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I'd love to see the Board's reaction when they get these letters...."Oh no, not that one again!".
Oh yes, they have "high value assets" hidden from investors, only known by people thousands of miles away on message boards! Oy vey!
I'm sure they, like me are rolling their eyes about the idle "shareholder lawsuit" threat. Of course, you could hire a law firm and prove me wrong that it's not really an idle threat, but we both know that will never happen. ;) (and so do they!)
The letter will certainly accomplish nothing, as far as the company goes, but it sure is entertaining!
This board is getting good again!
It will be interesting if this letter leads to anything.
I think the challenge with shareholders and FINRA is proving the swap done in 2014 was 1-for-1, as documented in the 2014 annual filing. The newly swapped in asset should have carried the same valuation as the Plantations.
The 1-for-1 value of the newly swapped in asset was not added to the balance sheet in 2015.
The open question for me is why the dividend was completed with a May 15 record date, if it was to capture a 2014 asset swap. I suspect the value is embedded somewhere, possibly as an off balance sheet asset, which they may now be trying to recognize to become fully reporting.
The second question is what else do they have planned. There is a significant cash balance in the company and they wouldn't be spending all the effort to become fully reporting; declare the dividend; and become Pink current if there wasn't a bigger picture at play.
I am excited about what is to come!
In viewof the information that RD has provided the business description should be deleted since it now seems established since it no longer holds true.
RD "We can conclude one thing for certain. Those plantations are gone... Sure thing.
Now, this would truly be a very troubling development for the BOD (and for us) usually... weren't it for the fact that it has probably already been settled. A year ago. Possibly 2 years ago.
And it seems pretty plausible that there is a direct relationship between the preferred shares and the settlement (money). IMO."
What seems a bit strange to me if your interpretation is correct is that the preferred shares were not created before and before the other stock dividend t hat was promised a long tima ago now.
Gansu Yamei Trading, the 100% subsidiary that owns the plantations is now showing the "Ascentage Group" as the 100% shareholder. I don't remember seeing this before.
2) the 2020 report states that he company is out of business
3) HERB doesn't even mention that subsidiary any more in their latest reports.
We can conclude one thing for certain. Those plantations are gone... Sure thing.
Now, this would truly be a very troubling development for the BOD (and for us) usually... weren't it for the fact that it has probably already been settled. A year ago. Possibly 2 years ago.
And it seems pretty plausible that there is a direct relationship between the preferred shares and the settlement (money). IMO.
It's becoming a bit boring now. Next date to watch is May 30, the last day when FINRA can announce the dividend if the ex-date will be June 1. That's how it should be, if the review is completed on time. If not, then the guessing game becomes even more problematic.
And look, they are fully reporting. But they still haven't disclosed Jack chit. Not the plantations. Not Equity Art. And not what the preferred shares are about. And I'm not at all happy about it.
506 shares at .13.....
...did someone say manipulation? sheesh!
That is irrelevant Snow. FINRA is reponsible for orderly markets. That includes longs and shorts. They do not apply a different set of rules for companies that happen to have no shorts.
RD Your reasoning in this case does not impress me. It looks as if this company is now in a scrape that will be difficult to extricate itself from. It may have valuable assets that are not in the books. It looks very difficult to t ransfer those assets to shareholders in a way that is acceptable according to the rules that apply.
RD Being short in this company is hardly a realistic possibility and therefore a poor example.
Here it is. Happened in early 2018.
https://aiqicha.baidu.com/company_detail_99582112265734
Also validates the plantations to some degree. Because the cash (flow) has to come from somewhere. Aandt already confirmed that this is Equity Art in China.
Thanks for the info on Equity Art. I didn't know about the investment.
I agree with your valuations of the Plantations and HERB (existing business).
I posted evidence several times that the company invested RMB 925M (I think it was) in Equity Art in China. So it isn't far-fetched to assume that Equity Art should be worth $200M+. Let's make it $1.50/share.
The plantations $2+ billion.
HERB itself (what they reported) another $200M+
And I don't think Beadswap is worth much.
Ah yeah that makes sense. I figured I was missing something in my late night wonderings.
