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Hey Blue. Didn't you realize this is Biotech. Milestones are irrelevant. Who you hire to run the ship is as well. Investors will always be there to fork out more cash for any raise you ever do. We've been doing it for over a decade. Did 2 raises last year alone. And did an ATM thing as well. Not even sure what that is but who cares. It's BIOTECH so they bought it!!!
Partnerships never really happen in this industry, it's all talk. I've been saying it for 10 years and they still think it will happen. I know right?
Did I just see that you worked at Elbit? YOU'RE hired!!! Just make your resume look good for the lemmings. They'll believe anything trust me. Look at mine!!! Successful companies. They actually bought it!!!
You want to travel the world. Boy you're in luck. We do the same show year after year and everyone thinks it's ok. We even go to manufacturing shows even though we don't manufacture for anybody but ourselves. All first class to boot
You'll be perfect for the board. In 10 years I bet you'll have half a million shares. All I ask is you do what I say. Remember who put you here always. You work for me, not shareholders like you're supposed to.
Remember too what I said about embellishing your credentials a little too. What chump will ever check to see if you WERE actually a director on 2 nasdaq companies from 15 years ago.
And most importantly, feel free to give us big bonuses. Nobody will know if we deserved it. How could they. You think we keep them in the dark by accident? Just makes them think tons of stuff going on behind the scenes. I heard someone say anything under 2 bucks is a steal. thats what I'm talking about!!! And I heard too that someone thinks big pharma is keeping our price down. We don't even talk to big pharma.
Welcome aboard the gravy train. All of this is the latest craze in Biotech. All the cool companies are doing it.
Hi Spidey,
Not entirely sure which post you were responding to. Maybe from a week ago which yes, you already answered thank you.
What I was more recently asking about over the weekend was with regards to the delay in preclinical studies from Fukushima and NYBC. They are now more than double the timeframe estimated. The trials that don't involve enrolment of humans, only mice or whichever animal they are using.
Using the logic of ethics, cro promises and such, don't really cut it for me. Yes I'm sure that this could be the case at times. But at what point should the company be held accountable for the timeframes they state. Pretty much every single one they have put out is missed. Not by a month, a quarter...but often more than a year. No explanation, nothing. Just changed presentations. You have stated they could be a little more transparent. They are not transparent at all!!! I will continue to chalk these many missteps, that continue on without any explanation or guidance, to our incompetent management and board.
Yes the IC timeframe to enrol was horrific. Who really knows. Your explanation is quite feasible. But we are now a month late on interim results in HCT. The one they hired the secretive, large CRO for way back in 2016.
Could all of these misses just simply be management throwing out pretty much fictitious timeframes to lure investors into taking the plunge? Quite honestly, I think this may just be the case. Only trouble with that is you burn your bridges and piss investors off like they have done with some here, and lose all credibility.
My other question of which was overlooked was regarding the board member who's resume has not been proven to add up. A reason Pluristem felt they were suitable to be a board member.
Here's the quote from the 10K
During 2003 to 2004 Mr. Ben-Yoram served as a director of Brainstorm Cell Therapeutics Inc. (BCLI) and Smart Energy solutions, Inc. (SMGY), both of which were traded on the NASDAQ. Just have a look at the blue section at the top of the links I have now provided.
Brainstorm wasn't formed until November 22, 2014. Was Golden Hand resources before that time.
https://www.sec.gov/cgi-bin/browse-edgar?action=getcompany&CIK=0001137883&owner=exclude&count=40&hidefilings=0
Or Smart Energy Solutions. Wasn't formed until September 1st 2005. Was Datigen before then and at the time in question.
https://www.sec.gov/cgi-bin/browse-edgar?company=Smart+energy+solutions&owner=exclude&action=getcompany
And please feel free to go through any of the filings and see if you find his name as director anywhere. I tried, and couldn't.
And that's just one of the three board members I have found with questionable resumes.
I also wondered about Lior Raviv. An R&D analytical researcher in 2010-2011 for Teva. Then hired to Pluristem and now VP of Development. Was wondering if these are normal steps to get to such an important title at this lightning speed.
Or the head of HR only having experience at Elbit Vision Systems. Feel confident in her ability to take the vast experience gained at Elbit, to being able to understand the needs of a Biotech?
You make a point of Protalix. They have experience yes. They have a lingering price yes. But they have made deals and seems pretty impressive from what you have written. Kind of shows even with good management that is able to do deals, it's still hard to improve price. What would their price be if they had incompetent management and wasn't able to get these deals?
Yes I may agree that change in management may not have an immediate effect on our price. But bring people in that have the ability to look at our company and provide a clear direction and set attainable goals, I truly believe investor confidence would be enhanced tremendously.
Hopefully my comments don't get glanced over and dismissed. These are truly valid points about the integrity and lack of qualified people in important positions. Your help on the trial and product side have been stellar. But to chalk the misfits in this company and poor resumes as being ok, or we don't know the inner workings of the company or comments of such, does a complete injustice to this board. Only a few take a similar stance as mine, or at least express it. I would hope others are starting to believe the truth.
Again I have yet to hear any argument whatsoever that states otherwise. Yes we are progressing with trials and have yet to have any bad news on a study. But we have yet to see a study with numbers to back it up. That will change come April. Still hoping and still believe in the technology. Just hope others don't beat us to the finish line.
Thanks EichKing. Pretty simple logic if you ask me. I'm a few beers deep(er) so hopefully this post doesn't get chopped. Real beer not Yankee beer. Lol. Please ignore any incomprehensible statements I may make in advance. Feel free to cut and paste that one with an "all of it" quote. LMBO. You know who you are!!!
