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I haven’t had a chance to research the distributors mentioned, but so far they seem to be legitimate companies so hopefully they can make some sales! I think it’s reassuring that they were able to seal some sort of deal with the companies they originally approached in the Middle East. I was a little nervous that the business relationships fell apart when they seemed to be pivoting to deals with China and talking less and less about the Middle East. I’ve been involved for a while and lost a decent chunk of change, but I remain hopeful that this thing turns around!
Medica Group: Total Aesthetic & Medical Solutions
- 16 years in business
- Specialize in aesthetics which is reassuring for sales of the green laser
- Distribution deals with some major aesthetics companies that are successful in the US (i.e. Miradry)
- Potential pro & con: distribution of multiple cosmetic lasers (experience in the field, but also competition)
http://www.medicagroup.com/home
Gulf Drug:
- Established in 1969
- Seems like they went to the dubai expo, it’s nice to see the medifirst followed through with a connection from the expo
- Large, well-run company w/ experience in healthcare
http://www.gulfdrug.com/about3.htm
Arabian Ethicals:
- Established in 1977, long-term established wholesale agent
- Subsidiary of Ghobash Trading & Investing Co. (est 1981): “privately-owned, diversified Group that focuses on growth through value-creation”
- “We covered most of the private pharmacies and hospitals in all UAE with the help of our direct and indirect sales staff.”
http://www.arabianethicals.ae/divisions/medical/
http://www.arabianethicals.ae/about-us/ghobashgroup/
Although I would have liked to hear about sales of their current laser and am hoping that this LOI is for real, I do like that the company seems to be pursuing the green laser more aggressively. I am just a little concerned that the company may have realized which laser is more valuable a little late in the game and is trying to pivot to a new focus.
The red laser is geared towards pain management, an unfortunately, pain is an extremely subjective thing to study. It is difficult to scientifically study and prove, especially when most of the world (and primarily the US) compare all forms of pain control to that of opiates.
However, the wavelength of the green laser has been studied and proven. I would think that it should be easier to market the portability and cheaper price of a proven treatment as opposed to the less-studied/proven red wavelength.
I shared my opinion on the green laser from a medical perspective a while back, so here's to hoping that the LOI's turn into legit contracts and the green laser works out even better!
Cheers!
Nice find! News predictions anyone? I'm thinking:
- intro of NY ambassador
- announcing that they filed for patent
- hoping for sales!
Actually, if you read the company's disclosure, it states that Phillips (the inventor of the technology vdrm is marketing) works for vdrm.. of anything Keough (a patent lawyer with 0 experience in research and development) stole the IP.
I have no clue about patent law maybe you/someone can expand upon this: in vdrm' disclosure statement, it explicitly states that viaderma purchased the patent from Phillips. If visderma paid Phillips for the patent, it seems to me that it would be otikos at that point. Even if, hypothetically, Keough tried to take legal action as a "co-inventor" it seems to me that he would instantly lose the case. Think about it, how could Keough possibly argue that he assisted in developing the product as an attorney vs a phd scientist.. I guess he could say that Phillips signed the paperwork with Keough as an inventor but it seems like it would be pretty clear cut that Phillips is more likely to be granted patent rights, which were then transferred to otiko.
I get that and I appreciate a lot of the digging you've done, but If we truly see Keough as competition, I think we need to dig a little deeper into him. You've referenced otikos prior charges which he was eventually deemed not guilty (still concerning, I agree), but is Keough really a saint? From what I understand he placed his name as an inventor on technology that he clearly had no role in developing or clinically testing, he was barred from practicing patent law for a year, and has had some sort of dispute resulting in bad blood between him and the inventor of the product he is trying to sell!
I'm going to start researching their company a bit more and see what I find, but I appreciate the discussion.
This is where I will preach objectivity again.. were questions truly cleared up through Keough? He simply told you he plans to pursue the IP and sell product. The same questions apply for Keough as well my friend: if he is pursuing the IP, why is it still abandoned? Why was it abandoned in the first place? And where is the proof of the sales?
You have scrutinized vdrm for not showing proof of these things (and I can understand that) but where is the non-abandoned proof for Keough?
