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Please tell us what product they have engineered, designed and "own"?
This is, I am sure you understand very different from the products they resell from China were they have the factory print their logo on. You do know anyone can do this for a minimum quantity order.
You quoted from the company propaganda that "experts in embedded biometric technology". This would leave a person to think they are the engineers and developers of biometric technology. Can you please name one product they have made. A product they own the OP on. A product that is there's exclusively.
The pill box we know was brought from the Chinese factory that made it originally as a pistol safe. It is a product owned by the Chinese who sell it to anyone. Just check out Ali baba.
I have seen all the other so called products they have listed readily available for purchase from China manufacturers.
So what have they made? Or as a little due diligence research will show they are just a reseller of others products.
To call themselves experts in embedded biometric products is beyond laughable.
I am truly sorry for everyone's losses here. So very sad.
CEO, no company car. CEO has taken far less in salary than employment agreement.
Marketwired is owned by NASDAQ. It is a highly reputable media news service.
The Italian company does not have the issued patent/s that SmartMetric has. They also do not have a working card. Just like the other company in Europe. So how are things working out over at your company? Must be painful to watch whats happening.
Let's hope that those making these statements have no association with the company or note holders. Kind of thing that can send people to prison.
Wow. The Chinese sure make one heck of a knock off. Identical in every way to the RXSF product. But it raises a lot of questions. What is the difference between RXSF from other fingerprint gun Safes or for that matter any other fingerprint activated safe in respect of RXSF's patent. There are a lot of fingerprint Safes out there. Why aren't they being stopped from being imported?
The only difference between the gun safe and the pill safe is the color of the box and the logo.
Why isn't RXSF enforcing it's patent on all these gun safe importers?
I thought RXSF was the manufacturer and has an incredible knowledge of biometrics.
Looks like they are just resellers of a Chinese manufacturer who is using bulky old fingerprint lock tech. Anyone can go online and order direct from the factory and resell to Walmart or Wallgreens.
Manufacturer: Foshan Nanhai Gary Technology Co., Ltd.
The following manufacturer is selling a white metal box that it originally made as a gun safe. It uses the same box painted white with a pharmacy ensignia in Red on the iutside. The factory will print whatever logo you want.
Gary Technology Co., Ltd. Our company is a professional portable small safe box manufacturer. For the MS100 bio white safe box, the best price is as follows:
Sample US$80;
10 pcs US$50;
50 pcs US$48:
100 pcs US$47;
1000 pcs US$45;
Hi Pottsville. I'm not able to discuss information that is not public. Even if I know there are things I can say and things that aren't public that I can't.
So what I do know is the payments world very well. There are 4 major and another 2 minor credit card 'networks" in the World. These networks are not card issuers but provide lines for transactions to operate over. (this is a simplistic description). Then you have the credit card issuers. Credit card issuers are not network operators. They are the banks that sign up customers to use their issued credit cards.
Many people confuse for instance Visa and Mastercard's role and wrongly think they issue cards. They don't. But they do control and operate the networks that connect the retail card reading machines and ATM'S etc.
It is important to understand that in order for a Bank to issue a credit card that operates on for instance a Visa or Mastercard network the bank must have that card approved by Visa or Mastercard. The credit card manufacturer's who sell credit cards to Banks must also get approval and obtain various licenses from the one or more networks. Even the manufacturers of card readers and ATM's must get their equipment approved by one or more of the network's.
So SmartMetric is no different. It's card must be tested, approved and various licenses must be granted by one or more of the payments network's. This is before a card issuing Bank can issue it's first SmartMetric biometric credit card.
From what I know the process is exhaustive and expensive. But at the end of the day will allow Banks around the world to use the SmartMetric card and offer it to their customers.
I do know that SmartMetric is going through this process with one of the major global credit card networks while it is at the same time marketing it's card directly to the card issuing Banks.
Finally I do know that when a company enters into agreements such as testing and licensing agreements these have non disclosure clauses that restrict making public these agreements in press releases etc. These large companies are very sensitive about when, where and how their names are used by third party's and control the use of their names very tightly. I would think this is why SmartMetric hasn't made public statements naming which network or networks it is dealing with.
I wish RXSF well and hope it is able to shake off the toxic lenders. The issues RX is having to deal with reveal a much bigger problem for small and micro cap companies in the USA. Predatory company lenders have seem to have spread like the plague and have infected so many micro and small caps.
I've always believed it was an act of commercial suicide for a company absent of sales revenue to take on debt. I feel so strongly about it I think it should be illegal. Much like other types of predatory lending to induviduals are illegal.
