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But but...the content is not new to us
of course, but isn't it new to have the
naming of TC etc ?
was all of that on the old info sheet?
Why would TC not object to this NDA-wise ?
Because it is just I-Hub ??
More ZERO messages - to be precise
not More ZERO news; messages.
I am very, very sorry if this 'message' is old
hat or I am wrong...seeing chimeras in the desert..
but it looks to me like a Press Release and a beautiful
moment - when TRANS CANADA came out of the closet ..bringing
a lot with it
trying to be calm, no, negative
preparing for return to reality, the wait,
I looked again : it is still there !!
It ALSO has a paragraph dedicated to SIGNED CONTRACT
another to UPLISTING....
IS this a cruel joke...the opposite of the negative
tricks and links of recent times ?? what has an insomniac
stumbled upon?
Is this also on the STWA web site?
why would it not be ?
wake up somebody..anybody.. in...anywhere !
AM I GOING NUTS AND SEEING THINGS?
I have just gone into More Zero Messages on
this I Hub page.
I found there a colour page of publicity which is
dedicated to and entitled AOT installed on Keystone by
TRANS CANADA
It is named, it is loud and clear - and so is the spelling out
of the best possible situation overall as well as the possible or
likely nature of a forthcoming order..
Was that there yesterday ?...Where is it going next ???
Help
Alkaline...could you explain?
Thanks for the exciting realism...but
this hypothetical question from STWA to TC
after hearing of the order..
'could we have a month to do some groundwork on the
investors..before the 8 k'?
how would that groundwork appear to us, the investors?
As a Press Release ?
Apologies if I am off course..!
Thanks Zerosum
I have caught up with that subject
With regard to the TC order: if there is a positive side to this delay and to the
constant focus on the abstract or legally confined, (and to the overlooking of the
world of PR or its finer points), it is that STWA and TC share a knowledge of the
SCALE of what is to come
and that this SCALE will dwarf the previous frustrations and make it seem all worthwhile
Possibly this is wishful thinking or desperation talking : but I am going to indulge in it
(and tempt Fate)
to the full - because one day it is going to have to be right !
The other side of the coin - let's say/ for the sake of the argument - is that TC are going
to purchase or lease only the AOT they have been testing. Which strikes me as even more
fanciful than the other side.
It is just a question of when TC announces its full commitment to a more efficient and profitable future and one that is also greener.
I hope they do not draw it out until October 15, given the expediting of successful testing that
has already occurred. And given also that any attempt to sweat the STWA shareholders has to take Kinger Morgan into account.
TC must be aiming for the best possible deal with STWA and lead the oil industry and the USA into a new era.
Little surprise, I suppose, that the odd Press Release is not so professional.
Good post DPS
I am sure you are right and also that STWA is
in a great position, waiting for events (or just one)
to join up the
dots and also to make earlier Press Releases kick in
and give more momentum.
It would be the worst of all scenarios if a lawsuit was
provoked and I am sure that lawyers are all over every
communication. Caution must prevail.
But it still seems excessive to have everything controlled by
legalistic factors alone - not
just the facts revealed or the channels used but even the TONE of
a Press Release : there seems to be a ban on clear celebration of success or on STWA determining its own formats. We have the
equivalent (sometimes) of Depression !
If I was in charge, my PR campaign would focus on the Stream - not the names of clients - just Upstream and Midstream (or wherever!) and it would emphasise all the grades of oil and how the map of oil or energy management - and its costs - was being re-drawn. Lots of colour, lots of Green.Erc. Child-friendly !!
Pie - medievalism..whoops - I was making the same error which
I was criticising : ie my point was that the mistakes in the transcription ('before terms' instead of 'the full term') was turning shareholders into medieval scholars who have to de-cypher gobbledegook..or work out exactly what is being terminated ..or not.
Talking of not being able to terminate.. the bashers - a big thank you to all the posters who bother to respond to their rubbish. I don't read any of them but it is clear from the responses what they continue to manufacture.
I hope they are well paid by their slave driver (or/and have lots of STWA shares)..because, sure as daylight, these 'sophisticates'
are wasting their time.
Good week-end
R & D can live with PR
There is no doubt that NDA's have to be respected and that only orders for AOT are single-handedly most likely to raise the s.p
But the commercial world is where we are and the commercialisation of AOT is what is being sought.
