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Sorry! Previous post regarding buy thru TDA was posted to WRONG BOARD. Did NOT have issue with FTNW
FWIW, TD Ameritrade will not let me submit a buy order. Said I need to speak with a broker...
Dad to kid:
Son, if I let you go to the game this weekend you need to clean your room.
Kid:
I promise I'll clean it by "early next week".
Dad:
It's Wednesday afternoon, why haven't you cleaned your room yet?
Kid:
Dad, I said early next week I, didn't say early during the business week. Mid week would be Thursday and early week would be Monday-Wednesday while late week would be Friday-Sunday
Dad:
Son, that is the lamest attempt of an excuse I've heard in a long time, you're GROUNDED.
Early next week they said, they didn't say early during the business week. Mid week would be Thursday and early week would be Monday-Wednesday while late week would be Friday-Sunday
Scheduled = no, authorized until 4/15/2017, between 10,000-20,000 - 1.
The O/S is increasing everyday due to warrant dilution. If the pps doesn't drop in tandem, the market cap goes up.
Not sure about kick to pink, but they are technically in violation now so could be any day. Doubt they make it out of April still on QB.
The "Strong buy" was my "mad plan" back on Jan 16 (see post 79074). I depressed myself by re-reading it today since one of my comments back then was "we are stuck under .25 cents"...
I proposed the theory because at the time, the consensus was the "one thing holding us back is manipulation". Maybe it's something else now? In any event, the sad reality expressed was if Strong's buying wouldn't stimulate many other people's sustained buying, the pps would just slide back down.
Sorry, not sure I understanding your position here, but IMO the pps will decline until they are delisted from QB. Could be a pop on hype at .0001 before next RS? Ask yourself if $80-$100 in your pocket now is better than maybe nothing later?
If you were never contacted, never signed anything, & not part of an investor group, then I'd say you are not subject to the standstill rules.
Etrade is dropping the ball. If you're sure you want to exercise, I suggest doing 1 of these 2 options:
1) Call Etrade & tell them you know people with TDA are exercising daily. And the DTC needs your full name & account number which you give permission to provide. You want an exercise confirmation by the end of the day or you want the needed info to file a complaint against them (Etrade). They work for you so it's their job to do this.
2) I can't find the name & phone for the agent doing the exercise. You can browse thru the SEC filings over the weekend to find it? Call them, or Vapor, or email excashless @ VPCO.com asking them how to exercise direct.
The B/S value went from 1.08 to 75.78 after the 1-70 RS. The qty of warrants you own was also reduced by the 1-70. So if you own & exercise 100 warrants, you get $7,578 worth of shares, based on the closing pps from 2 days before your request.
If you successfully submit the request on Mon 4/18, you get the pps for Thurs of 4/14 which was .001 so $7,578 / .001 = 7,578,000 shares. The problem is if it takes until Thurs 4/21 for the shares to actually hit your account, which is possible, and the pps on 4/21 is .0005, then your shares are already worth half their value.
It's a total roll of the dice. Factor in the pps could hit .0001 or they could be booted back to pink ANY DAY which means no exercise. Final thought is there are still a ton of unexercised warrants. Are people holding them because they think they will be worth something, or are they just not able to exercise?
Are you an "85 percenter"?
Were you ever contacted regarding standstill?
I was neither & yes, I exercised. I posted something about the process regarding a couple "rule changes" they never disclosed & how it screwed me.
I attempted thru TDA & never heard anything so I called them (TD Ameritrade). They said Vapor was requesting my full name & account number which was "unusual" & they needed my permission to do that. Don't know how long it would have taken for them to call me? Anyway, I told TDA they "had permission" but since a week had passed since my request & the pps was tanking daily I wanted to know what date would be used for pps conversion. TDA emailed me back an hour later & said that "2 days prior to today so .07 cents per share". I said " cancel the request". They said "too late", request was submitted and NO cancellations! The rules for exercise had allowed a cancellation if done within 24 hours so "change #2".
By the time I got my .07 cent shares pps was below .02 so I said F it, I'll wait & see what happens, which was another big mistake!
