Replies to post #169213 on Plastic2Oil Inc (PTOI)

[arvitar]

LOL! Dead wrong. It is a civil suit. Because it is a civil suit, the SEC doesn't need to "prove" a whole hell of a lot of anything to have Bordynuik disgorge his ill-gotten gains.

"The standard of proof in a civil lawsuit is significantly easier to satisfy than the “beyond a reasonable doubt” standard of a criminal case. In a civil lawsuit, the case must be proved by a “preponderance of the evidence,” that is, by enough evidence to conclude that it is more likely than not that the victim’s claims are true"

http://www.crimevictimlaw.com/civil/claw.html

[loanranger]

"Here's the first random example I found via Google of a "private placement" fraud allegation from the SEC."

Talk about coincidences. It was a random example the last time you found the exact same example, too!:

"Here's a random example I found of blatant private placement fraud (the real kind, not the media kind).
Total "ill-gotten" gain given back including interest? Comes out to 8.3% of the private placement:

http://sec.gov/litigation/litreleases/2011/lr21808.htm "
http://investorshub.advfn.com/boards/read_msg.aspx?message_id=70579218


I responded to it at that point and never heard back. May as well just copy and paste.....your attempt to make your point by providing only a piece of the story hasn't changed:

"Here's where your 8.3% came from:
"the companies raised approximately $2.9 million through offerings"
"Nyce consented to a permanent injunction, and will pay $242,339 in disgorgement and prejudgment interest,"
($242K/$2.9M = 8.3%)

What happened to the rest of that sentence?
" and a $65,000 civil money penalty. Petitti consented to a permanent injunction and will pay a $25,000 civil money penalty."
And the entire previous sentence regarding the rest of the defendants?
"Petroleum Unlimited, Petroleum Unlimited II, and Kimmel, have consented to permanent injunctions and will pay disgorgement plus prejudgment interest, and civil money penalties in amounts to be determined by the court at a later date.""


That said, defining "illgotten gains" and quantifying disgorgement amounts can be complicated and I don't think that there is any point at all in guessing where this is going in that regard.

[wEaReLeGiOn]

Completely and utterly dead wrong- I couldn't care less about random samples, the evidence against Bordyniuk and Baldwin is more than enough to shut this company down for good.

Just like JBII would be trading on the AMEX 3 years ago, Completely and utterly dead wrong-

this is a civil lawsuit so in order to sue for "illgotten gains" they have to prove those "gains" were "illgotten"