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Be sure that soon enough they'll repost the same BS without fail while never addressing the fact that's it's not true.
Quote: "WMIH needs to issue new Preferred shares to TPS and P escrow holders to realign preferred holders with their ABS Trusts."
Flat out false nonsense that is constantly peddled here. WMI Preferred stock (PQ + KQ) were NEVER aligned with any Trusts. The TPS were backed by Trust assets but those went to JPM when the exchange event occurred as stated in the POR. Just read the PQ or KQ Prospectus since it's all laid out in plain English.
Do you know whether Subordinated Note claims against the FDIC are on par with Equity, or are they sandwiched between Senior Note claims and Equity in terms of payment priority???
Quote: "The Receiver anticipates that it will make a final distribution at a later date. It is unlikely that the Receiver will have sufficient funds to distribute to holders of receivership certificates issued to WAMU subordinate note holders or equity holders."
Honestly AZ, the only confusing posts are yours as i'm sure many here will agree, most times they don't have a clue about what you post. Why is that???
Yet again an attempt to alter the docs to suit a particular argument. WMIH received the equity interests in WMMRC but not it's assets, just like WMIIC. The run-off portfolio was valued at ~$140M which was virtually all pledged to the LT for payment to Run-off Notes (Piers), with any excess going to WMIH. They have no new business with only the existing portfolio being liquidated and distributed...NO BILLIONS left!
Quote: "The plan provides that Reorganized WMI (1) will receive $75 million, (2) is valued at $210 million (before it receives the $75 million), which includes $140 million for WMMRC."
I honestly don't get how they expect distributions will be made to our Markers. Unless we can be paid directly from the FDIC, there's no other entity other than the LT that can make those distributions....via LTI's!!!
WMILT 2012 MOR
Quote: "If distributions from the WMI Liquidating Trust become available to creditors and equity interest holders who currently do not have LTI's, additional LTI's will be issued to effectuate future distributions."
That's the point I tried to make to AT, that there had to be knowledge that more cash was available to the LT. That's one plausible reason why JMW allowed this farcical delay over a clear case against the employees. The only other reason I can see is that she turned a blind eye to counsel blatantly milking the estate. Based on her original demeanor towards this case and equity, I find the latter to be less credible.
The runoff portfolio of WMMRC was not in the billions but was valued at ~$130M. This has been used to pay Piers as agreed to in the POR. Any remaining value goes to WMIH, and then WMMRC will be dissolved with zero run-off assets. Read the POR and the LT's subsequent filings, it's in there.
Not all that cash was spent on the Employee Claims issue. There was also the Tax litigation, A+M's fees, Grant Thornton lawsuit etc. That's if that $233M figure is even accurate, which I don't, I was just quoting AT's claim.
You're failing to recognize that there are other factors holding up resolution, namely and more importantly the ongoing Receivership and the Bankruptcy which are still unresolved.
Using your logic the $67M could have been paid or the claims dismissed long ago but instead used to prolong the inevitable...why is that???
Any SH assets will be held at the FDIC (Receivership issue) or Entities controlled by the LT (Bankruptcy issue) so either way those processes need to be resolved.
We know that there are still issues regarding the FDIC to be resolved and also the bankruptcy so delaying the last impediment to Escrow payment would make sense.
The DB issue was only resolved in late 2017 after filing the lawsuit in 2008...yes 2008!!! The assets, if there, are mortgage based and are therefore still active or have matured leaving loads of cash.
You don't spend $233M to preserve $67M if cash is that limited, that indicates there's a possibility much more available.
The fact that this decision will free up $67M is indeed not a HUGE deal, it's the fact that it will enable the process to move forward. We would finally know if all our suspicions about Safe Harbor assets are true or not. That imo is the real significance of these motions.
Yes it definitely lay out a path for this saga to finally become resolved. I believe the chances that the motion to dismiss Employee Claims will be granted is 90%+. The FDIC's regulations will not be skirted to allow these payments to be made.
This is actually really good news in that, IF, the LT's motions are granted Piers could be finally paid off leaving the door open for distributions to be made to our Markers (via LTI's). We could finally see if there was anything really substantial hidden behind the "curtains" after all.
The info was never updated online and some of it is just wrong.
Don't worry, soon enough a certain poster will see an article about them raising billions for their own use and instantly it will all miraculously become ours, just like Royal Bank of Scotland's capital raises....LOL
And companies that have nothing to do with us raising cash, as they routinely do, helps our Markers how exactly??? Just asking.
I also ~ Remember', Releases Submitted Did Not Involve KKR, Fortress, CT, Softbank and many others ~ who now own 80% of WMIH.
