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Tax losses ain't happening anymore!
It was, but with the new Freedom Motors Cities and Moller VTOL's, everything has changed. It's taking off!!!!
Tax losses can be worth millions
Previous post going back in time you said this is done
Time frame informing us
Nope. I just can read between the lines. This is huge news and management will inform us soon. That's why the patents in the vault are worth billions. Plus the existing ones.
NO OFFENCE, I think you are kidding around and we are done here
All over the internet. "Freedom" (as in Freedom Motors) cities and VTOL (Moller holds a patent on VTOL). Massive news and we will be seeing this in late 2024. Just search "Freedom Cities VTOL"
Where did you find this
With the big news of Moller supplying VTOL to the 10 new Freedom cities, trading will resume quickly.
He needs to get this trading again
Maybe not. AI can just keep writing a press announcement every 10 years or so.
I'm pretty sure we would have heard if Doctor Moller had passed on.
Not that there's anything happening now, but Doctor Moller's passing will be the true end of the story.
I just wonder if he's still alive.
A week ago (February 7th), another Moller patent:
U.S. Patent 6808140 - Vertical Take Off and Landing Vehicles
...expired. This appears to cover a twin engined Moller concept, presumably an M200 design. It can be seen here: U.S. Patent 6808140
This means that the only remaining patent of Moller International or Paul Moller that remains in force is:
U.S. Patent D736140 - Vertical take off and landing vehicle (Essentially the most current design for the M400 with foldy wings) - Expires August 11, 2029
Moller has ceased operations.
Flying car patents still have
Patents can be worth millions billions patent
A week ago (October 12th), another Moller patent:
U.S Patent 6450445 - Stabilizing control apparatus for robotic or remotely controlled flying platform
...expired.
This means that the only remaining patents of Moller International or Paul Moller that remain in force are:
U.S. Patent 6808140 - Vertical Take Off and Landing Vehicles - Expires February 7, 2023.
U.S. Patent D736140 - Vertical take off and landing vehicle (Essentially the most current design for the M400 with foldy wings) - Expires August 11, 2029
This website https://daviswiki.org/Moller_International provides an excellent history of Paul Moller and the Skycar. I just inserted the entire Skycar Blog to this site. It can be found under "2011 - Oct. 5" in the chronology. The Blog got pretty crazy leading up to the Oct. 11, 2011 demo flight, which of course never happened! Hilarity ensued!
I haven't posted here in exactly a year.
Why isn't that hard to understand. Nothing has been happening, so there isn't anything to write about.
What *has* been interesting is that almost no one else has posted anything either. No posts whatsover for seven months, then a request for information on how to sell Freedom Motors shares, and an article from Popular Mechanics about batteries. That's it for the last year.
In terms of posts on the Freedom Motors blog - there have been a grand total of two in the past year. The December update references the most recent newsletter, which features the usual shaggy dog stories about how Freedom Motors funding is just around the corner, but hasn't quite happened yet (with some COVID inspired variations on the usual theme). The newsletter also explains regarding the exchange of Moller International shares for Freedom Motors shares (proposed back in 2019 after Moller shares were deregistered) - "until funding for Freedom Motors is received, it is not reasonable to complete an offer to exchange MI shares for FM shares." The December newsletter also states "FM receives numerous requests to buy its stock" while also stating that discounted shares at 97.5 cents each are available. These shares have been available at that price since January 2019 - presumably there hasn't been a lot of interest.
The most recent blog post was in early February. It was only a paragraph long, and contains so few specifics that it's not even worth commenting on.
In media, the only recent references to Moller International are as a historical note in reference to other companies working in the personal VTOL/air taxi space, as an explanation for why some people find the concept hard to take seriously, or as an analog for a dodgy looking company in the field.
Even the true believers here seem to have given up. Too bad, really - they were entertaining.
Where can i sell stock in freedom motors. I have certificate
Sorry, I missed one patent:
U.S. Patent 6808140 - Vertical Take Off and Landing Vehicles - Expires February 7, 2023.
(It's listed under Paul Moller rather than Moller International, so it doesn't come up in the same listing as the others).
This covers a Skycar concept with two big engine nacelles, with small fans in the nose and tail (I assume for pitch control during vertical flight). I think this was the M200 concept.
A minor milestone today - Another one of Moller International's patents has expired.
U.S. Patent 6325603 - Charged cooled rotary engine -- was filed on June 24, 2000, and thus expires today.