The commercial world turns on success and in that success there is generally a role for PR/spin/ call it what you will - and, obviously, if the spin is not based on substance, then that will prove a danger in itself.
We have no fear of such a danger. The many years of R & D have ensured that : from Rand to Temple to Wyoming/PRCI and all the rest, we have achieved serious status within TC and KM and others ONLY because of our dedication to R & D.
We have it all . We should enjoy our PR. It should be in language that is simple, clear and loud. We had great news from TC, we had PEG and then a contract with KM who invited us to PEG. Think of all the facts about AOT in situ and of all the ways all of this (and 5 other NDA's) could have been expressed in OUR narrative and with no offence to any NDA.
It has been the opposite.
As if TC had said,'you can have a party..but just make sure it is a bad one'. Did they say that ?
Any negativity within the NDA, or the potential for it,has been compounded by the language used at all stages.
It is nothing short of absurd that our greatest or most commercial triumph to date, T.C's change of terms,has been the cause of only confusion and fodder for the bashers. With the word 'ternination' playing a starring role.
We have had posters behaving like scholars; going back to original medieval documents to prove why there should have been no such confusion. Awful.
When the chance came to clarify/reverse thrust etc on August 11, the medievalism got worse via a new employee at STWA who turned that greatest moment to rubbish ('before terms' instead of 'the full term'etc)
The PR which accompanied the crackly CC was dismal and I will not repeat my reasons. But it is mirrored by the fact that STWA has never published the PR company's name accurately.
To be fickle, all we know is that she drinks Guinness. And writes a good blurb about herself.
Most potential investors will not know STWA as we do. Most will need signs of good order and credibility. None or not many of them will be prepared to overlook signs of the opposite - nor will they attribute these failings to a glorious over-abundance of substance based on R & D.
Small potatoes (after the event) Jaymark
but I was in touch with STWA about the market's latest
reaction and our vulnerability to it - and how all STWA's progressions must
surely warrant a greater share price and that there must
be more to be done in the Public Relations department
(not just Investor Relations)
etc
I did get an answer and it was that they are working on it.
They seem to have been surprised and disappointed by the
response - but the PR element was a SHAMBLES.
As I detailed in my previous post..and as many others have
said over some considerable time.
zerosnoop/ PR (McGuinness?) and mistakes
Thanks Zerosnoop for the PR text....but I am not sure
about how well it read..but would I be misguided to link a fall in
s.p with PR in general ?
I guess the fall in price was inevitable : it is the Absences which
count. Always. Never the Presences of many and varied nuggets of news and progress. An absent purchase order is the only presence.
As for the Press Release : well, in all my years as a copywriter,I never saw a prime space filled with such financial details - and STWA's were repetitious and negatively inclined/contextualised.
One reference and one link to last year's figures would have been sufficient : our treasured page of PR was non-stop regurgitation of the comparison with Bad.
Of all the countless uses of one page not used - a chance to highlight in loud terms the ideas of an acquisition or the Joule Heating...And why is Gregg quoted in the first line as having only one existing customer?
Who handled it ? do we know ? STWA has not even sorted out the name of the PR people : the name of them is wrongly reported as
McGuinness Communications. It is McGuinness Consulting. Doesn't this matter ? What is Guinness actually doing cf Stonegate and Zerosum's portentous assessment of them ?
Whoever did the transcript of Gregg's address made numerous errors.
The largest error effected badly and hugely one of the most important sentences of the whole thing : about line 20. About
Trans Canada. Our star turn.
Starting "On July 15 we were notified by the pipeline operator.".
Instead of saying 'that the full term' (of the lease) was not needed, it says "before terms" - and thus the sentence becomes rubbish (in the strictest terms of PR - ie you ARE your message)
For me this represents a major invitation to believe that our s.p could be different. And that the amateurish approach to PR so far on show is the main factor in this.
I hope this can be turned round by Mr or Mrs Professional
McGuinness - which is what the substance of STWA invites and deserves.
Not to mention the shareholders. Who are supposed to have a significance over and above the perennial gallantry of reminding themselves (and their families and friends) that the s.p has nothing to do with the potential value of the company
BUT do we get a Press Release ??
IN the CC, we have a lot to celebrate of course; there is no doubt of the
great progress made and that the intimations about the future
will surely lead to actual achievements.
