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well, a bird in the hand (tax writeoff) is worth 2 in the bush (long shot shell company worth a squat)
it is a legal trade...sold it to Scottrade itself
Well the IRS defines worthless in its code, and makes you do alot to prove it worthless.
I basically sold my shares for 1-cent total to Scottrade itself making it a legal trade.
"Instead of doing all the research involved with proving to the IRS that a security is worthless, consider selling the security to your broker. That way, you actually have a confirmed sale to establish value. Also, if the security is worth a few dollars, you can lock in the capital loss deduction immediately without waiting for the security to be completely worthless. It is imperative that the transfer of the security be a valid sale."
Just a FYI for Scottrade people...I filed a worthless stock form with them, and they cleared my account of the shares..at least I can start taking the losses at tax time.
technically under the tax code...no...cuz this pos is still on the grey market, and technically not delisted. However, I'm unclear as to whether it was ever legally registered to begin with. Anyhoo, Scottrade pays like 1-cent which makes it a legal trade and closes the pos off my account.
Those with Scottrade can file a request for removal of worthless securities for 2008 tax purposes. Form is on their web site.
Knowles: Hide..watch...learn...he pled G U I L T Y. Facts always outweigh innuendo, theory, insinuation, supposition, speculation, gossip, untruths, lies, conspiracy theories and all other unfounded ramblings. He pled guilty because he is guilty....accept it...it's reality.
You got to be be kidding me...CPAs said those were fine. LOL. Bogus from revenues to retained earnings. And yes, it DOES matter that he signed off on the unaudited as to his credibility, truthfulness and knowledge of his company's financial position.
Fhanen...you got to be JOKING...print them off, take to any CPA, and watch him or her laugh you out of the office. Don't forget to tell hi or her that a CEO signed off on them too. LOL
We dissceted them quite well a long time ago. Go back and READ.
Headcounselor: You see the tactic...all your posts are answered by the enablers with cutesie questions like...are you sure? If they had ANY substance in the REAL viability of this company, they'd answer with verifiable fact. Their lack of answers is an answer. This company has about as much life and future as does a cow pattie in the prairie.
Dano: ya mean the doors aren't open, someone isn't answering the phone, the lights aren't on, they aren't making sales, they don't have employees? Good lordy...call Knowles...he'll have a spin on that....probably just closed for Leap Day. LOL
MRuWinky...exactly. There is NO REASONABLE DOUBT that JP made those investor videos that included false information disseminated on a public venue along with publicly posting false unaudited financials twice, publicly posting false statements within PR releases via his PR firm.
This is no Happy Ending Fairytale others try to spin for his innocence based on conspiracies and JP being duped by others.
Fhanen: You got to be joking, or in severe denial. Who would believe anything the company reported such as share count to someone who simply calls on the telephone after all that has been revealed about the outright lies issued by the company and its CEO? Simply laughable and too funny.
Ask the company?! Too funny. I got some ocean property in the Sahara for ya?
Fhanen...can you tell me how you verified the outstanding share count? I mean verified, not speculation.
Knowles...for a guy who allegedly doesn't have any personal or business connection with JP or CK operations, you sure seem to know where he is, and what he or the company is doing...or are you simply speculating?
I finally agree with you on something...yes, the trial has not started, the outscome is not known. Finally, a statement of fact from you.
Sandvet: The only "secure storage" he'll know in the future will be the Federal Prison System hopefully.
stating that the FBI allegations are actual fact? or is the statement you mentioned below your opinion based on the FBI\SEC allegations?
Those are charges not allegations.
I haven't seen any convictions yet nor have I seen the SEC pull Plant from the position of CEO or kept CyberKey from doing continued business.
Convictions do not come until the result of a trial. There is no verifiable proof Cyberkey is doing business.
So you know for a fact that Plant was the leader in falsifying a government contract with Homeland Security?
No other person involved in the false contract has been charged. Please provide proof he was not the leader or complicit with others. Please verify others who have been charged in reference to the false contract.
The fact is that Plant's attorney will only have to prove reasonable doubt, that's it!!!!!!
The 2 keywords are "reasonable" and "doubt" not simply doubt. Therefore, it not as simplistic as you describe.
Me have insider information, surely you jest.
You've made many public statements that to a reasonable person indicate some degree of insider information aka contact with those who work there, or have direct knowledge obtained from others who know those who work there. IMHO.
Fact: Jim Plant publicly stated receipts of $18-million as a result of the contract.
Fact: Jim Plant stated audited financials were being prepared when they were not.
