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Kag: I'll let you take the stage now to harp on about the fact that BOCX is presenting the RIA test and not the colorimetric...or you can be so kind as to spare us the drivel.
excellent observation Rob. could be a coincidence, or it could be the beginning of a long campaign by Abbott to build RECAF's credibility in the scientific community. i have a hard time believing that ABT has nothing to do with this, as BOCX has 1) never presented at this conference and 2) is the stingiest public company ever known to man.
very nice...won't do a whole lot for the stock price, but it's a positive development. BOCX needs to get the F out of their little R&D shell in BC and step into the real world of publishing and presenting. i'm still bothered by the fact that the BOCX data remains home grown with no university or third party sponsorship, but the fact that they are presenting data in a real scientific forum is a huge step up from just PR'ing it for investors.
5766? what calendar is that and what is the significance
very insightful comment Kag.
my oh my....the sell-off is bringing some activity to the board. if there is a problem with ABT, we will see a sell-off to the .10 level, on very high volume. this stock religiously telegraphs news.
the reality is nobody knows what's going on with the stock, but i believe it is the outfit that filed a planned sale of a few hundred K shares. the market maker in an illiquid issue always buys on the way down and sells on the way up, so he is making the planned seller suffer. after all, due to SEC filing rules the market maker knows exactly how much the planned seller has to offer...he must be licking his lips as he will be selling all of the stock he is buying now on our next rally when retail starts buying.
gyro; no...forgot about that. will try...u should try too he is pretty accessible.
the bottom is the point at which the last crop of weak, unconfident, and under-capitalized shareholders sell and stronger, more optimistic, and better capitalized shareholders buy. so...if you would please sell your shares already we might get there sooner. thanks.
uhh...maybe it's the outfit that filed a plan to sell 300k shares or something.
grandma: yes that is him. he is a very respected pharma analyst, and an old friend of mine. we've spoken about BOCX many times...many of my conclusions on the stock are based on his insight as he is truly an expert on the diagnostics industry, unlike me or anybody else here.
i agree taxman...sell now before the news hits.
gila; angela often picks up BOCX's main line early in the morning before administration gets there.
great find HALF_FULL. good to see them hiring...looks like they are expecting a comfortable cash position and more work. i see the document is signed by Angela...she is a very helpful and knowledgable researcher that has been with Moro for a long time. she is absolutely passionate about RECAF.
Gold Seeker: it's an absolute Godsend. there are multiple sources for acquiring an endless supply of "known" serum samples...see below information. my rule for buying pharma/biotech has always been phase 3 testing or later because i HATE the FDA process. since RECAF is considered pre-clinical, if we had to sit through a lengthy trial i'd probably sell...a quicky 510k using archived samples is the most likely scenario based on info given to me by multiple, credible sources. once the assay is ready things will happen FAST.
1) companies who collect or acquire samples and sell them to diagnostics companies...a few well known ones are:
http://www.ilsbio.com/inventory.html
http://www.precisionmed.com/completed_alzheimers_depression_collections.html
http://www.questdiagnostics.com/brand/business/b_bus_clinical_trials.html
(Quest is a large public company that offers, amongst other things, a turn-key outsourcing solution for diagnostics clinical trials. Sample sourcing is just one thing they do)
2) trials specifically designed to collect known serum samples for the purpose of "tissue banking"...these are usually NIH or university sponsored trials. also, virtually all research hospitals, corporations, and goverment organizations archive the samples from prior clinical studies where "known" samples were collected...the samples are typically flash frozen and then bought, sold, traded, and donated in a global secondary market. doctors are smart people...without a mechanism like that medical research would be 100 times slower than it already is, as researchers would need to recruit patients for sample donations every time they wanted to do research (not to mention clinical trials). that is totally unfeasible...