Also, TDA kind of wanted to blow me off when I first called them. I had to be " persistent " with them. Tell E-Trade about the name & account stuff or call Vapor's agent direct.
Don't think so. Below is from the NT filing:
PART III -- NARRATIVE
State below in reasonable detail the reasons why Forms 10-K, 20-F, 11-K, 10-Q, 10-D, N-SAR, N-CSR, or the transition report or portion thereof, could not be filed within the prescribed time period.
The Company is unable to file, without unreasonable effort or expense, its Annual Report on Form 10-K for the year ended December 25, 2015. Additional time is needed for the Company to compile and analyze supporting documentation in order to complete the Form 10-K and in order to permit the Company’s independent registered public accounting firm to complete its review.
According to their own filing, the FY End was December 25, 2015. They are at least 1 week PAST the EXTENDED deadline.
LTNC's fiscal year end was 12/25/2015
10k was due 3/24/2016
NT extension of 15 days gave them until 4/8/2016
I staked out all the Jr. High bus stops in my area. Early Friday mornings I drive around in my van and toss e-cigs out the window to where the kids will find them. Sometimes I'll cruise around in the afternoon to check the results. So far so good.
I agree. These boards should exclusively be for cheer leading. How can people not be content with the pps at .24-.25 cents and falling? It's like when your favorite sports team is floundering due to injuries, bad decisions, or bad luck. Fans should just sell their hats, jerseys, & other stuff and stop buying tickets and just pick a new team. Geeze.
Anyone not comfortable here should sell now and be done IMO
VPCO should merge with Great Basin Scientific. They could develop a machine that uses a Vapor Pen to blow into a medical tester that measures breath stink.
If anyone is wondering why this would be a perfect match, GB sold the same type of units that converted into toxic warrants as VPCO! GB has been thru a handful of recent RS's & their pps continues to plummet. Both companies have destroyed shareholders using the same technique. Can you imagine the epic devastation if these idiot masterminds got together?
10K says $22.4 million cash at 4/6.
They no longer claim the "15% not" figure, only that 85% are standing. I estimate the 15% number is "way down" to about 13-14%!
No, I was not. However, I converted my warrants a couple weeks ago so no reason to. I still have a few "preferred" shares. I "only" held 6,500 warrants so maybe that was considered peanuts?
OK, I get that, sorry if I snapped! Maybe I'm saying this is a "sign" for what they are going to do. This snake slithering out the door taking whatever he can on the way is likely the "plan". The Brausers "were" the company, it's over. I'll hold the $1.98 I have remaining just in case something actually happens but yeah, with over 1 million warrants yet to convert, you're right, I just don't see it. Good luck to us!
PS, it will be hard for me to remain quiet though when the next poster says "maybe Altria will buy them"!
I respect your opinion and you are certainly entitled to it. I also think they won't RS until they "need" to & maybe they will pull off a miracle, although I doubt it.
With that said, how can think the president resigning & walking out the door with a consulting contract worth $290,000 is not relevant to the conversion? Aside from his shady past & the situation he put the company in, what could he possibly be providing worth anything? They just said they need to raise capital to stay afloat and don't have even half the money they would need to settle the $75 million warrant liability & this is not worth mentioning? I'm starting to rethink my first sentence...
Brauser got a "consulting contract" on the way out the door. One time payment of $50k & $10k per month for 2 YEARS. I just hope he'll be OK & will be able to "make ends meet" with that little. He's worth every penny though, look what he's done for shareholders up to this point.
Does anyone still think these guys are not scumbags & care anything at all about you or the company?
65 million and growing every day...
"New boss same as the old boss". Brausers' came from that wonderful Vaporin merger last year. They were the ones with ties to Frost I believe too? I recall someone saying back then the Brausers have a rep for raping & destroying companies they get involved in. If only I had listened...
Re: Monsell. LinkedIn page says we are a "wine & spirits" company - see paste below.