BUT the accompanying report is a Financial Report only - ie
it has none of the direct endorsements of AOT etc - whereas surely
a Press Release would headline items like Gregg's positive
response to the TC tests and also focus largely and explicitly on all the positives such as Joules or acquisitions.
We (the share price) needs the biggest possible audience to read
the clearest kind of news...While many institutional or professional investors will read/listen to everything - and that is great -
my concern is that we are still vulnerable to negative market
forces - and wherever there is scope for negativity, there it will be applied and the s.p. will suffer
and all the technical preparations like SOX Compliance and Nasdaq will look like a faraway proposition
I note the reduction in NDA's to 5..but maybe the emphasis now is on NDA's actually being negotiated rather than nominally in place
and the same tedium will continue; waiting; dropping share price;
Longs having to sell when their roof falls in.
Hurrah Deephole
great post and how good to see an alias of that
..er...vintage !
I have Sox and Sano etc on Ignore and Hindenburg is
another one. Pitiful.
I have forgotten your other half's alias..SnugasaBug kinda
thing..
But I hope you are both well and better able than I to remember the early days// pioneers of R B...RosesNewYork..
especially the horrors/bashers..like Garzit and Nonamedud ..
who will possibly have invested and jumped on the wagon..
like Sano and Sox etc
" our status as an approved supplier
of pipeline efficiency here in North America....is immensely
attracitve...to Europeans..and Whackywinston as investor nearly mad with
frustration.."
I think that is about right, verbatim
Let's hope Gregg tells the world on Monday about what has made STWA into an
approved supplier.. how can he not ???
yahoo
Changing the timeline
Trans C have changed the timeline, freed themselves of a phase.
The natural focus has become a choice between leasing or buying and this must be based on a desire to get on with it,
I don't see how any further information gained between now and October 15th can compare in significance to what has already been
established and led to these decisions.
Gregg must have a lot of that information which can now be shared with us and a lot of it which means that either leasing or buying is a certainty.
Let's hope there are other nuggets about the other NDA's which can only point in the same direction.
A photograph of an Upstream installation would be the cherry !!
AISI/ Shi 468 and Aug 10
OK..so I got over-excited about that Aug 10 idea - it would have
been a bit odd to discover such a significant deadline at this late date.
Gregg has every reason - and the scope - for ending any kind of
uncertainty about AOT's commercial viability.
It's a guess but he must be as sick of MM's as we are and now he has the chance simply to be consistent with what is obvious to all and to do this without violating any NDA's
There has been increased deployment, reduced testing, and more contracts and the recent publications have been assured and matter of fact about a future which is also greener : the hints about huge applicability across the board accompany these progressions.
8 months is a long time and a first call is itself news-worthy.
There must be a lot of information from across the board/ every part of the Stream which is now worth its weight in gold. With or without the biggest news which becomes more credible in any event.
I wonder if Gregg will be allowed to use any photos ..eg of a new
Upstream application.
I still believe - after 11 years, 5 months, 3 weeks and 2 days (approximately) since my first purchase of shares - that there will be some kind of big new News...
that's my one post for the day
August 10/11 and Shi2468
Your Point 1 was a total surprise to me - where did you get that
date of August 10 as the last day of the NDA? (when STWA is free to
go public?)
I would be very grateful if you could explain.
If that is accurate, wow - surely it is a HUGE clue re Gregg's intentions
and the choice of that date. Which must have some significance news-wise.
Well done for unearthing it..
I don't agree with your Point 3 that Gregg is proven to be someone
who will just repeat himself..
I think he will have been very aware of the criticisms and determined to
counter them with what is correct and substantive :
And this is surely going to mean a Press Release to follow.
I am doing my level best to resist Hope...but it is very
Difficult!!
Pre-recorded on August 11
On reflection, I don't see how it could be otherwise.
Simple Q and A would probably tend towards the chaotic
The policy is to tell us of progress - so surely it is better to
have that clarity and for the whole thing to be un-mediated by a jammed switchboard.
The company knows the shareholder concerns but that does not
mean a live conference call would be able to reveal more
It seems to be that things are loosening up - Don Dickson moves around the map, the 10-15% increase is on the map, along with the
56% decrease in viscosity and the many published statements re AOT's deployment and abilities (which mean that trial periods can be shortened)
It is now OK to talk out loud about AOT as part of the furniture.