This means that the only Moller International patents that haven't expired are:
U.S. Patent 6450445 - Stabilizing control apparatus for robotic or remotely controlled flying platform - Expires October 12, 2021
U.S. Patent D736140 - Vertical take off and landing vehicle (Essentially the most current design for the M400 with foldy wings) - Expires August 11, 2029
Any day now...
This time is different...
Paul will never let us down...
Soon to the moon...
Negotiations with strategic partners...
Joint venture...
Before year end...
This spring, weather permitting...
huge public and media interest...
China...
Philippines...
M400...
M600...
Neuera...
Moller should contact...
Moller millionaires...where are you????
I see MI/FM published a newsletter. Why they do this, I don't know. It looks like they only have about two fans left.
Something that makes me laugh time and time and time again is statements they make like the following: "Many battery-powered Personal Air Vehicles (PAV) have been developed; however, none has proven that they can fly over 50 miles at over 100 mph. or land at a curb, which is essential for general usage."
1) Moller's vehicles, or engines for that matter, has also not proven they can do this. Moller, you hovered your vehicle around for a couple of minutes.
2) Land at a curb...um...most of the eVTOL developments are significantly smaller than Moller's latest 'designs', so I don't know what they base this BS on.
One thing that Moller CAN do is come up with excuses. Yes, their lack of progress now can be filed under the COVID-19 pandemic, but really, throwing in a dash of 'protest action' is a bit much. Just like when they blamed the 'regime change' in China for the fact that their $480 mil deal fell through. Yet, other companies (like the now dead Martin Jetpack) managed to secure Chinese funding in that same time.
There is only one thing to to Moller and that is to shut up and fade away. I would have said fade away with dignity, but this company has no dignity left.
Talking about "stealing" Moller's ideas...
I just saw an article...
"Chinese passenger drone manufacturer EHang has officially entered into a partnership with Shenzhen tourism company LN Holdings to create the world’s first ‘UAM themed’ hotel."
Sound familiar?
Well...to be fair...Moller's plan was to build not one, but two 5 star hotels in China...
It must be sad for the old man to see his dreams made true by other people...
Here's a link to the article...complete with a video of journalists taking actual rides in an actual vehicle that is not tethered to a crane...
https://transportup.com/headlines-breaking-news/vehicles-manufactures/ehang-will-build-the-worlds-first-uam-hotel-in-collaboration-with/
I have noticed the shift to Cargo drones as opposed to passenger carrying VTOL aircraft.
It is sad. Unfortunately with the Covid-19 pandemic and the effect it is having on the global economy I cannot see much investment going into eVTOL 'flying cars' in the near future.
I do understand that some breakthroughs in battery technology is necessary for eVTOL aircraft to become really viable, but people are on the right track.
For many years I also realized that Rotary engines are also not the answer, though...
The dominant reaction by the Facebook crew was that the Sabrewing craft (essentially a drone) somehow "stole" Moller's design.
Well, if Sabrewing "stole" Moller's design, then Moller "stole" his design from the Bell X-22. The only resemblance that the two craft have is that they are both lifted/propelled by ducted fans at the four corners. (As was the Bell X-22). Otherwise, I don't see any of Moller's hallmarks -- no vanes to redirect the thrust, no foldy wings, and most important of all, no rotary engines. (Ed de Reyes has gone over to the dark side and embraced <gasp> electric propulsion!)
Ed does state that the Sabrewing design was "influenced by his earlier work as an engineer and test pilot on the Moller 400". It also states that the design was influenced by the Northrop Grumman Global Hawk.
Sabrewing seems to have evolved out of Elytron/Converticopter, with Ed and Oliver Garrow being closely connected with both. The Converticopter web site is now returning a 404 error, so perhaps the company is defunct. There also appears to be a connection with Thorntail (remember them?). The mailing address for Sabrewing on the company's web site (www.sabrewingaircraft.com) is identical to the mailing address that Thorntail was using back in 2014.
The VTOL industry does seem to be shifting more in the direction of cargo drones, rather than passenger craft (see https://evtol.news/2020/03/06/cargo-evtol-matures/). It might be a matter of scale -- Passenger VTOL probably requires a craft with a minimum payload of 250 kg or so to be useful, while drones can do useful work at much smaller sizes, which can be scaled up as the state of the art improves. Also, if your cargo drone crashes, it's far less likely to generate headlines (and lawsuits) than a passenger carrying craft.
I just read an article, of which I will put a link below, about Ed De Reyes' EVTOL aircraft. The article references Moller. It is a very badly written article with many inaccuracies regarding VTOL, like claiming "In the early 2000s, the Moller International Skycar became the first non-helicopter vertical takeoff and landing aircraft to actually get off the ground". The author probably never heard of the Osprey, the Harrier or any of the many experimental VTOL's like the X-22.
