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if no crime is committed, no suit will ensue. I never had a gentleman's handshake with Billy, but I own shares. THerefore, my deal is not with him, but with all the entities that govern rules and rights of shareholders, especially minority shareholders.
you are not doing him any favors sir.
Well, that makes a little more sense... but I disagree.
If Billy dies today, my shares still have value because I own a company.
If Billy doesn't honor his word ( or more importantly, the law) then we'll take action.
I disagree that these shares are only as good as BIlly thinks they are. Laws limit his ability to make our shares meaningless/worthless, although all indications from the TRO are that he'd like to do just that.
not accusing, there was a post on this board last night or the day before.. probably deleted by now.
This guy said they gave you a fake number, then you called that day, they pretended to be Billy, and then you came on here that night and posted about it.
I'm not sure if what he said was true or not.. ( It was his first post ever) but surely you can at least understand why people would question.
So again, I am not 'accusing' nor would I. The only 'facts' I have are what you post, and what that guy posted. Unless there is something verifiable and concrete... I have no idea who ( if either to believe)
So... I don't mean to accuse or be offensive... but I simply wish to suggest that if you want to be taken seriously... then find a way to get in touch with Billy and find a way to verify that.. Otherwise, for better or worse, no one seems to believe it.
Frankly, it doesn't help credibility that you're the 2nd largest holder here but you say it's a garbage stock and that we don't actually own what we own.
Either way, have a great weekend!
We know that at least one conversion you had with BIlly was fake, because people gave you a fake # and called you with it.
Put yourself in our shoes. What would you think of this if you were us?
You post a lot but I guarantee you that you'd get better traction from one legit post with real info than these things that are hard to decipher.
Your alleged conversations with Billy 2 years ago are not applicable to anything that's being decided on right now. If you have the ability to get in touch with him, now is the time.
I still don't understand why you own 90m of shares in UOIP if you think we're garbage and don't own anything, but I sure do hesitate to open that can of worms.
What is your guess on how much $ shareholders get from this?
Then we really, REALLY need to chill.
We all want the same thing and it's important to act quickly but not act rashly.
We know that the big holders have the funds ready to hire the absolute best legal help, and we know that ZW more than anyone else here has relationships that could be crucial down the road. If the inventors know of fraud, maybe they can give us tips to help our cause,.... as long as we don't burn those bridges.
Point is. Let's all take a deep breath, let's all acknowledge that 'We' are not the enemy here, and let's not shoot ourselves in the foot by taking frustrations out on each other.
This is an exciting time to be a shareholder!
GL to us all!
We've all got to chill a little bit.
ZW is correct that no one should 'abuse' BIlly. Nothing is gained by threats or whatever. Absolutely should avoid that kind of stuff. Wrong and not in our best interest.
There is nothing wrong with hoping he does the right thing, and ZW has not only talked with Billy in the past, but the inventors as well.. so I respect that he knows things that we don't.
There is an easy middle ground here everyone. Let's take action, assume the worst, but hope for the best. Can't we all agree on that?
my personal opinion.... if BIlly didn't say anything yesterday.. he's not going to say anything today... and if he doesn't say anything today, he won't tomorrow. We absolutely don't want to be sitting around waiting for him, and all of our decisions should be made with the assumption that he will never voluntarily reach out. If he does.. great! Nothing lost except a few bucks, but the many thousands we'd get from the actual settlement would more than offset that!
I agree. We lose nothing taking action.
If it turns out that he was legit all along, I'd feel the least bit bad for trying to protect our interests in the interim.... we could always cancel any legal steps we've taken.
There is no benefit to waiting to see if he'll do the right thing. I don't know what we should do or when we should do it... but ANYTHING that depends on what Billy says or does should be taken out of the equation completely!
Exactly. And.... If we take legal action and then find out a week later that the TRO was a joke and Billy planned to pay us all along and does so... No harm done :)
great summary sir.
I agree wholheartedly and as I posted the other day, if each person gave $75 for every million they own, we get to $25k and that gets our process going.
I expect this $150 to be my most profitable investment ever.
I'd say do whatever you're going to do sooner rather than later. ] A lot of time, money, and stress relief meds could be saved if he somehow intends to make us whole.
THat said.... Based on the TRO, I think it would take more than words from a phone call to prevent action from being taken. He's had plenty of time and chances to respond to shareholders.
