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You are correct
@ 57sec into the clip, Carlos Gutierrez (President, United Resource Recovery Corp.) says:
"Nobody else that I'm aware of in the world can utilize this feedstock".
uh...I guess he need to do a little DD himself, eh?
I wonder if they have a big source of medical waste? Remember some of the info JB gave on that from the Nov 09 conf call? Most states were falling WAY short of the mandatory levels of (expensive) disposal.
I'm hoping for some surprises like that -- getting paid to take "unrecyclables" in large volumes.
Ty
News out: SwissINSO Expands Capacity for Producing Its 100% Solar-Powered Water Purification Units
http://newsystocks.com/news/3702397
Now let's see some orders!!
Tyk
Installed is step 2 -- I'd like to see a handful of other JV sites begin the permitting process -- something that is possible if the DEC/CRA results and processor design/blueprints are available.
Where I live, the permits can be applied-for before breaking ground, but there are final tests prior to being operational to ensure the requested emissions/noise/materials, etc. is as stated. That would get the ball rolling IMO.
Tyk
A little math on JBI's emissions results:
NOx: 0.81 lbs/hr @ 24x7x365 = 7095 lbs/yr = 3.5 tons/yr
That means if JBI's Plastic2Oil processor is running 24x7 all year, the NOx and particulate emissions are only 9% of the limits set by the Oregon state DEQ for Plas2Fuel's plant in Tigard.
source: http://www.deq.state.or.us/news/publicnotices/uploaded/100120_755_34-9514-PNE-02262010-AQ.pdf
But the Tigard site produces how many barrels per year? Because the math above assumes 100% capacity for JBI, which is roughly 200 tons of plastic per day. So if JBI only processes 20 tons/day (46,000 bbl/yr), then the NOx emissions are less than 1% of what Oregon will allow Plas2Fuel to emit, or only 12% of what they are expected to emit.
How about output quality?
Taken from the PDF above:
"The noncondensable gases (gaseous emissions) are captured and ducted to a thermal oxidizer air pollution control device for combustion."
--> JBI captures & compresses all off-gases for re-use and sale
"The proposed facility will produce a synthetic crude oil-like product" --> JBI will produce pure diesel & pure gasoline (separated)
"The finished product is a gel-like substance at normal room temperature"
--> on this board aka "p2o slurry" that "cannot possibly be sold"
Folks what we have here, is a game-changer!
Tykün
It was a trick question.
If that brochure caused the "massive run up" to $7... then to what will you attribute the next run-up where investors make $10's millions of profits?
nice LOL
The British Royal Society of Chemistry released a paper this subject last year -- the energy yield from incineration of plastic is about 50% of the total energy contained in the hydrocarbons. So if you can get out 91% by mass of fuel (diesel/gas.. doens't change much) and 8% natural gas, then you effectively DOUBLE the energy yield compared to incineration (EDIT: less the efficiency loss of a diesel engine / generator of course).
Add to that the CO2 saved, the lack of dioxins in the P2O process, and the fact that it's also less expensive, and you begin to understand "why bother".
Tykün
makes me wonder why bother with the intermediate step of making the plastic into fuel
Err msg with Interactive Brokers: "This position can only be closed"?
Firstly, congrats to holders of EIGH over the past couple of weeks!
I have followed this board for a while now and tried on several occasions to start with a small position, but kept seeing the error message "This position can only be closed" (Interactive Brokers). I thought I'd read something about this problem in the past, and that it was resolved, but alas.. no.
Does anyone have any idea why this is happening, or what I can to do resolve it? I tried calling IB support, and they told me it was an exchange issue.
TIA!
Tykün
Well as you can muster from this msg board, unfortunately not much has happened since then -- there were many delays with getting the fully operational site, getting the required permits to go live, etc. There have been few material events PR'd since then, as the company appears to be in full "shut up and produce" mode and not leaking anything about their internal progress.
I personally have every reason to believe they are making good progress and will make good on their claims.
As for what I saw with my own eyes: the processor is massively simpler (smaller, fewer components) than photos I have seen of P2O "plants" from Envion and Nill-Tech that have equivalent capacities, albeit without the gas compression system that they've since added, or the diesel/gas separator which is still to come. It's definitely worth a visit for the sceptical investor, if that can be arranged. I'd hazard a guess that next year's AGM will also include tours.
Hope this help.
Tyk
Here are one attendee's thoughts. Hope it helps.
http://investorshub.advfn.com/boards/read_msg.aspx?message_id=49428585
I used to, but I sold them all to buy the PQs -- I got out of commons altogether, and the prefs aren't listed anywhere in Europe.
Tykün
That may be precisely why we aren't hearing anything from JBI at all in this regard lately -- the truth shall be revealed.
"if Mr. Bordynuik was being truthful then he wouldn't have anything to worry about"
I believe Mr. Bordynuik has already publicly stated that JBI can get waste plastic for free. You choose not to believe him, and that's your right. But submitting proof to appease those who don't believe him is perhaps not his priority.
I seriously doubt that there are many people sitting on the sidelines w/r to such claims and who choose not to invest for lack of proof of actual plastic supply contracts. You either believe him or you do not, and if you do not.. then there are likely many other things that prevent you from investing in his company.
Soon thereafter you will be demanding proof of the catalyst, proof that patents have been filed, proof that the fuel blending site is operational, proof that IsleChem is not biased, proof that the processors really cost only $200k to build, proof that it really only takes 2 hours to process 20 tons.
You see.. this proof you claim to be so important will get JBI nowhere, and will only stir the message board debate. I'm quite certain JBI simply wants to produce oil and generate revenue. After that they won't have to answer to anyone.
Tyk
If Steve555 can lock-up supply for free, why is it that you believe that JBI or any of their future JV partners will not be able to?