Well, we will see what happens next. I still think they are putting in a lot of effort here, eventually they will accomplish something.
Food for thought or debate ...
All of the assets, transfers, etc have been outlined in the Financials for shareholders to review. Shareholders are choosing to undervalue the stock. HERB may claim the market unfairly valued the stock if there are any anti-competition claims filed.
We do not know the value of Equity Art because it has yet to be valued (I believe) and is off balance sheet. However, the ratio of the preferred shares 1:10 provides some direction of the value of Equity Art if you assume it is a reflection of the HERB Market Cap : Equity Art value
There should also be consideration for the transfer of GAAT to GY. At the time GAAT was valued at over 2.2B if allowing consideration for the Inventory, Property and Intangible value prior to the transfer. The transfer was supposedly a 1:1 (value for value) as described in the 2015 annual review. GY should be equal value to GAAT or shareholders need to be compensated for the difference if the assets were sold (I believe).
We also don't know the value that Beadswap (Crypto: BEAD) was sold for when BTZI acquired a 50% stake in 2021.
I don't agree. Let's turn it around. Let's assume you are short. And suddenly FINRA announces this dividend with shares redeemable for $5 and the stock rallies to $2 on the news.
The shorts go bankrupt. They sure as hell have a case here against market manipulation. $5 based on what info? What assets? Unaudited. Never disclosed. Remember, HERB is Pink Current, fully reporting.
They can sure as hell sue the company and FINRA.
So this is one of the responsibilities of FINRA. Orderly markets. Prevent and act against market manipulation.
RD To me it looks worse market manipulation if there is an ex-date regarding a very valuable issue of preferred stock and the market is not informed about the value of the preferred stock. This means that some shareholders may sell their shares not knowing that they lose a very valuable stock dividend.
The weird part is they haven't told us anything. Sure, they said they are issuing preferred shares as a dividend. At least it's something.lol.
It could all have something to do with the fact that the assets (plantations) haven't been disclosed yet. So if they tell us now that the preferred shares are worth billions, it could sure as hell be seen as market manipulation. Because nobody knows for sure what it is worth. Or let's say they plan to redeem the shares 3 months from now (fixed date) for $5 share. How can the stock not rally on this? How can this not be seen as market manipulation? lol
So I'm really curious how this plays out. And when we will get more info.
I wouldn't be suprised either if FINRA lets the review go past the pay-date, deliberately... quietly... so that there will be no ex-date. So that in the end there will be no impact on the share price at all.
Could it be that this does not go through FINRA at all?
Here is an example that may or may not be relevant... I am not a dividend expert.
GASS - Stealthgas did a spinoff and issued common shares and preferred shares to all shareholders. It does not appear on FINRA, but looks to have been successfully completed.
https://www.stealthgas.com/investor-relations-mainmenu-99/401-stealthgas-inc-announces-record-date-for-distribution-of-imperial-petroleum-inc-shares-for-spin-off-of-tanker-vessels.html
https://www.globenewswire.com/news-release/2021/12/06/2346672/9952/en/STEALTHGAS-INC-Announces-Completion-of-Spin-Off-of-Imperial-Petroleum-Inc.html
I have checked the past 10 years on the FINRA daily list. Not one company that issued preferred stock as a dividend to their shareholders.
I did find a few that paid preferred dividend shares etc. to already existing preferred shareholders.
And I found 9 redemptions. Only 1 in the last 5 years. Where shareholders get paid in cash.
Lots of liquidation distributions/bankruptcies on OTC though
There is a crucial difference between the two dividends.
The art spin-off is stock in a new company. And the regulators don't like it when people start selling those shares. Which is why they are often restricted.
But the preferred shares are shares of the same company. And we can't sell them. It is much the same as a regular stock dividend. Except, we don't know yet what to expect. But FINRA shouldn't give us a hard time on this dividend.
The company probably did well not to disclose anything. Any statement about the value of the dividends and the stock could rally, which could easily be seen as market manipulation by the regulators. Kind of what Elon Musk is doing with his tweets. Blatant market manipulation He'll probably get another $20M fine for it. lol.
The chart certainly looks good. We'll probably trade in the 0.15 - 0.25 range until we get more clarity.