Anyway. it seems like Ed De Reyes, Moller's former test pilot now has his own company that aims to get into the electric VTOL market. Any Moller fanboys want to comment on this?
It must be hard for you guys. Ed gave Moller a bit of credibility a couple of years ago, so you guys were quite taken with him. Now that he has committed to an electric aircraft, the one thing that fanboys unanimously bash, it must be quite a shock...
Ahhhh...old Ed. He invited me to Moller's one failed 'test flight' as his guest and the un-invited me after giving a fanboy a hard time. Good times. And I'm yet to be proven wrong. Randy will probably delete my post again...because anybody whose view is not Randy's view is labelled a troll....
https://www.defenseone.com/technology/2020/04/flying-car-future-looks-flying-cars-past/164995/
flaflyersfan, obviously you didn't read my entire post.
Obviously you didn't read any of my previous posts.
I am well aware of Moller's stock situation.
I myself used the spike in share price during the 2012 "$480 million China Deal" craze to offload my stock. The price went up enough for me to sell my shares and break even. Unlike other fanboy stockholders, who call themselves "Moller Millionaires", I never purchased stock with the vision of becoming a rich man off it. I owned a handful of shares just because I wanted to be part of something I believed in. Even if I held on to my shares it would not have hurt me in this situation, like others.
I still believe in the dream, I just don't believe that Paul Moller will be the one at the forefront of achieving that dream.
As I described in my post, the fiasco with the 2011 "Public Testflight", otherwise known as the "Porta potty event", was my final turning point from being a Moller fan, although doubt had started setting in many years ago.
My post was merely me pondering whether Paul Moller would live to see his dream of "going to school in a VTOL" be realized, albeit by someone else and not himself.
Po3sHare, MLER stock was Revoked. It is gone forever and everyone that did not sell lost their entire investment.
Good luck.
Last night I couldn't sleep. Due to COVID-19, the daily news on 'flying cars' all but stopped completely. I decided to scratch in the archives of flying car news and I came upon the 1991 Popular Mechanics cover story on the Moller Skycar. About 30 years ago, that article changed my life.
In 1991 I was 12 years old. At 12 you truly believed everything you read in the media. Since I can remember I had been fascinate by everything flying. My parents took me to every airshow close by. My dream, since about the age of 3 was to become a pilot. More specific, a fighter pilot.
In 1989 a movie called "Robot Jox" was released. I watched the movie with my mother. In this movie the protagonist owns a flying car. This was my very first introduction to the concept of a personal flying vehicle that can be used on a daily basis that doesn't require a runway. When the hero of the film used his flying car to travel home after retiring from piloting a huge fighting robot, my mother spoke these words "One day, when you are an adult, there really will be flying cars." Her words stuck in my head.
Two years later I came upon the Moller article. I was completely blown away. The article opens with a glimpse into the future where a man in 1999 gets into his Moller Skycar, starts it up (with the two on-board computers checking the engines), pulls it out of the garage and from his driveway the Skycar lifts of 'silently' and after 'hover checks' the man zips off to work...
I did the math. By 1999 I would be 20. I would be an adult, so what was going to stop me from owning that beautiful machine? My future was set. Just like the guy in 'Robot Jox' I would come home from a day of piloting fighter jets (where he piloted giant robots) and land my bright red Skycar in my driveway.
I cut the article out of the magazine, put it in a plastic sleeve and re-read it about a thousand times. I kept it with my other 'treasures', the place where I kept my most prized toys. When I was 14 we went on vacation and our house was burgled. The only thing that they left in the house was a broken TV. My article was gone.
Also some time later I read a DC Comics "Starman" comic and at the close of the story the superhero is offered a lift in a "Moller Skycar". In my mind it told me that Skycars was on everybody's minds.
I never forgot about Moller, his Skycar and his promise.
In my late teens I even found the Skycar in books in the Library. By then doubt started creeping into my mind. I was nearing 20 and nobody owned a Skycar.
Still, I didn't forget.
In the mid 2000's I gained access to the internet. Honest to suzie, one of the first things I googled was "Moller Skycar" and lo and behold, there was a website! Paul Moller was still working on it!
Unfortunately the website was not the only thing that was on the internet about the Skycar. There where many articles on Paul Moller. Some good, but many where bad. Critical. They were calling him a crook. A snake oil salesman. He had cheated his stockholders out of a lot of money by making misleading statements. I got angry. Not at Moller, but at the media trying to destroy this man's dream.
