is Loving China.. considering learning Mandarian
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Man, you hit the nail on the head..
America has turned into a fat lazy "I want it now" culture. I don't see things improving, I see them getting worse. Our entire culture is heading into the toilet.
This might be a bit controversial and OT, but I firmly believe Christian fundamentalism is just as bad for the U.S. as Muslim extremists are for the Middle East.
Take China, where Buddhism and Daoism create a pluralistic society, where harmony can reign supreme. The U.S. has private banks setting monetary policy through the Federal Reserve, whereas China is Communist and monetary policy is set by the Government.
Personal beliefs and feelings aside, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure which culture will thrive and which one will self destruct. It just a matter of accepting it at face value.
I don't know where you've been getting your news lately but GM went bankrupt, the credit markets froze up and the U.S. economy collapsed in late 2008. To add insult to injury the financier of the company, Carnes, diluted the common to death and is now on trial for it.
The deals were real, the excitement was real and the potential was real, but things changed and the business plan failed. Shareholders became hostile and happiness turned into sadness for many.
I hate to bust your bubble, but investing in a start-up does not guarantee an investor a return, in fact start-ups are more likely to fail than succeed based on historical statistics.
Like any true entrepreneur, you get up, brush off the dust and tend to your bruises, but you don't give up.
Don't you think with the current investigation, had the CEO of RVGD done anything wrong he would be a defendant?
Business plans fail more often then they succeed. Quit trying to place the blame for your losses on others. You bought into a start-up, if you didn't realize the risks associated with that then you probably should reevaluate your investment strategies or invest in securities more to in line with your risk tolerance.
Start-ups are high risk.. with high risk comes the potential for large rewards, but you are never guaranteed those rewards, never, and the cards are always stacked against you from the get go.
You run your own small business do you not? You should know first hand how difficult it can be to get your business off the ground.
Public press releases clearly state my retention and shareholders were notified when I departed. For the 5 months retained, I was paid $8,900. I hate to bust your bubble but there is no alien abduction theories, or government cover ups. I was simply hired to interact with retail shareholders on a daily basis so the CEO didn't have to. Amazingly enough, at one point I was considered the "mastermind" of every OTC scam in existence had you read this board shortly after my departure.
These message boards are worse than two old ladies in a beauty parlor.
Yes and I have no idea nor do I really care, I'm sure the court documents can provide that information for you. However, I would suggest taking some time to research how promissory notes and convertible debt work so you can better understand what you are reading in the court papers. The interpretation by message board drama queens is far from the reality presented in those court papers.
Please don't take this as me being rude, but obviously you have a lot to learn about basic securities law before you start asking these types of questions, that the answers to will only confuse you further.
Your concerned with something that is not really related to the issue at hand. As I mentioned in a previous post, you need to understand Rule 144 and the changes that were made in early 2008 to understand the issue as it relates to RVGD.
Simply put, in my opinion based on the rules, the shares Carnes received should have been restricted under changes to Rule 144. He is in trouble for "selling" unregistered securities. The SEC itself has a wonderful time making things confusing all on their own with their half ass written regulations that can be interpreted any number of ways.
Again, I'm not trying to be an ass, or avoid the question, I can simply tell by your line of questioning and thinking that you do not even have the slightest knowledge on the subject and trying to explain it would only confuse you more.
Here is what the SEC has to say about Rule 144(i).
Question: If an issuer had previously been a shell company but is an operating company at the time that it issues securities, is the Rule 144 safe harbor available for the resale of such securities if all of the conditions in Rule 144(i)(2) are not satisfied at the time of the proposed sale?
Answer: No. Rule 144(i)(1) states that the Rule 144 safe harbor is not available for the resale of securities “initially issued” by a shell company (other than a business combination related shell company) or an issuer that has “at any time previously” been a shell company (other than a business combination related shell company). Consequently, the Rule 144 safe harbor is not available for the resale of such securities unless and until all of the conditions in Rule 144(i)(2) are satisfied at the time of the proposed sale. [Jan. 26, 2009]”[2]
Source: http://www.thelebrechtgroup.com/index.php/publications/tlg-publications/97-rule-144s-impact-on-shell-companies
Things changed dramatically on 2/15/2008 when the SEC adopted changes to Rule 144/145, specifically Rule 144(i). It has had a major impact in cleaning up the pinksheet market but more time will need to pass to really see the effects.
