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If Quirk doesn't exercise his warrants then the OS doesn't go up.
Maybe it's just that simple.
Giving him more time to exercise the warrants increases the likelihood that he will do so.
Dilution is not my friend.
Somebody wanted more.....400K @ .0085
Good point. The DOW isn't representative of the whole market. However the Russel 2000, the Naz, and the S & P also showed that same decline spasm. So perhaps it's not specious correlation.
Just because the larger market didn't drop as JBII declined from it's peak of $7 doesn't mean that there are no correlations in the other direction.
While it is true that correlation does not prove causation, it is also true that correlation doesn't prohibit causation.
All in all it seems safe to say that JBII doesn't move the larger market. The larger market can move JBII.
Congratulations to all of you folks that got the cheapies today.
You don't want to cool the condensate any more than required. That would just waste energy.
This is an issue of removing bulk heat at a moderate temperature.
It would be nice if that heat could be used to preheat the material going into the reactor. The question is there enough recoverable heat to justify the added complexity.
Pentane boils at 36 deg C.
Heptane boils at 69 deg C.
Octane boils at 98 deg C.
Those are considered gasoline components. Anything lighter than these is the gas that is being produced and used to fuel the heaters.
So this gives us an idea of what temperatures the cooling system has to handle.
Looks like winter is going to be prime time for production.
At 1:07 CDT bid $4.99 ask $5.00 Very tight.
P2O may be defined as waste recovery in a more strict definition.
Recycling from the link provided.
<snip>
Plastic recycling is the process of recovering scrap or waste plastics and reprocessing the material into useful products, sometimes completely different in form from their original state. For instance, this could mean melting down soft drink bottles then casting them as plastic chairs and tables. Typically a plastic is not recycled into the same type of plastic and products made from recycled plastics are often not recyclable.
<snip>
<snip>
Thermal depolymerization
Main article: Thermal depolymerization
Another process involves the conversion of assorted polymers into petroleum by a much less precise thermal depolymerization process. Such a process would be able to accept almost any polymer or mix of polymers, including thermoset materials such as vulcanized rubber tires and the biopolymers in feathers and other agricultural waste. Like natural petroleum, the chemicals produced can be made into fuels as well as polymers. A pilot plant of this type exists in Carthage, Missouri, USA, using turkey waste as input material. See the main article on thermal depolymerization. Gasification is a similar process, but is not technically recycling since polymers are not likely to become the result.
<snip>
And of course that part that is most relevant to us from the same Wikipedia link provided by SCION.
<snip>
An emerging company, John Bordynuik, Inc. ([1]), claims to have the answer to cost effectively converting plastic to oil using a thermal depolymerization process aided by an unique catalyst.
A press release dated April 13, 2010 ([2]), makes the following claims based on testing done IsleChem, a New York State certified laboratory:
- JBI's P2O solution is repeatable and scalable.
- Approximately 85-90% of the hydrocarbon composition in the feedstock is converted into a "near diesel" fuel.
- Approximately 8% of the hydrocarbon composition in the feedstock is converted to a usable off gas much like natural gas.
- Approximately 1% of the feedstock remains in the processor as a residue.
- This analyzed residue contains various metals from coloring agents and other plastic additives that were originally in the feedstock plastic and a small amount of carbon.
- The fuel product was analyzed with a gas chromatograph and the chromatogram is similar in many respects to diesel fuel.
- The fuel product viscosity is approximately 2 cst @ 40 degrees C, and is an amber fuel.
- The fuel product contains only trace amounts of sulphur.
- The fuel product centane number exceeds 40.
- The residue does not appear to contain any highly toxic or difficult to dispose of components.
- There is no evidence of air toxins in the emissions.
- The energy balance of the process is positive; that is, more energy value is produced than is consumed by the process. Early data suggests that it is by as much as a factor of two.
IsleChem's results confirmed the Company's results. Furthermore, the process is proven to be scalable to 20 T or larger processors and promises to be free of any harmful emissions or toxic residues, and a high positive energy balance, thus maintaining compliance with the "green" efforts of JBI.
<snip>
That pretty much covers it.
It would be recycling in strictist terms if the company that buys the hydrocarbon output decided to use it to make more plastics. That is a choice that the purchaser must make. There is little reason to think that they couldn't turn the hydrocarbons back into plastics since the original plastics were made from oil in the first place.
If you are the lucky person that got 500 @ $4.67, that's a heck of a deal.
My understanding is that it is 20 Tons in 24 hrs.
If you are that sure about the continuing decline, it would be wise to sell out now and buy back in at the lower price and have many more shares in your account for the same amount of Dollars invested.
With a much lower cost basis recovering you initial investment becomes a much higher probability.
Don'tcha think?
You keep quiet.
It's the Golden rule.... He who has the gold, makes the rules. Lol.
When the people that have the money tell you to keep quiet .......
Thanks for sharing that.
The wheels of the govt. turn slowly.
Sigh
If you are frustrated, think how the folks at the office feel.