What do you expect from people that have been invested in this stock for many years. Pretty new to this board, yet spout off the apparent thousands upon thousands of stocks you're supposedly gobbling up. Spouting gibberish that anything under 2 bucks is a steal. Or the goal of 100,000 shares. LMBOx1000. Nah, you should expect glowing praises on your incredibly enlightening cut and paste or infamous "quote" posts.
If you were to start up a company...say an electrical one. Would you hire a bunch of plumbers? Is that what you would want the Manager you hire to have experience in? Or better yet, the head of HR? Sure you may be able to make it work eventually, but there would be a steep, long learning curve. And a costly one too. Would that be a wise decision?
But apparently that's how Biotechs work. It's the norm. Is this field not an incredibly complex field, with all the rules, regulations and governmental red tape? Probably one of the worst I can think of, except maybe nuclear plants. Let alone the inordinate amount of cash needed to bring your product to market seeing as it takes over a decade to get it there. Notwithstanding the incredibly low odds your product will make it through to the final trial unscathed.
And another point in these shows. How much time and effort is put into booking flights, hotels, meals, cars, preparation of presentations, along with other things. Time is also taken from some of the other 180 employees that is wasted doing this. Going through receipts, inputting, etc. not just the travelling employee, but others as well. Auditors time validating the expenses. Most likely the personal assistants doing much of it. I'm sure each of our co-ceo's have had the pleasure of having. That's what you get when you think you've made it to the big leagues, even if it's premature, kinda like the huge bonus!!!
There are two big equations in any company. Management and the product. You could have a great management and a poor product, and still make it work. Or a great product and poor management, could also work. I would take the first in reality. But why would anyone not want great in both? Defies logic truly.
People who own shares have a say. Unfortunately the choices I have made in how I invest in this stock, I have none. We may make it eventually if the product outlasts management. But with great management, we would have been there years ago. Or in the very least, have a war chest of cash to ensure we make it to the point where we know if our product either succeeds or fails.namd then have the chance at other indications to hope for
Our cash on hand does not get us there imo. Unless ARS comes through. If we fail in that one, look out. Any failure at this point, be it ARS or IC results, will be the death of this company. Or at least a few nails in the coffin. And it will be a long shot to dig our way out. Maybe then we will get a big Pharma buyout, on their terms after all, for pennies on the dollar. Or maybe the "controller" will have the last laugh, after the decade long conspiracy. Damn those dark pools. Gets us schmucks every time. Why didn't I listen!!! LMBO.
Yes just keep glaring past reality. Keep being fine with it. Just because it's about management, ignore it. Saw it on other boards so it's just a fad, trend, whatever you want to call it. Relevant questions, comments directed to you, just ignore, it's just how boards work.
Who cares that our board members have collected an average of half a million shares for what. Or that some of them have things listed on their "resumes" that are extremely questionable, if not fictitious. How can one be a director on a company before it is a company? Just the norm o guess right.
They are supposed to act on behalf of SHAREHOLDERS, not management. And when some have questionable resumes, how or why do you think they are going to live up to the reason they are there. Yes when a new company is formed, many are just token appointments. Like most of the long timers here were. But as a company progresses, they change. Not ours though.
Just because you want to try and justify the vast amount of information out there that's shows an inept management and board by chalking it up to being the norm for biotech, others do not. I have yet to see a single post with any factual information in the defence of management or board. Heck even without factual evidence, I have seen none. You're questioning management, call them names.
If Zami had managed to take Elbit to become a powerhouse of the textile industry or whatever it is they do, I could possibly see a value. All the companies on his resume are two bit companies when he was there, and after.
But let's just bring in others with the same pedigree unfortunately. Let's have the head of HR, come in with experience only from Elbit. She must know good biotech employees when she sees them. Elbit groomed her for that.
Or a year or two as a Teva as a R&D analytical researcher, a couple years at Pluriestm for Lior Raviv. (My bad in the previous post on him...thanks MC). That's good enough to become VP for me.
Most other companies have announcements of big hires they have brought in over the years. Industry veterans with tons of experience. We get Lior, or even worse, a co-ceo for Kaki. Or announcements of preeclampsia steering committee that has done jack. Are we even still in that game?
Most if not all here, believe in the technology. Some have wavered in the belief of the technology, as our price has remained the same for a decade. Other companies without the technology we own, have doubled, tripled, and so on. So there is a legitimate reason to start questioning the technology.
We all know your belief in the road show and it's good for them. What is the purpose of going to a manifacturing show, when it's not for sale? Or the same show year after year, same people, same everything. Waste of time. But contrary to your belief, it is expensive and takes time out of everyone's lives involved, that would be better suited doing actual work.
I already made a point on milestones and how they are more than double the original estimate on preclinical trials. That's normal right. That's fine right. You didn't want to answer it last time. Care to now? Just the norm I know. Don't believe it? But that's all you will say.
So please let me see your argument that management is good. Yes they are progressing at a snails pace. Yes we have seen zero bad data as of yet. Not really good arguments imo.
Or an even better question for you. Why would you NOT want a management team and board with a ton of experience? Other companies made the change, and have been greatly rewarded. We have not and remain stagnant year after year. Kind of defeats the purpose of investing.
Sainthood. LMBO. Because they can have a civil point of view and actually try to answer questions, without resorting to name calling. You want to shrug off legitimate questions about the above mentioned by calling posters names, don't think it will come without deserved criticism.
Anxiously await your response. Hopefully it will remain for me to see.
Here's another one for you Spidey. Thanks to 1stock for pointing me to this.
Lior Raviv. VP of Development.