Comprehension???
I keep seeing the claim being made that..."~ There Simply Are No More WMI-LT’, ... LTI’s ... That Are Going To Be Issued to Tranche 6 participants"
The LT has ~$100M left, IF, as is likely to happen the Employee Claims are dismissed which would ensure that Piers can be paid in full,..by what mechanism will the excess $50M-$70M be distributed to Tranche 6 participants???
Quote: "Remember', Releases Submitted Did Not Involve the WMI-LT ~"
I also ~ Remember', Releases Submitted Did Not Involve KKR, Fortress, CT, Softbank and many others ~ who now own 80% of WMIH.
Still trying to figure out exactly what you're inferring!
1,194,340,178 of 1.705B (70%) common shares provided releases.
With the likely application of the NOLS since the completion of the merger, what kind of pps increase do you foresee for the WMIH?
When is the next quarterly report due?
He's 100% correct BOB. If way more than $10B comes back, say $32B, under APR Commons receive much more than Preferred, but with 75%/25% they lose $14B to Preferred....again, comprehension issues!
1) If $8B came back using APR Preferred gets all $8B and Commons would receive $0.00, with the 75%/25% Preferred gets $6B and Common $2B.
2) With $12B and APR, Preferred gets $10B (face value) and Commons receive $2B, with 75%/25% Preferred gets $9B and Commons $3B.
3) If $32B returns using APR Preferred get $10B and Commons $22B, with 75%/25% Preferred gets $24B and Commons get $8B.
Quote: "So please explain to us all WHY the preferd holders again should be upset here OK!!!!!!!!!!!!"
How did you come to that conclusion from what he posted??? As far as I've seen he's always claimed to own Preferred and Piers.
Paraphrased, below states that if an asset is legally "transferred" by the transferor or a consolidated affiliate, it is deemed isolated even if they are subject to bankruptcy law.
That certainly doesn't seem to state that Safe Harbor is a totally bankruptcy remote process!!!
Quote: "A transfer of a financial asset, a group of financial assets, or a participating interest in an individual financial asset (which are referred to collectively in this Statement as transferred financial assets) is considered to have isolated the transferred financial assets only if a legal analysis would support the following conclusions under the laws in the applicable jurisdiction:
b. In the event of bankruptcy, receivership, or other insolvency of the transferor or any consolidated affiliate of the transferor that is not a bankruptcy-remote entity, the transferred asset would not be deemed to be part of the estate of the transferor or its consolidated affiliate."
Over and over with the same garbage while completely ignoring what the LT themselves stated what their mechanism is. I wonder why it's never truthfully addressed. The excuses are beyond silly.
I can just see IR rolling their collective eyes every time they receive these types of WMI based questions.
Which of these two sentences are the same, take your time!!!
1) I usually walk, run OR take a taxi daily
2) I usually walk, run AND take a taxi daily
3) a mechanism to Liquidate, Convert to Cash AND Distribute LT Assets
"Stocks are CASH"......let that sink in. If you were making a valid point then fine, but you're not. Just twisting and totally ignoring what the LT's mandate was. If you chose to stick with this nonsensical idea, by all means do continue. This has become tedious and unproductive.
I think my line of questioning may seem to indicate that I believe ""Escrows"" are not the owners of any WMI Safe Harbor assets.
This I assure is definitely not the case as I have been adamant for years of that very fact.
What I seek to understand is how would those Safe Harbor assets be totally unaffected by bankruptcy decisions that directly impact the distribution of those assets.
As I stated, no PSA could envision this scenario where Equity was cancelled and reissued as Equity interests with a 75%/25% distribution ratio.
It just doesn't seem possible that the PSA could make distributions based on conditions that no longer legally exist.
So the market valued $26B-$30B in Available for sale securities cited in WAMU's June 2008 Form 10Q were ""sold" to JPM even though most were MBS's not owned directly by WMB??? In addition the FDIC logged ~$26B in unrecorded assets as of Dec. 31, 2008 in it's Statement of assets in liquidation??? But as you said, "nothing to see here"!
Quote: "Stocks are CASH",....weren't they just liquid??? LOLOL
That was priceless!!! May I suggest while making your next purchase that you present a stock certificate in lieu of cash and note the outcome.
Absolutely unbelievable!!!!!
For that statement to mean what you claim it does it should have read..."to serve as a mechanism for liquidating, converting to Cash OR distributing the Liquidating Trust Assets..." Your premise makes no sense when the statement is taken in totality. Again read what was stated, shares being liquid is irrelevant when taken in context of the LT's mandate. It's basic English!