It was this rule change that I believe Carnes got in trouble over. I'm not going to get into a class room exercise over it, but if your interested you can google "Rule 144i" or "Rule 144(i)", there have been a number of articles written about it.
It is also why you haven't seen hardly any pinksheet R/M's in 2009. Here is a good article..
http://www.thelebrechtgroup.com/index.php/publications/tlg-publications/97-rule-144s-impact-on-shell-companies
It doesn't quite work that way in regards to the dates. Stock message boards are the absolute worst place for anyone to learn about the market or to gain insight. It is like watching a 10 year old BMX'er explain autocross racing to a veteran Grand Prix racer.
Very few people on Ihub have enough knowledge to discuss the charges intelligently. The "wrap around" agreements are a term used by the prosecution to make its case in regards to how the notes were structured (matured). The dates in question refer to the conversion of notes. It is to complicated to explain in layman's terms, you either understand how convertible notes work.. or you don't. It is simply not as cut and dry as many seem to want to think.
I disclosed my compensation way before Ihub ever started the IRP program. By the time they launched it I had quit doing promotions. It was a thankless job and wasn't worth the money. It never mattered if the stock ran 1,000% after you started promoting it.. people only remembered what came afterward when the dust settled. I knew of people who bought the bottom.. watched it run 1000% then rode it all the way back down to a loss... then have the audacity to blame me for their losses.
I learned one thing about the penny market as a promoter.. 98% of the people who trade penny stocks are complete idiots and have no business with a brokerage account. I guess that is why the scam artists love the OTC so much lol.
The true moral of the story is.. folks simply need to learn how to invest properly and when they don't, they need to take responsibility for it.
I can't stand people who blame stock promoters. That would be like blaming the Advertising company for Chevy because your car turned out to be a lemon. Or those morons who wanted to sue gun companies because of the deaths they caused. Maybe lets sue Budweiser for deaths from DUI's...
Folks just need to take responsibility for their actions.. which is something that has been lost in American culture.
But you obviously have no problems slandering my name on a public forum.
That is an easy question to answer. But first I will pose a question to you. Do you know all the requirements, legal steps, financial steps etc.. to take a company public and raise money through the public markets? If you didn't know these things would it make you a bad businessman?
The majority of businesses that go public must hire an outside consultant or firm to assist them in going public. The process itself isn't complicated, however it can seem overwhelming to somoene who has no experience in doing so. As is with any service provider, some will give you a great service and others will rob you blind. Almost all of them will convince you the process is extremely complicated so they can justify their fees.
Lets do a quick practical exercise. Go to Google and type in "Go public". http://www.google.com/#hl=en&q=%22go+public%22&aq=f&aqi=&oq=&fp=74f5ed7994d722e7
There are 3 sponsored adds and dozens of others. A quick survey and I count at least 13 consulting firms to assist you in going public on the first page alone. The market is saturated with these consultants. Why? Because it is EASY MONEY! Worse than a used car salesman. These guys just need one client every few years to make hundreds of thousands of dollars. It is the biggest gimmick on Wall Street.. these guys are nothing but middlemen that combine and mark up the required services to go public.
You need two professional services, an attorney and an auditor. In most cases, these middle men make more than the two professionals combined.. and for doing what? Nothing.. just simply pointing you in the right direction and making you feel better about spending the money. Once your public.. they typically rape you with their "no money down" toxic debentures you signed for... not realizing what you were doing. After all, you hired these guys because they were suppose to "assist" you.
I could go on and rant for hours on this subject alone. I haven't even gotten to the 504 funding guys like Mazuma and TJ Management that will call you with the intensity of a debt collector begging you to do some financing.
Very few companies ever get legitimate consultation when going public. The majority of the people who have the knowledge to do so are also the same people who would steal from their own grandmother. Ultimately it is Wall Street at its core.. greed ridden and corrupt.
