Thanks ascott. I'm undecided as well. My gut reaction is to vote "hell no" but the thought of getting what little is left of my money away from the snakes that have pissed it all away is tempting. Hmmm.... Do I take the criminals I know or get new ones? Reminds me of earlier this year when when I saw people trying spin Tang investing in this stock as a positive. That worked out well didn't it?

Anyone have an idea on when we're supposed to be getting proxy materials on the "merger"?

Winalov. Your last sentence is the key to what I am saying:

"Unfortunately management credibility has worn down long time ago".

Since small biotechs sell hope in a future outcome in order to finance operation today and Biosante has lost credibility; they are left with little choice. They are looking for a strategy that will clean the name they have sullied and create a new vehicle for cash injections. Without it, financing is going to be way too expensive from here on out (until they actually succeed at something and restore some credibility).

I'm personally not surprised the stock price has fallen more. They are telegraphing weakness (they seem to be particularly good at that). Maybe it is an elaborate game but based on their track record of buffoonery I doubt it - they are shouting to the world that the street called their bluff.

I'm not saying I like it. I'm not saying I'll vote for it. I'm just saying the scenario makes sense to me - and unfortunately I have no choice but to wait as you suggest. So we'll see.

I think the biggest problem right now is what is built-in to the stock so to speak; The stench of systematic failure. When the market walks away from a company you are left to the hounds. I think we have been witnessing being left out in the cold for a while now. Once you get there, the only way back in is by taking on another name and/or a change in senior leadership. In that sense, the merger is exactly the right thing to do. In the sense that it will further dilute and make even more vulnerable the BPAX shareholders, it's a raw deal.

Thanks. I appreciate that. It's not like I want to be so bearish on it after all I own the darn thing.

Exactly. Post of the decade! here it comes..... Deleted.

Mr. DD,

I think your analogy is more appropriate than you may realize.

On the one hand, you have people who are guided by their hopes of success and desire for order. Everything that is contrary to their investment goals is a mystery of the BPAX God/Board. They spend time puzzling over these mysteries on this board. They will guess at answers but ultimately the answer is not important - their belief in an outcome they desire is enough to take it on faith. When a fortuitous event occurs - as they sometimes do, it will surely be proof of the BPAX God/Board and proof that their long suffering was all that was required.

On the other side, we have people who observe and document the state of things now, historical record of how we got here, and try to predict where we will go from here based on all the evidence we can gather. They use methods that attempt to prevent their own selfish hopes and dreams from clouding their judgment in order to understand things more clearly and improve their lives.

An understandable position on both sides in my opinion. I know what side I would rather be on but I don't fault you or others for their attempts to maintain peace of mind. I do however get a little tired of the sanctimonious attitude of the true believers.

JTFM,

I'm hoping for some movement on price after safety as well. However, with no FDA allowed indication (based on Phil D. reply) we'll still be waiting. This is a company that's already burned institutions and embarrassed analysts before... so I'm not sure we're going to get a bunch of upgrades and get launched into Orbit. We'll probably get a decent bump but based on track record, any gain will almost certainly be wiped out by an offering - history is on my side here unfortunately and those new trials don't pay for themselves.

I'm starting to form the opinion that the company is doing nothing to help the stock price and prevent manipulation because in the short run it's the only realistic way they will be able to get anyone in on a stock offering. Look at what they did on the last few, consistently playing the price down while we're already in the basement. Look who is buying in, we're dealing with shylocks now.

Most people can rationalize anything when a $500,000 salary with perks and benefits most of us could only dream about are on the line. Besides, this is the only way and it's for the investors own good in the long run, right?

If the pipeline and testosterone safety data is as "secretly valuable" as some claim then we are in a very dangerous position. Rock bottom prices, massive float, and the few remaining big investors pissed off, this is a recipe for disaster.

Let's hope that we get some really good news really soon.

We've had this conversation before, but somehow we always move silently around the point...

I'm not arguing that the company wouldn't be an attractive target for buyout. I'm not saying there isn't evidence of Abbot involvement. I'm not even saying that the company is *trying* to screw us.

I am saying that the stock price is crap. The company has done virtually nothing to prevent this and at times appears to assist it or at least ignore it. Furthermore, I will reply to the Abbot herring by saying that in a buyout the share price of a publicly traded company is a key factor in determining the amount of money to be exchanged. Perhaps you are under the impression that companies like Abbot are charitable with their shareholders money? I am not, and therefore Abbot chomping at the bit is only worrisome to me.

Whether it was intentional or not, we are vulnerable to be taken advantage of (even more than we have already suffered) and in my opinion almost certainly will be.

Sorry double post

If the scenario you refer to is the reality (and it may well be), and we didn't get into this position by stupidity or irresponsible behaviour, that can mean only one thing as far as I can see; they have sold us down the river.

