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Sort of like a preview, LOL!
LOL! What was that?
You can say that again. I really like what I see here, WOW!
Check this out, another Evan's video!
http://vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&videoid=22180189
Wow! It just had a ginormous gain, what's brewing here?
IGTP, Show me da money!
I agree.
We are going up today!
Question for TDameritrade users. How quick are your trades executed?
Big trading going on here. Only a few trades executed yet the volume is now 77,000,000.
Too funny! Whoever did that, good job.
Did you stay at the Holiday Inn last night?
I am having a little trouble. It's on and off.
My signature simply means "I'm not just going to sell you my company for 1.9B when it is a whole lot more worth than that. You have to pay more" LOL!
I don't think WMI will just leave their money there without any security. It sounds to me that both companies agreed with the judge's blessing that money is WMIs. It could have happened at the judge's chambers for all we know. Any other deals being struck there? Oh, if I was only a fly on the wall...
And while WMI sits in Chapter 11 staying safe, more financial institutions keep failing and some are on the verge. I am guessing when this is all over, WMI prevails right around the time that the financial institutions have reached bottom or in the state of recovery. All IMHO of course...
"did you know that WMI filed for Chap 11 NOT because it was in bad shape, but to protect it's assets! That is most important here and a lot have forgotten the reason why."
This post states why there is no public record of the claim.
http://messages.finance.yahoo.com/Stocks_%28A_to_Z%29/Stocks_W/threadview?m=tm&bn=86316&tid=62308&mid=62312&tof=2&rt=2&frt=2&off=1
Matt: This is my previous post:
Just to re-state in layman's terms what Bop has said tersely and with lawyerly precision, and to put a different spin on it:
Under both state and federal law, before any actual lawsuit can be filed against a GOVERNMENT agency, the plaintiff must first file a "claim" with that agency and give it time to respond and settle the claim. (That claim is NOT a public record and is not filed with any court, so there is NO way for us to get a copy of it.) The time allowed for the agency to respond varies, and it's been 35 years since I took the bar exam, but generally the agency has 90 to 180 days to respond before any suit can be filed. Once the claim has been denied or refused (which almost always is the case), then and only then can the plaintiff file suit. (They even have to allege in their complaint under penalty of perjury that they have filed a claim and hat it has been refused.) So, if the claim was filed on Dec. 30th, the clock is ticking. Bop: Can you tell us what the federal claims period is?
Cheers to all. . .
P.S. Such a claim is basically just a formal letter to the government agency. It's not "filed" or made available to the public through any formal procedures. Maybe someone will leak it. . .
Good question. Maybe some forces are telling the IRS to look into WMI taxes several years back... LOL!
That I know for a fact from my personal experience as well.
The 12.5 Billion claim isn't final though and I hope it is significantly less, that way we get a larger refund.
So IRS will owe WMI money but only after NOL is applied.
Jan. 24 (Bloomberg) -- Washington Mutual Inc., the former parent of the biggest U.S. bank to fail, owes $12.5 billion in back taxes, the Internal Revenue Service said in court papers filed in the company’s bankruptcy case.
The company filed papers Jan. 22 asking U.S. Bankruptcy Judge Mary F. Walrath to void at least part of the alleged debt, arguing that because Washington Mutual lost so much money, it expects to get a federal tax refund. The company also said the IRS filed a claim in bankruptcy court before making a formal determination about how much Washington Mutual actually owes.
“In all possible situations, the IRS will owe WMI money,” the company said in court papers filed in Wilmington, Delaware.
The company, based in Seattle, filed for bankruptcy on Sept. 26, the day after its banking units were seized by regulators and sold to JPMorgan Chase & Co. for $1.9 billion. WaMu has said it plans to try to get a refund for previous years’ tax bills based on $20 billion in losses
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20090123/bs_nm/us_freddiemac_outlook_loss
NEW YORK (Reuters) – Freddie Mac (FRE.P), the second-largest provider of funding for U.S. home loans, on Friday said expected fourth-quarter losses may force it to draw up to $35 billion from the U.S. Treasury to maintain a positive net worth.
The estimated draw means Freddie Mac may post a loss exceeding the record $25.3 billion for the third quarter, which reduced shareholders' equity to a negative $13.8 billion.
The Treasury closed the deficit with a purchase of senior preferred stock, a facility formed by the government as it seized Freddie Mac and home funding rival Fannie Mae (FNM.P) in conservatorship in September.
The amount of the capital infusion "reflects management's current estimate of the impact on the company's net worth in the fourth quarter," Freddie Mac said in a filing with the Securities and Exchange Commission.