Has experience as an R&D Analytical Researcher at Teva from 2010 to 2011, and schooling credentials. How far up the food chain in this field is an R&D analytical researcher. Is the next step for this position anywhere near VP of development? Is 1 or 2 years max enough experience to make this jump? Or would one expect a lot more experience in this industry, given the importance of this title.
Are you ok with this persons qualifications too?
Hi Spidey,
I was thinking take half of the 2nd 50% away since half would survive with no treatment anyway. Just a little mental lapse of reason on my part. Pretty embarrassing actually, but everyone has their moments.
When people start to bring up something with regards to missed milestones, it's good to rehash it and take a look at the vast array of misses since they get bigger month by month. Really puts it in perspective, and for me, proves my many points on the inability of management to take us to the next level due to the majority of them along with the board having zero experience,in this field.
What are your thoughts on the 7 month delay in getting anything from either of the preclinical trials. It has taken more than double what they expected. Of course, we don't know the inner workings. But what are your thoughts into this horrific miss which doesn't rely on recruitment. You've mentioned ethical concerns could delay, but they would know this.
So much of what this company does, stinks. And I am tired of anyone, including yourself, saying they are ok with management. The missing pieces to that 3rd board members resume you know the one stating a director in 2 companies listed on the Nasdaq with timeframes didn't match the companies existence. How is anyone fine with this???
And one other thing I don't buy is the holdup on ARS. Sure the intricacies of design, ethics and such could delay the time to start. But funding does not. Could easily announce funding, but nothing. It's in their presentation about funding, but really no funding has been approved.
The two examples of management changes for two other companies that start their respective companies on impressive moves. Why would anyone not want this for our company. It astonishes me daily. If my battered up noggen could take it, I'd be bashing it on the wall.
You've stated yourself that you would rather have experienced people in there. But that management is ok.
I honestly don't know what it will take to change people's minds. It's like all of rural America is on this board, and Zami's the new Trump.
So basically when a biotech puts out milestones, they should just be ignored. Why put them out there to begin with if they have ZERO relevance. Any comment on the 7 month delay in preclinical results. Again it's hard to get mice to enroll.
What pluristem results are you referring to when you talk about mitigates problems with regards to chemo and radiation therapy? Funny that is one of the 7 month delayed milestones in the above mentioned. But who cares about milestones.
And for you 2% improvement getting approval. Approve it all you like. You think any payee or anyone in their right mind is going to pony up 30 to 50 grand for a 2% improvement. Will anxiously await your responses tomorrow.
But I'm good with management.
It's just too easy sometimes!!!
LMBOx1000
Was thinking a little more on the ARS study and the 50% survival of the non treated group. I just realized that theoretically, 50% of the TREATED group should have survived as well even if treatment did nothing at all. So wouldn't that put us at just 10% better than the placebo?
Something with my numbers doesn't seem right to me. Maybe someone can help. Of course, this is being very simplistic not taking all results into account, but just something to ponder. That's why we need numbers involved that give us statistically significant results. And this thought would also have to be applied to competitors results as well.
The wait to get this ball rolling is painful to say the least. Once initiated, it's out of the hands of Pluristem's hands, so timelines should be met.
Exactly!!! Here are the milestones from Jan 2017 presentation.
Data readout does selection ARS 1H17
Contract with U.S. Government for ARS 2H17
Initiation of pivotal study ARS NHP 2H17
Data readout phase 1 open label HCT 2H17
Preclinical data Fukushima 1H17
Preclinical data NYBC 1H17
U.S/Europe phase 3 study initiation 1Q17
Japan pivitol study initiation 2H17
Closing on JV deal with Sosei 1Q17
Data from IC multinational phase 2 early 2018
Interim results from Europe phase 3 CLI 2H18-1H19
And at the bottom with milestones for 12 months a couple more.
Initially trial hip fracture
Licensing deal JV with China.
Misses on vast majority of them. Some by 7 months now. So why the delay on preclinical data from Fukushima and NYBC. Having trouble enrolling mice?
But I'm ok with management.
Me too. Maybe next week will be different. LMBO. Or will we end up a couple pennies today and go right back down on Monday like usual.
No worries EichKing. I took a look at the presentation and thought I saw the same thing. Glad allo pointed that out though. Makes a big difference on which options to buy, the cheaper June, or the September that just opened up.
Yes the controller along with conspiracies and dark pools for years now. LMBO. Couldn't be the thing called "the stock market"
With regards to ARS, would have been much better if non dosed primates didn't have such a high survival rate, considering the term lethal dose. Zami makes a huge claim, fully recovered, but not sure how valid that statement is, if at all.
As for which I would take, I would go 100% R18. Entimolid with all the side effects and blood transfusions, I would take my chances. But I like to gamble, hence why I remain in this stock for the possibility this thing turns around.
One correction I would like to make thanks to Allo pointing this out. I thought IC readout was changed to 2h18 from April in the presentation. But it is actually 2q18 so that is one thing that didn't change. My apologies for this.
I anxiously await these results and was very disappointed my mistaken thought of 2h. So I'm glad April will hopefully be when we actually get to see results from this larger study.
Most likely preclinical stuff don't you think. Sounds more like mouse trials, not humans. Or could they jump straight to humans?
Sorry I don't know why that link didn't work. I'm not sure of the person you mention, as this was the bio of the Ceo previous to the current.