So, is it tempting fate too much to guess and hope that STWA is going to give US a real treat ? Not the institutional investors specifically - they get visits from Cecil and now Gregg - but US, the nominated audience of the call ??
It is surely our turn : for us to hear it first and for the first time and in the first conference call ...that would be poetic and commercial justice after many many years of bumping along the
bottom of a penny ocean..
How else to thank us..?
August 11 and AISI
I sure hope you are right about August 11 and your post puts the
case strongly....
Gregg did say these calls would be a feature so I hope he has
decided to use the first to counter an absence of response to
investor frustrations....with some real news, face to face,
that will also then
become a Press Release ..
otherwise we appear to be stuck in the time scale of NDA's and
8K's and so on
we all know what you are talking about
the polite word is nothing
as I am sure your king will know
in more lucid moments (back-stage)
Wish I could buy some more stock
tantalising
maybe some of the sceptics who can afford to post (without investing)
could lend me a few bucks? $10 for every post in the last 6 months ?
could you all have a whip round ? it 's clear you like talking to each
other...however many of you there really are .
Thanks
Screwed the pooch ? (Flubug)
I had not heard that one before !!
No I do not think KM or TC or PRCI or Temple or Wyoming or the
various Government departments (including US Defence)....nor all the
other participants along the way and NDA'd corporations
have done anything to the pooch...other than give him an extremely
juicy bone with the prospect of a whole butcher's shop of them to come
along with
an abundance of fields and land to enjoy...
all those yummy smells !!
Good posts, Alkaline and others
I think a big plus of this recent news is that it diminishes the need for and the hold
of the NDA.
There are now two more independent bodies, totally commercial this time, who will
be available to communicate on a High Street, so to speak, about the qualities of AOT
and other products.
The share price will not be paralysed until an NDA is turned into a contract - because the
other kinds of news will be available - and as the investments also flow in.
So, we have the horse....now where's the cart ??!!
Alkaline.
Sorry for delay. Only allowed one a day.
TC is not doing anything for others/ the industry; risk-wise or otherwise.
Except in the most general terms.
The detailed info gained by the pilot will be proprietary. The other clients
will know only the types of oil involved and that orders are/ not placed.
But if they want to wait and see, that is their business, but nothing to
do with exclusivity between STWA and TC. As I understand it, TC were
quite interested in marketing the AOT which perhaps explains the pilot.
But exclusivity is a serious deal..it can't be unofficial or 'sort of' agreed
in the vague terms you suggest...with 'sort of ' tests and discussions going
on with an entire industry while TC makes up its mind.
I think STWA made clear offers to the first customer but there must have been a
lot of evidence of commercial viability prior to that. It just is non- business sense
to have other large corporations waiting on one, contractually or unofficially.
The delay in my opinion is coming from the lawyers.
Alkaline
How about the AOT being moved so that it can be used
on other types of oil?
One Big Bone : I think you are wrong in your idea that other
operators are waiting for TC before they can make choices.
TC and STWA have no exclusivity. I have checked this with STWA.
Any such exclusivity would be registered as a material event in a
10q or formal document.
TC will get their perks otherwise..ie in the preferable
rates/terms but without any reference re how STWA
negotiates with the rest of the industry.
The picture you convey makes a mockery of
All other NDA's.
We could hear about these negotiations / deals
at any time.
Not wishful thinking. Well, it is in some ways...
but not via Inaccuracy re TC 's overall role.
Waveslave
Thanks for that. That was useful.
I have done so much for you all...but now that good service
must be contained within one post per day. Alas.
I know many of you will be disappointed. Please don't be.
I know you will want to beg me for more ...please don't ...
well, just a little.. go on
Happy Independence Day
Well said DPS, FML, Zerosum et al
To repeat myself, which is The Vogue :
NDA "s (and NDA's which are serious) do not have the capacity
for parallel conversations with the Press or the Market. We must
learn and accept the priorities of real-world negotiations.
No matter how vague a PR might be - it would be undiplomatic and
generally cause problems including distrust.
and if it was sufficietly vague to be diplomatic , it would be pointless.
"Things are going well Upstream" etc.
I think we should - despite massive real-world frustrations in my case-
look on the Bright Side (M P Flying Circus) : the silence = a good sign;
things are indeed serious.
be pointless.
JT - you fail to consider
the realiities of negotiating or doing business with clients wthi whom large and
long term conditions are beng sorted out. in a friendly and co-operative fashion.