Of all the pinksheet companies I worked for, every single one of them got shafted by the consultant who helped take them public... every last single one of them. As a result I went into business providing that consulting and have done well by providing an honest service.
STEC just noticed a class action filed.. don't know the details but it certainly can't help perception any.
STEC honestly don't know, I have not followed the stock. I would be curious why the stock had such a huge run and pullback. Look almost like a pennystock pump and dump chart lol..
SIAF looking like nice base forming at $.80.
There are a lot of people who read the board but don't post. I have been around Ihub long enough to know there are some very intelligent investors lurking about, they just rarely ever publicly post.
Probably because everyone jumped on the short bandwagon because of the earnings. Having that many shares short only increases the chances of a short squeeze. Since the introduction of online discount brokers, the market tends to act like a herd of stupid lemmings. With book of $3.25 and flush with $36M cash for acquisition/expansion, I think being short right now wouldn't be smart. That isn't to say I'm loading up the boat to go long either. I see the stock continuing its consolidation as the previous financing is absorbed. It will be several quarters before we see any real appreciation in share price. However, I do not see the stock dropping much from current levels, at least not enough to make shorting the stock an acceptable risk.
SIAF - RDBO keep in mind there is no such thing as land acquisition in China. You pay for the rights from the Government, that are allowed to be amortized through GAAP. As of now, SIAF has more land bank.. almost double that of RDBO.
Also keep in mind, there is not a single business in China that the Government doesn't take some position in. So until everything is settled with RDBO's dairy start-up, it will be hard to predict the total dilution to shareholders. SIAF overcomes this by launching JV's in order to keep the parent company nondilutive.
Also, SIAF is already partnered with one of the largest Government owned Ag companies, SanJing, which gives them a bit of a lead as far as relationships within the China government. You have to also keep in mind SIAF has dairy cows coming out of nursery so you will begin to see increases in production before 2013.
One last thing, SIAF has established bulk sales to the larger existing China diaries. This eliminates the worry of achieving retail acceptance. I do know that SIAF is however working to launch a retail side of there dairy operations that will not directly compete with it's bulk buyers thus increasing potential for net margins.
More O/S translates into more Cash.. used for expansion.. which translates into more future earnings. $36M cash to be exact.. that is a lot of hog farm construction. Book of $3.25.
FEED - I don't know that I would short FEED. Margins declined due to a number of reasons out of control of management but the Company's future is still bright. They also raised a butt load of cash in 2009 to construct additional farms. Those farms when they come online could dramatically improve the bottom line. I doubt we will see that for another year or so, but I would still venture to say shorting would be a bit risky at these levels versus the return to be made considering the amount of promotion that has been done on the company.
I quit trading it months ago when all the equity raises took place and killed the momentum. I'm just on the sidelines now watching waiting for an improvement.
FEED like a drunk yoyo this morning on earnings. Some insane volatility for the balls of steel day trader.
SIAF - RDBO
Interesting, was this a recent R/M?
I did a quick review of the recent 10Q. I will state up front I am biased towards SIAF when comparing. I've done an enormous amount of DD in regards to SIAF and China dairy. The one thing that caught my eye with RDBO is that they will most likely need to raise additional money whereas SIAF has already funded it's start-up operations.
I also noticed RDBO has convertible debt(equity), where SIAF has only bank debt(no equity). SIAF's net margins will be a bit higher because they also manufacture in house there own feedstock as well as operate (hold license/patents)on organic fertilizer. Including their exclusive rights to a fishery process, they are a more diversified company.
I would need to do further DD, but I would say RDBO needs to mature a little more, get past whatever funding rounds they need and most importantly, make sure whatever promoters and previous directors of the shell have sold. That is something SIAF already went through and therefore is no longer a burden on the share price.
No, I was never contacted and I doubt I would have been able to add anything of interest. My involvement with RVGD came after the CEO realized Carnes was not a positive influence. The whole reason I was retained was because he wanted Carnes/Kistler out of the picture. I gave the CEO my opinions on matters he brought to my attention, but in all honesty, my involvement was limited to just providing an outsourced IR service. Pretty much just a glorified answering service. I was mainly being paid for my "popularity" at the time. The whole fiasco damaged some of that popularity, but the general knowledge I gained from it far outweighed what a few amateur penny traders thought of me.