"Mr. Daniel M. Junius, also known as Dan, served as the Chief Executive Officer of ImmunoGen, Inc. from January 01, 2009 to May 13, 2016 and served as its President from July 2008 to May 13, 2016. Mr. Junius has over two decades of experience in financial management and business strategy, including nearly ten years as Chief Financial Officer at two NYSE-listed companies. He served as an Acting Chief Financial Officer of ImmunoGen, Inc. from September 13, 2013 to December 30, 2013. He joined ImmunoGen, Inc. in May 2005 and served as its Acting Chief Financial Officer from July 2008 to January 2009, Executive Vice President from July 2006 to July 2008, Treasurer until July 2008, Principal Accounting Officer from May 2006 to July 2008, Executive Vice President of Finance since July 2006, Senior Vice President of Finance since May 9, 2005, Chief Operating Officer from July 2008 to January 2, 2009 and Chief Financial Officer from May 9, 2005 to July 2008. He has twenty years of business experience. He served as the Chief Financial Officer and Treasurer at New England Business Service, Inc. since 1998 and also served as its Executive Vice President since August 1, 2002. He served as the Chief Financial Officer and Treasurer of Deluxepinpoint from 1998 to 2004 and its Executive Vice President from August 1, 2002 to 2004. He joined DELUXEPINPOINT in 1998. He served as Chief Financial Officer of Nashua Corporation from 1996 to 1998, Vice President of Finance from 1995 to 1998 and its Treasurer since 1985. He joined Nashua Corporation in 1984 and served financial management positions of increasing responsibility. He has been an Independent Director of IDEXX Laboratories, Inc. since March 11, 2014 and Cerion Technologies Inc. Liquidating Trust since January 1996. He has been a Director of GlycoMimetics, Inc. since March 21, 2016. He has been a Director of ImmunGgen, Inc. since November 2008. He served as a Director of Vitae Pharmaceuticals, Inc. from July 27, 2016 to October 25, 2016. He served as a Director of IDEXX Laboratories, Inc. since July 2008. Mr. Junius holds Bachelor of Arts in Political Science from Boston College and Master's in Management from Northwestern University's Kellogg School of Management"
In your zest to explain the attributes of the company, I think you entirely missed my point. This CEO had brought this company to a certain level, but couldn't get them to the next. A severely eroding stock price most likely brought the change to fruition. A CEO with experience has taken the helm and is turning this stock back in the right direction. Given shareholders some confidence in direction, hopes etc of this company.
Our company has been promising partnerships for as long as I can remember. UT was a start so I though. But when their trial was basically moving slower than slow, doubts started. And then the hammer came down. Gone for reasons we will never know. Since then, nada. At least nowhere near the level of UT.
There is no shame in realizing that you are over your head. Again, with the millions of shares they own, why not put this in more capable hands. Heck even the board would want this with their average of approximately half a million shares.
But no, wouldn't have that happen. Instead promote someone with even less experience to join in steering the ship. Why would anyone with the so called business experience allow this to happen? Either one of two things IMO. Realization they are over their heads, and wanting to try and get help from someone they have worked with for many years. Or just wanting to let this long time business acquaintance of many years, reap the benefits of being the co-CEO.
No breaking up the company into two divisions. No nothing. Just a promotion, eating more of our valuable cash, for reasons I have never seen anyone try to defend. Honestly EichKing's statement on not wanting experienced people in there to see the many faults of this company, could be a real possibility.
Looking at the bios of both Sangamo, and Immunogen, among others, brings about a true sense of dismay when thinking about to incredible potential this company has. Many other companies that are less advanced in their trials, have improved price and market cap dramatically. We sit stagnant year after year.
Pretty much the only explanation I can think of is the management team. Controller...LMBO. What do you think potential partners, large investors think when they meet with these guys? They have a hard enough time getting scripted interviews out without looking nervous or twitchy. How do you think they would fair in a large Pharma boardroom talking with people with decades of experience in the field.
Something's amiss here. If anyone has a better explanation of our stagnant price for many years please feel free. We were getting a closer and closer 52 week trading range. Down to close to within half a buck. If it weren't for the pump for the raise, we'd probably be close to with 30 to 40 cents. How many biotech stocks can you say that about. You'd even be hard pressed to find this tight a range as it stands even with the pump. Many have well over a 200% or even 500% range. We sit exactly at 100% thanks to the pump.
Wanted to take a look at immunogenix like you mention. Quite astonishing the partners they brought in or had some sort of agreement with. And that was from 2012. But even with all these, price floundered. Kudos to the CEO that brought all these players in.
Abgenix (bought out by Amgen
Sonofi
Biotest
Bayer
Novartis
Eli Lilly
Roche
Here's the link to bio of the old CEO you were mentioning. Business experience but no industry experience.
.https://www.bloomberg.com/research/stocks/people/person.asp?personId=182588&privcapId=29794
Have a look at their new CEO and management now. Changed a little since then and seems quite experienced.
http://www.immunogen.com/about-us/executive-officers
Funny how the new CEO took over April 26th 2016. Have a look at their price then. They were on a serious downward trend from $18. Aug of 2016 were down to under $3. But now they are above $8.
Again just goes back to my point of getting experience into this company to help us get to the next level. Others do it such as the one above, same with Sangamo. Funny they did it in the same year as well, 2016. They were sitting at $6 range then, $20 now. But I will just continue to shake my head in disbelief of people not wanting this for a company they invest in.
I would think most believe in the technology. It's your right to also be "ok" with management. Obviously some aren't, especially me upon looking more into the stellar board we have. The ones that have been token appointed many years ago, accumulated half a million shares themselves for doing what? The ones who approved a 4 percent dilution via a gift to the twins, for which we have not seen any reason to date as to why.
It is very strange to say the least. Point after point is made about the poorly run company that we have. There is so much stuff that has been brought up about the fails this company has done. It's truly remarkable.
I'm sorry but what I have talked about with regards to this presentation, is no doubt there to mislead someone to believe they have $63 million in the bank. Of the $36 million in cash, minus another $7 since it now the end of January, and that's $29 million. $6.8 million of the $27 million in grant money is coming to us. Brings that to $35.8 million. Far cry from the $63 million most would assume by seeing it. Comes down to integrity like I said.