A mixture of over zealous regulation for brokers that once specialized in raising equity capital for micro caps causing most such brokers to abandon this sector along with the parasitic mostly unregulated toxic lenders has caused a starvation of legitimate risk capital for microcaps.
This is a very serious issue that goes way beyond the awful situation individual micro caps find themselves in.
I feel for RXSF because they do have a product that meets a need in the market. Sure Monday morning quarterbacks can come up with this and that decision that could have been done differently. But I do think most company Directors are hard working and do really try to get their respective businesses off the ground. But so much comes back to financing. No funding sends pretty revenue companies under. Bad debt funding pre-revenue also cripples companies but causes death from toxic funds to taj ed a little longer.
Some companies and I mean only very few are able to bootstrap themselves into revenue where they can shake off the toxic lenders. But it is always so much better for a company not to get involved at all with these lenders. Much like taking money from the mafia. You almost always know that it isn't going to end well.
I wish RXSF well. I take no pleasure in seeing their sp being hit. I hope they are able to shake off the note holders and truly move forward with their uplist round. They have a product that serves an important public service.
For me I'm involved in another microcap. It has been amazingly fortunate to be able to fund itself from direct equity investment without having to take on debt. It too has an amazing product that has taken a great deal of R&D and is now at an important turning point.
For the good shareholders of RXSF I wish you all much success.
It's been a few weeks since I've been on here. I think it's time to provide some facts.
1. SmartMetric has funded it's research and development by selling equity to investor's. It has not taken in debt that converts at an outrageous discount to the market that always results in a huge dilution for existing shareholders.
2. Some professional fees such as a premier Wall Street law firm have been paid for in shares rather than cash.
3. SmartMetric was invited to speak at the prestigious Smart Card Alliance Payments Forum. The invitation was made with no expectation for SmartMetric to become an exhibitor. No money was asked for SmartMetric to be a presenter.
4. SmartMetric decided after accepting the invitation to also take the opportunity to exhibit in the Forums exhibition hall. All exhibitors paid for their booth space.
5. SmartMetric does not pay for articles in magazines or newspaper's. Many articles have been written about SmartMetric. None have been paid for articles by SmartMetric. This also includes various recent radio interviews which have included Bloomberg radio.
6. The SmartMetric card is made up of a number of components as well as SmartMetric proprietary software. EMV chip and sensor are only a small part of the components that make up the card. A sensor is not a reader. It is only one component that goes into making a functional fingerprint scanner.
I understand SmartMetric is actively involved sakes and marketing efforts with prospective customers around the world. I would expect the reason why the company is being deliberately quite is it is being very careful to not make the mistake of talking about material developments before they are publicly announced. Completion of sales with multi billion dollar corporations is not something that is done with just one meeting. But I'd it were selling a pill box you could expect sales to be done quickly. But SmartMetric isn't selling pill boxes.
No tax debt and facts about another sensor company.
Let's clear up some facts. First SmartMetric had an historical tax liability. The key word is historical since the company paid a few years ago this liability in full. And has no tax owing as someone is trying to suggest.
Second a sensor company who has been working on trying to make a flexible sensor has been mentioned. This company does not have a mass production ready flexible sensor now. In their own media release they say they are "going" to ship a rigid sensor this year and they then go on to say they will ship once they have their manufacturer up, their flexible sensor in 2017.
It sounds very misleading to be talking about their mystery flexible sensor while at the same time further down in their release they admit it isn't ready for release toll 2017.
So they supposedly are going to try to make their rigid sensor first. And then sell the "sensor" to hardware companies. Guess what. SmartMetric is a hardware manufacturer.
Too bad for them SmartMetric is already in the market with an ISO conforming complete product and not just a sensor that may be coming.
Here is part of their release.
"The initial order has a value of NOK 12 million and shipments are scheduled to start in Q3 2016. The first shipments will consist of rigid sensors.
Volumes to our undisclosed customer are expected to increase to a total of 650 000 units in 2017.
The on-going development with our customer is aiming to ship a mass-produced, fully flexible and ISO-compliant biometric smartcard that will meet all requirements in this segment during 2017."
Not paid for advertising. Neither was the recent Bloomberg Radio interview and the upcoming Fox radio interview. From what I understand the company is being contacted by media following the Orlando show.
Some reality checks.
1. Quarterly filings called 10Q's are rear view looks... It does not show Actual Cash On Hand Now.
2. The company would not be going through the approval process with a major card networks if it didn't have a working card.
3. At times legal fees are converted into shares rather than the company paying cash. These are done at a discount to market. It is not debt financing and the company does not issue shares for debt to debt funders.