I know that whatever Carnes was up too was really upsetting the CEO of RVGD personally. It was a sad situation really. The shareholders became very hostile, but trying to explain the situation doesn't do any good when the majority of them are inexperienced amateurs at best. It was like trying to have adult conversation with a 2 year old. The message boards only inflamed the emotions..
I'm just glad to see justice being served.
I take it from what I have read, the judge actually does his job in serving justice? I would hate to see all these folks just get a slap on the wrist.
So what is the cliff notes version of where we stand with this case? I've tired catching up on some of it, but I figure someone who has followed this more closely could sum it up in a few sentences.
I have some interest in this case because Carnes actions tarnished my reputation slightly while acting as IR for RVGD> I thought the guy was a scumbag then.. and now this trial should prove it.
Need Help!
I could do this on my own.. but I figured the collective knowledge of this board would speed things up for me greatly.
Can folks PM with a list of China companies that have recently conducted a R/M with an OTCBB shell, or any shell and subsequently filed with the SEC?
I need some reference materials.
Yes you could.. but if it was ever proven that you lied, you would be subject to criminal prosecution because you presented false information to the public.
If you never file anything.. there is nothing anyone can sue for :)
A comment was posed to me and I replied. I'm not a shareholder so I have no interest.
You are 100% correct, I know down to the dime the cost for a private company to go public.
It doesn't cost a dime however for a company to prepare and present unaudited financial statements. Something as simple as an exported quickbooks report would suffice. The only cost associated with this is the $500 application fee and $3,000 annual fee to pinksheets. http://www.pinksheets.com/pink/products/news_service.jsp
Any CEO of a publicly traded company should at the very least provide shareholders with this basic information. If paying the fees and providing unaudited reports are to much of a burden on a public company, it has no business being public in the first place.
I also agree with you 100% that many pinksheet companies are real companies, I have worked with a few.. but the vast majority of them at the very least make an effort to provide shareholders adequate financial information.
haha.. a man after my own heart.. it is boring watching L2 screens flicker all day.
More like mosquitos, they do leave an itch seems like.
I understand completely lol..
I worked as a promoter, that site can come in handy for tracking promoters and promotions. Just keep in mind, don't judge a company because it uses a promoter. Most OTC companies have no other alternative than to use promoters as they do not receive much coverage from the media or analysts.
Sorta like the blog writers, who write articles that are published on places like SeekingAlpha.. they may not be paid to write the article.. but 9 times out of 10 they own stock in the subject company. So in essence they are promoters too.
Always make your decisions based on fundamentals. If a stock is moving on promotion.. all the more better if it supports the fundamentals. Promotion is all about exposure, fundamentals will always be the core for a real investment decision though.
SIAF up 5% on very light volume. Looks like this one is ready to rebound above $1. Earnings out today.
Can you say thin? lol
I agree with you 100%
I'm smiling :)
Overreaction is sure to come from this report. Anyone who thought unemployment numbers would show signs of an improving economy are foolish. Unemployment numbers are very much a lagging indicator and would only be used to confirm other indicators.
I believe we have hit the bottom and are leveling out to slightly improving. Other indicators are improving which would suggest this.
The U.S. economy, though yes in trouble, is simply to robust to fail. China won't let the U.S. economy fail anyways, they have to much invested. If anything they will slowly wean us off the free money tap while using interest payments to push there own economy ahead.
If anything comes out of this financial crisis, it will be more a lifestyle change among Americans who have simply consumed to much in the past few decades. Folks will be forced to live more modest lifestyles.
SIAF 3Q Fins out $.03 EPS, $1.04 Book
$.08 nine months ending, previous guidance of $.13 EPS for full year 2009. HU plantation and dairy retail sales should really boost 4Q numbers.
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Sino-Agro-Food-Inc-Announces-bw-746396992.html?x=0&.v=1
SIAF: Folks running from ask.. 2X .80 by 2X .85. I love low floats when the shares dry up.