Fact: Jim Plant promoted and advertised products such as Child ID Key, Web Portal for Nascar that did not exist
Fact: Jim Plant approved and signed unaudited financials stating false revenues, expenses, income, retained earnings on the balance sheet. Not once but twice and they were publicly posted.
Fact: No other individual(s) except JP and Ruth have been charged to date which lends credence to his and her sole complicity in this scam, and ruins your comspiracy (duped) theory.
Fact: JP sold more than $1-million worth of shares yet claimed to have $millions in revenue and profits from which he could be paid a higher salary, dividend distributions etc.
FACT: JP stated CK owned patents yet they owned none verifiable.
There are no independently prepared financials publicly posted to prove any of your "allegations" that the company is doing business, is a viable entity in the business world. I see nothing in the legal docuemnts filed by the govt prohibiting CK from disclosing that information. The attorney said no? Just another excuse in a laundry list of excuses by the company and its minions.
Knowles....once again the typical positive innuendo...please define specifically the generality of "a lot is happening". Of course alot happens the closer one gets to a trail. Alot happens the closer one gets to Christmas Day too. Good grief.
Don't need the lawyers number. Lawyers get "paid" to defend. Doesn't mean they believe or disbelieve a client, but only to put up the best defense for money. Give us the number of the CPA firm JP uses now to post all those big sales you insinuate CK is making that will takes us to DA Moon.
Knowles: There is always an excuse as to why JP can't provide information except through those who speak with him (the little innner circle that changes yet carries out his edicts) then they come up with hearsay, innuendo and positive pie-in-the sky scenarios without any chance of verifying it.
I think most intelligent people can see through your condescending tone, overinflated ego and demeanor, and your effort to discredit me in your last post by indicating I use the board to vent " board rage"....far from it, Sir. I am not angry in the least bit so don't try to go there.
Once again, you use diversionary tactics to avoid the fundamental issue as to why the company is in this present condition in nomads land, and it along with its CEO, facing federal charges.
Wouldn't waste 10-cents to make that useless trip...and it is totally unnecessary....all JP has to do is release verifiable business data from a CPA firm like P&L, Balance Sheet, Cash Flow Statements....would solve alot of the controversy. Problem is he won't do it because those documents would show this is a DEAD company. If all was sooo great like you and Knowles contend, then JP would be chomping at the bit to get that info public YESTERDAY.
Knowles: You are so full of self righteousness it borders on sickening. I have no pity party. I lost FAR less than you did on this POS which by your thinking makes me smarter than you. I dont like to lose money, but I have nobody to blame but myself for staying in this POS too long. I can take ownership of that mistake. The return on that loss will be the day JP heads to be a cellmate with bubba.
I have a life too Knowles, a nice one at that, and yours centers on being JP's one man rendition of Big Apple.
Yes, please head to a sandy beach and sip sweet umbrella drinks...could you leave tomorrow? LOL
Knowles, you state: "If you don't wish to settle for the doors being open, the phones being answered, employees and the bills paid then you will have to settle for watching closely to what happens within the next three to four months as the clarity I see unfolds."
(1) no, I don't settle for doors, phones, employees, bills paid without verification from a reliable source and you are not a reliable source. Once again, please tell all of us (a) number of employees and their titles/duites, (b) the total monthly expenditures and revenue from keeping those doors open and phones answered from a P&L signed off by a reputable CPA firm. Not even asking for audited numbers, just the quarterly P-L, Balance Sheet, Cash Flow Statements from a reputable CPA firm. How hard is that for any small business? Not hard at all. We use a CPA every quarter to review accounting. Jimmy can't do that yet you state he has a REAL business right now? Hmmmm.
The clarity you see is through rose-colored glasses. Nothing wrong with being positive. There is alot wrong with spewing innuedo like you have some inside info, and trying to bend it with positve slant. Your diversionary tactics to remove the focus from the basics that got CK where it is today....JP's false public statements, both written and verbal, about a DHS contract, large government agency contract, receiving millions in revenues in the bank, audited financials being prepared, uplisting to Nasdaq, web portals, all types of ID Keys, patents etc.
Once again are you going to try to tell all of us in your positive demeanor that he was duped by others into doing all this, and he was just a passive bystander who has been wronged by very unscrupulous associates? He would have had to be as ignorant as a rock. Sorry, I don't by that scenario and if you deem that negative then I belong to a community of them who got burned here.
