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OSG
Very impressive day today, fun to watch.
Good luck to all.
EquityFeed down for me also.
Thanks for posting what happened today32. I just saw your message and I canceled my GTC sell order. Sorry to hear about the fees but at least it was not more expensive.
SEC Announces Roundtable on Microcap Securities
Some of you may be interested in listening to this webcast live on the SEC website on October 17 if you don't know about it already:
http://www.sec.gov/news/press/2011/2011-186.htm
"SEC Announces Roundtable on Microcap Securities"
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
2011-186
Washington, D.C., Sept. 19, 2011 — The Securities and Exchange Commission today announced that it will host a public roundtable next month to discuss the unique regulatory issues surrounding the execution, clearance, and settlement of microcap securities.
The roundtable is being sponsored by the SEC’s Microcap Fraud Working Group, a joint initiative of the Division of Enforcement and Office of Compliance Inspections and Examinations. The Working Group is the Commission’s primary resource for issues relating to market participants and trading practices concerning securities primarily quoted on the OTC Bulletin Board (OTCBB) or OTC Quote (previously Pink Sheets).
The event will take place on October 17 from 1 p.m. to 5 p.m. at the SEC’s Washington D.C. headquarters. It will feature in-depth discussions of key regulatory issues including Anti-Money Laundering monitoring, compliance challenges, and potential changes to the regulatory framework. Panelists will include representatives from The Deposit Trust Company, broker-dealers, the Financial Industry Regulatory Authority and others.
The roundtable is part of an ongoing SEC effort to focus on the particular challenges facing issuers and regulated entities within the changing business and regulatory climates. The purpose of the roundtable is to enable Commission staff to gather ideas and request input for regulatory measures surrounding the execution, clearance and settlement of low-priced securities.
The event is open to the public with seating available on a first-come, first-served basis. The roundtable also will be webcast live on the SEC website and archived for later viewing. For more information about the roundtable, contact the Division of Enforcement at 202-551-6607.
# # #
http://www.sec.gov/news/press/2011/2011-186.htm
Special Alert Regarding National Stock Transfer...
http://dtcc.com/legal/imp_notices/
Check out the 1270-11 .pdf dated September 09, 2011:
"Special Alert Regarding National Stock Transfer..."
"This notice is to inform participants that DTC has coded all securities serviced by National Stock Transfer as non transferable. In addition, the issues have been chilled for all physical services(Deposits, WTs and CODs). The chills are effective September 8, 2011 and the impacted CUSIPs are
listed below."
I was on the ask on the 8th and 9th on one of the stocks in this list and had no idea about a chill on the security. It gets harder and harder to stay out of trouble lately with penny stock sales.
Hi today32,
I agree that my answer to you was not very helpful. Since I have not personally experienced falling victim to Penson's low price security policy I do not have a personal experience as an example. I was called by Track Data the morning of August 15 and was warned that I would be very affected so I canceled all orders and stopped all trading through Penson. I did send off 10 specific questions to Penson via Track Data in mid-august and those answers I received combined with reading the policy is all I have to go on. What I really do not like about the policy is even if you personally make sure that your volume does not exceed the 25% threshold you can still be dragged down and included in the charges by other Penson customers who do exceed the 25%. Also, there is no limit on these fees to protect the customer. On many trades that I did I was well over the 25% threshold, sometimes even 100% on super low volume stocks.
I do not think with only 100 shares that the charge you will face if any will be meaningful, perhaps nothing when you plug your trade into the formula.
((100 x .55)- 55) x (3/365) x 10%
Here is a sub penny example with explainations that I received from Penson if it is helpful for you as an example for the future on other trades:
*NSCC will not provide the actual computation to the trigger the charge (it’s proprietary). However, we do know it’s when the FIRM (Penson) exceeds 25% of the avg 30 day volume in an equity security during a settlement cycle.
*The above firm level computation makes it difficult to manage proactively over a broad customer base of accounts.
Example: symbol PnkJNK averages 400000 a day at .0002
Day 1 Correspondent A has customers sell 30000, 20000 and 50000. $20 customer credit for the sales earned,
Day 2 Correspondent A has customers sell 30000, 20000 and 50000. $20 customer credit for the sales, but $1000 NSCC charge (lock up)
Day 3 Correspondent A has customers sell 30000, 20000 and 50000. $20 customer credit for the sales, but add more $1000 NSCC charge (lock up now 2000)
Correspondent B has a customer sell 100000 $20 customer credit, but add more $1000 NSCC charge (lock up now 3000)
Day 4 no sales and the day 1 sales are settled 300000 out (75%) $2000 NSCC
Day 5 no sales and the day 2 sales are settled 200000 out (50%) $1000 NSCC
Day 6 no sales and the day 3 sales are settled 100000 out (25%) 0 NSCC
Correspondent A has prudently keep his customers at 25% on day 1 (100k).
But because this is an unsettled computation, on day 2 he’s at 50% of the daily average and will have triggered the charge.
On day 3 correspondent A is at 75% and the charge increases. But because this is a firm level computation Correspondent B puts Penson at 100%
And so on and so on…
But what is the NSCC charge? In the above example it’s 1000-3000. This represents a daily firm capital lock-up and means we are financing that balance (not actually charging them the 1000-3000).
We will be passing through those charges at a cost of 10% to the customer to carry the financing. For sub-pennies the math is not pretty…
((Quantity x .01) – Trade value) x (number of days until settlement/365) x 10%
((100000 x .01)- 20) x (3/365) x 10%
980 x .0082192 x .1 = .81 cents or about 4% of the trade cost in this example.