The request would be made by its regulator, the Federal Housing Finance Agency, Freddie Mac said. The actual draw could vary widely as it finalizes financial statements, it added.
Freddie Mac would be using about half of its $100 billion Treasury lifeline that was put in place to ensure the company can continue its role as provider of funds for U.S. housing, which is in its worst downturn since the 1930s.
Other sources of funding have shriveled during the credit crunch, enhancing the importance of liquidity from Freddie Mac, Fannie Mae and the Federal Home Loan Banks.
Freddie Mac's fourth-quarter results will likely show risky mortgages held in portfolio drove most losses, Barclays Capital analyst Rajiv Setia said this week.
But increased delinquencies on loans earmarked for Freddie Mac's guaranteed mortgage security business have also deepened the loss, he added.
Delinquencies on loans backed by Freddie Mac rose 0.2 percentage point in December to 1.72 percent, more than double that at the start of 2008, the company said earlier on Friday.
Shares of Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae have traded mostly below $1 since September as terms of the conservatorship nearly wiped out common and preferred shareholders. The debt of the companies has been buoyed by a Treasury backstop, and a Federal Reserve purchase program.
Treasury injections will likely keep the companies operating as government entities for years, as they struggle to service costs and provide money for U.S. housing, Setia said in a Tuesday conference call.
Before the conservatorships, the companies operated as quasi-government "agencies," where they relied on charters from Congress but answered to shareholders.
Freddie Mac in its filing also said it has agreed to let JPMorgan Chase & Co (JPM.N) assume servicing rights to mortgages formerly under the control of Washington Mutual Inc.
Freddie Mac is asking the feds for another 35 Billion dollars.
Apparently the first one was not enough.
Wamuq fans are you ready? Are you rrrrrrrrrready? For the hundreds in attendance, and the thousands watching around the world... LET'S GET READY TO RUMBLEEEEEEEEE!
U.S. Is Told To Return Big S.& L.
This is a better comparison
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9C0CE1D81138F935A3575AC0A966958260
LEAD: In a stinging rebuke to the management of the savings and loan bailout, a Federal judge in Topeka, Kan., today ordered Federal regulators to return a $9 billion savings institution to its owners by Thursday morning.
Biggest Setback So Far
The decision today, the first in which a judge has ordered the return of such an institution, is the most significant courtroom defeat for regulators since the savings and loan bailout legislation was adopted last year.
Recognizing that the ruling could set a difficult precedent, the Office of Thrift Supervision said in a statement late this afternoon that it would seek an immediate stay of Judge Saffels's order as well as a review by an appeals court.
Unless the ruling is overturned by an appeals court, it will provide significant legal ammunition to scores of institutions that either have or are at risk of being taken over. In many situations, the Government has found no evidence of criminal misconduct or insider dealing, but nonetheless seized institutions out of concern that they were near insolvency. Cases contesting seizures are being brought with increasing frequency as the Government steps up its program of taking over ailing savings institutions.
''We firmly believe the Government acted in a timely and proper manner in taking over Franklin, an institution that was being operated with insufficient capital and in an unsafe and unsound manner,'' said the Government's statement, which was signed by Harris Weinstein, the Office of Thrift Supervision's chief counsel. The statement called Franklin's accounting procedures ''improper'' and said they had enabled the savings association to recognize gains and defer losses ''while distributing more than $45 million of the institution's funds in dividends to the shareholders.''
'It's a Relief'
Officials at Franklin hailed the ruling.
''It's a relief that we've come this far and achieved this milestone,'' said John Scowcroft, the president of the Franklin Savings Corporation, the holding company for the savings and loan. ''Now we have to see what's left of the company. People have left and people have pulled deposits.''
Regulators at the Office of Thrift Supervision had said both at the time of the seizure and during the court proceedings that the institution had failed to recognize losses totaling $470.4 million on its financial statement, while the institution's accountants said that those loses need not be recognized. Judge Saffels sided with Franklin and said the Government had acted ''arbitrarily and capriciously'' in deciding to take over Franklin, adding that the thrift office had committed many errors in administrative proceedings.
''It is the court's conclusion of law that the O.T.S. acted inappropriately in placing Franklin in conservatorship and that the O.T.S. lacked any basis which would justify its appointment of a conservator,'' Judge Saffels said. The judge, a former chairman of the Federal Home Loan Bank in Topeka, also said that the Topeka branch of the Office of Thrift Supervision had made ''fundamental factual errors as well as material errors'' in analyzing publicly filed financial statements of Franklin.