I found blog's and message boards. I found other people equally enthusiastic about this dream as me. There where a few people on this blog critical of Moller. I hated them. Why rain on my parade? Why rain on Moller's parade? But, alas, some of them made sense. I ignored them. Why listen to their poison?
Then came 2011. In October the Skycar would fly at last in front of the media. Like other fanboys (some where real estate millionaires and some had MBA's, how could I not be in good company?), I grabbed my pom-pom's and cheered. But, as the date of the demonstration flight neared I started noticing how the company handled the situation. Their own posts went from 'It is definitely going to happen', to 'We are positive it is going to happen, to 'Get off our backs! This is not as easy as it looks!' to complete silence by the end.
And that was my watershed moment.
Since then Paul Moller has declared that he was always overly optimistic.
Last night I also looked at his TED talk, his one lecture at his old University (I think), a lunch that was taped with him and 'Mr Future' and I cannot help but feel sorry for him.
If the 'hummingbird' story is to be believed, them he has had his dream of personal VTOL flight for nearly 80 years. 80 years. As someone who has had to let go of dreams I can only think how he must feel.
Unlike me, he has worked very hard to realize those dreams, but now, his own dream of bringing a 'Volantor' to market must feel as far away as ever. There is no money to continue his work. The prospects of Freedom Motors, in my own opinion, is all talk and no cash.
But, listening to his TED talk, his lectures and interviews one must confess that his vision of the future of personal transportation is almost exactly the same as the one that Uber and the likes are professing now. The only differences being that Moller always had the idea of individuals owning Skycars, where the current train of thought is hailing these vehicles like taxis as opposed to owning one.
Paul Moller is turning 84 this year. I know he is working very hard on 'life extension' for himself. I know his Skycar will never fly, but my hope for him is to see people traveling from 'vertiports' in VTOL aircraft before he passes on.
On another note, all these EVTOL aircraft are cool, but none still look as good as the M400 Skycar. Especially the one often referred to as the "Merlin".
Those were good times.
In October 2011 I posted a message on the Moller Blog as Jah Mackey, the wonderful PR guy. You could post a message using any name you wanted, totally uncontrolled! I made an announcement that Moller had reached a production deal with North Korea to build the Skycar! Hilarity ensued! Fanboy JEFF said there would be a lawsuit! This was the same time as the infamous public flight which was to be held on October 11, 2011, but was canceled as they wouldn't be able to handle the flood of attendees. Using my company (Very Big Aviation company) email address, I as even able to offer a sponsorship and obtain an invitation. Amazing times! I copied the entire blog, from Sept 3, 2010 to October 6, 2011, after which the blog was removed.
Go back in time until before trading was suspended, sell them.
Alternatively...
Go back in time, slap the younger you silly for ever thinking that buying this stock was a good idea.
I offloaded my stock years ago. 2012, I think. I used the little spike in the price after the $480 mil "China deal" was announced to sell off all my shares. I managed to break even.
Anybody remember that deal? You know, the one that included not one, but two 5 star hotels...the one where all the fanboys again said "But this time is different!".
Why don't the Facebook page posters refer to themselves as the "Moller millionaires" anymore?
Shaken Not Stirred, you cannot;
It is over. MLER will never trade again.
Good luck
My comments on the newsletter:
- "we prototyped a 54cc compound engine that is projected to produce 10
hp on methanol and is the size of a grapefruit." - The key word in this
sentence is "projected", again with the projections, never with results
of testing.
- "The reason for this prototype is to cater the overwhelming demand for small engines of this class in the Asia Pacific markets (APAC). Our partners who represent us in APAC has indicated through their market research that the demand for this class of engine is over 50 million engines per year." - Can we see the so-called market research? What methodology was used? Did it involve the sucking of a thumb? I think we can all agree that any 'market research' coming from the Moller camp in the past involved the sucking of a thumb.
- "More in the technology front, our 150cc engine demonstration model with hydrogen as primary fuel is coming along well." - Ever notice in the last 50 years how they have never said XXX 'is done'? Always busy. Always coming along. Nothing ever gets finished. Ever.
- "We estimate that we have accomplished over 90% of this model and wish to complete the remaining 10% within the next 8 weeks." - Anybody willing to bet that 20 weeks from now it still will not be done?
- "We continue to assist our demonstration partner out of Canada who is in the final preparations for using our 530cc engine with biogas fuel. We hope to put this into operation within the next few weeks." - Again, willing to bet by year end they will say the same.