If you do talk to him, tell him to please issue a PR stating that UOIP and UOIP alone owns CHanbond, and that he won't get a penny more than what his share % would get him.
Short of that... action needs to be taken by us to protect our interests. If we wait for a reply from him before doing so... we may be waiting a long time.
GOod luck to us!
Address for bloomberg law is help@bloomberglaw.com <help@bloomberglaw.com>;
Wouldn't hurt for many of us to let them know about the TRO.
Calculations on taking action. Hypotheticals
Assuming $25,000 is needed to start
If all holders over 5M shares give a proportional amount ( not including Diedre, jbbb, or gooferball... I included Rob and didn't realize it til later) then that is about 275M shares... which Means that if each of those folks gave $91 per Million shares held, then $25k could be raised. If $50k is needed, it would take about $182 per Million shares from this group.
____
If this is expanded to included everyone who holds over 2M shares, then there are about 335M shares, and so that would require $75 per Million shares held to get to $25,000, or $150 per Million shares held to get to $50,000.
---
If this is expanded to include everyone holding over 1M shares, then it's about 375M shares, and so if everyone gave $67 per 1M shares, that gets to $25k, or $134 per M shares gets to $50k.
________________________
I have no agenda with this, just trying to give everyone a sense of what this would look like if we all contributed our share. I do understand that for time and simplicity's sake the larger holders may want to pursue this on their own.
my hope is that once the legal community sees how absurdly lucrative a win would be, and how ironclad our position is... they will be begging to take this for low fee or on contingency (Though for larger holders, I can see just wanting to pay cash and keep 100%!).
GL to us all!
___
ditto all of this.
Absolutely!
If he is trying anything close to what's in the TRO, that's theft pure and simple, and it's brazen. He may be a smart guy, but Bernie madoff was a smart guy too.
Often I see people get blinded with greed and once they get hooked, they think they can get away with anything.
At least we have the advantage of knowing about this before it happens.
Frankly, I'm surprised that lawyers aren't beating down our door to take this. It's a slam dunk. maybe now that things have 'settled' down we'll get more respect.... but we most certainly have recourse and Im sure Billy will capitulate once we take action.
I doubt he thinks he can win... he's probably just banking on us not trying.
ZW I know you and AJ were in contact with the inventors. Are they aware that we might take action, and are they aware that we think Carter will abscond (is that a word?) with the funds?
I know it's not legally binding or anything, but would love to hear from them about what they think we should do. Surely they have family or friends who invested?
Now that the case is settled, I assume they'd be much more free to discuss this stuff... and give a sense of whether Billy is really going to make us all pay $50k for a lawyer, or if he's going to do the right thing.
Billy could very easily dispel any concern with some contact. I've been a holder over 2 years here and not word one from him.
The only thing we've seen is a TRO, which shows he's going to try to take our money.
If he is legit and intends to pay everyone out, no one here should feel the least bit bad for having doubted that. A simple phone call, PR, filing, etc. could have prevented the hundreds/thousands of hours of work that have taken place and will take place just to try to get our $
I hope it's easy and he intends to pay, but if that's the case, he has done the worst job ever in the history of CEO's in communicating that intent.
Also.. it's certainly possible we get 'something'.... but it will be important to keep an eye on the amount. I doubt he tries to send nothing, but rather a penny or two per share in hopes that we're all happy with that and go away.
how much?
THey really gave us 'Arun' for our money!
you drive fast sir. I used to live in malibu.. the drive to or from Vegas could be hours longer depending on whether it was the beginning or end of the weekend. :)
Forget Vegas.. When it hits 85 cents.. or lets call it a dollar.. Let's just all head up to RI. We should eat at the finest restaurant in W.W. And then for next meal, we should eat at the finest restaurant in E.G and tip extra well. Then no one can say their economy isn't being helped.
you might hold UOIP shares for a living if we get our fair share of this settlement!
Congrats to everyone. Not anywhere close to being done yet, but a huge milestone for sure.
Really do love seeing justice done for the inventors. Sad that they had to wait this long, but glad they have been vindicated and will get to enjoy the fruits of their labor.
Hope we get to enjoy the fruits of our investment!!!
can anyone remind me of the timing here?
