7+ million share day, with 5.5 million of those shares posted as traded at the close, means something big just happened, or is about to happen here!
Note that the 5.5 million share spike happened (or was posted) in the last 3 minutes, and the price jumped from 1.04 to 1.09/share with the first 1/2 million shares posted 3 minutes before the market closed.
Earlier PRs in December said they had licensed a catalyst from the Canadian University. There was no mention of licensing a "component" in the December PRs.
I am still trying to figure out just what a commercial facility is:
http://investorshub.advfn.com/boards/read_msg.aspx?message_id=64562068
http://www.google.com/search?q=define+commercial+facility&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a#hl=en&client=firefox-a&hs=sNe&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&q=Commercial+facility&tbs=dfn:1&tbo=u&sa=X&ei=OBQETurND8uSgQe9iJHaDQ&ved=0CBoQkQ4&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&fp=68c0ff49d7f8fcb6&biw=1280&bih=587
According to the US DOT:
Commercial facility - Facilities that are intended for nonresidential use by private entities and whose operation affects commerce.
Here is the other catchy fluff phrase:
"commercial performance testing"
http://investorshub.advfn.com/boards/read_msg.aspx?message_id=64562068
NDAs, and signing NDAs is a routine practice. Ask any patent attorney or patent agent. I have used them for over 25 years. Carbon Sciences would require the signature on a NDA before disclosing anything of substance, not already protected by a patent application, to a potential JV partner or a large accredited investor. No potential large investor or JV partner or customer would consider any kind of deal or exchange of cash or agreements with out first signing NDAs, and then examining what CS actually has applied for patent wise, or has or believes they have as a trade secret.
Read up here and learn something new:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-disclosure_agreement
Limit orders can and typically are filled by MMs from inventory at higher or lower prices than what you see on level II. We never see the limit orders.
You did not do the search right. Use this page:
http://appft.uspto.gov/netahtml/PTO/search-adv.html
Then list:
AN/(carbon and sciences)
as the search string. That tells the search engine you want only patent applications where the words "carbon" and "sciences" are in the Assignees Name (AN). Meaning you want only patent applications that were assigned to "Carbon Sciences" as the owner.
This searches for published US patent applications. If they have a provisional application, which they have not published, it must be converted to a non provisional with in 365 days (and then published on the USPTO schedule), or it gets tossed out, and they loose the priority filing date.
These guys have been around long enough that I would have expected to find something at least from the stuff they were doing 3-4 years ago, or even 2 years ago or 18 months ago, published by now as an application at the US PTO.
I asked Byron 12 months ago if he would supply me a copy of the current unpublished patent application(s) that he claimed had been filed, and offered to sign a non-disclosure agreement, and he never replied to my written request.
I just rechecked the US PTO office data base, and I can not find a single patent application assigned to CABN!
http://appft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO2&Sect2=HITOFF&u=%2Fnetahtml%2FPTO%2Fsearch-adv.html&r=0&p=1&f=S&l=50&Query=AN%2F%28carbon+and+sciences%29&d=PG01
People try to trip stop loss sell orders by banging the low bids on a day like today, when people get scared and the bids fall away. I crunched the numbers today and 95% of the shares were traded today between .18 and .19/share. Could also have been an MM grabbing stop loss shares for the next rally to sell. I hope it was not your shares they stole?
We should be banging on the .20 door tomorrow with a little luck, now that the Greece scare has been kicked down the road a ways. Suddenly with oil on its way back to reasonable levels (The world wide and US SPR is releasing, selling oil, in the news today), and Greece in the bag, this summer is no longer looking like a possible 08-90 crash!!!!!
I agree, I was just redoing some charts and at the moment I see an expanding triangle, with us near a 3 year low that may be the triangle target as well as a double bottom target at the same time. Wish I had dry powder to spare to add here. My average cost is $1.2, been in this one since 2009.
Lot of shorts on this one, that may cover going into end of the month window dressing, they may be driving it down here so they can cover? Volume is below average.
I agree it should bounce a good bit pretty soon. I see no fundamental reason for the drop, other than market jitters.
I did not see the AS increase news? But if they did sell new shares, these guys will push it to $2 before they sell new shares, just like they did with RXII!!!! I don't see any reason for them to sell new shares here. They have plenty of cash already.
Serious signs of life here!!!!! Go YRCW
That chart is not brand new, and it already showed about 1600 hours of testing.
