Democracy starts with you, tag your it! ...Thom Hartman
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Look at the release you signed.. what cusip is on there? That’s how you know what you own
Well according to JusticeWW this should be around $200 PPS ? Seems like dilution is factored in advance and still in play. It’s literally been years of performing far below book value..almost like some people knew/know the future plan to come and it trades accordingly
Sandridge Bankruptcy Judge Jones now under investigation by federal prosecutors with the DOJ for his 10 year hidden relationship with a Chapter 11 attorney with cases before him named Elizabeth Freeman. Maybe Sandridge will be under the microscope!
https://www.wsj.com/articles/former-bankruptcy-judge-david-r-jones-under-criminal-investigation-over-relationship-with-lawyer-830a0ddf
COOP could be/has been buying back its own stock on behalf of, as a pre-planned event, for the future benefit of the 'Direct and Ultimate Parent'... to backdoor majority ownership down the road, to the benefit of those who released and own their % of WMI/WMIH.
It doesn't require majority stock ownership right now, and could be as simple as a clause or amendment to COOP's Articles of Incorporation.... Further, any holding or parent company may own a smaller stake, including less than 50%, as long as it gives the subsidiary’s managers day-to-day control. Additionally holding companies may own assets other than shares in another company. And in Merger acquisitions, consent of majority of shareholders isn't required considering certain conditions are met. There is an ocean of wiggle room that WMIH is taking advantage of, in our case with COOP.
Remember, a servicing sub like Nationstar was needed in 2018 to manage the returning WMI legacy interests from 2008, since WMB and its servicing affiliates were taken by the FDIC/JPM.
COOP wouldn't need to SEC report anything yet, until its actually given/granted, like in an exchange for legacy assets for example. And yet another example of why COOP stock will never go up to analyst forecasts because this future dilution is baked into the cake.
COOP's LEI filings have an 'accounting reporting exception' to hide the identity of who it's "Direct Parent" & it's "Ultimate Parent" is. I've posted it a million times.
COOP the Child reports, using SEC allowances, instead of it's Direct & Ultimate parent corporations. All 3 of which are globally tracked for their financial transactions whether in safe harbor or not. Despite COOP using SEC allowances to play hide-and-seek, the global community is not blind to COOPs shell games, otherwise there's no way to track global legacy income interests.
"The Legal Entity Identifier, or LEI, is a data standard — similar in concept to a bar code on store items — but that instead precisely identifies parties to financial transactions. The Office of Financial Research (OFR) has led the global LEI initiative from a mere concept to a fully operational system."
.....and then there's the whole LinkedIn thing....where a pile of our WMIH people still show WMIH on their "Present" employment. Hard to believe that rigorous financial professionals haven't collectively updated their current employment to something other than an intentional ghost corp
I suppose it depends in how one defines “beneficiary”. I’m more of a mind these days that we aren’t supposed to know specific details because WMIH is the technical beneficiary. So WMIH who originally hired Susman Godfrey for fair and reasonable, would get the details, as WMIH is the actual beneficiary. However, We who released own beneficial interests of WMIH. So as WMIH gets paid, we get paid…and most likely without any accounting details. The only way I see us getting details is if there an exchange of our beneficial interests, for new stock or something to us, whereby we could reverse engineer value based on any stock for cash arrangement
and they are hiding.... both of Mr.Cooper Group Inc's 'Direc't & 'Ultimate Parent' Corporations are currently "NON-PUBLIC" information..... https://www.lei-lookup.com/record/549300KD8C6DPXYC2M26/
"Direct Parent Exception Reported" otherwise known here as 'xxxx'
&
"Ultimate Parent Exception Reported" otherwise known here as 'XXXX'
I would hope that's something. .... but I don't know enough to get excited yet.
I just haven't spent the time yet to understand who/what JPMC Financial is, and is this where JPM folded WMB into? I remember the original OCC doc in 2008 JPMNA asked permission from OCC to put WMB into CUSA (Chase usa).
xxxx & XXXX
The only thing that trips me up whether this PLR is us or not, is this reads like there is a few more subs in the mix...unless some of these are subs that have been hidden until their future as a temporary liability pit stop during a future distribution event...sort of like how Wand Merger was used as an interim temporary place holder for the Nationstar merger?