4. Anyone with a basic understanding of how cards works on a network knows a card issuer has to have the card's licensed by one of the payments networks. It has been publicly stated that the company now it has a working card is going through this very licensing process.
Another green day. Great for SMME shareholders. I thought I would offer some insight into a company that has a patent for basically a fingerprint lock on pill boxes. It is my understanding that this company approached SmartMetric regarding doing a cross licensing patent deal. After researching their patent SmartMetric declined. SmartMetric viewed their patent as having no relevance to the business of SmartMetric.
It has been interesting to watch some supporters and people deeply involved in that company use various methods to attack and spread misinformation about SmartMetric.
This pill box company is in bad shape in my opinion. It has funded itself through taking on what is called structured debt. Loans by way of convertible notes. Called in the industry toxic debt. It looks like this company funds itself by rolling one convertable note loan into another. Problem is for this company is that it is now in a law suite with one of its lenders so in my opinion it will be very difficult for it to continue rolling into the next debt deal.
As a side note. I know from talking with SmartMetric that they get offered structured debt funding deals almost every week. They most recently turned down a million dollars from a debt funder out of New York. Simply the company has been very careful in my view to protect the interests of its shareholders and not take on a funding deal that would see huge dilution for the existing shareholders.
For me this is a testament to the wise and careful management of SmartMetric. Yes it could have taken in lots of money from financiers and this money could have made things happen a lot sooner. But the company management has always had an eye on the long term and has never wanted to overload it's balance sheet with debt that would then be converted into equity at outrageous conversion ratios that would see a disastrous dilution of ownership by the existing shareholders.
So getting back to my opening comment. It's great to be seeing the green upward movement in the company share price. A great sign for all concerned.
Have a nice day.
Working card means able to scan a person's fingerprint and activate the card. The banks there realize a lot more goes into having it linked to a person's account to make an ATM transaction. It has been confirmed that the card is going through licensing and testing at the moment with one of the major global payments networks. Following, that payments networks issuing Banks will be able to link accounts to the card and begin issuing the card to their customers. Yes there are more steps in the process but the biggest step is having a biometric card that works. Also a card that unlike pretend competitors who's cards are too thick, is a card that conforms to credit card industry size , thickness and other standards.
Thanks. Be well.
I'm out of here for the time being. Having done my DD I'm moving on. Good luck to all the investors and hope you are all well rewarded. Thanks.
Can someone let me know how the SmartMetric site here can be updated. For instance SmartMetric isn't coming out with a bitcoin card. Talking with the company they have no plans now to be in the vmbitciin space. The company is highly focused on serving the mainstream banking industry.
Ok. HockieHead. Nice to speak with someone from within the industry. I'm coming from an engineering background as well as business and I understand patents very well. As you know reading patents and interpreting what claims mean is an art form in its own right.
So we will agree to disagree.
Regards.
How much is Rx being sued for? Is Rx going to file an 8K abouts it's potential financial exposure in this filed law suit?
I disagree with your broad interpretation of the patent. Opening an attached device is pretty narrow. And it's the very limitation of the words used in the actual claim that are over arching when reading the patents claims to actual devices.
By the way, if it is as you say which I don't agree with, why hasn't Rx sued Apple over its use of biometrics on phones? The fact Rx hasn't says it all.
Hi. Can you please explain how the action by RX has been terminated by the court yet you say it's ongoing?
Also what do you know about the suit against Rx? Is this law suit disclosable?
Are we going to see an 8K showing what exposure if any Rx may have by being sued?
New York Southern District Court
Judge: Alvin K Hellerstein
Case #: 1:16-cv-01095
Nature of Suit 140 Contract - Negotiable Instrument
Cause 28:1332 Diversity Action
Case Filed: Feb 12, 2016
Terminated: Mar 23, 2016
Tuesday, April 05, 2016
24 cmp Amended Complaint Tue 6:06 PM
FIRST AMENDED COMPLAINT amending1 Complaint against Rx Safes, Inc. with JURY DEMAND.Document filed by Rx Safes, Inc.. Related document:1 Complaint filed by Rx Safes, Inc..(Sbaiti, Mazin)
Thanks Yankeedave. Could have been an interesting product. Could have stopped Un authorized changing of say the office ac thermostat. Too bad the patent is expired. Mind you I think those perspex boxes for covering ac thermostats sold in Home Depot are an example of sometimes low tech trumping high tech.
Thanks again and regards.
I have read a lot of posts on here by a poster who is involved with a pill box company that uses very old fingerprint tech to safeguard medicine boxes. Nice idea but nothing like the SmartMetric advanced tech.
So I did some research on the other companies patent and here is what I found.
Ok. Here is my DD on the RX patent.