It is not at all clear what the latest test data PRs are referring to, the first or second generation catalyst? And all that link does is make it less clear. I had forgotten their mention of a second generation catalyst, but now I recall it was one of the reasons I was asking questions last time, who is first, what is second, and I don't know is on third. Have they said anything else about it, naming it specifically as the second generation catalyst, where they said anything more than "near perfect catalyst", anything more than "reaching the theoretical yield"?
Now you have me wondering what the 1000 hour commercial and 2000 hour lab tests were testing, Cat #1 or Cat #2, or dor number 3, and is Cat #2 the Canadian University licensed cat, or a new one they plan to write a new patent application for?
Byron was legally obligated to disclose that November news that their attorneys had discovered prior art that made the November catalyst un-patentable, or risk getting nailed by the SEC and stockholder lawsuits for withholding it. It was the kind of information they could be sued for not immediately disclosing.
The other grey (not good news, possibly bad news) news (what I was referring to when I said bad news that he is not giving full disclosure on), he continues to sit on is what I am referring to.
Another poster said I was wrong about 2000 hours of catalyst tests already being done. He is wrong, I am right. CABN already completed, and announced 2000 hours of lab testing of the catalyst was completed, lab testing meaning to any chemist or chemical engineer, that they ran the test with high purity CO2 and CH4 feeds. The current 1000 hours of additional complete testing is with the commercial, dirtier, less pure feeds like a commercial facility will need and want to use. It is too costly to totally purify the CO2 and CH-4 feed stock before feeding it to the reactor. The trick is to find a catalyst that is not quickly poisoned by those contaminates. Those contaminates will vary by compound and concentration from well to well, which further complicates commercialization!
There are catalysts that will already do dry reforming, but none of them have been economical yet. They had various problems, like poisoning from commercial contaminates that deactivated the catalyst.
I agree, if they in fact have an exclusive dry reforming catalyst that is patent protectable, or already patented and licensed to CABN, and if it is the best one the world knows of, then I agree they have a great world class technology, a possible game changer, but these guys have pulled the rug out from under us too many times already, shifted gears too many times in mid stream, for me to pay today's premium price for shares, when we still have so many unknowns that they have not written down in stone yet. So I will wait to re-invest as well.
I just do not see why Byron won't spell out exactly which catalyst they are testing? A new one, the old un-patentable one, or the Canadian University one? Why is he being so vague about this?
I have not forgotten the Panic sell off in November last year when Byron released the news that their great new catalyst was not patentable after all and everyone was running for cover. When that happened I held my shares, and told this group then that the party might not be over. I was the lone voice in the crowd then as everyone ran for the doors. And I was right then, as they signed a license deal with the Canadian university about 2 weeks later. Unfortunately they never told us what patent #(s) they licensed? They never told us if it was the same one they had re-discovered and run their own tests on, or a better one, or what? Just too many secrets right now for me to trust a group with the track record they have so far.
Why haven't they mentioned the Shell engineer for the last 7 months? He was the reason I stayed on board last year when I first thought about giving up this outfit.
Mark my words, the next 10-Q is very likely to show new shares sold at .80 to $1.60/share in the last 3 months!
And once the old shares are physically replaced with new ones, and somebody lends them to shorts, we will see a nasty dip here.
I sold the day it hit $6, the day the R/S happened.
I simply refuse to pay a premium for shares I know I will be able to buy much cheaper this summer, over the next 6 months.
CABN has repeatedly sold new shares to accredited investors for as much as 70% off of retail to keep the bills paid. When I first bought shares here, there we 90% fewer shares outstanding, and that was 2 years ago, and they said then they had the magic formula ( a process they have since abandoned, or shelved as they could not get a partner to sign on or get it funded, so they abandoned it), and they said then all they needed was a JV partner to fund a pilot plant. Now we are testing a new magic formula, with no idea for sure if it is the un-patentable one, or the Canadian University licensed one, or a third one they hope to patent?
A company like this can NOT support an infinite market cap, so as shares are added, the share price drops based on the markets view of the companies potential maximum market cap. The accredited investors that are buying the new shares at a discount, and selling you shares at a premium know this, that is why they keep buying new shares at a lower and lower price each time and then selling the old higher cost shares to you at a premium over what they paid.
If they try to build their own plants to produce fuel, it will take huge amounts of funding, and stock dilution to get there. If they license it, the revenue will be much smaller (as well as profits in $$s), and thus the target market cap will be much lower raising questions as to whether the current market cap is overvalued at the current share price times the current share count?