Great explanation, Thx! Have a great 3-day + (I know you will with all that horsepower), and Thx for your service!
Thx for this post. When you were referring to the potential of .06-7 for COOP shares for those who released, are those $ 7.4B in Euro Bonds + interest accumulated, taken into that .06-7 multiplier? OR, are the $ 7.4B in Euro Bonds another separate source of returning value? Seeing how WMI/WMIH owns these and COOP as servicer
ie, Could a person who released, get .06-7 multiplier in more COOP shares, and then also see value for the $7.4 B in Euro bonds on top of that? Or are the bonds wrapped up in that .06-7 multiplier?
TIA
lol, we've all seen so many new IDs over 15 years here..... disinformation campaigns are real. Longs don't trust anyone - we've literally seen and been through it all. It's not personal, and if you spend some time on the message board, then maybe..., but nobody's gonna give investing advice. And those spreading FUD get ignored. The answers can be found if you really want to spend the time here in honest pursuit. In fact, AZ gave you the correct answer.
I guess my overall point is that COOP's PPS is always lagging far behind where many say its actual value PPS should be,.... its way undervalued. Why?
Whether COOP's buyback shares are 'actually' canceled, or "typically" according to your AI (infers a maybe sometimes), or whether COOP is holding them in house as "treasury shares" and the smart people in the room know dilution is coming...something is holding this PPS down. It's not like people are beating down the doors for shares here cause there's a lotta room between $85 and $200+ PPS, if it's so undervalued as J. Bray says.
There is a market uncertainty and insecurity about the share buyback apparently. imo they know something is coming, and the market has had its fill of present conditions. It's reached saturation. Which is why I say the PPS today is baked into the cake.
Where has COOP declared the result of their share buyback program has/is to permanently retire these shares? If they were retired, and/or the market valued these shares as permantly retired, then the PPS should be even higher than what JWW has calculated..ie far north of $200 PPS. The only plausible explanation for a stale PPS compared to where it should be trading north of $200, is if dilution is expected. The PPS has risen incrementally to $85 over the past year as shares have been increasingly repurchased by COOP over the last year. The only thing that explains a throttled PPS versus actual value, and despite COOP's share buyback, is that dilution is right around the corner - or at least the general market fears that. I think dilution is baked into the cake already - which is a good thing. If repurchased shares are ultimately redistributed as payment on principle of legacy assets (sans 15 years of interest) that are newly freed up as the receivership terminates, and if dilution is baked in the cake...then imo we should/would see a PPS much higher than it is now, once the market realizes what COOP just gained for its share re-distribution
What's the fair PPS gonna be if all the shares COOP bought up, get redistributed back ? Where we are at currently? Maybe the $200-250 'fair pps' has never happened because those that know, know dilution is coming - or are waiting for COOP to clarify. So maybe the PPS we languish at, is so far below your 'fair PPS' because current prices are baked into the assumed coming dilution cake.
And Dime?
Its not tradeable at Schwab yet, but the fact that it actually shows up now using the search function, is very notable to me. And I have tried multiple times over the past years to search these at Schwab, solely for indication of possible action on the horizon
Makes you wonder eh? If JPM is now starting to pay off the various tabs at WAMU bars around town, this could be a possibility...in the lead up to closing of the receivership, which seems closer than ever.
Sorry if you sold your UQs, but you're not gonna lose on Ps, Ks. Nor has anyone lost anything if they still hold their original WMIH/COOP shares - those things have been a rocket, and I have zero complaints about COOP. So whatevssss, if you think you're screwed. If you actually released anything
Thanks for posting links to those trusts. I’m blown away by the Ks now showing. Making me wonder about whether the Lehman CTs are gonna blossom next.
Those people pushing Ps wanted you to sell all your UQs to them. UQs always own the bulk of the estate.