Even before today's decision, the legal proceedings involving Franklin had been particularly difficult for the Government. Last month, the Office of Thrift Supervision and an outside lawyer it hired to defend the case were censured for filing a motion without a proper factual basis. And M. Danny Wall, the former head of the Federal Home Loan Bank Board, was cited for contempt earlier this year for refusing to testify in the case. The contempt ruling is being appealed.
'Unsafe and Unsound'
Federal regulators had asserted that the basis for the seizure was that Franklin failed to comply with generally accepted accounting practices, putting it in an ''unsafe and unsound'' position and at risk of collapsing. During a monthlong trial that ended in mid-July, those contentions were disputed by accountants from Deloitte & Touche, who maintained that Franklin management had employed proper practices.
Today's defeat for the Government comes less than a month after a Federal judge in Washington affirmed the regulators' decision to seize the Lincoln Savings and Loan Association.
Never mind, you beat me to it.
Are you referring to this?
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/08/25/business/25maxxam.html?_r=1
Ruling Goes Against F.D.I.C.
By BLOOMBERG NEWS
Published: August 25, 2005
A federal judge ordered the Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation to pay $72.2 million to the Maxxam Corporation, controlled by Charles E. Hurwitz, to cover a decade of legal costs. The penalty was the largest ever assessed against the F.D.I.C.
Judge Lynn N. Hughes of United States District Court in Houston called the agency's attempt to hold Mr. Hurwitz responsible for the 1988 failure of United Savings, a Texas savings and loan, "political extortion."
The F.D.I.C. and the Office of Thrift Supervision sued Mr. Hurwitz, seeking to strip Maxxam of 4,000 acres of California redwood trees to help recover $1.2 billion.
"The F.D.I.C. caused Hurwitz pain," Judge Hughes wrote in a ruling released Tuesday. "The effects of these relentless attacks on his reputation and on the value of the businesses that he led cannot be repaired."
The government suits were settled or dropped in 2002.
"The F.D.I.C. has been appropriately punished for having wasted the taxpayers' money in a politically motivated litigation," J. Kent Friedman, Maxxam's general counsel, said in an interview.
Shares of Maxxam, which mines bauxite, makes aluminum and grows timber, rose $2.56, or 9.7 percent, to $29.01. Maxxam is based in Houston.
David Barr, a spokesman for the F.D.I.C., said the agency would appeal. Judge Hughes has already been reversed twice in the case, Mr. Barr said.
Oh and WaS, I love your video.
I did not know this. I have been reading some of Bopfan's posts but I have not been following all of her posts. Did not even know that Bopfan is a she until I read it here on Ihub. Now I see your point.
There have been a slew of posts over there throughout the course of the past week with Bopfan promising an exciting week and everyone, including him/her working the timing of things in with the inauguration to minimize the effects of public scrutiny.
WaS, much respect for you. Some of us just think that there are merits to Bopfan's theories. Otherwise, lawyers of WAMUQ wouldn't be researching "Fraudulent Transfer" They've been discussing it since 01Nov08. Now, no one knows for certain if they are going to pursue this avenue but it's good to know they were still talking about it by 20Nov08.
I wouldn't worry about newbies. Most likely they are holding their shares tightly. The only ones that may be left in the dust are wanna be traders thinking they can keep getting in and out of this stock. I too flip this but always hold a core position.
Relax folks. Makes me wonder why people wonder if people only bought shares based on Bopfans posts. Surely you don't believe that do you?
Whew! Thanks, I finally kept up with the posts and saw that.
Back on track.
What's going on? Even Bopfan is now convinced WMI can't sue
under Fraudulent Constructive Transfer? I really thought this is our ace.
Under Bankruptcy code, There are two kinds of fraudulent transfer.
The archetypal example is the intentional fraudulent transfer. This is a transfer of property made by a debtor with intent to defraud, hinder, or delay his or her creditors.
The second is a constructive fraudulent transfer. Generally, this occurs when a debtor transfers property without receiving "reasonably equivalent value" in exchange for the transfer if the debtor is insolvent at the time of the transfer or becomes insolvent or is left with unreasonably small capital to continue in business as a result of the transfer.Unlike the intentional fraudulent transfer, no intention to defraud is necessary.
He divided 12,988,753,556 by total outstanding shares of 1.7B
Thanks ProfitScout. I have read the filings. Just want to make sure their plans haven't been derailed. Back to lurking now...
I am not worried about that. I think the fraudulent conveyance situation will eventually lead to a buyout, IMHO.
I am really convinced that Fraudulent transfer AKA fraudulent conveyance is our ace.
Encouraging. Are they still scheduled for commercialization for this year?
This has really been a great flip but I've always held a core here. You know! A "just in case" position, and it may just pay off.