CMO, ECIG International Group
Golden, Colorado Wine and Spirits
Also says "starting" April. So everyone settle down, there's NO WAY we don't get a PR. Maybe today? He may not have officially started yet and they are ironing out the details along with what they want to say.
We got a dopey PR about the exciting accounting change so I'm sure (as I can be) one is coming real soon.
Can't you just steal a kidney? Maybe from an illegal immigrant? We won't tell.
The lofty salaries & bonuses were declared in Q3 so nothing "new" there. They should be forced to be paid in warrants! Where they couldn't convert due to rules & delays & by the time they got their shares they would be worthless, F'ers.
As I've said before, the ONLY thing that matters here is the WARRANTS. Says there are still well over 1 million to convert that would now require over 21 BILLION shares or more than $75 MILLION dollars. Being sued too by at least one group for around $375k because they can't convert their warrants. Says they need to raise new capital to survive/settle warrants. Warrants, warrants, warrants.
Found this stuff via 10 minute skim so my numbers above are estimates, but very close.
As I've said in the past, if only Oprah would announce she lost 40 pounds using a FIN AVS System...
They say the greatest talent of an "Illusionist" is deception. While I'm holding something bright and flashy up high in my left hand, I'm doing something else behind my back in the other that "I don't want you to see".
Schadel may indeed be a genious. 99% of the attention is now about a $15k note, not a potentially disastrous 10k or a rarely seen rise from the ashes to a monumental turn around that some see as simply not possible. He just might be thrilled and views this as an opportunity? Time will tell, but the 10k may not provide enough answers while we wait for the Q1. Until then, the show continues...
Hey, at least you're giving us a share buy-back theory! Thanks...
Hang tight Phin. If you only knew what I know. This will go up after today.
IMO SUPER LONG ECIG
I appreciate good theories too. Hopefully you are not "making up" the o/s. Also, I'm not sure you understand how "these" warrants work:
You said:
Understanding the warrants: person A has a 1000.00 warrant. Trading day pps is .01. Person A unloads for 100,000 shares. Now if pps is 2.00 person A unloads for 500 shares. It's all about pps. I believe everything is and was planned. All the way to the last amended 10-K/A.
If "person A" exercised 1,000 warrants with PPS at .01 (which is at least triple the current pps), they would receive 7,578,000 shares. If they "unload" when pps is at 2.00, they receive 37,890 shares.
Your calculations are off "a wee bit".
How many remaining warrants have you factored in?
What is the value of one warrant?
What is the debt liability to buy out all warrants?
I do not think that is correct? LTNC keeps all of the A/R from the sold branches, the "past" revenue. I thought Ryan said LTNC controls, or owns 55% of the future revenue? The piece people are excited about.
So if I am correct, & they "own" 55% of future revs, don't they also "own" 55% of future debt? Which would be 55% of all TSGL's debt since they are starting with a clean slate.
Question:
If TSGL started with a "clean slate", and they take on debt to purchase LTNC assets, and LTNC gets 55% of TSGL's revenue, do they not get 55% of TSGL's debt as well?
I realize the dichotomy with the jumbo RS & the effect it would have on the warrants rounding up to those ridiculous values. On one hand, they NEED the RS to maintain QB to settle the warrants, on the other it could make things worse! Keep in mind we are dealing with crooks or idiots (IMO).
Warrant holders have NO VOTING RIGHTS so do not assume the "alleged 85%" voted for anything. If there is a sale, wouldn't the buyers be buying the warrant obligation as well?
The only thing I'm comfortable in saying is I have no clue how they will settle this. My converted shares are worth about 15% of what I paid for the units now so I will hold them at this point and accept that I will likely end up holding only my dik.
Thanks. At one point I wanted to tell people "oh no, this isn't a toxic death spiral & it's not debt, it's warrant conversion". In reality, now I think it's the sneakiest, deadliest death spiral one can conceive!
Minor point: the original value assigned to a warrant was 1.08, the warrant conversion price to pay for a share was $1.24. That's why I say the pps had to be around 2.50 to make it worth it to go that route. What a difference it could have been indeed...
I will repeat what I've previously said: It is silly for anyone to speculate what will happen going forward without including how the warrants will be handled!