If it is any consolation, Grannatt has told he that he can't talk several times when I have called. Sometimes he has time and will discuss things. A few times he has told me up front I only have 5 minutes and that is what I get.
It may help to remember that he is just as frustrated with the pace of things as you are. He has a lot of his own personal future riding on this company just like you and I do and on top of that he is working long hours to move this forward.
Sorry that you haven't been able to catch him at a better time.
Don't take it personally.
Z I think a discussion of JBII competitors in the marketplace is appropriate in evaluation of JBII's risk.
In this case we see that a company claims that it can do many of the same things, at reduced efficiency, and with some different output products. More importantly it allows us to compare the number of licensees of JBII (all of the US is licensed I'm told) versus the competitors.
So for my part I consider that on topic.
Thanks
Steady_T
I don't quite understand what the back of the T is supposed to mean vis a vis JBI? Could you elaborate please?
Since you asked.....Refinery costs are $1 to 2 per barrel depending upon the type of crude used as input and the desired types of fuels as out puts.
http://www.eia.doe.gov/oiaf/servicerpt/ulsd/pdf/appendix_d.pdf
What that poster doesn't seem to know is that large computer systems use tapes today. They are no longer reel to reel tape but are tape cartridges. They look a bit like an old 8 Track and are not endless loops like the 8 track was.
My wife recently retired from a nationwide property tax servicing company. They used tape carts by the hundreds daily. Most were used for short term data storage to allow for program recovery if there was a data or program issue. Many are used to store data for year end and month end processing, and of course there are many copies of data made to satisfy legal requirements.
Once they discovered a program error that had existed for over a year and they had to go back and reprocess over a years worth of data to correct the issue.
Oh yeah, tapes are still used by large companies.
I do consulting for small businesses and advise many of my clients to use tape back up. Tapes can be stored off site and therefore provide protection against fire and flood that on site hard drive back up can not.
I live in sight of Jerry's world...
I'm hear to tell you that he doesn't get his raw materials for free or have someone pay him to take it off their hands like JBII does.
That stadium makes money 1 to 2 days a week. The football team makes money about 18 times a year.
As I understand it, a P2O processor will be cranking out profits 6 days a week, 52 weeks a year. Not to mention that there are no limits on the number of expansion teams...er ah processors that JBII can place in the market place for the foreseeable future.
Thanks for that.
That was the PIPE we know about, that happened about 6 months ago.
All of the current board chatter is about a PIPE that was speculated upon by a poster to this board. So far there is no confirmation of a new PIPE.
It is amazing how one poster can ask for information about a rumor he heard and things start to snow ball.
IPO's and PIPE's are not the same thing.
Anyone can invest in an IPO assuming they can get the shares from their broker.
A PIPE is Private Investment In Public Equity. It is a different beast.
http://files.ali-aba.org/thumbs/datastorage/skoobesruoc/pdf/TWRP08_chapter_02_thumb.pdf
<snip>
A PIPE (Private Investment in Public Equity) refers to
any private placement of securities of an already-public
company that is made to selected accredited investors
(usually to selected institutional accredited investors).
See “How is ‘accredited investor’ defined?” In a typical
PIPE transaction, investors enter into a purchase
agreement that commits them to purchase securities and
usually requires the issuer to file a resale registration
statement covering the resale from time to time of the
privately purchased securities.
<snip>
These are the US rules. What the rules are for Canada I don't know. Maybe in Canada you don't have to be an accredited investor to get into a PIPE.
Upon a little more digging...
From a new paper article:
http://atlanta.citybizlist.com/yourcitybiznews/Detail.aspx?id=61373
<snip>
Under a previous debt settlement agreement, signed Aug. 26, Domark had agreed to pay Kidd $150,000 in cash and to transfer 3.5 million common shares of JBI Inc., based in Niagara Falls, Ontario.
<snip>
http://southflorida.citybizlist.com/yourcitybiznews/detail.aspx?id=73052
<snip>
Under the purchase agreement, Kidd also bought 1 million shares and debt of $534,271 that DoMark owed Sieck. Kidd is paying with 250,000 restricted common shares in a Canadian company, JBI Inc., based in Niagara Falls, Ontario.
<snip>
http://www.faqs.org/sec-filings/091130/Domark-International-Inc_8-K/
<snip>
On August 26, 2009, in a Debt Settlement Agreement by and between the Company
and R. Thomas Kidd, any and all debt owed to Mr. Kidd for expenses, advances, or
loans has been settled. The Company agrees to pay Mr. Kidd $150,000 cash and
transfer 3.5 million shares of common stock of TRTN, OTCBB held by us.
<snip>
http://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1365160/000116552709000780/g3549a.txt
<snip>
On August 24, 2009, 310 Holdings, Inc.("310") and the company closed a
Securities Purchase Agreement whereby the 310 purchased 100% of the issued and
outstanding common shares of Javaco in exchange for $150,000 and the issuance of
2,500,000 shares of 310's common stock to Domark. We also entered into a
separate agreement and have assigned $9,997,134 of media credits in print and
radio to 310 Holdings in exchange for the issuance of 1,000,000 shares of 310
Holding's common stock.