It has a number of claims but all follow on claims are what are called dependant claims tied to claim 1. So the correct reading of the patent is based on all of the limitations of claim 1. If a devise or piece of technology does other things than what is limited by definition in claim 1. Than it is not covered by this patent.
Here is the full text of claim 1.
What is claimed is:
1. A biometric verification device for providing secure access to a unit connected to the device, the device comprising: a. a biometric sensor capable of sensing a biometric trait of a user that is unique to said user and providing a first signal containing information representing said biometric trait; and b. a processing unit connected to said biometric sensor so as to receive said first signal, said processing unit being adapted to compare said information with biometric data stored in said processing unit representing a biometric trait of an enrolled person, and provide a verification signal indicating whether or not said information corresponds sufficiently with said biometric data to verify said user is said enrolled person, wherein said processing unit completes said comparison and generates said verification signal within 20 seconds of when said biometric sensor senses said biometric trait, said biometric sensor and processing unit, together being configured to use no more than 1W of peak power.
The opening sentence is one that narrowly defines this patent. Namely:
A biometric verification device for providing secure access to a unit connected to the device,......
So let me explain what this means. A verification device that provides access to a "unit" "connected" to the device.
This of course does not cover mobile phones where the fingerprint is used to turn on the phone. It is not used to access a unit connected to the device. So you can easily see the limitation of this patent.
Yes it does cover a pill box biometric device. But for much of what is being done in other areas of biometrics it does not cover. At all.
So statements on this board about the other companies patent being a broad patent are not born out by factual analysis.
Statements that SmartMetric are breaching this pill box patent are laughable. It's like saying that Samsung and Apple are breaching this little pill box companies patents. Of course not.
Yes. From what I have read in its filings it owns a smart card patent. I also understand there are a number of patents pending. Didn't they sue for patent infringement. They must have had a patent to be able to do this don't you think.
Ok. Here is my DD on the RX patent.
It has a number of claims but all follow on claims are what are called dependant claims tied to claim 1.
So the correct reading of the patent is based on all of the limitations of claim 1.
If a devise or piece of technology does other things than what is limited by definition in claim 1. Than it is not covered by this patent.
Here is the full text of claim 1.
What is claimed is:
1. A biometric verification device for providing secure access to a unit connected to the device, the device comprising: a. a biometric sensor capable of sensing a biometric trait of a user that is unique to said user and providing a first signal containing information representing said biometric trait; and b. a processing unit connected to said biometric sensor so as to receive said first signal, said processing unit being adapted to compare said information with biometric data stored in said processing unit representing a biometric trait of an enrolled person, and provide a verification signal indicating whether or not said information corresponds sufficiently with said biometric data to verify said user is said enrolled person, wherein said processing unit completes said comparison and generates said verification signal within 20 seconds of when said biometric sensor senses said biometric trait, said biometric sensor and processing unit, together being configured to use no more than 1W of peak power.
The opening sentence is one that narrowly defines this patent. Namely:
A biometric verification device for providing secure access to a unit connected to the device,......
So let me explain what this means. A verification device that provides access to a "unit" "connected" to the device.
This of course does not cover mobile phones where the fingerprint is used to turn on the phone. It is not used to access a unit connected to the device. So you can easily see the limitation of this patent.
Yes it does cover a pill box biometric device. But for much of what is being done in other areas of biometrics it does not cover. At all.
So statements on this board about the patent being a broad patent are not born out by factual analysis.
Regards all.
Thanks Yankeedave.
I read the purchase agreement of the company's patent from a New York company. The filed sales agreement says the following:
To support the seamless transition of assets under this Bill of Sale, Buyer agrees to engage the services of seller and execute a separate consulting agreement for services with Axius Consulting Group, Inc. for a minimum 12 month period at a minimum monthly fee of $20,000 per month.
So is RX still paying $20,000 a month. It says the fee is payable for a minimum of twelve months. Is it still in effect?
I have read the patent. And also read the purchase agreement. Both describe a very narrow patent covering pill boxes.
Having read the 6,766,040 patent it looks like it is restricted to only pill boxes. An interesting market niche but by no means a broad patent in the biometric space.
I'm still going over the patent and will update everyone on what I find out further. Patents are something I understand very well.
Hi. I'm knew here and still doing my DD. Can anyone help me find any public filing of the terms of the license agreement concerning the RX patent. I would like to know who RX has licensed their important patent from? I would also like to know how much they have to pay for the license? Is there an ongoing license royalty fee? Who are the two guys who actually own the patent? Was the license automatically cancelled when the patent lapsed because of non payment of PTO fees?
Like I said I'm still doing my DD and any help in understanding this stuff would be very much appreciated.