I can see it going either way but that's the gamble in OTC.. if Keough's company fulfills there promises they may experience a decent bump in pps since they are already in the dollars. But if otiko fulfills his promises, a jump to the current pps of their "competitor" would be, as many on these boards say, a moonshot!
Also, this was posted in 2013... when the patent was still open.. but yet they chose to abandon it? Why would they do that?
Interesting, but you're contradicting yourself. You make the argument that you can't believe vdrm PRs, but you are citing a PR as historical fact.
Also, as I see it, Keough's company is in the same boat... they have let the patent expire but are telling you they plan to pursue it. They have also not sold the product, but say they will be selling it next month. What makes their word more reliable?
I agree that it seems like there are 2 companies vying for a similar product, but you have to look at things objectively.
I agree with the uncertainty about the patent, and Armstrong is certainly a heavy hitter in the field, but that having him jump on board tells me that the drug must work pretty darn well... now, if otiko already has the data, vdrm has the jump on Keough who would have to start trials now.
I am also intrigued by the relationship problems with Phillips and Keough. Pairing medications with a delivery systems isn't just putting some antibiotic/antifungal/cbd oil in a blender with the delivery jelly and boom new product. Phillips knows how to pair these things and works with otiko, does Keough and co know how? Or would they have to hire scientists to figure it out?
I agree that there are definitely many question marks regarding the patent for the delivery method, my theory is this: they filed for these patents before truly clinically testing anything leading to their abandonment. They chose quick money with the already FDA approved topical antibiotic. Then they started pairing the delivery system with other medications and had success so they tried to double back and secure the patent, but bad blood had already developed between Keough and Otiko/Phillips (possibly bc otiko did most of the field testing and felt entitled to the patent).
I can see it playing out like this bc think about a young company choosing between a delivery system that may or may not work and a product that is already FDA approved and ready to go. After all, how do you prove it is the delivery system that is novel and makes the medication work and not just the topical antibiotics? You pair it with multiple different medications and test it, but that takes a lot of time, patience and faith in the system with no guarantee of success.
I could be way off but that's my theory. On the positive side, it appears as though otiko may have gotten the jump on clinical testing if the PRs are true likely bc he has a clinical background/connections with medical professionals and a better idea of how to properly test a medication (it's not easy!) vs Keough (a lawyer by trade) who had to raise money to pay an expert to start the process.
Just my 2 cents, hopefully vdrm is the real deal and skyrockets and makes a lot of people happy!
In my opinion, it's a race to patent the delivery system. Specific medications can be ever so slight altered and be sold as a separate entity by a separate company. Ever wonder the difference between brand name medication and generic? Most of the time they are the exact same molecules but are different stereoisomers.. basically the same compound twisted into a different shape. So I'm not at all surprised that the addition of acetic acid could be FDA approved as an entirely different drug, it happens all the time. However, I think the delivery system itself, if patented, would be more difficult for other companies to poach. It should be interesting to see how this unfolds!
Think they're open tomorrow?
Just to be clear, presenters have to pay for nearly every legitimate medical conference. Furthermore, guest/keynote speakers typically discuss broad topics within the field and are definitely not permitted to sell a product. You cannot have any conflicts of interest in your presentation (I.e. Being CEO of a company that owns the product you are presenting about) and you can't mention a product by name.
Having both lectured and presented posters at many of these meetings, it is safe to say a poster presentation is the best possible forum for him to promote his product because he can reference it by name, show its associated research findings, and spend more one on one time with anyone who shows interest in the product.
Cheers!
I agree, definitely going to announce the NYC ambassador/discuss the meet and greet, but I'm interested to see what they say about sales. I think the next PR will move this stock in a huge way:
Green if any sales are announced
Red if they beat around the bush with sales
I'm hoping for green!
Judging by the pictures, is seems as though their New York City Medical Director will be from Central Park Dentistry. Dr. Paul Scheier, DDS is in one of the pictures wearing "Central Park Dentistry" scrubs. Seems like a cosmetics-oriented dental practice.
Now that we have all kissed and made up, let's close green today!
"Suggestive, biased, controversial", 3 words that can be applied to any opinion... it's kind of ironic when everyone's signature says "jmo, do your DD".