Way over their heads. Yet a vast majority stay silent, pawn it off as they're "ok" or it's just the norm in biotech. Yes some don't want to face the facts, keep the head in the sand and hope. Others have to have a completely different agenda.
If one was to have the many blunders management has had in their line of work, does one honestly think they would still be employed? Sorry boss, I missed the deadline on that one...for the umpteenth time. Did I say I was going to get that to you in January, I meant January of next year. Again it is remarkable the lack of public outcry based upon all the factual information out there on there continued failures.
They've been missing targets since day one. Decade of misses. But let's keep giving them chances. When will it end!!! I truly am living in Bizzaro world when it comes to this board and stock. Maybe everyone is in cahoots. Wouldn't surprise me. Would actually make me feel better that I'm not losing my mind.
Not to beat this thing like a dead horse but it is right there in the financial section of their presentation. Right underneath their total of $36.3 million in cash total. $27 million in non dilutive grants. So to just look at that, one would think they have $63.3 million. There is no way around it. Regardless of who did it, the company is still responsible for having that on their website. It wasn't there in the October presentation in the financial section.
Thanks for the reply Spidey.
With regards to ARS not showing as being paid for by the government omission, that is an me missed point that should be in there but is on the other side of the equation. The funding is not. I understand and agree with the value of these grants, regardless of where the funds are dispersed. I'm glad you can at least see where I'm coming from.
With regards to interim results, I was just wondering if it was possible to release before follow up time results. If it can be, great, I will accept your statement on that as I have no idea as I'm not in this field whatsoever. All my questions and thoughts are based on what I research and what I feel are logical and valid points.
Looks like it will be a "we'll get em next week". One week hopefully we will get some sort of big announcement or at least some word from management on the direction, thoughts, anything in reality. Silence is dumbfounding imo, especially that this year has now become our apparent year yet again.
Hi Spidey,
Yes they mentioned it in the PR. But if you look at the presentation, only one clearly states collaboration. Have a look at the presentation yourself. Do you not see this as misleading in the least? This is for potential investors and others to see. Honestly I think this speaks volumes for the integrity of management.
One question for you. They were originally expecting interim results for HCT I'm 2h17. The actual enrolment didn't begin until February 8th of 17. Every outcome has a follow up period of 1 year. Is is possible to get interim results before the year follow up period is done? Just trying to see if management knew this was not possible but yet still put it in their milestones from January's presentation of last year, knowing it would be impossible to do. Tia.
Hi Happy,
Just a couple of things. With regards to the bonuses, putting a cost cutting contingency plan into place, surely negates any supposed behind the scene thing that has not been made public over a year later. Undeserving and the timing is a slap in the face to shareholders. No other way to look at it imo.
The funding I mentioned. We had a discussion about this and I had found only a small amount of every grant goes to Pluristem. Spidey, I think, pointed out that they all used collaborative in the release. But yet only one slide in their "shareholder update" shows collaborative. Tries to make it look like all $26 million goes to them, when it's closer to $8 (I think) That's what is sketchy and misleading to say the least.
Partnering after approval makes little sense to me sorry. But to each their own. As far as I can remember, this was never their intention. Once partners weren't coming I remember Zami staying no partnering until phase 2's are done. So I guess we are still on track since no real phase 2 has been completed. Our only one has been delayed in getting us the result too.
That's right Eichking. Nice to dream of getting to a point of selling something, as far out as that seems.
Looking into the CHA agreement again, it states the following.
"Under the terms of the agreement, Cha will perform and fund multiple clinical trials in South Korea for treating CLI and IC using PLX-PAD under the supervision of the Korea Food & Drug Administration"
What trials have they actually "funded" to potentially reap 50% stake in a JV? Looking at IC, they had 8 sites of the 30. Don't know if I would call that funding. How many of the 172 enrolled wen through Korea? Nothing at all for CLI. Will we have to give 50% for something they really weren't involved with, should we gain approval?
I'm sorry but between CHA and Sosei, they don't look like much to me. Feel free to try and change my mind. I realize partnering most likely necessary to gain access to these markets, but seems a pretty small amount for CHA to give up, to gain a 50% stake. We get a potential 30% in Japan if that ever happens.
I assume we paid for a vast majority of this trial, based solely on recruitment sites. So why did they do this partnership then. Again going back to risk, not much risked by CHA, but would be rewarded substantially if approval comes.
This imo, is just another one to be chalked up to experience, or lack thereof. Just like starting hip trial, then delay it 4 years before putting it back on the table. (Not on the table yet, but funding has come) or preeclampsia. Duschenes was another I think. MS, Lou Gehrig's, also come to mind. But could be wrong. I'm sure these preclinical trials aren't the cheapest things to do. All for what, to throw them on the back burner.
And now, oncology. Just seems to me they have spread themselves too thin chasing any potential treatment. Would have been better to focus on one or two, and get to the finish line.
Not much of anything this company does, makes much sense to me. ARS better come soon and better work out. Or I will be right there calling this company dead as well.
Hi Saud,
Yes that is what they have stated from the beginning. Manufacturing company though I think. Partners sell it giving us royalty payment, and we get the manufacturing $$$. Just who knows since we have had no new pharma partner for many years. Some laughable quotes from that excerpt.
"Pluristem is a partner of choice for global pharmaceutical, biologics and medical device companies."
Wow we have so many partners it's crazy. But to be the "choice" must mean something
"Pluristem strives to work with potential partners and provide them solutions to expand their product pipeline and address their manufacturing needs."