http://clinicalstudies.info.nih.gov/detail/A_1997-C-0147.html
http://clinicalstudies.info.nih.gov/cgi/wais/bold032001.pl?A_06-I-0074.html@collection
http://clinicalstudies.info.nih.gov/cgi/wais/bold032001.pl?A_04-H-0012.html@collection
http://clinicalstudies.info.nih.gov/cgi/wais/bold032001.pl?A_03-H-0051.html@collection
http://clinicalstudies.info.nih.gov/cgi/wais/bold032001.pl?A_00-C-0078.html@collection
i bought the stock after the crash and never personally received any of the spam, but i remember when first joining the BOCX boards on the internet it was a fresh subject and guys like Rudy and the other old RB crowd were all recipients. apparently the spam was blasted throughout the internet and via direct mail and a lot of it was made to look like it was from BOCX. the spam claimed that RECAF was the cure to cancer and had fully approved by the FDA for all indications, and made other wild claims. i remember that in the aftermath people were discussing that the whole thing was the work of some established "pump and dump crew"...very bizarre stuff. reminiscent of the old "pool traders" that would run stocks and commodities up using false information and then distribute to the public who would get fleeced.
mysscat: i don't know, but i do know that there is an entire industry centered around storing monstrous volumes of historical serum samples to be used for large-scale diagnostics testing. BOCX management is convinced that, once the proper ARCHITECT assay has been developed, clinical testing for the 510k application can be done very rapidly by leveraging these historical serum sample databases. apparently BOCX has been given notification by ABT that this is how they will proceed. my friend kammerman, who i trust ten times more than BOCX management since i've known him for decades, says that "of course" this will be the case. he says that, since it is a straightforward general screening application, Abbott would never spend the money on recruiting new patients rather than using the known samples from a third party database (either academic or commercial).
Kag: I'm glad you took the time to research the SEC enforcement process, but you are misinterpreting your findings. Your statement that "Companies slapped with a SEC trading suspension are not allowed a Wells process" and the supporting paragraph you provided is 100% irrelevant in the case of BOCX because the trading suspension was so short and, more importantly, the SEC NEVER FILED A WELLS NOTICE. Thus, any discussion on BOCX's inability to make a Wells Submission is 100% irrelevant.
Your comment that the trading suspension "was likely the intended extent of SEC's action aganist BOCX" is even more absurd. The comment assumes that the SEC knew ahead of time what they would find during the informal investigation (which is really a glorified word for "discovery process" in legal parlance). If the SEC found serious wrongdoing on the part of the d/o's, believe me the trading suspension would not have been the extent of the enforcement action! You gotta be kidding me!
No amount of academic circle jerk will change the fact that the SEC halted the stock, did discovery, and quietly went away. If you believe that they will one day wake up and bring charges years and years later, sell your stock because we'd tank if that happened. Enough on this please...go back to class and pay attention this time.
FYI BOCX's updated shareholders in the following:
BioCurex On Its Way Back To The OTC:BB
RICHMOND, British Columbia, July 22, 2004 (PRIMEZONE) -- BioCurex, Inc. (Pink Sheets:BOCX) provides a Company update on its effort to reestablish trading on the NASD OTC:BB:
Three months ago BioCurex underwent an investigation by the SEC. Following a sudden increase in the price of our stock, the Commission decided it was in the best interests of our investors to halt trading of BOCX shares for 10 days based on "questions regarding the accuracy of assertions by BioCurex and others, in press releases and e-mails to investors concerning, among other things, (1) a study confirming the effectiveness of its primary product and (2) approval of its main product by the Food and Drug Administration". The company immediately clarified any semantics in reference to the FDA classification of its Histo-RECAF technology and stood firmly by its reported results. Further, in an unprecedented move, a complete and detailed description of the raw scientific data including the statistical analysis of our lung cancer study was posted on the company web site for everyone to view.
Those same results, along with other studies, were subsequently presented in two congresses that gather international specialists in the field of cancer markers. The presentations elicited a significant amount of interest by very knowledgeable persons as outlined in a previous news release. It should be emphasized that we would not have gone to those congresses if we did not have complete confidence in our results, nor would those results have passed the scrutiny of the international scientific community in the field, if the results had not been well substantiated and valid -- which they were.
We have fully cooperated with the SEC, while standing by our claims, which are valid.