I have never called Byron a liar, but he is not telling the entire story (errors of omission), and by not telling the entire story, just telling us the good fluffy news, and not any of the bad news, he is leading investors like you to the slaughter house! If you don't mind further 50 to 80% hair cuts then by all means buy away here!!!! Buy the dream!
I have been around long enough and involved in enough start ups like this one, to know how long it takes, and how much it costs to get from point A to point B. 2 years ago, CABN made it sound like they were much further along than they really were, like they were already at Point X, much less B or C.
When I can see a real patent application in the patent offices, with claims that look like they will work, and performance data that will pass the economic tests, I will look at re-investing in this one.
Let me ask you a question. If they have 2000 hours of positive lab test data from ETF, why have they not published the ETF lab report to prove it is verifiable by the independent lab ETF?
Where is the Ex-Shell Oil engineer?
Note: Emerging Fuels Technology = ETF
Just want to make sure I have not confused you or others. From what I can gather they are running "commercial lab tests" at a reputable facility, namely ETF which they have named several times recently, but they are a lab, not a production facility, and thus are not doing lab-lab tests now, but are doing commercial feed stock lab tests in the lab. The difference is in the level of contamination in the feed stock.
What I do not believe they are running is a commercial pilot plant test at Commercial FT production site, in spite of the vague PR trying to make it sound like they are, to people who are not in the industry, and thus are less informed as to how this sort of thing works, and thus are easily miss led to the buying window!!!! That kind of trial/test would be the next step, and would require considerable additional costs out of somebodies pocket, and 3-6 months of design and construction work.
I hope you all are prepared to loose your *sses because I just bought the falling knife here this morning!
LOL
All I can tell you for sure is that I am buyer down here, and selling 1/2 at .04 if we get there anytime soon. I have ridden this one up 400 to 800% a couple of times since 2008. I have more MHAN shares now than I ever had, and average cost for me is about .02 now.
I am worried about the entire market right now, but today's oil news I think is going to be good long term. In spite of today's nasty sell off in the markets, I am doing OK today, which is encouraging.
China BAK Battery, Inc. ("China BAK" or the "Company") (NASDAQ: CBAK), a leading global manufacturer of lithium-based battery cells, today announced that it was invited to attend the 2011 Ernst & Young Asia Cleantech Ignition Session in Beijing, on June 24, 2011, jointly hosted by the Ernst & Young Global Automotive Center, Global Power & Utilities Center and Global Cleantech Center.
The Global Automotive and Cleantech Centers co-host executive roundtables that convene key stakeholders across the electric vehicle (EV) value chain, including OEMs, suppliers, utilities and government, investors, consumer product companies and system integrators, focusing on the most important issues in the burgeoning cleantech market. For more information please visit: http://www.ey.com/Publication/vwLUAssets/roundtable_en/$FILE/Cleantech_Ignition_Session_Invitation_EN.pdf
Dr. Zhongyi Deng, China BAK's VP of Sales, will attend the session. "I look forward to sharing China BAK's EV battery supply experiences with the other attendees," commented Dr. Deng. "The Company has experienced strong interest from major vehicle manufacturers in the quality of its lithium-based batteries for electric vehicles. For example, China BAK's EV battery cells power a set of pure electric vehicles manufactured by Dongfeng-Yulon Motor Sales Co., Ltd., a joint venture between leading Taiwanese automaker Yulon Motor and Chinese automaker Dongfeng Automobile Co., Ltd. and delivered to the public transportation authority of the city of Hangzhou, China on June 17. At the same time, we think that one of the goals for the development of the EV industry is to find ways to reduce costs for all participants. I therefore look forward to discussing the Company's roadmap to attain this goal."
About China BAK Battery, Inc.
China BAK Battery, Inc. (NASDAQ: CBAK) is a leading global manufacturer of lithium-based battery cells. The Company produces battery cells that are the principal component of rechargeable batteries commonly used in cellular phones, notebook computers and portable consumer electronics such as digital media devices, portable media players, portable audio players, portable gaming devices, and PDAs. China BAK Battery, Inc.'s production facilities, located in Shenzhen and Tianjin, PRC, cover over three million square feet and have been recently expanded to support the production of larger batteries for various types of vehicles. For more information regarding China BAK Battery, Inc., please visit http://www.bak.com.cn.