Well said sir.

I couldn't agree more about management. It wouldn't take much for them to help out the shareholders. Why aren't they doing it? I have a really hard time believing that it's not orchestrated. Could people with this kind of education and experience really be that stupid and irresponsible?

While the post may be in bad taste, I strongly agree with both it's sentiment and that this type of reminder is badly needed on this board. While the wild dreams of some are nice, it's helpful to remember that some of us have lost thousands on this investment/scam and managment has demonstrated at every turn that they DO NOT CARE about us.

Anyone who wants to reply to this and say how swell BPAX management really is, go look at the chart. When the chart looks right, then we can all hold hands and sing.

Oh never mind me... I must be a paid basher. If I wasn't then I would realize that "silent mode" was in effect because we're all about to be rich.

Besides, bad taste or no, seems like he was trying to make a joke. Sheesh. Is this a no joking, pumping only zone?

Very well said. This should be posted daily on this board to keep some sanity. Let's save the hoping and dreaming for when management does anything to demonstrate they even remember we exist.

Yes. Those poor bastards. How can they survive working for so little? How will they afford a new Bugatti Veyron with two kids in the ivy league? Thank god for bonuses.

Hello. I have also lost on this POS. Please continue to post this type of information on this board. I will join a lawsuit if I can. It seem pretty clear to me that last year management chose a new set of bosses (noteholders) without informing the shareholders of the company.

Been saying since I got on here: Biosante management CAN NOT BE TRUSTED. Been hearing stuff like this since I got here...

"Oh, I trust Dr. So and so, look at his resume"

"An R/S can be a good thing"

"They have enough cash, why would they dilute further?"

"They own shares in the company too" (This one is my favorite. Free, nearly worthless shares are not as high a priority as a $600,000 a year salary with the perks)

Not exact quotes but you know who you are.

Their agenda is taking care of themselves PERIOD. If we ever get out of this hole they've burried us in, it will only be because they think they left a dollar somewhere on our corpses.

Perhaps this raping is somehow for my own good? Buyout around the corner? How am I to seperate this one from the 6 previous?

I started voting against the board a while ago. I suggest everyone on IHUB do the same. You want change? Keep buying your cheap shares and vote against them on everything until they start acting like they work for us. No raises, no stock plans, NO CONFIDENCE.

Jeff,

Thanks for taking the time to post your email. I'll be very interested in the answers you get (if any).

JTFM, I guess at the end of the day, we have to trust someone with our money if we want it to grow. Having a very impressive resume (like Dr. Sullivan) is one way to help demonstrate that you can be trusted. Execution of a business plan and increasing investors fortunes is the ultimate proof - I'm still waiting impatiently on that part.

An argument from authority is a dangerous thing; a lot of people lost fortunes in the last few years believing in the experts.

Hopefully the men running BioSante are not the same type as their classmates.

Right. I was just saying that if the more "evil" form of shorting still appears to be going on with no action from the SEC; I have my doubts that outlawing shorting would help - Not that I've made up my mind about it like you have. Just saying.

I hope you are right. That would be HUGE. HUGE. HUGE!
What's happening to me...

"And what happened then? Well, in Whoville they say that the Grinch's small heart grew three sizes that day."

If I'm not mistaken, naked shorting is already illegal. I don't personally believe for one second that it's being enforced however.

Does the delivery method come into play at all? Or is it simply a matter of showing the amount of testosterone in the system at a given time and not how it was delivered?

Perhaps you already addressed this so please forgive me if you did...

What keeps a company like Abbott from simply buying us up for next to nothing? What keeps Simes out of court for the next hundred years if he captains a ship full of gold to the bottom of the ocean so it can be sold at scrap prices?

I just don't see how a monster like this looming in the shadows is good while we are on our knees. Perhaps you don't either - but that's not the impression I get.

IMHO The most *likely* reason they don't communicate is that they have nothing (positive) to communicate. Which, I agree, is getting pretty old.

What are you worried about? Don't you read the board? Let me refresh your memory...

Reverse Split = Good for shareholders

Dilution = Good for shareholders

Big money that would sell out thier mother owning more and more of the company = Good for shareholders

Failed Trials = Good for shareholders

Approved drugs that generate no revenue = Good for shareholders

Come on man! Be positive.

I would invite anyone who wants to complain about your posts and their lack of gushing enthusiasm to go take a look at the 5 year chart for BPAX. Anyone here want to call that a good investment? Would anyone here be willing to hire someone for an executive position if that was their resume?

LOL. I kind of lost my love after I found out half the league was cheating with roids. How about cars?

If we didn't have posts that suggest answers based on logical fallacies (a particular favorite here being the "non sequitur") what would we have to talk about?