Thanks.
Hi Kezzek. Are you saying that the RX cornerstone patent has expired for non payment of fees? Does this also mean that someone could now challenge the patents reinstatement?
Kind of looks like an iffy company if they can't rustle together enough money to keep current such an important assett. I wonder if they disclosed to all of their convertable debt holders that they let their patent lapse? I would have thought they would have been obliged to let them know. Also did they file an 8K to inform the market if their lapsed patent? Pretty material if you ask me.
I understand the company has contracted independant consumer research by a research company used by advertising agencies in the United States.
The research targeted USA Visa credit card holders, employed and earning between $50,000 and $200,000 per year. The sweet spot for consumer targets of credit card issuers.
Results:
80% are concerned about card fraud.
67% said they would pay for a safer credit card with a built in biimetric fingerprint reader.
68% said they would pay $69.95 for a biometric fingerprint credit card. (This was 1% higher than the previous question - it is thought that when consumers saw the actual price more said yes to wanting it)
Thank you Shinner. Love the Aussie sense of humor.
Nice of you to give her a few weeks. How long do you think the process is from the time a Bank gets serious to the time they sign a contract?
How much experience have you had in the credit card industry? How long do you think the licensing process is?
Expecting results in a few weeks doesn't sound realistic to me or something anyone that has a modicum of understanding of the payments industry would say.
In my opinion it's wonderful that SmartMetric was a part of this industry body forum. Even more wonderful that important industry players are now in serious talks with the company.
It is my understanding that no other pretenders trying to compete with SmartMetric have a card that can work in all readers, such as ATM'S. Or have cards that conform to Visa and Mastercard standards and therefore can not be issued by banks.
I also understand that SmartMetric is the only biometric credit card company that has an internal rechargeable battery. Something very much needed if the card is to work at an ATM.
SmartMetric I understand has taken years to develop its world class tech. It's great to see that it sat tight and waited till it had a product that conforms to industry standards before it released it to the industry.
I am sure the company could have released a non conforming card years ago like those Johnny come lately's who say they have fingerprint cards but can't work accross the payment industry eco system because they are just too thick.
Funny how for someone who isn't known in the industry that she was personally invited by the head of the world's oldest and premier smart card industry body. Funny how a nobody ended up presenting at the industry conference on smart cards in payments.
Still waiting for an answer regarding the new video in Chaya's presentation. Or how about the unpublished additional market research. Would love to hear from the person who was supposed to be there about these.
Perhaps its time we should be insisting on proof that so and so was truly there.
Stockmedic. Since we didn't get an answer I'll ask again. Did you see the company's new video during the presentation and what did you think?
I'm puzled stockmedic. If you were in fact at the show and you are so full of scepticism to use your own words. I'm pulled that you didn't make the effort to see first hand the pridyct. As you have already admitted.
Nicrob. You are absolutely correct. I do know how the payments card world works send you have described well what is needed to have the card spit out money from an ATM. SmartMetric has created from what I understand a working card. That is the card functions electronically. It scans your fingerprint and actually turns on the EMV chip. The company has also stated it is going through the licensing and approval process with one of the largest global payments networks. This will allow the card, once all licensing and approvals are finalized, to be issued by this payment networks branded issuing Banks around the world.
I understand that SmartMetric held off attending any earlier shows or exhibitions until it had a card that conforms to industry credit card standards. The exhibition SmartMetric released its card at was a credit and smart card industry show. Experts from within the industry and I mean card manufacturing experts where there. That's propably why Zwipe didn't attend because they don't have a credit card conforming card while SmartMetric did because it does.
I am sure SmartMetric wouldn't have unveiled its card at an exhibition full of experts if it didn't have the goods.
Reading the company report it is great news to finally see the marketing reaching the target market and the level of interest in the company's new high tech card product.
As Chaya said in the show. SmartMetric has taken the power of biometric protection found on today's smartphones to the world of the credit card.
I beg to differ.
I'm not practising law on this site or anywhere else. Sorry. My opinions and observations are mine and mine alone and are neither as a legal or financial advisor of any kind.
If I happen to make either a legal or financial statement it should never be relied upon for investment purposes.
I do not seek to influence or pursued anyone regarding buying or selling of shares. All I am doing is expressing my opinions as an informed citizen and under the protections afforded by laws protecting freedom of speech.
Happy and prosperous investing to all.
The RX patent only covers pill boxes. It is a very narrowly written and defined patent. I hope Talon received good patent counsel advise before they fell for the licensing deal. I've seen it a lot where unsuspecting companies are conned into entering into patent licensing deals based on misrepresentations of a flimsy patent.