Who are we helping address their manufacturing needs. Wish we were from day 1. Would have been huge. But according to Allo, we can only manufacture MSC's. IR never responded to me on that one.
Hi Happy,
I'm an ideal world, yes it would be great to wait for approval first. But that is not the case in this field which takes exorbitantly large sums of cash to make it to approval. Hence, $200 million spent so far, without approval.
This is why companies that do get a big Pharma to partner with them, can often see their price raise dramatically. Everyone knows the value this brings. Cash, milestone payments, expertise in the field, instant credibility. Decreases the risk of failure from a financial standpoint tremendously.
We were at one point, getting closer than ever to running out of cash to see this thing through. Within 18 months I believe. Yes our situation is much better at the moment, but they put a cost cutting contingency plan into place in case they couldn't strengthen their balance sheet. This was the same year they gifted themselves $5 to $6 million in bonuses. Astonishing to me. That cash would have been much better served in funding operations. And as an FYI, their presentation states the 3 funding sources. It's funny that only one of the 3 state collaborative. Other two make it look like all the cash is ours, which is not even close to being the case. Shady and misleadimg to say the least.
Going it alone, which they seem to be doing, is still extremely risky. What would happen if the ARS results when they come in sometime, aren't that great? Or the IC results aren't the best? I don't think they have the ability to raise any more right now, let alone if one of those two things happened. Along with all the other associated risks that could happen in conducting clinical trials.
And let say we do go it alone and get approval for something other than ARS. What chunk of the pie are we going to pay for marketing, distribution sales etc. They would have taken on zero risk. So how much would they be willing to accept to utilize their resources. They're used to getting gobs of cash everywhere they turn, so why waste their valuable resources doing this for us without being paid a substantial amount. Would hate to get a low10's royalty rate for taking on little to no risk.
Honestly I would think if they were going to in fact do this alone, do it alone for the entire way. If we were to get approval, we would be able to fund the necessary things to set up marketing, sales, distribution etc. A significant increase in price would allow a raise at a much higher price to fund this. Sure it may take time in building this out, but with a steady stream of money to start flowing in, this would make sense to me. More so if it's on an indication where there is no other suitable treatment.
And if we were to potentially have other products come on to market in the coming years, why give any piece away. That's what big pharma did to get themselves to where they are now. So why not us. That way you have control of every aspect of the company, from beginning to end.
Now obviously I am basing all of this imo, with logic being my only guide. It is an extremely complicated field to say the least. And even more obvious, I am putting a giant cart before the horse. But just some things to think about, and would be even better if one day we are actually discussing this.
What happened to the mysterious missing time slot you were hoping would be relevant to us at this show? You were hoping for news after close the other day right. Any timeline on when we may hear from Lonza...Amgen...GSK...pretty much any prediction. Next week, next month...year...decade? Would have been a great time to release news right? Too bad it NEVER comes to fruition. Come tomorrow with another silent day, we can say like always, we'll get em next week.
But going to these shows touting their manufacturing skills over and over is money well spent. You would think any company in this world that actually cared about it would be well aware of it a decade ago. It's not like they're trying to pitch manufacturing to others. That would make sense. But we don't manufacture for anyone but ourselves. Kind of like having an exclusive contract with another company and going to a show to proudly display it. But when asked, sorry we can only sell to xyz.
Stick to recycling of articles and news. You ARE the best at that.
It's all pretty confusing isn't it. Originally IC readout was scheduled for April of this year. Didn't realize that changed until Q2. Don't know why that changed. Very important piece to the puzzle as it will be the first set of results with a significant number of people. Thanks for pointing that change out EichKing. Got to love the changing milestones each amd every time they get close.
They also stated these results will be used to support CLI commercialization. Maybe we could see something happening sooner in something other than ARS. But who knows.
The more you try and make sense of any of it, the more confusing it becomes. But that's what you want to do to shareholders and potential investors. They like to have to make sense of it all. Increases confidence that they know what they're doing.
Of course they are not partnering on the manufacturing side or giving up any of the IP, prior to commercializations. Would make zero sense. It's the R&D side of the equation in question, and always has been.
Yes CHA was funding that side and THAT is the point of partnering at this stage. Reduces the risk by lowering the amount of cash to get to the finish line. Up front cash, milestone payments, help to ensure you will make it there. You can say they are funded to get one or two approvals. I don't think that's the case at all. Yes ARS, but if that fails or falls through it will be incredibly painful. I don't see CLI getting half enrolled for at least 2 years.
Japan obviously seems to want a Japanese partner before allowing the "fast track" trial to begin. The one needing only 75 people to enrol before allowing conditional marketing. They were given the go ahead on Dec 21, 2015 from the PMDA. Don't you think we would have been able to enrol 75 by now if something was done quicker than this agonizing Sosei deal?
How much credence would it have given to other products in their pipeline having one with at least conditional approval? Maybe there would be some real interest, not just from people they see regularly at trade shows.
But we know nothing on anything to do with this, as well as pretty much anything. No strategy, direction, nada. Last thing we heard was Zami stating there would be no partnerships until phase 2 results were completed on a product.
Hopefully $2's open up. That way I can bypass June. Looks like we're going to need all the time we can. Don't you mean grey poupon.
Well I would think such a pressing issue like ARS, and the incredible desire to have something approved with all the accolades R18 has, would speed things up a bit.
Is it the negotiations on funding that's this issue? They did it for free before with all the trials previously. Same sort of thing that some are concerned with about accepting a partnership on someone else's terms. Getting the next one on your terms. Again while others were funded $50 million plus for their studies, we did it for free.