Liquidate (1): close down · wind up · put into liquidation · dissolve · break up · disband · terminate
(2): convert to cash · convert · cash · cash in · sell off · sell up
Convert to Cash: self explanatory!!!
Distribute: give out· issue · dispense · administer · pass round · dole out · allocate · allot · apportion · issue · hand out · deliver · convey · transmit
From the above definitions the LT stated, "to serve as a mechanism for winding up, converting to cash and allocating the LT Assets".
Hypothetical?...seriously??? There's nothing "hypothetical" about it, it's written in plain English. I kind of have a problem when facts are ignored or twisted to support silly theories.
That is correct Dm but as far as the bankruptcy goes this will not be an issue once all Creditors, ie Piers, are paid in full.
The purpose of Safe Harbor being bankruptcy remote is to prevent Creditors or the Debtor from selling off the Debtor's assets to pay claims.
In our case the Creditors are 99%+ paid off already therefore the major threat to any Safe Harbor assets and their investors has now passed.
The delay imo is that the bankruptcy must be officially closed to resume payments to WMI for any beneficial interests they held.
If I remember correctly, bankruptcies can lead to the suspension of distributions to the Debtor or in some cases investors for certain investments until the case is resolved.
If the PSA's state that in the event of a bankruptcy or receivership that Preferred stock must be paid in full, and once paid ALL leftovers are to be distributed to Common stock.
How would that work when we know the bankruptcy POR 7 cancelled all Preferred and Common stock interests and documents back in 2012???
In that case wouldn't it mean that non-releasing Common and Preferred shareholders would also be entitled to share in these distributions since Safe Harbor assets are bankruptcy remote???
Also, if POR 7 had eliminated all Equity, as in most bankruptcies, would we still be compensated when Safe Harbor assets were returned, as the PSA's stated???
You seem to not understand what the LT stated in the highlighted text below so allow me to translate....The illiquid assets will be liquidated and converted into CASH before it's distributed to our Markers. Whether stocks are liquid is not the issue, they told us what the assets would be converted into....CASH!!! Seems the S4V theorists keep conveniently ignoring that.
1.2 Purpose of Liquidating Trust. The sole purpose of the Liquidating Trust is to implement the Plan on behalf, and for the benefit, of the Liquidating Trust Beneficiaries, and to serve as a mechanism for liquidating, converting to Cash and distributing the Liquidating Trust Assets in accordance with Treasury Regulations section 301.7701-4(d), with no objective to continue or engage in the conduct of a trade or business, except to the extent reasonably necessary to, and consistent with, the liquidating purpose of the Liquidating Trust.
Quote: "Assets outside the BK case (safe harbored MBS Trusts beneficial interests): residual assets will be distributed according to the individual PSA (Pooling and Servicing Agreements) of each MBS Trust."
Have you ever come across a PSA that specifies how Trust payments would be treated in the event of a bankruptcy or receivership of the Originator/Depositor?
Not sure how a PSA written years before the bankruptcy/receivership occurred could predict the cancellation of WMI's stock and thus determine how residuals would be distributed.
Read the WMILT's mandate again....it states they will Liquidate to CASH, NOT SHARES. How much simpler did they need to state that so it could be understood?
Do you agree with ron's assertion that the FDIC cannot destroy records of an institution which it places into Receivership???
2) Do you also agree that WMB became a "true sale" (LOL) so there are no "Golden Parachute" issues re the WMILT and the FDIC???
NOTE: Read itsmyoption's post and it seems to indicate that the FDIC rule was amended so that the records must be kept no less than 6 years after the end of a receivership. That means WMB's records can only be destroyed after Sep. 24, 2024. So instead of destruction of records after the 10 yr anniversary of being placed into receivership (Sep. 24, 2018), the timeline is now 16 yrs.
That being the case, what is the eventual % ownership of WMIH by former NSM shareholders? It was supposed to be 36% but obviously it's much lower now or was the deficit made up by the other NSM holders?
Edit: Ok thanks, got it. Now back to not paying any attention to WMIH Corp. for the time being!...LOL
Unless we were sold out by the Debtors and the EC counsels back in 2011-2012 imo this will not impact us.
The POR was negotiated between the parties and as such the FDIC must fulfill it's pledges in that agreement.
The validity of the releases they received depend on them following every pledge made in the POR.
POR Section 1.183...pg 23
Quote: "provided, however, that “Released Claims” does not include....(2) any and all claims held by Entities against WMB, the Receivership and the FDIC Receiver solely with respect to the Receivership, and"