I wholeheartedly support vdrm, but I think a little but of skepticism can be healthy for good discussion. Look what happened here: there was an unclear component of the company's history, posters highlighted this inconsistency, and other posters (notably JLUT and waterpro) took the initiative to clear it up! How is that bad?
I agree with your sentiment, but not with your targets. The two posters that you listed have been posting useful information about the company. All of the research they have been doing is useful for valuation of the company.
The only thing more dangerous than a basher is an uninformed buyer in my opinion. We're all here for the same reason. Evaluate the facts, determine your entry/exit stategy, and pull the trigger!
Let's keep it civil and hopefully make money together!
So you are thinking that would be the future "acquisitions" they spoke about in the most recent PR? That seems like it could be very good news regarding the product. They must feel comfortable that they can sell it enough to want to own it...
I agree, I think there is a large market for lasers, but more so in cosmetics than pain relief. Everyone wants to look younger without going under the knife and physicians love it because its a cash business! You don't have to wait 3 months for insurance companies to pay you 20% of what you charge for a treatment, you get 100% on the spot.
I think the value in this product is the price. Historically, cosmetic lasers were insanely expensive and became obsolete in a few yearas making it a poor investment for private practice physicians. With this, physicians can advertise that they do cosmetic laser treatments (which is a sexy topic these days) and after 10 patients sign up, the laser is completely paid off!
Just my opinion, but I think there is significant value here!
Idk why, but I have a strange feeling once the first PR hits we are going to have weekly sales PRS one after the other as they are all finalized. Just as each consolidation phase starts another PR will drop to continue a massive uptick. I have no proof of said PRs, I just feel the sales data will be released separately for continental growth. I hope my gut feeling is right!
I am interested to hear the reply/see the CBD patent so hopefully he replies. I emailed him about a month ago with an unrelated question and never heard back so I'm glad he seems to be responding to most of you.
I think this was reviewed in-depth a while back on the boards here. If I remember correctly, the conclusion we came to was that the original patents had been abandoned (for whatever reason) and that the PR stating a "new" patent was filed in Dec 2016 was really Viaderma re-starting the patent process. As far as the CBD patent that was apparently filed in 2014, I have not been able to find it. I wonder if that one was abandoned as well and his most recent PR pertaining to new patents is referring to re-submitting the old patent. I think someone emailed him to ask for the patent application numbers, but never heard back.
I posted my thoughts/concerns regarding many Viaderma's products from a medical perspective a few weeks ago. However, I think it is important to highlight the potential of Viabecline as it is currently on the market and being sold. All the other products are icing on the cake and further contribute to the company's potential value, but right now their revenue comes from Viabecline.
I stand by my assessment below (copied from my prior post), but I wanted to clarify one major thing. When a new medication is brought to the market, they are often tested against the current standard of care to determine the efficacy of the drug. If it is shown to be more effective than standard practice, it is deemed "superior". If it is shown to be equal to current practice, it is deemed "non-inferior". If Viabecline is proven (with legit clinical studies) to be superior to IV antibiotics (as stated in a prior PR), that would be groundbreaking for the medical community and completely change the game regarding wound care. However, Viabecline would still be an ENORMOUS success even if it is shown to simply be non-inferior!! Why? Everything you do in medicine carries a risk, including antibiotics. Long-term use of antibiotics is not "healthy" for the body and has many systemic side-effects, most notably, c.diff infection resulting in profuse diarrhea. Furthermore, they generally require hospital-stays which aren't cheap. Therefore, if a topical antibiotic was shown to be non-inferior, it would almost definitely have fewer side effects and could be used at outpatient clinics. Physicians would want this medication because it would be better for their patients and hospitals would love this because it would avoid costly, long-term hospitalizations. I still have my concerns regarding Viaderma's products, but even there current product alone has the potential to make a pharmaceutical company rich.
