Home > Boards > US Listed > Computers - Semiconductors > Intel (INTC)

Re: Looks like processing variation is not well

Public Reply | Private Reply | Keep | Last ReadPost New MsgReplies (1) | Next 10 | Previous | Next
wbmw Member Profile
Member Level 
Followed By 28
Posts 26,118
Boards Moderated 0
Alias Born 09/11/02
160x600 placeholder
Intel on Track for Lowest Close Since December 2020 -- Data Talk Dow Jones News - 1/28/2022 11:45:00 AM
Analysts Conflicted on These Technology Names: Intel (INTC) and Teradyne (TER) TipRanks - 1/27/2022 4:15:29 PM
Analysts Have Conflicting Sentiments on These Technology Companies: Boeing (BA) and Intel (INTC) TipRanks - 1/27/2022 3:55:20 PM
Goldman Sachs Sticks to Its Sell Rating for Intel (INTC) TipRanks - 1/27/2022 12:10:49 PM
Intel Beat Expectations, but Lowered Guidance TipRanks - 1/27/2022 10:40:33 AM
Analysts Offer Insights on Technology Companies: Hexcel (HXL), Intel (INTC) and Qualtrics International (XM) TipRanks - 1/27/2022 8:35:48 AM
Intel's turnaround is working, but more time is needed to 'flex its spending power' Seeking Alpha - 1/27/2022 8:19:20 AM
Intel price target cut at Citi as guidance hurt on heavy investment, PC correction Seeking Alpha - 1/27/2022 7:16:09 AM
Analysts Are Bullish on Top Technology Stocks: Boeing (BA), Calix (CALX) TipRanks - 1/27/2022 6:25:17 AM
Intel: Upbeat Q4 Results; Disappointing Q1 Earnings Forecast TipRanks - 1/27/2022 6:22:17 AM
Annual Report (10-k) Edgar (US Regulatory) - 1/27/2022 6:08:28 AM
Notice of Iran-related Disclosure Filed Pursuant to Section 13(r)(3) of the Exchange Act (irannotice) Edgar (US Regulatory) - 1/27/2022 6:02:48 AM
Intel (INTC) Receives a Rating Update from a Top Analyst TipRanks - 1/27/2022 5:56:55 AM
Intel Wins Big As EU Court Scraps $1.2 Billion Antitrust Fine – Report TipRanks - 1/27/2022 3:46:22 AM
Analysts Offer Insights on Technology Companies: Intel (INTC) and Seagate Tech (STX) TipRanks - 1/27/2022 1:55:11 AM
Intel (INTC) Receives a Hold from Mizuho Securities TipRanks - 1/26/2022 11:30:29 PM
Intel CEO Gelsinger says product constraints to continue into 2023 Seeking Alpha - 1/26/2022 5:52:46 PM
Intel drops 4% despite Q4 results beating expectations Seeking Alpha - 1/26/2022 4:18:15 PM
Intel raises dividend by 5% to $0.365 Seeking Alpha - 1/26/2022 4:05:57 PM
Intel Non-GAAP EPS of $1.09 beats by $0.18, revenue of $19.5B beats by $1.14B Seeking Alpha - 1/26/2022 4:04:14 PM
Intel wins appeal of $1.2B fine from EU antitrust regulator Seeking Alpha - 1/26/2022 8:58:17 AM
Intel (INTC) Receives a Rating Update from a Top Analyst TipRanks - 1/26/2022 7:27:12 AM
Intel Wins Appeal of Decade-Old EU Fine Dow Jones News - 1/26/2022 5:44:00 AM
A Peek Into The Markets: US Stock Futures Gain; Fed Policy Decision In Focus Benzinga - 1/26/2022 5:16:30 AM
Intel's results come as chip giant faces a year of challenges Seeking Alpha - 1/24/2022 7:10:00 AM
wbmw Member Level  Wednesday, 07/18/07 03:35:25 PM
Re: chipguy post# 45792
Post # of 151380 
Re: Looks like processing variation is not well
controlled in AMD's 65 nm process. Sucks to be AMD
when it tries to ramp its naive quad cores with far more
logic transistor on-die. Pity it can't match up low and
high leakage devices in MCMs to reduce TDP variation
at the socket level. Oh well...


There are other interesting things as well. Notice how high they have to keep on ratcheting up the voltage in order to hit higher frequencies. They seem to need as high as 1.3V for 1.9GHz, 1.325V for 2.3GHz, and 1.35V for 2.5GHz. It looks like their BE-2000 series parts are lower voltage than this, which enables the 45W TDP, but they can only reach 2.1GHz today....

Moreover, their leakage seems to triple with only 200mV. That's a really thin window. Obviously, they can't reach their clock frequency targets at 1.1V, but leakage starts to explode above 1.3V. It's a catch-22! For their 3600+ chip, 65% of the TDP power comes from leakage! The 'Droids are disillusioned if they think that SOI has given AMD a free pass in this area.

And by the way, I agree that an MCM approach to quad core would have been better for them, because they could have mixed low leakage and high leakage parts. You have been saying this for a long time, but now you can point to some numbers.

Let's say you combined two of these cores to form a hypothetical quad core Brisbane. Based on the figures below, you might end up with a part with 33.2A current draw at 1.35V, and another one with 64.4A current draw at 1.3V. And unlike a quad core Brisbane, Barcelona will have even more of these power hungry transistors. How will AMD be able to release a 1.9GHz Barcelona (equivalent frequency to the 3600+) at 68W TDP and 2.1GHz Barcelona at 95W TDP with this kind of process variation? The yields will be terrible, and they'll be forced to throw out a good percentage of their parts.

Suddenly, all of AMD's roadmap problems are crystal clear to me....

I think it will be very interesting to see how long it will take AMD to solve these problems. Unless they completely overhaul their 65nm process, I can't see how they can to it. You can't modify the design to fix this. No amount of power management can fix the amount of leakage while active....

Public Reply | Private Reply | Keep | Last ReadPost New MsgReplies (1) | Next 10 | Previous | Next
Follow Board Follow Board Keyboard Shortcuts Report TOS Violation
X
Current Price
Change
Volume
Detailed Quote - Discussion Board
Intraday Chart
+/- to Watchlist
Consent Preferences