<snip>
Looks like JBII got what it wanted and Kidd made out big time.
Quote
____________________________________________________________________
Domark shareholders are organizing a class-action suit and the JBII CEO claims to know of judgements against Kidd.
____________________________________________________________________
And what Kidd's shareholders do to him is not relevant to JBII.
Unless you are suggesting that the not yet filed lawsuit i.e. theoretical lawsuit, will somehow result in the the reversal of the sale to JBII, how is this relevant to JBII?
And if it really did come down that way then you would have what you want...The shares back in the JBII treasury and the Javaco sale reversed.
To be eligible to participate in a PIPE one has to be an accredited investor. The vast majority of folks don't qualify.
I suspect it is because we understand that your logic is based on a false premise.
So far you have not shown that there was fraud in the deal.
Besides Javaco doesn't appear to be a mistake. There is the recent 8K showing a 52% increase in sales.
SteveF you seem to be confusing two different items.
So far no one has shown that the assets transferred from Kidd to JBI are in any way compromised or encumbered.
What does seem to be encumbered are the shares that Kidd received in return for those assets. Those shares were free and clear when they were transferred to Kidd. It is the liabilities that Kidd has created for himself that has caused those shares to be encumbered by the lawsuits against Kidd.
I just picked up another 850 shares.
I'm ready to see what's next......Permits, uplisting.
Smile86 I don't see someone "buying" the trust happening.
I have been wrong before and will be again.
We shall see in the fullness of time.
Who would be interested in buying what little if anything the trust has left in the way of assets?
Even then, it would be an asset sale which would finish the wind down of the trust.
MOSH is in the terminal phase. Period.
If they go Pink, what would be the advantage of trying to go back to the OTCBB?
Unfortunately your story is based upon a misconception.
A trust is not like a stock. 51% ownership doesn't allow you to rewrite the rules or elect a new board as it does in a stock.
A trust is governed by the trust agreement which is very hard to change.
Somerset makes a good fit because it is not a large refinery. The volumes of input it requires are more of a fit for the amounts that JBII will be producing, especially during the start up and build out phases.
JBII has a bit of a chicken and egg problem. Where do they sell the small number of bpd that they will be producing as they go through the permit processes and start up of small number of P2O machines?
If the critics want an issue to raise with Somerset it would be making sure that JBI gets paid for the fuel the ship to them.
I suspect that JB has been working on that issue but it one that requires careful planning.
I did..... And I have bought more since then.
Two reasons that I can think of.
1st... Buy the rumor sell the news mentality.
2nd... Most of the folks that went to the AGM are already in as far as they can afford. Tapped out as it were.
I expect a further drop in price in the next few days as the market makers do a shake. That drop won't last long, maybe a few minutes. maybe a day or so.
Until JBII uplists or starts production there is not a lot of buzz outside our little community.....That will change.
JMHO
Scion... Did you attend the AGM? If so I'd like your take on the proceedings?
Thanks to all you folks that have posted you observations of the AGM. For those of us who were unable to attend your observations have been most welcome.
Steady_T
Slow Pyrolysis....Which explains why that is not a relevant reference.
The JBII process works in less than 4 hrs and uses a catalyst.
The Pyrolyze process described does not if I recall.
www.otcmarkets.com/pink/quote/quote.jsp?symbol=jbii
Gets you a look at the LVL II for free.
According to your line of logic, there should already be a large demand for waste plastic and no company should be paying a tipping fee to dispose of it.
Aye, there's the rub. The reality is that companies are still paying a tipping fee to dispose of waste plastic.
You are also correct in saying that at some point P2O processors will likely have to pay for waste plastic. What you fail to discuss when you are talking about market forces is HOW MANY P2O PROCESSORS WILL HAVE TO BE ONLINE before the demand is sufficient to change the markets dynamics.
There will have to be several thousand processors spread over the US to begin to utilize enough plastic to where there will be competition for waste recycled plastic. As you point out supply and demand will kick in, but there are several interesting things about the supply and demand situation for waste plastic.
The supply is unlike most market driven items because it is a byproduct of something else that is in great demand. So the supply is being generated to the point that companies are paying to get rid of it.
The demand is currently SO LOW that companies have to pay to get rid of it.
Once the demand starts to grow, companies will be quite happy to deliver the waste plastic for free to avoid the tipping charges.
Only later in the growth cycle will there be enough demand for waste plastic that companies will be able to charge a fee for it.
For that to happen JBII will have to have a large number of P2O processors in operation, and will be making quite a bit of money.
So maybe in 5 to 10 years P2O processors will have to pay a fee for input plastic, until then I don't believe it will be an issue.
And if it becomes an issue sooner than that it will be because JBII has been more successful in rolling out P2O processors than anyone has thought.
I think that is the catalyst cost rather than the cost of the plastic that is being referred to in the filing.