People who buy now can not be certain that they will qualify for the dividend (and the dividend could be "everything"). Not if FINRA needs more than 2 weeks to complete the review process. Which is certainly a possibility. Because then there will be no ex-date and they will use the record date to determine who qualifies. Ugh, but true.
Also interesting, the 30% nasdaq drop had zero effect on this stock. The woes in China had zero effect on this stock.
So now we wait, and play the guessing game.
If we hear nothing today then we have to assume that the distribution is going ahead as planned.
Which makes it a >25% distribution.
Which means the ex-date will be one day after the pay-date.
It's just so weird that they are not telling us anything. I think the reason is, because the assets have not been reported. This applies to the art as well as to the plantations. So any statement that hints about value is probably prohibited. Either way, we will probably learn a few things here in the near future about what is going on.
Fingers cross for good news for the Loyal Longs!
I won’t go to the 52 week high, but .259 is pretty fuken close
Nothing better than chasing a Chinese company on a Friday with the atmosphere in the markets right now! Lol
Leaches. $0.20 or $0.25, it won't matter much when we expect to get $10 out of it.
Good luck.
They've done that many times to me as well. Someone who wants to make $$$ is controlling the flow.
They just went around my .23 fukers, they gave 5,000 @23 to someone else
I think Pauly is hitting 0.23 now. Smart move.
LOL. Been watching the BID move up slowly all day 0.12 .... 0.14 ... 0.17.
No one is going to sell into the BID the last business day before record date.
Let me say this again. After today, you simply cannot be certain anymore that you will qualify for the dividend. So get your bids in at $0.20. Cheap bastards.
You have the floor....
Anyone who buys stock today, will have a 99% probability that he qualifies for the dividend. After today, it will drop below 90%.
That's the HERB reality for you in simple terms.
Ameritrade reacted even faster than I had imagined lol. The stock is tradeable again.
The record date is May 15 per the 8K released on 04-15-2022.
https://www.otcmarkets.com/filing/html?id=15733105&guid=duKwkpe8vNEnzrh
Agreed, that would be the best solution. Not even sure if Ameritrade reacts so fast that the stock is tradeable again today or only early next week.
You would almost hope for a new record date on June 15. So they can do what they have to do first (file a form 10 or settle with parent, I have no idea).
That would be the best scenario for us, even if it means a 4th cancellation. So lets hope for that today, after hours.
Amazing, never thought they would react to that within hours. Good stuff for one.
Divi no idea, need to wait for official advice and FINRA documentation I guess.
What do you know.... HERB is Pink Current already.
Any thoughts about the dividend?
I don't think we have many drivers that can take the stock higher.
Here is the tricky part.
Finra hasn't announced anything yet.
So you would think you still qualify for the dividend if you buy now, right? Wrong!
If Finra's review goes past the pay-date of May 31 and is approved, there will be no ex-date and they will use the record date as the cut-off date. But only if the review goes past the pay-date.
I told you... the whole thing is rotten to the core.
And what does it mean if they use the record date? Can you still buy and qualify if you buy today? Possibly or probably, because there will be no ex-date.in that case
Interesting, eh.
Today would be the ex-date for regular dividends.
It's not happening.
Put that bottle of champaign back in the closet.
The stock will be punished for it and drop to $0.10
If this were any other company, the only and obvious conclusion would be that they have been playing us all along.
At least they have a securities counsel in the US now. They didn't have that a year ago IMO which was the reason for the first 2 or 3 screw-ups.
They're operating a very profitable business. They're executing on filings. These are all big steps.
I can't speak to the nitty gritty about the Dividend but am trusting they will get it to the finish line based on the volume of recent company activity.
There are only 2 options after today (because FINRA hasn't announced anything yet)
1) The dividend will be delayed and the company has to set a new record date
2) FINRA has determined that the dividend is (or could be) worth more than 25% of the market cap.
Either way, it's not going to be pretty. The guessing game starts all over again. And the company still hasn't given us any information either. And we are all so tired of this (nonsense).
Yasheng is executing where they need to on OTC requirements and Operations. Lets see if they deliver on the Dividend. Hopefully it accounts for the $B's of value in the Plantations.
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