Of course they stopped telling us how many are left, but at last count, and after the 1-70 RS, it was still over 1 million. Even if "only" 500,000 warrants were exercised at the current pps of .0053, it would require 7.1 BILLION shares. My guess is there are close to 1 million remaining.
One final thought for now: Each warrant that was valued at 1.08 went to 75.78 after the 1-70 RS. If the plan is to "wipe-out" warrant holders with a jumbo RS, 1 warrant at 1-10,000 gets a value of $757,800 dollars & 1 at 20k RS goes to $1,515,600 dollars. Since they "round up", how the F would that work!
I have 2 basic theories regarding the creation of the Units. They both revolve around management either being complete idiots, criminals, or a bit of both.
#1
The Units included 20 warrants with the option to convert to shares at $1.24 each. The pps for VPCO was right around that level back in July when they wrote this up. If the pps was around 2.50 or higher, people would have been happy to pay 1.24 for a share and the company would have received a large sum of cash too. The dilution would have been nothing compared to what they ended up with. Is it possible they actually thought the plan to acquire stores would go fast enough that the share price would rise to these levels? Was the 1.08 per warrant guaranteed black-scholes value thought to be just an incentive to sell the units?
#2
This scenario goes down the path of stupidity and/or "who cares as long as we get our $38 million". Meaning they had no idea or didn't care that all people would look at is the 1.08 value per warrant. The units sold for the most part for around $9 each. Just the 20 warrants at the b/s value exceeded $20 in value so this appeared to be a true arbitrage situation. Don't forget about the fixed 10 common shares for each unit too. When it was clear people just wanted to cash-in their 1.08 value and dilute the crap out of the SS, did management say F it, let the dilution roll, as long as we get to pay off debt and keep millions in cash while "giving the appearance" we are executing our retail plan, we'll be fine?
I still have a difficult time regarding the "standstill". Like I have said, up until a couple weeks ago I held 6,500 warrants. I was never contacted by anyone regarding anything about them. I realize that is a very small amount and maybe a small group of investors hold the majority?
They never 8k'ed whatever they supposedly offered for people to standstill. I think it was more like "hey guys, as soon as we get kicked off Nasdaq to Pink, you won't be able to convert". In other words, a "forced standstill". What could they have offered, that they didn't offer me, that didn't need an 8k?
Also, I discovered they don't even know who the people are holding warrants in "street name"! The only way they could have come close to the "100%" they alleged they were going for would have been to contact ALL brokers and have them contact their clients.
They also changed the rules a bit regarding the exercise of warrants. I had a standing request in from the day they originally halted conversion. The day after they hit QB, I called TDA to find out if my previous request was still pending. Answer was "no", but before they could re-submit my request, Vapor wanted my name & account number, which TDA does not forward without permission. (new rule #1 and keep in mind nobody contacted ME about the new rule and the company never published it either.) I said "yes", but also wanted confirmation what date would be used now when I re-submit? The standard rule was shares that you get are based on closing pps two days prior to request date but I wanted confirmation of my date due to prior/pending request. So TDA gets back to me & says "ok, your request has been submitted and shares will be based on 2 days ago". The pps 2 days prior was .07 cents and that was when price was diving every day. I said "cancel my request". All of this took place over a couple hours. The "old rule" was you could cancel a request within 24 hours of making it. New rule #2 is "no cancellations once submitted. It took 4 days to get my shares so by the time I got the shares I paid .07 for they were trading at about .02 cents which resulted in a net below what I paid for the units, f me!
Thanks for taking the time! I guess I was thinking since they got to QB as a "seasoned company" maybe the "30 days after initial listing" rule over .01 wouldn't apply, but I think you are correct, they will get booted in short order at this rate.
I am on the same page regarding the possibility of RS'ing everyone to death and then start fresh with 21+ stores, 15-20 million in cash, and hope for the best. I know that sucks and opens them up to many other issues, but they don't appear to have too many other choices.
I'll make a couple separate posts regarding my other ramblings and thoughts...