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If I was gift wrapped oodles of JPM stock with a welcome letter from Dimon himself I'd still dump them all instantaneously. I don't trust them. I don't trust their derivative holdings. I don't trust that the same powers that moved to wipe WaMu out wouldn't do the same even to the "mighty" JPM, so long as it furthers their agenda.
Eventually I feel like we're going to be stuck with one central bank that owns everything. Lets call it The Goldman Bank of Morgan's America.
Regardless, once I'm done with WaMu I will never play the market long term again. It's too corrupt for me to feel comfy leaving the family jewels soaking in it while the globalist sharks circle. We've already seen their fins... and we've seen them bite.
Be careful.
"Just think of all the dividens you would get while holding for 1 year to dump JP Morgan Stock. I think that would be a worth while wait."
They're playing poker right now. There's no reason for them to settle over fear of the Judge's approval. They won't worry about it until the Judge says... "approved" at which time they will no longer be playing with house money.
Right now they have a few different possible outcomes that could potentially play out in their favor. The 4 billion, the investigation, etc...
They won't contemplate settling until they start seeing the chips coming off of the table. For now they're just letting it ride.
And the press has been more than kind to them so far.
Considering educated people were wondering how the FDIC would pull this off before the bill was even was even conceived, it's been a blip on the radar for some time.
If you want a quote from Sheila Bair saying we want this money so we can pay off WaMu, then you should sell whatever you have, if anything and try your luck somewhere else.
This has been a speculation, dd, educated guess stock since the company was illegally seized and destroyed.
There are NO sources that can guarantee any of the money will go to WaMu. That is why the stock is currently valued at .115 cents per share.
Oh yeah... really not a happy camper right now. :O)
Some more positive WaMu news might numb my misery though.
I'm pretty sure those references are referring to subs. But what do I know?
Just to be a pain in the butt, WMI should merge with its subs that were stolen. I'm talking anything JPM took but that was owned by the Holding Company. That would really make things messy.
After all, JPM is unable to produce a list of what they bought.
How would the subs know for sure who they're owned by? If JPM is selling properties without title of ownership... :O)
If WMI could pull something like that off, JPM would have to buy them out to own the goods.
Yeah, I know... Outlandish.
Kidney stone. No sleep last night. Delirious. EOM
Jackson...
Any ideas about what was discussed on 4/23?
http://investorshub.advfn.com/boards/read_msg.aspx?message_id=37548049
Anyone know of a proceeding held on 4/23 or why they want it kept confidential for 3 months?
http://www.kccllc.net/documents/0812229/0812229090502000000000001.pdf
NOTICE OF FILING OF TRANSCRIPT AND OF DEADLINES RELATED TO RESTRICTION AND
REDACTION
A transcript of the proceeding held on 4/23/2009 was filed on 4/30/2009 . The following deadlines apply:
The parties have 7 days to file with the court a Notice of Intent to Request Redaction of this transcript. The deadline for filing a request for redaction is 5/21/2009 .
If a request for redaction is filed, the redacted transcript is due 6/1/2009 .
If no such notice is filed, the transcript may be made available for remote electronic access upon expiration of the restriction period, which is 7/29/2009 unless extended by court order.
To review the transcript for redaction purposes, you may purchase a copy from the transcriber (name, address/contact information) or you may view the document at the clerk?s office public terminal.
Clerk of Court
Date: 4/30/09
The following entities were served by first class mail on May 02, 2009.
Washington Mutual, Inc., 1301 Second Avenue, Seattle, WA 98101-2005
Andrew C. Irgens, Richards, Layton & Finger, 920 N. King Street, Wilmington, DE 19801-3361
Chun I Jang, Richards, Layton & Finger, P.A., 920 North King Street, P.O. Box 551, Wilmington, DE 19899-0551
Cory D. Kandestin, Richards, Layton & Finger, P.A., 920 North King Street, One Rodney Square, Wilmington, DE 19801
Lee E. Kaufman, Richards, Layton & Finger, P.A., 920 North King Street, One Rodney Square, Wilmington, DE 19801-1299
Mark D. Collins, Richards Layton & Finger, One Rodney Square, PO Box 551, Wilmington, DE 19899-0551
Rafael Xavier Zahralddin-Aravena, Elliott Greenleaf, 1105 North Market Street, Suite 1700, P.O. Box 2327, Wilmington, DE 19899-2327
The following entities were served by electronic transmission.
***** BYPASSED RECIPIENTS (undeliverable, * duplicate) *****
aty* +Chun I. Jang, Richards, Layton & Finger, P.A., 920 North King Street, P.O. Box 551,
Wilmington, DE 19899-0551
aty* +Lee E. Kaufman, Richards, Layton & Finger, P.A., 920 North King Street, One Rodney Square,
Wilmington, DE 19801-1299
No problem. I wish I knew more. 1,000 a share and I'd be right there with you. Beyond lucky.