The 939s are WMI owned assets collateralized with WMB written product. That’s what AZ means by intertwined I think.
Term sheets (think GSA) could've preserved first right of refusal purchase rights by JPM after any TARP statute of limitation expired..if BBob statement is even actually true. Could explain why this has taken so friggin long. In other words, both statement could be right. A person could say it was prohibited, and could also say JPM bought lock.stock.barrel...because they haven't closed the transaction yet. Like buying a house under contract (the GSA), where an escrow account is then opened with a closing date, the closing date gets extended multiple times - however both buyer and seller agreed to grant multiple extensions to closing date as needed (thx to coffee committee, the fdic receiver and corp, etc.)
thx John!
Math and share calculations are not my thing. I'm trying to follow 😄 So is it like of 36M in potential reconstituted COOP shares at new $50 value after share reconstitution/dilution = $1.8B worth of new COOP to pass out to those who released. So $1.8B value x 100,000 former UQ released shares by someone (easy math) = 'A MASSIVE friggin number (turn calculator phone sideways) / divided by / 36M shares = $5M
so... a released UQ holder receives $5M in new COOP shares per 100,000 released UQs napkin math? and that's not including 15 years of interest, not including Ps, etc. that would come via various other entities/funding.
Or am I using wack math
"The 'SEC trackable' Preferred Managing sub"s latest SEC filing 2/28/2024 ...STILL....shows the same Seattle address since the inception of the WAMU/Seattle Art Museum collaboration aka later became Russel Investments Tower after receivership. Address: 1301 Second Ave WMC (mail stop) 3501a, Seattle 98101.
Interestingly, the same Seattle address mail stop for the 'preferred managing sub' when cross searched, is shared with a David 'Glen' Davenport, attorney. When you look him up, he has ZERO online presence in Seattle for anything other than this historic Seattle address - not one peep, article, or review, nothing .. But he does show up as an attorney for JPMChase Bank NA under the Texas State Bar. Started in Plano TX just after the Nationstar 'registrant' consummation.....just a quick minute suburban drive to COOP's headquarters in Coppell TX !!!!! It really couldn't be more clear, who's watching over everything... lol. from the preferred managing sub (contains 2017 other securitization subs folded in), to legacy WMI, to reorganized WMI, and to the 'registrant' of WMIH....🎶he's got the whole world in his hands 🎶
things that should make one go hmmmmm. except maybe those of us who paid attention. 😆 Thanks for being persistent in posting at the HUB.
XXXX - pay me
IF that even happens, just don't remove more than $1m per year to stay under 20%. David Tepper tears won't hurt my feelings
Maybe its a custom stretched Ferrari, lol? Works for limos
COOP doesn’t own legacy P preferred assets. WMIH owns COOP, and WMIH separately owns P preferred assets.
COOP (frmrly nationstar) can’t own P preferred assets without paying for it…and I don’t know if that’s even ever gonna be on the menu. P preferred assets are instruments for WMIH (legacy WMI) benefit. Remember that’s how WMIH paid KKR’s preferreds A & B among other things. But KKR has been paid off years ago, and WMIH’s P preferred managing sub, has been storing the income ever since.
There is baby 'xxxx' and big gorilla 'XXXX'. WMIH is the child corporation 'xxxx'. WMIH is not the Parent 'XXXX'. The actual Parent corporation of WMIH is the BIG 'XXXX' who's identity has become clear from the relationship those 'now paying dividends' have from the WMB bonds, which could only be possible if, a certain so-and-so is 'XXXX'
WMIH, the child corporation 'xxxx' owns COOP, among some other legacy subsidiaries of WMI...like a certain 'Preferred Managing Sub' for Ps that still pumps out income. And oddly enough, WMIH ('xxxx') only SEC reports and trades as if COOP was it's sole business - WMIH only uses Nationstar's former shell to represent the whole of itself 'xxxx' and report as its sole operations. Which is laughable... The other legacy WMI subs such as that certain 'Preferred Managing Sub' still operate almost invisible, thanks to SEC regs regarding FDIC receivership and securities. The Preferred Managing Sub's income is still SEC trackable to this day,,, income is made and reported to the SEC, but where it is actually 'held' is the question...as WMIH isn't forced to report that portion of its income...yet....