Your question: "And can you please enlighten me on how you know how ETF does it's testing, or is this just a guess?" is easy to answer.
I am a degreed bio-chemical engineer & consultant specialized in the Air and waste water treatment business for metal finishing, with my own patents and my own R&D lab. So I know how it is done. I actually own some of Shell's old lab equipment for running the tests ETF is running. That is also why I got so excited about CABN's direction and plans 2 years ago and invested in CABN stock back then.
Here is my problem. I think if Byron had any real commercial site tests underway, he would be telling us who it was and screaming it from highest mountain top. Since he did not, I get the impression he is stretching the facts with typical PR fluff style, and it sounds like you and others bought into that fluff hook line and sinker. I was one of the early retail investors in CABN, got in shortly after Byron showed up at CABN. So I am pretty good at reading between the lines now in terms of Byron's PRs, as I have read his PRs for over 2 years now, And I know what he said 2 years ago, 18 months ago, 12 months ago....., and I know that what he said has all too frequently failed to happen.
I also own shares in a CABN competitor that has already signed 3 huge JV deals with three huge companies, but has repeatedly stumbled on terms and financing the JV pilot plants, thus dragging things out for another 18 months while they burn cash...etc. I myself had an offer from Ford (2000) once for a $1,000,000 performance contract system order (my patent), from a VP of Ford Motor, and was not able to deliver because we could not get it financed, as it was still in need of a pilot plant trial to work out the process control bugs, before taking on a full sized system order.
CABN has yet to sign on a single JV partner! Why is that?????
While the PR sounds like great news, I am still concerned about the lack of actual data, and particularly concerned about the way he worded this last PR, claiming it now has 1000 test hours at "a commercial facility". All the prior PRs said they were running a "commercial test", and the only place they had to run that test was the new partners lab (since no one else was mentioned, and since a lab test using a commercial feed was the next logical step), using what I would call a commercial feed, versus a lab grade feed, note that lab grade chemicals are extremely pure, unlike industrial (commercial) grades, and one of the industry concerns would be catalyst poisoning by traces of junk in the commercial CH4/CO2 feed mix which would be too costly to remove, it sounds to me like Byron is stretching his story beyond the reality of the current status. If this was a China stock today, the shorts would hang him out to dry for this error!
My concern is that they either did not tell us previously that there was a commercial site doing the test, or Byron has stretched the truth here by making a commercial feed stock lab test sound like a commercial site production test!
I already posted all my previous reservations of the current stock price, post R/S, and my doubts about where the stock price will end up after dilution to raise enough money to be able to get this company upgraded to a major exchange, before it has a JV deal and outside funding from a real customer willing to spend their own money.
The price is already down 30% from its recent $6/high. For now I am hanging onto my dry powder, for the eventual bad news in the next 10-Q, which will reveal the latest round of dilution and its cost.
Bid and ask is tight now and very close to breaking out and up over 20 cents finally!!!! Got TTEG!!!!
Solar and wind has already been hurt by NG, and Nuclear is going to be bucking the same NG head wind until NG gets back to $8-$10 area.
CBAK was a typo, sorry, good catch, should have been CGYV, not CBAK.
All I can say for sure is the fear level is much much higher than before, in answer to your question.
Since you asked about CBAK versus ABAT, I own some of both. I have been in CBAK for a long time, while watching ABAT for a long time, and I bought the crashed price on ABAT recently as I had already done 2 years DD on ABAT. ABAT as you know is under short attack directly now, and CBAK is not. CBAK losses have been dropping steadily, and CBAK is selling for 1/2 of book value, and is a huge company. I thought they would have turned a profit again by now, but have not lost faith in them, so I added on the pull backs.
I only started watching CNOA about 6 weeks ago. I fear there is much more going on under the rug with this one, and I have no idea where it is going soon, or long term, so I am watching it from the sidelines, as I suspect it may go lower. I also read rumblings that they are changing the business plan, but they have not told us what the new plan is? Also IIRC we had an officer or director resign on this one? (IIRC, but I am not sure).
CBAK bottomed last week, and is rallying hard today. My best guess is that we are heading back to $2/share soon, and the book value on CBAK is around $2.35/share.
Buy the dip folks, I already got mine at .008 today! Volume is up nicely, and has been for a while here now. Nice bid support at .0073/.0072 too.