- "Nevertheless, we will continue to move forward with our prototypes and models planned this year and are determined to mass produce by the end of this year." - Hahahahah! Always good to end a newsletter with humor.
Mr Smith highlighted all the other stuff.
Fanboys are delighted I assume.
Whatever happened to the global currency revaluation loonies? Why don't they mention them anymore?
And all these nameless companies...oh, wait, non-disclosure agreements. On the other hand, they are hocking engines, little grapefruit sized ones, not state secrets.
Who knows? It's certainly interesting that it wasn't considered noteworthy enough to mention in the newsletter.
It's also interesting that the newsletter doesn't say anything about David Sastry (who admitted that he is "not as engaged" with Freedom Motors as previously - make of that what you will), or anything about Naveen Madishetty (announced as the Freedom Motors Chief Advisor for Sustainability in India back in July, and then never referred to again), or the Memorandums of Understanding with Alturair and Stratus Environmental (announced December 2018 and then never referred to again). It's almost like they're making bogus announcements to fake credibility or something, although we know they would never, *ever* do that.
In fact, the only mention that anything related to Moller International has gotten on the blog in almost two years was the delisting of the stock, and the fire at Paul Moller's ranch. You kind of get the impression that Moller is an embarrassment that they wish they could make disappear, as it drags down any remaining credibility that Freedom Motors has left. The continuing expression of interest in Moller International in the comments on the blog, despite the lack of mention of it in recent times, may be an element in why the commenting on the blog was disabled.
Some of the fanboys on the Facebook page seem to have read the newsletter a little differently, stating that as a result of reading it, "they can see the light at the end of the tunnel". Too bad it's actually an oncoming train.
And what happened to the Mler to FM exchange of shares options
How do you propose I sell this turd of a stock I’m tied into? You wanna by my shares!?
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Moller International (MLER)
http://www.otcmarkets.com/stock/MLER/news
*** TOP REASONS TO BUY MLER ***
The Rotapower® Engine
Moller International (MLER) has developed a lightweight cutting edge rotary engine technology, called Rotapower®. It is vibration free with twice the power and one third the weight and size of the engine it is replacing designed AND the company has developed for the first and only feasible, personally affordable, personal vertical takeoff and landing (VTOL) vehicle the world has ever seen. (Flying cars called volanters the future is here!) It produces 3 Hp per each 1lbs
Moller International (MLER) has exclusively licensed its Rotapower® rotary engine production and distribution to Freedom Motors except for aircraft and ducted fans. Everytime Freedom Motors sells an engine Moller International (MLER) gets a cut!!
Freedom Motors agreement with Moller International (MLER) provides for a 5% royalty on engine sales and 30% of any revenue Freedom Motors receives from sub-license agreements it makes.
Freedom Motors has contracted with Moller International (MLER) to provide all engine development and now owes Moller International (MLER) approximately $4 million for these services
BUT IT GETS EVEN BETTER:
Moller International (MLER) focusing on it's sky car production has already received orders with deposits for its Skycar 200 and Firefly volantors. The Skycar is capable of vertical take-off and landing (VTOL) similar to a helicopter and flies from point of departure to destination much like an airplane. However, the Skycar has been designed to also travel at low speed for short distances on the ground like an automobile. It has fold-up wings which make it narrow enough to be usable on roadways. All this and, incredibly, it's easy to fly!
Neuera/Firefly volantors
There is an exception in the FAA rules for airplanes that weigh less than about 1400lbs. They are called Light Sport Aircraft (LSA). Moller International (MLER) plan to work with the FAA to create a category for powered lift aircraft which has the advantages of the LSA category. The Neuera/Firefly is a is particularly suitable for: Border Patrol, Search and Rescue and Utility Use or ATV replacement. Getting the Neuera/Firefly is now the priority, since it will talk the least amout of FAA Regs to jump over to get it certified.
Awesome share structure, as of February 19, 2015 there were 150M A/S and 69,379,796 shares of common stock outstanding meaning that when the share price rises it can rise quickly with the limited number of shares available!
Moller International (MLER) will eventually be uplisted to a senior exchange if it is not purchased by a bigger company which is highly likely! Currently MLER shares are trading around a penny, with it's new revenues and continued growth look for MLER to be trading in the multi dollar range within 12 months.
President and Chairman of the Board Dr. Moller has received 43 patents including the first U.S. patent on a fundamentally new form of powered lift aircraft
Moller International (MLER)
http://www.moller.com/
Freedom Motors
http://www.freedom-motors.com/
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