The conclusion of any LIBOR settlements impact, against the FDIC's WMB receivership's tentacles wrapped around our tangled legacy WMI interests, will force the acknowledgement and public accounting of these former 'safe harbor' subs. How exactly it is done....I await with restless anticipation, for the final act.
Mr. Cooper price offering on $1 billion in senior notes!
https://investors.mrcoopergroup.com/events-and-presentations/press-releases/press-release-details/2024/Mr.-Cooper-Group-Inc.-Announces-Pricing-of-Offering-of-1-Billion-of-Senior-Notes/default.aspx
😆 Good point, this would wrap up overnight if so
And now Schwab after hours showing $66.. interesting.
well, the proving date for class 10 was on the 21st, so being after that date might’ve been the cause for the order failing.
It’s surprising no one’s really talking about todays PPS. The MB is clogged with sky is falling sentiment
A couple weeks ago far prior to the deadline - I was also confused and sent proof of my holdings at Schwab (redacted except details specific to the CTs I own) to the email and ATTN: to Diane N. something. My gut says its not necessary because my holdings are in street name, but after seeing so much misleading #$$#% with WAMUs BK over the years, I felt I needed to send something anyways.
I couldn't access the claim form back then either...it went to an error page..too many redirections or something. However, the way the statement reads, they ask for your proof of claim, and if requested, to send them more detailed information about my holdings. This tells me 4 things: PWC must know all about Street name holders if only a general a proof of claim is required. Secondly, if they have questions about a claim, they say they will ask you to provide further proof (which I did, because the claim form is non-existent). Thirdly, this proof of claim information about my personal proof of holdings "as may appear to the administrators to be necessary" seems like its not such a big deal,...as if they already really know. Fourthly, the PWC letter that mentioned the deadline and the 'within 2 months payment schedule', actually only includes a 'transfer of claim' page, to inform them if you sold your CT interest to another party. So why would PWC include a 'transfer of claim' form a person could print out directly, but not include a 'Proof of Claim'? Tells me the Proof of Claim page its not really necessary, and they know who holds what... I'm guessing the Proof of Claim is really for people who don't hold in street name.
It will be telling after the November 21 deadline, if the sell feature at Schwab is also then frozen, just like the Buy button hasn't been available for a while. If money is coming within 60 days, I think they'd need the CTs to stop moving around amongst different holders until its all caught up
At the end of the day, I have sent a copy of my holdings to put my mind at ease. Overkill? probably...but..well is it? lol...
The bottom of the PWC letter does say "A creditor who has not proved their debt by the last date for proving may be excluded from the dividend"
‘..a distribution within 2 months of November 21, 2023’s proving deadline’
Says it all right there, don’t it 😃
Was the letter just for ECAPS? UK holders? Will CT holders get different notification?
Another version: https://www.pwc.co.uk/services/business-restructuring/administrations/non-lbie-companies/lbh-plc-in-administration/dividends-to-creditors.html
COOP, aka Mr Cooper Group Inc, aka 'the registrant', has an "Ultimate Parent" corporation as verified by GLEIF.org, that could be shorting COOP without being an insider... from one pocket to the other.
GLEIF.org is the international legal entity indentification (LEI #) platform, that every single corporation derives their LEI # from.
According to GLEIF.org, COOP aka Mr Cooper Group Inc has a "Direct Parent" and an "Ultimate Parent" who can remain anonymous due to a 'consolidated accounting exception'.
For kicks, what if something like JPM was COOP's "Ultimate Parent"? No wonder we haven't ever seen any other public proof due to consolidated accounting exceptions for anonymity. JPM could be shorting COOP to control its PPS for COOP's future mergers? or maybe JPM is shorting COOP to buy up cheaper shares for itself to flip later - just another way to make old WMI pay for itself ? I'm sure there's other scenarios. But it is curious how COOP always trades far below book