I think this is a screaming buy here. The ANX shares that CYTR recently took in trade for the previously shelved drug ANX bought from CYTR recently, are up about 35% already since the deal went through, and 2 advisories came out this week upgrading ANX shares to $7 and $14/share targets, and ANX is only at about $2.90/share so far with a 4 day rally already underway.
Add the fact that the current CYTR price is right on 3 year long term support (low), this could be an easy 20 to 40% ride up on CYTR shares in a very short period here as it follows ANX going up.
Also CYTR should show a nice profit on the recent sale to ANX in the next quarterly report. CYTR has managed to show a profit on average about 2 times a year the last 4 years in spite of not having any drugs directly on the market!!!!
When we look inward in an isolationist perspective, and suggest drilling our way out of the problem locally as the ONLY solution, we ignore the reality of global economics. If we became self sufficient in oil, but let the rest of the world suck eggs so to speak, the rest of the world, like China and Japan, two of our major trading partners in the now global economy, could still suffer huge economic hits if the international commodity markets for something as important as oil was left in the total control of countries like IRAN. The cost of items we import, are tied to the world cost of oil, not just the local cost of oil. So if we did not use our super power status to do all we can to stabilize world governments and economies and thus prices and supplies, yes we might become self sufficient with our oil for a short while, but rest assure run away inflation would result as oil and products of the oil economy skyrocketed. World wide and local Economics is no where near as simple as your personal check book.
Here is an interesting news bit this morning:
Warning Will Robinson! Lets get back on topic here people!!!!
Part of the climb is expectations that Greece will not default this year after all. Part of it is just market cycling, timing between quarterly reports.
I am glad you two have this all so well figured out. LOL
In the meantime I called the low yesterday, bought when it crashed to .27 on heavy volume, and today's current price is a 40% gain over the .27 low. My purchase yesterday is already in the green.
So I guess I don't know what I am doing, or talking about after all.
You all believe what you want. I have been doing this since the 1980s......
This is a very good article to read. Helps clarify many things!!!
http://blog.redchip.com/index.php/china/sat-and-saic-filings-a-china-investors-primer
Can you prove your comment? As I disagree. My posts prove that at least one MM must be there making the market for that stock, even when there are no buy or sell orders from the street. That single MM sets the spread. It is that MM's job to make the market, to place a bid and ask, even if he has no orders.
In a thinly traded stock, the MMs can wreck having, running the price up and down just to try and attract volume.
Can you prove that MM's are not trading this stock for their own account?
http://www.sec.gov/rules/concept/s72499/klaser1.txt
May keep it from selling off to .25/share any time soon. I am wondering what the tax credit really does right now. Is it a credit against future earnings, if they ever make a profit (do they need to make a profit for it to have any value?), is it cash in the bank, is it transferable in any way. Credit against what kind of taxes? Maybe someone else knows, I have not had time to dig into the details.
Lets just hope they weigh in with cash buys at the ask, and not sells at the bid. :)
This sort of a large volume sell off dump, on a day like today, with no real news, is typical of an MM raid to get plenty of cheap shares by walking the price down to trip stop loss orders, so they can load up just before news comes out that makes the stock rally.
I see no current, or even old news, or reason that this one would be halted in trading. It is not a NASDAQ stock, no need to maintain the $1 price, no allegations here of fraud, no evidence of any shorted shares at all.
This one is becoming a screaming buy. They control the majority of Cobaltic Li-Ion material supply in China!!! They are not going anywhere. This is just a screaming buying opportunity thanks to the shorts in the other China stocks scaring everyone.
IN 12-18 months this one could make new highs in the $5 area.
I think it is your turn to buy a puny 100 shares at the ask, NO?
LOL
Makes one wonder why it would even drop to .06 after all that buying at .074 earlier, makes me think the MMs sold shares they did not have at .074 and are now trying to cover them at .06, but they seem to have a lot of competition for the .06s at the bid!!!!
That is smart! There is going to be about 200,000,000 shares bouncing around this year once they are all converted and unrestricted, and with the only stock holders equity of any significance being the goodwill value COIN paid in shares for Terra, when COIN shares were still at .60/share, that goodwill value is now worthless. I suspect COIN has less than $2 million dollars in real assets, and stock holders equity left right now, so do the math, that works out to .01/share book value if Terra does not start closing sales, and they have had no sales since the merger, and the fertilizer sales were flat lined last month. Rest assured they will try to borrow more cash with more convertible debt this year, why else the 300 million share increase in the AS to 500 million shares!