We'll know more soon enough. :O)
"Thanks WaS, I would be very lucky with "just" $1,000 cash/share LOL"
There is some speculatory discrepancy as to what happens with the undeclared dividends. It's possible, though unlikely that Ps could get face and any unpaid dividends as part of a settlement.
Ps could be paid in full (with or without undeclared dividends) or they could be swapped for a similar preferred series or could be converted over to a newly created series with the same prospectus details.
Really... it's all guesswork at this point. Personally, I want the cash, thought there are many others that dream of having the dividends reinstated.
"Do I get that right, in case of a stock swap the holders of P´s would get $1,000 (+ dividends?) in cash?"
If JPM or anyone else acquires WMI via stock swap, then anyone holding shares now would be part of such a deal.
Investors that sold their shares would have to sue JPM for compensation.
Any deal involving the ownership of WMI would only involve those that currently own shares because technically, they own part of the company.
Preferred shares would absorbed or paid off just as any other obligation.
Your "bandwagon" theory would only come into play if there was a class action lawsuit brought against WMI or JPM. If WMI's assertions are correct, then such a suit would have to be brought against JPM.
The NOLs are tied into current ownership. If these shares are simply worth worthless "bandwagon" shares as your "potentially dumb question" would present, then the NOLs wouldn't be reliant upon current ownership and there wouldn't be a court order limiting said ownership of shares.
It's not a dumb question, but it's one that's been brought up time and time again. A quick board search would have revealed this information. Likewise, although it's not a dumb question, it's one used time and time again in an attempt to shake people of their (non) "bandwagon" shares.
I think there are just too many people involved these days for JPM and Dimon to feel comfortable with his staff being counted on to keep their mouths shut.
Back in the day when JP Morgan was alive and well and doing these exact same things, he had a small staff of elite insiders that would never blab.
Nowadays you've got a whole staff of people running loan tapes. You had a handful of people working with WMI and WMB, that believed there were part of a legit deal only to find later... they weren't.
If any of these people (I'd assume at least 100 of them) feels like they could be prosecuted for contempt, they'll blab.
I can't see JPM allowing this investigation... which would pin the entire destruction of the bank on JPM, to be left up to the common folk who with one mistep or slip up, could effectively destroy JPM.
By design, most people are completely unaware of their influence. To some degree they control almost the entirety of the world's modern banking system and a whole lot more than that.
But the fact that the Rothschild never dumped their shares and were involved in the early research of WMIs legal staff is one of the variables that kept me very interested in the outcome of the WaMu debacle.
"I didn't really think rothschild was so big and powerful they seem so big and vast that they can Control an entire country with their influence."
Jackson,
On top of what WaMu info could be uncovered in such an investigation, I'd assume JPM would equally be as scared about what could be dug up regarding Weil's other client... Lehman Brothers.
They DO NOT want anyone getting their hands on this kind of info and who knows what they'll spend the next week or two trying to hide, remove, or destroy.
But JPM has more to lose here than the totality of the destruction of WaMu, which in and of itself is staggering. A thorough investigation would likely open them up to likewise we sued for the complete destruction of Lehman as well.
If they don't settle... they're nuts.
"You would think so. Just the threat of another investigation and the threat of more claims in addition to the claims made in the Texas suit and WMI's recent motion should be enough to escalate settlement talks."
If you go back and look at the early (fall) itemize hourly billing docs, you'll find at least one month contained a multitude of dialogue between Weil (I believe it was Weil) and at least one Rothschild.
You know it Jackson!
What a way to end the week with a bang! Have a great night everyone!
You got it Butty! You guys are the best!
I've got no one to talk to about this...
But my mouth wants to run a mile a minute. I at least feel vindicated in that all the stuff I've been saying for months that everyone shook their head in disgust about is finally coming out.
I'm not crazy after all...
Well, not completely anyway. :O)
Stories legit...
As posted by Tyson on yahoo.
http://www.kccllc.net/documents/0812229/0812229090501000000000002.pdf
Be careful with that news article. Just because it got picked up by a bunch of agencies doesn't mean it's legit. We saw that stress test "leak" a week or two ago get picked up and it was bogus.
I'm only suspect of it because it's so so so poorly written.
I hope it's legit, but I'm not buying it... yet.
Checkmate.... :O)
Don't forget the TARP Money they want to give back.
This is going to make investors question if the money should be given back. Why risk stability so Dimon can take mega bonuses?
Am I wrong or was he talking about GS as the party that would buy WMI?
Looks hot to me man. I have no idea how no one is responding to it. I won't spill the beans. Hopefully they'll look for themselves.