You are correct sir. My apologies. I was mistaken about the idiot thing. It was Nutsy who said it: post# 16385. Not a big deal as it was supposed to have been in jest.

I realize there is an understandable fear to keep screaming shorts from taking over an investors board like this. I think some of the aggresiveness towards contrary opinions that I have been complaining about is at least partly due to this. Let's just not throw out the baby with the bath water so to speak. Especially since I'm one of the babies - LOL.

Thanks for the reply. I certainly hope for the best as I still have a significant (for me) position in this company. I think some of the active posters on this board have given a lot of good details that can be used to draw an optimistic conclusion for future prospects - and I personally am planning on waiting it out at this point. Though that could change; We'll see how much the board ignores and abuses us in the coming months (I expect a good bit of both). As you have pointed out, trust is getting more and more difficult here.

I agree that the daily vs. weekly diary is the favored theory at this point. Time will tell if that was the (only) problem.

I see your point about scapegoating and I think it would be a much better argument were we talking about a mid-level manager or below. However, we are talking about the BOD of a publicly traded company. The buck has to stop somewhere. What you see as scapegoating by me I see as blameshifting by management. Afterall, they chose to go the SPA route (I heard their defense for this), choosing to go that way makes the outcome of that choice their responsibility. Compounding this point, how about the fact that they are asking for another SPA? Can they continue to blame the FDA if the next one doesn't work out?

As always, appreciate the reply.

By the way... Still think I'm an idiot for thinking dillution is coming?

I know this isn't my conversation - but it's posted on the board so I'm butting in; Primarily because I believe this board could be a place for rational discussion of a company that we are all obviously interested in. The problem is, every time I tune in I see at least one of the frequent posters crying because someone posted something about the company that wasn't very nice.

I for one, am NOT HAPPY about the time frames and the additional 36 million dollars required for 2 additional tests. It is an EPIC FAILURE that most certainly get anyone in my career field fired on the spot and most likely ran out of the industry.

When is it OK for us to expect a return on our investment? Guess what? You don't get to decide that.

I appreciate many of your posts and would prefer you do not move on as you suggested to this person. I would prefer that you and your buddies stop being a butt-hurt chearleaders when some of the other OWNERS of this company take issue with as AF aptly put it today, being "bled dry".

The last big dilution I remember was right after it had been stated several times that they had money well into blah blah blah. Saying "we have enough money" is not the same as saying "I promise we won't dilute". Did he say something to that effect and I missed it?

Perhaps some of us idiots are speaking from experience

No - or at least not the friendly kind where we all win. What I'm trying to say is that I see people get excited all the time when a big shark buys into a company and they use it as a justification for their investment moves. I just think this is naive. If he could meet his target for ROI by screwing the rest of us then he would screw away; and he has the juice to do it. I am just rejecting the argument that Tang being here is necessarily a good thing. Contrary to what others have said on this board, I don't believe that Rich men get/stay rich by making good investments. Rich men are rich because they make sure that the game is in their favor at all times. We should hope we don't end up on the other side of the board from Tang or whoever. Owning a huge piece of the company doesn't make him our friend, that's all I'm saying.

When a shark get's in the pool with you it isn't necassarily a good thing and more often than not a bad thing. We have no idea why Kevin Tang is in this stock and whether that's good for us. A 100% profit from a very low price on a hostile take-over in a few weeks would be a great for him but wouldn't be so hot for most of us. Not that I think that's likely, I'm just saying it doesn't make me sleep better when some rich pirate get's in.

No way! Everyone on this board says this company is very well ran and the R/S is in my best interest. I'm so grateful they care enough to bend me over. Grab your ankles boys!

Perhaps I've just had the hope beaten out of me on this one. Like you said the communication and transparency of this company stinks so I'm left wondering.

You make some good points and I appreciate your thoughts. Thanks.

Thanks for the reply. Let me start by saying I hope that you are right and I am wrong.

However, this is exactly the kind of "hugging" I was referring to. Didn't I read you say you are/were a police officer? Surely you must be familiar with Occam's razor then. What is the simplest explanation? That we are all going to be rich soon because of a complex scheme to drive the stock into the ground, then do nothing as it gets shorted into oblivian, then do an R/S further driving the stock into the ground, finally to then release a bunch of amazing news that was saved up to launch us to new highs?

Or is the simplest explanation that management is incompetant (not as doctors but as managers of a publicly traded company) and/or have complete and total disregard for shareholders? You know, the scenario that happens routinely around the world.

Perhaps the medicine is good for me, or pehaps it's poison (again time will tell) - but if it tastes like ass I'm not going to smile and say it's delicious.

How's it taste?

Ha! Glad you liked that. I sure hope I'm wrong. I'll be the first to start the next group hug if so.