Sec processing processes this fee. Previously it was 15%
Hi today32,
NSCC assesses illiquid charges against pink sheet and bulletin board stocks irrespective of the price. The charge is a reflection of the outstanding sales in relation to 25% of the 20 day average daily volume. These charges can occur any time the unsettled sale/ delivery volume exceeds 25% of the 15 day ADV. Stocks priced below $0.01 are marked to 1¢.
((Quantity x .01) – Trade value) x (number of days until settlement/365) x 10%
((100000 x .01)- 20) x (3/365) x 10%
Hi Tex,
I looked it up on the daily list and INOV was the offending stock for me that I sold. As you can see it has the double NSCC Eligible Security asterisk but it was not DTC eligible. It was sure news to me when I got a phone call from New York that I had a problem.
http://www.otcbb.com/asp/dailylist_detail.asp?d=09/26/2003&mkt_ctg=OTCBB
About 10 years ago I sold 1,000,000 shares of a non-DTC eligible stock on the Track Data account (Penson). That was my first experience with a non-DTC eligible sale and I have been careful to avoid the same mistake again. It was very scary but did not cost me much in the end, only about $250.00. Of course that was 10 years ago and I am sure it would cost much more now.
The most recent Penson list I have was emailed to me from Track Data so I do not have a link. It is from July 2011 and around 325 symbols. I have been adding to this list ever since by manually going to the DTCC web page and adding all CUSIP’s to be exited from CNS as they are released:
http://www.dtcc.com/legal/imp_notices/nscc/2011.php
I like that link to keep up with the new non-DTC stocks since the entries are dated in order.
My Penson list from July has a lot of hand written entries on it so I do not have my current complete list in an electronic file format. The Penson July list I have is more complete than other lists I have seen on IHUB so if you have a way for me to upload the file or send it to you let me know.
I know that Ameritrade does their own clearing. I have been with them since Datek. I have a Track Data account (which clears through Penson) and an Ameritrade account. If I did not make my post clear I meant that I did not think Ameritrade would let me buy if CAGTF was not DTC eligible and I was saying that if I was using a Penson broker to sell I would be worried about their new low price security policy on top of the possiblity that CAGTF was not DTC eligible since the 20 day ADV for CAGTF is only about 400 shares.
Yes I have also entered test orders that Ameritrade accepted although the symbols were on Penson non-DTC lists.
As of August 15th I had to stop all trading through Track Data where I had a very successful penny trading business for 10 years because of Penson's new low price security policy. This new policy has hurt me very much.
CAGTF
I entered a test buy order on the Ameritrade account and there were no problems with the order going through. I do not think Ameritrade would accept the order if CAGTF traded only in paper certificates. I would be more worried if the offending trade would violate Penson's new low price security policy.
CAGTF is most likely DTC eligible since Ameritrade let me buy. I also have the most recent Penson non-DTC eligible list. I use a Penson broker (myTrack) as my main trading account but I enter a test order first on my Ameritrade account before every single OTCBB or pink buy order on my myTrack account. If Ameritrade accepts the order than I know the stock is DTC eligible because you cannot trade paper certificates on Ameritrade and you will get a message that "opening transactions for this security are not accepted." I sold 1,000,000 shares years ago of a non-DTC eligible stock on myTrack and it was a scary experience as the fees kept rolling in until the day when the stock finally settled.
Not just Zecco, all Penson brokers I would assume got the roundup.
A family member received 100 SKYC shares today on her Track Data account which is a Penson broker. I bought mine on Ameritrade.
Ameritrade assigned 100 DKII shares to my account today.
Thanks a lot for the update loss-pro, it is good to know that they have at least submitted the request for the shares. Hopefully things will work out for us.
Good luck.
I am not so sure about DKII either as I have also had several roundups fail in the past such as the ones you mentioned. At least the buy-in cost in general is quite low but it is sure a disappointment when one waits for such a long time for the roundup process to possibly take place only to have things fail. Hopefully things will work out in the future for us all more times than not.
Good luck.
It is good to know some others are in also. Hopefully things work out for us.
Good luck to all.
Did anyone own shares of DKII now DKIID?
DKII was in the daily list on 8/04/2010 for a 1-200 R/S. There was no mention of a roundup in the daily list but the DEF 14C from 9/02/2009 stated all odd lot shareholders and fractional shareholders will be rounded up to 100 shares. I bought 100 shares @ .15 on 9/17/2009.
Same here, 1 share of ACIED in the Ameritrade account. Hopefully there will be mandatory rounding some time down the road.
Good Luck.
To gabkok-
I only have two brokerage accounts. I have mostly used Ameritrade in the past for round ups with mixed results. From now on I am going to use myTrack (clears through Penson) which is my main trading account.
Good luck.
ACIE
I bought 100 ACIE @ .03 on 9/21/2009 on my Ameritrade account. If Ameritrade does not come through for me on this one I will do all my round ups on my other account from now on which clears through Penson. I hope things work out for everybody.
Good luck to all.
Thanks for the info djr63
Thanks for posting the details of what Ameritrade told you about GRBUD. I will hold on to my shares as well.
Good luck to all.
Ameritrade --> GRBUD
I bought 499 GRBU @ .11 on my Ameritrade account the day the split was on the daily list. About 10 minutes ago the 499 was converted to the new ticker, GRBUD. At least the 64.88 I spent was not a total loss.