Will do! :O)
Just so we're clear... you'd have to be going back about 6 months to find a 1.75 pps.
"you are correct, my bad. They were $1.75 about 7 weeks ago. I know because I sat here wondering if I should buy some. I blame only myself for not doing so. I am extremely confident that the commons will explode as well, just a little nervous I guess because I do have all eggs in one basket. I'm excited,yet not ready to put in my 2 week notice at work.If they expode I'll be the first to buy Vegas a drink in Vegas."
They were no t 1.75 2 weeks ago either. Try again.
A Month ago the Ps were not 1.75. They were 5 dollars. A similar bump would drive the share price to 18-20 cents a share... which just happens to be right around last falls upper resistance level.
http://ih.advfn.com/p.php?pid=webchart&btn=s_ok&ihsymbol=&ihpagelist=Quote&ihbtn=Get+Quote&symbol=USOTC%3AWAMPQ&s_ok=OK&period=1&drawmode=2&size=19&volume=1
"A month ago this stock was at .06 and P's were 1.75pps"
They'll have a hearing on it. For some reason they want to cut them loose... and soon.
Wampq was at .25 6 or 7 months ago, not a few weeks. Don't expect to see anything like that happen with the commons unless there's a buyout and they are given a dream deal or unless WMI reopens a pretty big bank.
They can emerge, but the plan isn't due until July. Many feel they will emerge as part of a buyout. I'm not so sure that's the case, but I do welcome it.
Do I have this backwards? I thought JPM was only covered up to 500 million, meaning anything more than that they have to pay.
"Since JPM limited the liability to them selves in the P&A agreement to ½ billion dollars that is all they should have to pay and the FDIC should pick up the rest."
I wouldn't say confused. I'd say maniacal.
"...all greased by a confused Treasury Secretary; Paulson."
What's REALLY going on here?
1) Someone's buying up Pqs but because so many are now tightly held they aren't able to do so on the down low. If I were going to buy out WMI, I'd start with the Ps and work my way down the list.
2) A couple of people on yahoo have speculated that perhaps a deal has been struck between WMI and JPM whereby WMI signs over the titles for some of the properties that are up for sale in exchange for JPM assuming the liability of preferred shares.
3) Some people realized the potential for WMI preferreds to come out of this smelling like a rose, but are still queasy about the commons.
4) It's just a fluke.
I have a hard time watching a stock run from 6-36 dollars in a matter of days and writing that off as a pump or a fluke. I think somethings up and I'm leaning towards institutional buying... and once they hit the max for the day they stop and then the sell off by traders kicks up.
Just some guesses. I don't think anyone really knows anything for sure. But I hope the commons run soon... Not so much for the flippers, but for those that have lost and are looking to recoup. Some just need to hit a figure to sell and break even and I hope it happens and happens soon.
For the rest of the longs... Lets see if the stench of settlement/buyout in the air is legit. Hopefully we'll know more soon.
Bair only said it 40000 times when WaMu was seized... We had to do it because we're backed by the full faith of the US Government. Guess what, now she'll pay for that mistake and if she doesn't have the money, then it will be the full faith of the United States Government that will pay up.
What stupidity this is. I'd like to know if Bair and Dimon are actually squirming, or if this is all part of some arrangement between parties... including Lehman.
I'll probably have to clean some of it up and stuff once it's all done... but thank you. :O)
For those that didn't catch it yesterday...
I posted the first 7 minutes of the wamu flick which is just a loose intro. I ran out of posts here yesterday so, I only posted it up on yahoo.
Double click the video to link back to youtube if you want to comment.
http://wamuqd.com/
I'll sell mine at 998... just to say I was first.
99% sure the rest was Chinese investors that piped money through TPG. TPG only lost 1.3 out of pocket.
"If they plowed $7 billion into WM and it only wiped out $1.3 does that not leave 5.7 billion?"
They tickle my belly. I am just finishing up what is the intro and prologue. I believe this to be the hardest part of the work as far as splicing up stuff. The rest is simply going to be me going through what happened and hopefully trashing everything that went down.
There's no ground for these "folks" to stand on. They're simply in the wrong. they should all be in jail just for trying to get away with this kind of crap.
I can't wait til my family sees this thing. Maybe they'll finally understand if they just see it all put together instead of my mad ramblings day after day.
I seriously hope I don't screw anything up though. God knows I debunked myself in that first video with a few things I put in there that were obviously wrong.
"The arguments put forth by JPMorgan and the FDIC really are laughable."
We're not disagreeing. I expect them to request an extension as well. But should this go to court I don't think for a second they'll delay the restructuring indefinitely.
That's all I'm trying to say.
Working on the stupid movie since about 12am so my brain is slightly fried.
"We can agree to disagree. I reiterate that "Weil will request and receive an extension""