My impatience is no less than anyone's - but it has to be a factor that a vendor cannot
turn around to the shareholders at an opportune time and make a press statement, no matter how vague.
It is bad practice. Even if things are going well. It would be presumptive, undiplomatic.
I wish it were not the case that our priorities are not shared.
I hate having to sell, even if it is at a profit.
Hi Waveslave
Er...I don't generally explore the available levels/software to
see who is doing what ...
but whatever the interpretations, it sounds good to me that a
dealer was doing what you reported
Anyway, we've made it to July and Trans Canada is still with us..
MAYBE, just maybe, that end of Monday rise will continue into July -
given a pretty real milestone being passed
more real than anything else on offer !!
Waveslave :
you can see that 27,000 at $1.20 ??
Well said not Dental Floss
There is a lot we could know in general
terms about other negotiations and timings
The void and silence....is ..well, I've never been to the
Grand Canyon ..but sitting around a campfire (with or without
any matches - as the symbol of TC) at its bottom
at midnight..that about sums it up for me..
Hang on (grasping at straws!)
Doesn't it mean nonetheless that Trans Canada have not
taken the option of ending the agreement ?
It is not the MOST significant bit of news but
for all I know (and wish) ..it might give a bit of MEAT
to the trading community
After all, what else have they go to work with
Unless it is information or, sometimes, the lack of it??
This sounds like a Job for Armour
Countdown time. June having 30 days.
Wednesday June 25.....
where are you Armour when we need you ?
End of JUNE
I wonder if that is the kind of detail that the
traders/market are aware of....work with...
why wouldn't they...surely they do...
good one Waveslave
keep it off topic
can't knock the ball around with you right now
Ah yes, is that the same calm
that we get every few weeks, months and years..?
No...it's just a little bit different
with fewer bodies falling off stools in the silence..
most of the survivors having already sunk into a deep
vegetative state.....listening to the calm....the calm
and when the storm comes ???
the shock will kill them
If there was any exclusivity between.
Trans C and STWA, it would have been the subject
of a formal document and there'd be no subject of debate.
There is nothing to stop STWA progressing, likewise
the 9 clients/NDA's
And there is plenty to be done without a pilot - even
Everything required for a contract. It is not an unproven
Product. STWA and the industry have endless proof of itts
working and is
free to use aspects of TC information.
Lawyers can cover any shortfalls or stop gaps re specific
information re specific oils in specific circumstances.
That does not answer my point....
I am asserting that nothing is dependent on TC's
Position other than TC's future
The other Midstreamers are free to move ahead
ANd STWA is not bound into any exclusivity with TC
which prevents that progress
Well, maybe I am being very dumb
BUT that is a lot of guesswork, albeit based on a very
sound idea that it would be unwise to reproduce the same
research across the board : let one company do it.
Yes. Up to a point. That sounds less like guesswork.
But maybe that was just TC's way - rather than them doing it
for the industry as a whole. Either these matters are more private
and proprietary than anything else or they are not.
How can anyone get into an NDA on the basis of anything other than their
own research or own response to what STWA is claiming about AOT re varlous
oils ? It is all or nothing ...not .." well, I am signing a NDA because TC is
leading the way"....
At some point there may be a general reference to TC being first but
what does that mean about nformation being shared ? Why should TC reveal
anything other than the contract ?
Surely TC can only expect a better deal with STWA..for being the first, the
spender of time and money and huge resources.. and that will be a private
matter between STWA and them.
Am I repeating myself ??
OK ...but all the other NDA/Midstreamers
are entitled to know about any relevant obstacles to
progress, surely ?
What would happen if Whacky Oil (midstream division) wanted to get on with it
and was ready to sign ? ie we had enough evidence of good business to be done..
We would have to wait for TC ? for undisclosed reasons
and for an unknown perod of time ??`
It makes no sense....however great the gratitude to the first
customer etc...Any advantages of being first can be agreed between
TC and STWA but not to the detriment of STWA's connections with
Whacky Oil and others..
??
Ok...but it would be in black and white
That T C has this exclusivity
It would be known and discussed
That none of 9 NDA s could be finalised
Until TC is ready
It is NOT in black and white that this was agreed
with TC.
Can you point me to the clause in the agreement?
It can't just be some understanding behind the scenes