(see prior posts of Steve555 for his/her statements on waste plastic supply)
Tyk
Not really sure why admin deleted my post -- clearly relevant to point out a competitor's techology as a supporting argument that JBII is not a "scam".
Please PM me anyone who wishes to see a public presentation from an existing P2O company that describes their fuel output.
Bueno.. of course, locking up feedstock and/or fuel sales is great, and I'm sure they will try to do this (or have?). But that doesn't prove the profitability.
My argument was more against those who claim JBI is committing fraud and lying about his technology, when clearly it's been proven in the marketplace already that similar tech exists and is being operated on a commercial scale (albeit with equally opaque profitability claims thus far). The example I cited has some big names involved, which should easily convince readers that the company and their technology is no fraud.
But it's all moot -- JBI will reveal their hand soon enough IMO, and then all doubt will be put to rest. I have placed my bets already, as have most people who know the man behind it all.
Tyk
It's clearly illustrated on the AGM slides: 52% rise compared with the same period previous year.
you're not alone on the dca front
I got a sample kit from Pak-It last year... was very happy with all the products! But during the shipment (to Europe, mind you) the laundry packets leaked a little.
In some cases we found that the Pak-It products were better than the non-green solutions (e.g. glass cleaner and citrus all-purpose).
Laundry soap was great too!
Tyk
Actually, there's plenty of room for success even with non-free plastic. Try the math:
$70 oil - $10 cost to produce = $60/bbl profit
$60/bbl = $377/ton of plastic
Now check the spot price on plastic on the market (the washed, sorted stuff), and you'll find plenty of it available lower than that.
Without free plastic the odds of success are ZERO.
Most companies that use large volumes of plastic ... don't just give away plastic
Soon is just before you become a JBII long. C'mon, you know you will be...
Imperial...indeed, JBII and CERP are by far my two favourite stocks these days, and I'm long (2-5 years) on both.
I don't for a second believe that one will rise at the expense of the other though -- they are both excellent investments and trading well below their potential.
Tyk
So you can imagine how pleased I was to take some off the hands of our heavy seller at a measly $0.715 today.
I wish I had some of Washington's own Pyramid Hefeweizen for the call!! I worked in Tacoma for a few months back when WaMu was still a bank ... love the stuff.
Tyk
While I cannot speak for JBI and their NY site, I can say that I personally know of people in the industry (plastic recycling) with easy access to tens of thousands of plastic per year -- industrial streams which are very homogeneous.
IMO access to feedstock is not going to be the bottleneck in rolling out P2O.
Tykün
I know.. and I was being sarcastic actually as for at least the next few generations I'm not at all worried about the plastic supply for JBI's P2O process. The industrial waste stream alone is enormous.
Despite what some think, there is no shortage of "free" plastic waste to process.
Tyk
oops: "although state/federal permits have not yet been issued"
oops: "On average, the oil recovery rate is 62%"
There is only 1 thing that cause trouble for JBII, and that's CERP.
(disclaimer: the author holds shares of CERP, but far more of JBII)
If I understand correctly, in the 5 months prior to the publishing of that article, the Envion site produced 360 barrels of oil! That's less than 3 barrels per day.
Wow, impressive.
And even if they have since reached capacity which is equal to a $200k processor from JBI, did you check out the fuel range being produced? Gasoline, Kerosene, Diesel, Jet Fuel.
I think I prefer this:
...to this...
The market determines a justified stock price. Clearly there were people last December who felt that $7+ was "justified".
What revenue would justify that price again, for you?
If that is true, then as many like to say here: GAME OVER!
Answer: those were the CEO's own words, according to BNAmericas.
How exciting!
(cannot post article due to copyright / reprint protection).
Tyk
The article requires a subscription .. has anyone read the full content? Was somebody from CERP quoted in there at all, or was it an industry expert's analysis of CERP and the south americal bio-plastics market potential?
Or ..was it just some lame-o stock promoter trying to create some buzz? Either way, it's certainly a believable scenario. After all they moved to Indiana to be closer to the source material!
Tyk
WOW, that is nice. This can really be a monster. I honestly think the next 18 months could see the CERP stock price do 10x, short of a massive manufacturing crisis or the collapse of crude oil prices.
Tykün
Yes, we still have to see if the permits will limit the accepted feedstock types (polymers), and we don't know for sure if there are different "blends" of the catalyst for different feedstocks (though this has been hinted at for PET for example).
But regarding "free" feedstock.. I do believe they'll get plenty for free initially, but I don't think that can last forever. But between $0 and $400/ton (the net revenue at crude prices) leaves plenty of room for healthy profit for years to come IMO.
Excellent -- applies to some other stocks I follow! LOL
Big guy, I'd be interested (genuinely) to see your rationale for the $45/barrel cost-to-produce, given the following facts that JBI is claiming. Of course if you dispute any of these facts below, then that's another rationale altogether (and another debate).
. cost of 1 processor = $200k (excl. CapEx for aux equipment...)
. size of processor = 600sqft (excl. feedstock & fuel storage)
. # staff needed to operate 1 processor = 2
. throughput of 1 processor = 20 tons (125 bbl/day) in an 8-hr shift
. cost of feedstock plastic = 0
Using those as a starting point, do you still arrive at $45/bbl OpEx cost, and if so what are your metrics & variables?
Thanks,
Tyk
Funny, I would have said just the opposite: I have no idea what this stock will do in the short term, but I sure know where it will be in the long term.
I know what these stocks do over the long term but I try not to speculate on the short term
I forgot catalyst costs. Although nobody truly knows how much is costs nor how much is needed per ton of plastic, JB has gone on-record of saying it costs "pennies per kilogram" to manufacture. I would argue therefore that it likely doesn't affect the profitability very much.
Tyk