The trading suspension caused the company's shares to be removed from the OTCBB. Since April 23rd 2004, our shares have traded in the "Pink Sheets", an unorganized market where actual Bid and Offer at any given time are not always available to all of our investors.
Woa! .50!! Women and children please leave the room immediately.
Kag: what is undeniable is that the SEC went through the discovery process and has completely abandoned the issue. BOCX has confirmed via PR that after the initial discovery phase they had no contact with the SEC, and that was well after discovery (and if you think they'd lie about that in a PR you are nuts). The SEC was right about the semantics with regard to "approval" versus "clearance", but nothing else. If they did, BOCX management would have received Wells notices and/or other enforcement actions. So...the question is, Why are you harping on this? Do you believe there is still SEC risk in the stock, or are you just trying to get attention? After such a long period with no further SEC action, I would put the risk of further SEC action at less than 1%. The SEC does this quite often...they halt stocks, do discovery, and then either bring it to enforcement division or they walk away. It is pretty clear that they walked away.
Move on. Please don't start another repetitive thread of commentary.
PS: any insider who wouldn't sell shares into a 1000%+ price spike when the spike was based on some outside "pump crew" rather than material developments would be NUTS.
furthermore, if you want to look at a case where the SEC halts due to suspected misleading info, does discovery, and finds wrongdoing -- look at CAFE. after a few weeks of the halt the SEC steps in and starts with the enforcement action.
BOCX, unlike CAFE, underwent SEC scrutiny and the SEC walked away. No amount of academic circle jerk on this message board will change that fact.
kag; those are exactly the two reasons i gave. but the speculative part which you had to "be there" to know was the intense spamming campaign going on...you have no idea what was going on. it was intense. the spamming material had complete and utter lies in it, and it was made to look like BOCX was distributing the material.
you can do your internet research and make academic comments, but many of use were there. it was very clear at the time that the spamming material was causing the huge spike in price, and the SEC always halts stocks under those circumstances -- look at CAFE. if we had a little breakout, SEC would have never stepped in.
pawnee; there are two critical events you must understand, and they are very separate.
1) SEC halted BOCX trading because they said they got "FDA Approval" rather than "clearance" for their application. They also were suspicious of the data that was released, because it was seemingly too good to be true. The REAL reason why the stock was halted was the mailers and email spam bombarding the market related to BOCX -- this was orchestrated by pump groups not BOCX -- which caused an unreal price spike.
2) BOCX was delisted because of an SEC blue book technicality that requires stocks be automatically delisted after X amount of days (10 or something).
CONCLUSION: The important part of the story is that the SEC quietly went away without making charges. They went through very little discovery with BOCX, and quickly realized they were WRONG. To be more exact, they were right about BOCX's poor semantics re "approval" vs "clearance", but BOCX would have never been halted for that if the SEC didn't believe there was a larger issue (ie misleading data and pump groups spamming the market). The typical course of action for the semantic issue would have been to force BOCX to re-issue the press release...perhaps a small fine as well.
BOCX, however, remained trapped on the pinks due to the blue book rule...the SEC, if you know anything about them, quietly disappear and let the company deal with the badwill when they open what's called a "formal investigation". This is because they have no duty to inform the public of the closing of such investigation. They only are required to inform the public if the investigation is escalated to the next levels (charges, etc). It stinks for the companies, but works out well for the SEC since they do not have to take responsibility for being WRONG.
90% of the reason I bought the stock and am sitting on great profit is due to the SEC issue. I have done well with other SEC plays, ELN being perhaps my biggest winner as far as those. The SEC's clumsy and inefficient enforcement division creates fantastic buying opportunities for savvy investors. If you understand the SEC you can make a pretty penny.
appreciated erthang
erthang: i'm pretty close to changing my alias to erthangshumbleservant or whatever it was if we don't achieve $2 by fall. i ask for your mercy to relieve me of this, but i am willing to do it if you require it. :)
mysscat: i agree with goldseeker but also believe that he genuinely feels terrible. how could he not?