Yes, there is ZERO below that Knowles. Savior...hmmm, thanks but actually I plan to offer the opposing view to your unsubstantiated innuendo that could cause the unsuspecting to buy this POS even at .0001.
Still trading? LOL. Good lordy...that's a classic...what a couple of hundred bucks worth! Anyone can be paid minimum wage to answer a phone with the greeting Cyberkey Solutiuons. Please provide me exact, verified sales revenue numbers via a CPA approved P&L, Balance Sheet, Cash Flow Statements, or stop stating unsubstantiated innuendo about sales.
The "we" tense is my mind speaking to me telling me "we" had about all we can take of your unsubstantiated claims about the good health of the company. You remind me of games between children "I know something you don't know" which is mindless for a person of your advanced educational level.
Step up to the plate Knowles...provide facts, verifiable ones, your sources for the verifiable facts, or just keep being JP's PR guy. I suspect you'll be the latter.
Knowles..I certainly plan to keep my day job which has nothing to do with the basic issue here, and my intent is to keep posting about Jim Plant's lies to shareholders that are based on FACTS rather than your shameless innuendo pumping that strongly indicates some form of direct or indirect communication with JP, or related associates that exonerates him, and is and will make the company a viable and respected company in the business world. It is remarks presently like yours, Robo's that previously cost shareholders money by insinuating some kind of positive knowledge above what was public at the time...that's pumping, plain and simple, IMHO.
So you and Robo can try to make upsubstantiated statements like...only way to go is up from here, they're still in business and selling product, she's got legs etc but you will be challenged to back it up with FACT...verifiable fact. Your efforts and Robos efforts to ask why we are here to bash a .0001 stock, or we don't hold shares is infantile. A tactic used by the previous pumpers to eliminate challenger and detractors who came forward with verified facts before the government moved in on CK. You think you may be embarrasing us, you embarras yourself.
We have a right under the constitution to speak freely on a public forum, and I personally got stuck holding this POS...so I can speak my mind freely for that too. My intent is also to see justice served, and if I think he's guilty, then that is my right to express based on his public statements.
Knowles...the is NO verifiable proof of your diatribe about alot going on in the background, product selling, a viable business. You come across as nothing more than an advance man and PR guy for JP. We do have a clue....JP is charged, he LIED about the contract, he lied about millions in revenues, millions in receipts, audited financials, the MYFAN key, CHILDID key, all the CRAPOLAKEYS and web portals etc. Also, only he and Ruth have been charged...NOBODY else, right or wrong, NOBODY else to date has been charged except those two persons. Oh, you going to claim the FBI and SEC have botched that too? LOL
Knowles...more of your diversionary tactics away from the main issue that JP lied to shareholders and nobody had a gun to his head when he did it. No contract, no receipts in the million of dollars, no audited financials...and NOBODY duped him into saying those things on PRs and public videos.
Again, I challenge you and the other JP minions to file a formal complaint with the FTC and CPSC if your are so 100% positive the Biolvault and Keepsafe are junk.
But once again, a diversion from the basic issue of the charges against JP that do NOT involve the Keepsafe.
There is absolutely no need to hit it with a hammer. I never assumed that it was "destruction proof" and Sequiam never made such a claim in any verbal or written material. The one who actually implied that (indestructible nature) via advertising was JP and Cyberkey with their Fingers ads for print and video media.
Well said Goldenstar, and if the others feel so strongly with their "junk" claims then they need to address the issue with the FTC and CPSC. What I find so ironic is that JP continued to sell the Keepsafe inventory. Obviously he was more concerned with money/sales than waving a consumer protection flag and pulling the item. That speaks volumes about the allegations of junk.
I still have my Keepsafe...works like a charm.
Knowles: He knew well before the final investors video and the release of the December unaudited financials that he did not have a contract YET he still told shareholders he did and collected $18m of it. He also signed off on bogus unaudited numbers knowingly and willingly. He also said AFs were in the works. All of it untruthful.
The size of the comapny has nothing to do with law. It has to do with one's own ability to oversee the operation especially items like the validity of a contract, and his bank balance at the VERY least. From everything I've read here, he was a hands-on person (described as a control freakby many) in a very small company YET knew nothing of a bogus contract, or his own financies? Come on. These people just led him down the wrong path and he wore rose-colored glasses or blinders? Doubtful, very doubtful.
I only speculate that the doors remain open, not due to sales but funds JP stashed from the "better days" at CK. Doesn't take much monthly funds to provide the appearance of a business...rent, phone, electric and a small hourly wage to a receptionist or answering service.