From Prior Post:
Viabecline (topical tetracycline antibiotic): again, this product seems to have potential and I am a big fan of using alternative mechanisms to improve efficacy of antibiotics as there is a huge need for antibiotics given the increasing rates of bacterial resistance. If this product is truly more effective than IV antibiotics and other topicals to the extent that VDRM says they are, it would be groundbreaking. However, again, I am skeptical because:
1) I believe the company has stated that they believe the product increases the rate of healing independent of the increased antimicrobial effect. I am not sure how that would happen. Typically, diabetic foot ulcers (especially severe/end-stage) are due to a lack of blood flow to the tissue creating necrotic areas where bacteria thrive. Antibiotics sterilize these areas allowing the body (with already poor blood flow) to recover without the added insult of infection. Therefore, I am not sure how it would actually assist in tissue recovery outside of the anti-microbial effect. It would be an excellent product if it shows superiority over other antibiotics alone, I am just skeptical of that statement.
2) I haven’t found good studies on it yet. The report he published is essentially a case series which is one of the least reliable forms of research in the medical community, especially when performed by someone who has inherent bias (owner of the company). He did announce that he will be publishing a paper on it in a more reputable journal, so it will be interesting to see his results.
Good Morning,
This is my first time posting, but I have been following VDRM for a few months now and have noticed a lot of misinformation posted regarding the potential health benefits/usage of many of VDRM’s proposed products so I figured I would shed some light on the subject from a medical standpoint. I will preface my analysis/opinions by stating that I am definitely not an expert in trading stocks, in fact, VDRM is the first penny stock trade I have made. However, I do have extensive knowledge of medicine and figured I’d share my opinion on the company & its products from a medical standpoint:
Onypro (topical antifungal for onychomycosis): this is the product with the most potential in my opinion. The current management of onychomycosis is a choice between poor outcomes with current topical treatments or oral medication that requires monitoring of liver function (which can be annoying to patients) and both treatments take a very long time to work. If VDRM has come out with a topical medication that truly works as they are saying it does (~80% success rate), that would be huge. However, I am skeptical of these studies because:
1) true academic clinical trials go through multiple phases, they are searchable, and they are published (usually in major journals) – I haven’t been able to find any of these
2) massive jumps in success rates generally don’t happen in medicine. It is very possible that he has come up with a novel treatment and it would be groundbreaking, but historically, medicine moves forward with multiple small steps as opposed to giant leaps.
Viabecline (topical tetracycline antibiotic): again, this product seems to have potential and I am a big fan of using alternative mechanisms to improve efficacy of antibiotics as there is a huge need for antibiotics given the increasing rates of bacterial resistance. If this product is truly more effective than IV antibiotics and other topicals to the extent that VDRM says they are, it would be groundbreaking. However, again, I am skeptical because:
1) I believe the company has stated that they believe the product increases the rate of healing independent of the increased antimicrobial effect. I am not sure how that would happen. Typically, diabetic foot ulcers (especially severe/end-stage) are due to a lack of blood flow to the tissue creating necrotic areas where bacteria thrive. Antibiotics sterilize these areas allowing the body (with already poor blood flow) to recover without the added insult of infection. Therefore, I am not sure how it would actually assist in tissue recovery outside of the anti-microbial effect. It would be an excellent product if it shows superiority over other antibiotics alone, I am just skeptical of that statement.
2) I haven’t found good studies on it yet. The report he published is essentially a case series which is one of the least reliable forms of research in the medical community, especially when performed by someone who has inherent bias (owner of the company). He did announce that he will be publishing a paper on it in a more reputable journal, so it will be interesting to see his results.
Transdermal Delivery: this has been a hot topic in medicine for quite some time and if this one is truly superior it would be amazing. However, many have tried and failed in the past. I would comment on the tetrastem/hair loss product/erectile dysfunction product if there was more information about it, but at this time I cannot make an informed comment about it. I am unsure of how deep the penetration of the delivery system is because there is some conflicting information about it. Notably, one new story mentioning penetration to the “corroded” artery (carotid*) for migraines, which makes no sense. Hair loss would require much more superficial penetration than that so it is still unclear.
This is not intended to bash or pump this company. I do think VDRM has a lot of potential because of the variety of applications the delivery mechanism can be used with, but there are also a lot of barriers it will have to overcome. Despite a rough start to trading, I have accumulated modest stake in the company and am hoping for the best, I just figured that I would share some of my medical knowledge/opinions since you have been gracious enough to share your investing knowledge.
Cheers!