We have another day or two and then they deliberate TR or FRI?
thanks!
I think you mean to say:
"......the route you would take IF you're losing an argument...."
:)
I don't think that happens in jury trials like we'd see at the USSC or anything. Other than procedural things, I believe the judge stays out of it.
Hopefully the lack of interest comes from a place of already knowing that they stole our technology :)
It is a strange system we have... that assumes random folks can make decisions about technical issues. I'd be as lost as anyone in there I'm sure..... and I also know I'd get tired sitting there for hours on end.
Hopefully they are all locked in enough to see what happened and make a fair call!!!
100% agree and no offense was taken whether directed at me or not.
Words cannot override what we see in deed and on paper.
I'd be much more excited for 'evidence' to come out of any conversation with him as opposed to any verbal reassurance! :)
Good luck to us all!
Wishful thinking more than anything :)
If there's any information we can get from him... hopefully it's a US Address so we know where to serve papers when the time comes!
So many possibilities here.
It's possible that he doesn't know what we know. Easy to underestimate common holders of a penny stock.
my guess is that once he does realize that we have a sense of what's going on, he'll clam up a little bit.
Is it legal to record conversations in DE without someone's knowledge? maybe we need to get a wire on ZW lol.
I certainly believe we do. It may be a fight, but I have no doubt that we'd get 'something' if we win... Even in ZWs very brief convo with Billy, nothing seemed to indicate otherwise. We may have to take legal action over how much, but we shall see.
It will pick up tomorrow.. I think everyone is resting up :)
Am I correct that we're expecting a verdict Tr/Fri?
Does the jury do damages at the same time as a verdict? Not sure how it all works.
With no experience and nothing to go on, I'm putting a win at 80%. I think it *should* be higher... but anything can happen, so that's my guess.
While we wait... anyone want to go with a different % and give a reason why.
While I agree we 'need' to win the first.. Isn't the evidence actually stronger against the one we actually met with and tried to sell to and then they ghosted us?
Not disagreeing, I just don't know the answer...
Would we not at least continue with that one even if we lost here (Just a hypothetical.. of course we should win).
GLTA!
Whatever verbal answers someone would give are not going to satisfy anyone on either side of the issue. For your answer, you should look to documents and filings. There you will find the answers you seek.
ChanBond isn't a person. What are you asking?
Love it!!!
THe more coverage the better.
Next week should be amazing!
mehhhhh... It works until it doesn't. Hopefully they see past the smooth talk and simply look at the issues for what they are.
I guess it's a good sign that the defense is throwing big $ at the issue.
They're scared, as well they should be.
I imagine some of this is paid for by the other 12. They probably pooled funds together to try to draw a line in the sand on the first. If this doesn't work... they're in trouble because they're giving it their best right now.
And... as we know, the evidence is even stronger with some of the other 12.
I'd like to hear a guess on % chance of approval prior to 7-15.
With no specific knowledge, I'm going to go with 75% chance of approval.
I see a lot of fluff or false arguments against us that shouldn't matter at all. There have been a couple that seem concerning. The definition of 'renewable' seems like it could cause legal delays, and the fact that prominent folks seem against it could cause some delay.
Even with that, I think we've followed the process and that's what ultimately matters.
Any other % guesses as we head into the weekend?
Also.. I think we're priced at a 10-20% chance of approval, so I think there's certainly value even if the value isn't certain :)
GL to us!
Indeed! And I would be offended for you :)
There's a very thin line between trying to 'relate' and trying to manipulate. Hard to say without being there but on paper that one does seem over the top.
Hoping we win on merits and none of this stuff matters... but it's still nice that defense is off to a dubious start with that one.
and on the other side of it... I was a soccer player.. and barely understand any of this!
Even if we get a group of people who are not extreme experts on this stuff... Who's to say that's to our detriment? Sometimes simple and plain talk is best, and we have that on our side, whereas it seems like the defense will try to complicate and confuse.
Hopefully they'll see those attempts for what they are!
Thank you kindly sir! Always get excited to see your posts. I think we're sitting on a gold mine here. Wish I could afford more.
Thanks!
Awesome. A very positive sign indeed. If he will go out to dinner or drinks or whatever with you, it's on us! I'm happy to send some or all of the cash.. Maybe we could avoid a protracted battle if he can see that we know what's going on.