What do we have to lose? We lost it already...our cash. I'm also a shareholder, but you pass judgment on so many people here and indicative of your close-minded nature, and overly biased self-righteousness.
I wonder if you have driven thru a brick wall that's clouded your logic and reason.
Robo: "knowingly and willingly, beyond reasonable doubt." Are you trying to tell us that JP did NOT knowingly and willingly make public video statements, and issue public statements via his PR firm about (1) DHS contract (2) contract with large govt agency (3) $25m revenue (4) $18m collected (5) audited financial being prepared (6) publicly released and signed off by JP on unaudited financials in June and December showing $12m+ profits.
There is NO reasonable doubt that he did these things, said these things, issued these statements.
This alleged CEO was not in a large corporation overseeing 100s or 1000s of employees. He knew EXACTLY what was going on each and every day. Did he do it all alone? No, I don't believe so, but nevertheless, he is ultimately responsible for his personal actions, decisions, statements.
Those of you claiming he was duped...well, then you are simply saying he was an idiot, but now, telling us he's some brillant leader who will prove his innocence, save the company, and recover our losses. Will he part the Red Sea and walk on water too?
And NO, we can also go straight to ZERO...and NOT up as you often proclaim in your pumping.
Knowles: I understand no press releases because they have NOTHING to tout that is positive so their silence is worth 1.5-million words...uh, dollars.
Again, where are the P&Ls for the first three quarters. Extremely easy to do for any legit accountant. No public or legal prohibition on releasing such info. I assume he could ask Ruth to generate some showing $25-mil in sales, and you'd believe it.
Oh sure Knowles, beta testing another pipe dream! You still buying that crapola? Good lordy.
That's very clear as to their intent. They aren't even subtle about it.
In other words, you can't answer them but make MEANINGLESS statements about the stock trading, doors open, lights on and the other common fodder used by the spindoctors here, trying but failing misearably, to add any sense of credibility to this company and its CEO.
If all is soooo great as you, Knowles and others vainly allege then it would not be difficult for JP to provide any of answers to those questions to you, Knowles or the PUBLIC at large. There would be NOTHING legally to prevent him from doing so EXCEPT reality of NOTHING.
Okay, you want to ignore the fundamental questions that are the basis for the charges, then please answer some new ones.
1. What is the present sales figures for the 3 quarters ending September 2007?
2. What are the expenses for the same period?
3. Logically, what then is the net profit for the same period?
4. How many salaried employees work at Cyberkey Solutions, and what are their exact title?
5. How many non-exempt employees?
6. What are the exact Retained Earning from the close of business on December 31, 2006. What is the Stockholders' present equity?
7. What sales contracts are being fulfilled and with whom?
8. What exact products/services/value added is being sold excluding the 3 flash drives listed on the web site?
9. What is the monthly cash flow per their cash flow statements?
10. Who is their present CPA firm that is providing audited financials?
That should be a good start.
LaonStew...thank you for the correct answers to the very basic questions concerning this case and charges against JP. All the other stuff by proponents is diversionary in nature, unsubstantiated, innuendo with no basis in fact to offset the bottomline charges. Reminds me of Haldemann, Ehrlichman and others during Watergate trying to keep the Prez from being impeached. Same tactics at a much lower level.
I read alot of diversionary tactics on this message board by JP's supporters blaming anyone or everything except JP. However, I'd like Mr Plant's obvious supporter(s) to answer these questions:
1. Who publicly stated CKYS had a DHS contract for $25million
2. Who publicly stated confirmed receipt of funds from that contract
3. Who signed and affirmed the accuracy of the June and December unaudited financials
4. Who publicly stated audited financials were being done and would be presented to shareholders
5. Who created public advertisements using FINGERS to enforce the indestructable nature of the Keepsafe
6. Who created the June unaudited financials as Ruth was not employed at that time, and signed off on them
7. Who was the CEO when all of the above was done
That should be it for now...care to answer Knowles?
Truth is nobody knows what will definitely happen in the future, or the company's present status. IMHO there is some shameful pumping by a few who have no verifiable evidence on the company's present financial status, its present or future viability, involvement by others in the demise etc. Also, no concrete evidence as to what will transpire when this hits the trial phase or settlement phase or even a dismissal phase.
The facts are (1) Jim and Ruth have been charged, (2) the legal machine is moving slowly (3) stock is in the crapper (4) many have lost $thousands (5) doors are open, lights are on. That's pretty much it.
Turkey was served up already namely CKYS stock