CLI for 2020. Cmon really. IC trial started late 2012. 5 years later, still waiting. But we started Jan of 2017, and expect 2020. I'm sorry but that is incredibly optimistic to say the least. Lucky to get the half enrolled mark by that time.
What about promised interim results of HCT or NYBC. Again lack of any transparency on anything is unbelievable. Zero credibility and our share price proves it.
To totally disregard management's many blunders, is mind boggling. Butteo was the same way. Him and all his other "investor" buddies that were in the know. What ever happened to that poster eh? Boss of the Jungle order that handle shut down?
Sorry Spidey I meant dosing trial, not pivitol. So how long before we should worry. DOD study will run in parallel, so anxious to get it going.
Hey Zzatt.
Many FACTS are given from others on the dark side right. You know, the ones who questions management. I know you're fine with them as you have stated a million times. It's pretty astonishing that one could be fine with it, given all the factual info that has been posted on them.
Again, only ones who have not been rewarded are the owners of the company. You know, shareholders. Still buying? Or waiting for a run. Looking forward to seeing your name on the "major holders" list. Heck keep it up and you may have to file a 13-G.
Hi Spidey,
You just want to shrug off pretty much all of my questions regarding management, that's fine. Can't force someone to post. But your statement of "different directions/indications" kind of states my point. They have had many changes that has blown through a substantial amount of cash. Approximately $200 million.
Wouldn't experienced management focus on getting the first one or two indications close to approval, before chasing after any indication they can imagine? The risk they have taken in doing so, has strained their cash position and their ability to do another raise without being slaughtered.
They state the 2 director positions on the Nasdaq, Brainstorm and Solar Energy, this board member has had, is the reason they believe they are a suitable board member. A little vetting on that, would have raised their eyebrows one would think. But they truly are just token appointments, allowing for large bonuses to be approved at will. Puppets. And how many shares and cash have these long term board members been compensated for doing just that? But yes, you're fine with it.
I have never once said Pluristem is dead thank you. But after the decade of missteps, missing of pretty much everything, I can at the very least, understand EichKing's feelings and beliefs to make such a bold statement.
Eight months now since ARS pivotal trial was completed. Yes you said they have to get it all just right. At what point should we start to worry. A year, year and a half, 2 years? Again comes back to the transparency thing. Just changing the milestone to next 12 months doesn't cut it for me.
I believe in the technology, but have zero faith in management and their goons on the board. Like Blue has stated many times. Hopefully the technology overcomes management. 2017 was supposed to be our year right. Only ones that have been comoenated are employees and Board. Too bad for shareholders. That's what public companies are supposed to do right?
Thanks for the reply Spidey.
But I'm talking about the many years of zero explanation of CHA and any sort of progression, anything.
And extended deadline again on Sosei at the very least, no? Something.
This is what I talk about regarding transparency. Not talking product whatsoever.
What about the newly, yet to be disproven fact on the third board member?
What about the 4 year delay since hip replacement?
What about the cost of our GMP facility for all these years. Was it necessary to build it at that time? Or the 2 year delay is product development?
Steering committee set up in 2014 on Pre-eclampsia and yet nothing. Did they do this for free?
Increasing interest in early 2015 from Pharma wanting to patten. Timeline of twelve months for getting a partnership. Three years later, nothing. That's good right?
Doesn't matter if you knew the milestones would be missed. Does it matter to the street? Real management with real experience in this field would know this don't you think. You knew it right?
The list goes on an on truly. Our management or lack of it, is what has held this stock back. Period. You may be fine with the clowns running this thing, many are not.
It's truly not just about the CC's. It's about EVERYTHING. What's going on with Sosei. Deadline elapsed. No reason to explain anything there right.
CHA. Sell all the shares with zero explanation. Not a SINGLE word has EVER been said on CHA except the same paragraph or two in reports.
And to miss 5 of your 6 milestones and say nothing about It. No explanation whatsoever. Nah...that's fine. We'll just throw it in the next presentation and hope nobody notices. .
Management are just a bunch of cowards truly. Did you read my post of the third board member now having some very questionable items on his resume. Like saying he wS a director before the company was even a company. These are the people that voted the twins their huge bonuses for doing Jack. But let me guess. You're fine with that. Board and management aren't that important.
No these things are all normal. Every company does this. That's why our price has been stagnant for the last decade. Pretty much every Biotech's price is stagnant though right.
Was looking back at previous letters to shareholders and news and truly forgot how long ago some things have happened. Kind of like when a star dies and you thought it was last year but it was really 5 years ago.
Do you remember...
Jan 2014 - Results from phase 1/2 trial in muscle injury. Now 4 years later and phase 3 has yet to get stamp on trial design, let alone initiated. Why the delay? With the extraordinary results they claim, you would think it would have been started asap. And here I thought enrolment was the longest part to approval.
Aug 23, 2012 - phase 2 enrolment in IC begins. 6.5 years later, still waiting for results. But CLI should get conditional approval this year. LMBO.
Nov 14, 2007 - Pluristem competes construction on new state of the art GMP facility. It was crucial for them to build it at that time I'm sure. You know, the facility that can produce 150,000 annual doses, but has probably produced maybe a thousand. Wonder how much that has cost over the years. And don't forget the 2 years delay in product development it cost us. But don't worry, competition is miles behind.
Feb 2014 - created a steering committee on Pre-eclampsia... Wonder how much that cost and more importantly why?
And the great kicker... a paragraph from their 2015 letter to shareholders.
Pluristem continues working to establish additional business collaborations with pharmaceutical companies. The new opportunities in Europe and Japan have translated into substantial interest from potential partners who would like to work together with us in both geographic regions. We are hopeful that we will achieve additional partnership for our CLI program over the next twelve months, and are also discussing partnerships for our muscle injury program and our emerging clinical program for PLX-R18, our second product. The first planned study of PLX-R18 in humans would be a Phase I trial to be submitted later this year. More details about the program are provided below.
