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Renaissance

03/07/13 1:40 PM

#144628 RE: runandadd #144627

In a situation like that, I beleive we should use the solution that leads to the least amount of collateral damage. This is a term that I do not think was used at all yesterday. Hostages? Maybe. It all depends on the operation, suroundings, etc. Timothy Mcveigh on the drive over to plant the van? I dont think I have too much of a problem with that.

WarpCore61

03/07/13 1:54 PM

#144630 RE: runandadd #144627

I don't believe this issue can be rationalized by dreaming up a scenario where a wacko is killing hostages. One can use that exact same scenario in their argument to ban all citizen ownership of guns. This issue is with the government's assault on the Bill of Rights, where you and I as American citizens have a right to due process and a trial before being convicted and sentenced for a crime. In the case of drone use, you can be found guilty and executed by the government with no protection whatsoever.

Rand Paul is simply trying to get Obama and his administration to definitively state these drones won't be used against American citizens on U.S. soil, thereby violating the Bill of Rights... and they won't commit to that, and certainly won't approve legislation prohibiting such use. I wonder why?

No one has an issue with law enforcement taking action against a wacko killing hostages, because such action is VERY public and the actions will be scrutinized and those responsible for the decisions held accountable. It's a far different scenario where the attack occurs from afar, where the invisible drone might be many miles away, or even above the clouds. If someone is is killed while in their house or automobile by a drone-launched missile, this can easily be attributed to a natural gas leak in the house or even passed off as a mob hit, where our government quietly lets the news media run with the fabricated story, and the public never learns the truth.

The Obama administration seems hell bent on destroying anyone who doesn't agree with them or supports their agenda. Look at what they're doing with one of the most respected journalists in our lifetime, Bob Woodward. Remember the guy in the St. Louis airport who was working for the Ron Paul campaign? He stated some of those in the independent movement had been placed on government watch lists. I don't think it too far fetched to believe someone considered disruptive to such government because they're speaking out and resisting these policies could find themselves classified as a terrorist suspect, and with the Patriot Act in place, that can essentially remove your rights to due process under the law. And with the capability of drone strikes against those classified as terrorists on U.S. soil, it becomes a scary scenario.

I understand drone use in some circumstances in other countries, when military intervention might not achieve the desired results, and where our laws don't apply. But to avoid legislation that prevents such acts against our own citizens on U.S. soil is clearly the beginning of the end of our Bill of Rights as American citizens, in my opinion.

Sorry, Mr. President, but I don't believe you when you state you have no intention of conducting these strikes against our citizens. You seem to have a very short memory. You initiated the sequester legislation last year when the government faced shutdown due to the approaching debt ceiling, remember? Now your own statements blame the Republicans for this legislation that you created, and our wonderful media doesn't even hold you accountable for this lie. I simply don't trust you, Mr. President. I want to see legislation that prevents drone attacks on U.S. soil, so we can at least hold you accountable if this occurs under your watch. I applaud Rand Paul for taking this stand. What's disappointing is that few others stepped up to join him.

Personally, I want police and SWAT teams taking out a wacko, not a drone missile. At least that way we have the option of NOT killing all the remaining hostages along with the wacko.

hogman_5

03/07/13 2:15 PM

#144637 RE: runandadd #144627

A drone can't make an arrest...

ken w

03/07/13 2:18 PM

#144639 RE: runandadd #144627

Sorry but I think you miss the entire point. It sounds logical to take out a 'confirmed citizen' terrorist on US soil that poses a possible threat right? Only problem is that the Government, giving sole power to any one person or executive branch to make such decisions is against the Constitution and illegal. It's the argument that those who give up liberty for security get neither. The government could suspect you are a 'possible' terrorist and arbitrarily 'take you out' because one person decides you are an extremist or pose a possible threat to the nation, ie a citizen on US soil that's undesirable. Very dangerous argument. Suppose you disagree with the Obama or any administration over an issue like gun control, which is taking away your God given right to defend yourself. You could then be considered by a single person to be a threat to the nation and eliminated. The Constitution has specific rules for the nation that are very plain. Remember Ruby Ridge, Waco, etc? Government running wild against American citizens that deserved at least a trial prior to being executed. This is how rogue governments act - time to re read the Constitution. If a person doesn't like the Constitution then change it or move to a place like Venezuela where Dictatorships rule. Rand Paul along with Ted Cruz believe in the Constitution and they are giving a class to Congress on the rules provided to be a free society. Everyone should listen to the discussion and be reeducated on the principles that protect us all from oppressive and tyrannical governments. And this argument is not about something as mundane as the 'dislike' of paying taxes - it's about our individual liberties and the Constitutional protections provided for every single American citizen, the good, the bad, and the ugly. And if WSGI is working with DHS to allow drone strikes on US soil against any American citizen not afforded the right of trial, I will dump my shares held for over 8 years, period. It's not all about money - it's about the survival of our Republic.