Kag; you're not the enemy...just naive and a bit annoying. It's okay I was young once too. Respect your elders and...Good Luck!
lol dakota...i feel dumb.
bingo... the repetition sucks. boooo
GoldSeeker: repeating the same point 5 times will not make it better. You've said your piece on JP Turner about 5 times. That is exactly what Kag does -- repeat over and over again. Another clue...LOL!
scouty: no.
Gold Seeker: I have also had nasty PIPE experiences. They are oftentimes very painful. But, believe it or not they serve a very important function in our financial system -- even the dirty ones. They are an incredible source of funding for small companies. But, the investors who are willing to invest large sums in small, risky companies naturally look to minimize (and largely eliminate) risk by shorting against the box.
The company is happy because they raise money, and the PIPE investors are happy because they make a profit. Shareholders are hurt badly in the short-term if there is not enough public demand for the stock to keep up with the PIPE hedging supply... but, in the long-term, shareholders come out ahead. In most cases the shareholders would have been hurt more if the company announced that they have no further capital for operations. Wouldn't you agree?
Now, keep in mind I'm speaking purely about plain vanilla PIPE -- ie; restricted equity at a steep discount + short against the box. True toxic financing is another story -- namely, toxic convertibles (ie with no strike price or an extraordinarily low strike price). If we ever got involved with that stuff I'd sell 100% of my shares immediatley.
BUT...IMO there are good odds that BOCX will do a plain vanilla PIPE within the next two years. Could be tomorrow. If you are so opposed to PIPE's I suggest you sell your shares fast. They are a critical part of development for companies like BOCX. ABT milestones might not do the trick if BOCX chose to significantly back load the licensing agreement.
Kag: I don't expect you to admit it, but it's pretty clear to me at least. Who cares though the more the merrier.
All: GoldSeeker = Kag. I've been suspecting this for a while when Kag said he would leave the board and GoldSeeker magically appeared, but I'm pretty sure of it now. I guess that's why they're always agreeing with each other, often times posting right after each other, and always writing in the same academic tone...LOL...back to the NFLD short squeeze.
Gold Seeker kindly stick it where the sun don't shine. As I've posted before, I put the disclaimer there because I saw some of the admins on IHUB and other boards doing the same. I figured you can never be too careful.
OT mysscat: NFLD non-stop party baby. get out your disco shoes. by the way, if you are looking for short-term gain be wary of sell-the-news after temporary spike on trial completion announcement (any day now). I'm planning to sell a piece into the news and buy back on weakness. I have a long-term capital gains position from about 3 years ago which I will not touch for a while though.
Kag: I wasn't talking about trading, I was talking about finance. Regarding trading, don't even go there as you will embarass yourself. Regarding finance...Once in a while you have something to contribute regarding the science and the diagnostics industry, etc....but you have definitely displayed a complete ignorance with regard to finance. That's fine as you're a biology teacher with no wall street ties...there are plenty of people who are clueless on finance and I'm not criticizing you for that as I'm pretty clueless on biology. My only point was that you couldn't possibly be DC-Steve (a raging bull basher with over 20,000 posts to his name) because he definitely could get down in the mud when we would talk finance.
Know what you don't know. That's what makes a message board go round.
Jesse Livermore agrees with Kag, but Warren Buffett and all value guys would strongly disagree. It's a matter of style -- Livermore was 100% scalper, Buffett a long-term investor. Scalpers should never add to a losing position, but long-term investors relish the opportunity to average down.
IMO, buying BOCX at these levels is a slam dunk.
PS: GoldSeeker -- I'm glad you found humor in my disclaimer, but that wasn't the intention. It is actually quite serious.
fluffy: don't give him too much credit...the guy just searched for "martinelli" in the filings when i brought up the name. Kag is not DC-Steve. He doesn't understand finance well enough to be DC-Steve. That has been well established in my mind at least via the discussions we've had.
lol keller...penny stocks are like calls with a 5 delta. but BOCX has the risk of a 50 delta with the reward of a 5 delta.
IMO.
Kag: unlike you, many of us were in this stock well before the ABT announcement and are still very much above water. Just because you are losing money doesn't mean the rest of us are.