Substantial interest? LMBO.
But I'm fine with them. Maybe if the head of human resources had actual experience other than Elbit, they would hire people in this field. Here's her bio. Another stellar resume. Running Elbit and a biotech company probably similar right. I'm good with this.
Efrat Livne-Hadass joined Pluristem in 2007 and is responsible for all aspects of Human Resources management, including recruitment, professional training, and well-being. Prior to joining Pluristem and during the years 2001-2005, Ms. Livne-Hadass held the position of Human Resources Manager at Elbit Vision Systems, a company engaged in automatic optical inspection, located in Yokneam, Israel. While holding that position, she was involved in some major challenges and change processes which the company was going through, including managing HR in a small yet global public company. Ms. Livne-Hadass holds an Executive M.A. for Human Resources manager from the department of Labor Studies, Tel-Aviv University and a B.Sw. degree from the Haifa University, majoring in public healthcare services.
Was actually looking for election results when I stumbled upon this tidbit about another stellar board member Israel Ben-Yoram
The following was taken from Pluristem's year end report. Brainstorm is what caught my eye. I thought wow, experience in the industry.
"During 2003-2004 Mr. Ben-Yoram served as a director of Brainstorm Cell Therapeutics Inc. (BCLI) and Smart Energy solutions, Inc. (SMGY), both of which were traded on the NASDAQ. Mr. Ben-Yoram is also a member of STEP (Society of Trust and Estate Practitioners)."
So I decided to go take a look at "Brainstorms" 2003/4 reports to see what I could find. Seems Brainstorm's name was born on Nov 22, 2004, changed from Golden Hand Resources. And previously was Wizbang Technologies from before Aug 8, 2003
So how he could be a director of Brainstorm in 2003 seems strange no. Looking through all the filings from Brainstorm/Golden Hand, I found no mention of him anywhere in any sec document at any time.
Same thing with Solar Energy Solutions. Their name was Datigen Com Inc. up until Sept 9, 2005. So again, how he was a director in 2003/4? Seems a little fishy no? Found no mention of his as well in any sec document. Got to love public companies with actual records.
Not saying he wasn't a director but I have found zero evidence that he was. Maybe someone can find an Sec document anywhere proving a big part of his resume. It is, after all, a reason Pluristem management thinks he's a suitable director. Good luck and let us know if you can find any of these connections.
But yes, I'm fine with management and the board.
That is an excellent point on the hesitation of management to bring in experts. Instead promote inexperienced people to the top position. That is why this board does work. Keep the beer goggles on if you choose, but the reality is they are rosy on the outside, but rotten in the core.
Like is said in the link to my posts you dug up of mine, they were polite questions. A question such as if any type of cell could be grown in the 3d reactor. Pretty simple no? Zero response.
So maybe you caught her when she was in the office and not off the world tour. Or maybe she reads this board and put 2 and 2 together. Still think a response of some kind would be professional. That's why they're there no?
So again I will state that the companies upper management is full of clownz and are as transparent as a brick wall. Just stuffing each other's pockets full of shareholders cash. Running out of shows. Better do a raise to keep the old fogey tour alive.
No panic driven posts here. Just the constant drip drip of the stock price and missed milestone after milestone. It has been going on for years as the twin clownz give themselves huge bonuses. They've been at it for over a decade. You want to be happy how this company is run, so be it. Others have realized this management is over their heads since day 1.
Technology could be great, but in the hands of incompetent people to steer it in the right direction, could go into the history books along with other technologies.
You want to rest on the laurels of your 3D bioreactor for a decade, newer technology will come about to bite you in the ass. You don't think other companies realize the cogs when it comes to cell manufacturing? Does Lonza have an R&D department. Do others with deep pockets have the same? They just going to sit back and say oh well, they have the patents. We will just keep using Petri dishes.
Again, it does make zero sense to bash a stock that you own. But if you take a look at Samgamo that had piss poor management like we did, then can the lot of them, maybe you would see the light as to what experienced, competent management brings to the table. But we should just make do while they continue to miss everything and just leave shareholders in the dark.
You own shares, you have the right to deserve better. Hence the desire to bash the stock you own to make people realize that idiots run the company with zero experience in this field. But they're enjoying the high life with the world tour while actual companies deal with the real issues that they face in this difficult field. Experience matters tremendously in this field, and we have little in upper management who have any more than the textile vision company Elbit. Yay!!! You truly good with that? Think hard for a moment.
Balanced? Believe it or not I have tried to be. Just hard to try and be positive in any way when it comes to the inept twins. I can honestly say I never though I would become so negative on this company. To continually point out their many flaws is quite contradictory to having long skin in this game, but enough is enough. They need to go. But them gifting themselves 4% of the company, only strengthens their chance to remain unfortunately. This is why board did this imo. Ensures their seats are safe too.
As for CHA, I don't know what to think. They have seen a recent run of late, so possibly just taking advantage of that. CHA seems exactly like UT. Just say nothing except the token couple paragraphs in every report, then the hammer falls.
I haven't had the time to take a look into this SK treatment. Only see that they are in phase 2 trials. I still believe in our treatment, because of the male female thing. We have been at quite the disadvantage over others having 50/50 male female ratio. Others got their numbers with total males or very skewed numbers for males. We were 100% successful with males.
We truly need a partnership or a big influx of cash from somewhere other than dilution. The oncology news was big, and shows the broad scope of indications we could take a stab at. Getting the cash risk off the table would do wonders for this stock. Should have been done long ago, like many others have.