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Maybe. CH hinted that there might be one more Chinese fire-drill after the August 15th "ultimatum". If he runs one, I definitely want to see it.
Nobody "injects" value into a revoked, worthless shell.
They're both dead shares walking.
You claimed I was clueless about what happened at Washington Mutual.
The Plan of Reorganization, while much more elaborate than Corus Bankshares', would still seem to be relatively straight-forward in terms of which classes of claims received what. And the "R"'s do appear to have been the sweet spot in that re-org. Are you saying otherwise?
The brokers aren't preventing him from filing a 10-12G.
Are you saying that their 7th Plan of Reorganization didn't go into effect?
I can't tell if you're complaining about the WAMPQ's or not. The "R"'s appear to be where the real sweet spot in the Washington Mutual bankruptcy was. Last trade prior to the re-org was $2.82 and now an old WAMPQ is worth nearly $10 in new WMIH shares.
Interestingly, even the old Washington Mutual got a token amount of new equity. However, this was spelled out in the plan of reorganization, not something that was created or added after the fact.
I suspect there are some people who might be interested in the best way to approach a bank holding company that enters Chapter 11 in the future.
Of a bankrupted company where the old equity was wiped out upon emergence?
I'd love to see an example of that.
The cancellation of the old Corus Bankshares equity is not an "opinion". It is a fact. It did occur.
That is PRECISELY the correct way to go about it. Take the tax loss for 2011 and then IF, by some bizarre stroke of good fortune, anything ever comes back, then you treat it as a new holding with a zero cost basis. And, yes, you CAN still take the tax loss now and still have the position if it's ever reincarnated.
So why'd you give me so much grief over telling people about the Form 1040-X up to now?
Relax. It's just another jerk-around.
The old common stockholders aren't the only ones who have an interest in a bankruptcy filing. If there are impaired claims that can recover more of their losses from a reorganization (Chapter 11) instead of a liquidation (Chapter 7), it makes more sense to put together a Plan of Reorganization that lets the company emerge and begin operations again.
The hearings that have been discussed on this board have nothing to do with the old equity. They are solely about where to position the FDIC in the chain of claims. The FDIC is trying to have their claims against Corus Bankshares treated as Class 3 claims. The people who bought the TOPrS believe the FDIC should be treated as a Class 5 claimant. Regardless of the outcome of these hearings, nothing is going to happen to the old equity.
As far as "rumors" that these actions have value to the old shareholders? They're not coming from anyone who understands the bankruptcy process.
Depending upon your income tax bracket and your state of residency, the tax write-off could be worth nearly 40 cents on the dollar for everything you've lost.
If you've already filed your Form 1040 for 2011, all you have to do is file a Form 1040-X to get some of your money back.
No, I'm not here to "persecute" anyone. I'm here to explain what happened to Corus Bankshares to anyone who's really interested in hearing the truth and explaining to them how they can at least salvage some of their money from an unfortunate investment situation.
A Chapter 11 filing does get filed with the intention to continue an insolvent business. However, they very seldom are filed with the intention of keeping the old equity intact. In the vast majority of circumstances, the old equity gets extinguished.
Have you read Corus Bankshares' Plan of Reorganization that was accepted by the bankruptcy court last year? You can find a copy of it here:
http://www.holdcoadvisors.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/corus-confirmation-order.pdf
Specifically, you'll want to review the outcome for the "Class 8 - Equity Interests". It's on page 25 of the document. It's quite direct and specific about what happened to the old equity.
As I also pointed out, studying bankruptcies is a smart thing for investors to do. Every bankruptcy has a different angle, Corus Bankshares being no exception. By studying bankruptcies, you can make a more intelligent decision in the future about which securities a company has outstanding that might make the most sense to own when the Plan of Reorganization goes into effect.
You guys continue to be pretty light when it comes to outlining the mechanism for your victory.
Does your "plan" really just come down to waiting for divine intervention?
What cards do you think could possibly fall that would restore the old equity?
There is no guiding anyone out of the valley of death here. The old Corus Bankshares are already dead. You can elect to take advantage of the tax benefit or you can pass up on that money if you choose. At least that option exists.
Every investor should be interested in reading up on specific bankruptcy cases. Because every bankruptcy offers investors a unique opportunity to make money. Someone makes money with every Chapter 11 bankruptcy. They just have to find the right securities that stand to get most of the new equity upon emergence. (Chapter 7's aren't always money-makers for someone, but there are cases where a good vulture investor can identify a debt tranche that might be worth buying.) With Corus Bankshares, the money wasn't to be made with the old equity. It was to be made buying the TOPrS if you could find them trading at a distressed price.
Corus Bankshares is unlikely to be the last bank holding company that goes bankrupt. The lessons learned from this bankruptcy can help investors decide how to approach the next bank holding company that files for Chapter 11.
The Corus Bank, N.A., seizure absolutely would reflect on the existence of Corus Bankshares.
The Bank itself made up substantially all of the assets held by Corus Bankshares, Inc., the holding company. However, when the FDIC seized Corus Bank, N.A., the only liabilities they assumed were the Deposits.
After the seizure, Corus Bankshares, Inc., the holding company, was only left with a couple hundred million dollars worth of assets, consisting mostly of tax refunds, which are at the center of the current legal battle with the FDIC. Against that drastically diminished asset base, they still had liabilities in excess of $400 million to the TOPrS, other unsecured debt that was around $100 million, plus the outstanding FDIC claims.
There was no chance the old equity in the holding company could have survived after Corus Bank, N.A., got seized.
OK, to answer your question, because I believe people who come here seeking answers about CORSQ deserve to have someone here who will tell them the truth.
The question should be, why aren't you guys actually reading the filings?
And if there are people who are coming here who don't know what's taken place, or how to get at least some value out of their shares, don't you think they deserve to know?
Certainly not much harm in waiting another month. You've waited this long. And at least now you know how to get some of your money back when you're done waiting.
I would seem to be the only one who actually reads the filings and the court cases.
There is no plan to reinstate the old equity.
So your "plan" comes down to the new owners exhibiting some sort of a charitable streak towards the old equity?
Why would they be inclined to give away what's legally theirs?
Have you ever seen an equity that was cancelled by a Plan of Reorganization that was later "resurrected"?
The ownership of the new entity has already been established by the Plan of Reorganization. Do you expect those new owners to give up some portion of their stake in the new entity to the old, cancelled equity? And if so, why would they do that?
By what possible mechanism do you see their old equity having any value?
Some broker/dealers will let cancelled securities linger in an account for years. They're under no obligation to remove them from your account. But they're also under no obligation to leave them there indefinitely. They can journal them off any time they like.
The Class 8 (old equity) was wiped out by the PoR.
"Class 8—Equity Interests
(a) Classification: Class 8 consists of all Equity Interests in the Debtor.
(b) Impairment and Voting: Class 8 is Impaired by the Plan. Each Holder of an Equity Interest in Class 8 is conclusively presumed to reject the Plan and is not entitled to vote to accept or reject the Plan.
(c) Treatment: All Holders of Equity Interests in Class 8 shall not receive any Distribution. As set forth in Article IV.D, immediately thereafter such Equity Interests shall be deemed cancelled, terminated and of no further force or effect."
No. But I am someone who knows how a company can get their stock publicly traded.
It would have been significantly less expensive to have just remained compliant with his filing requirements before they got revoked. It's highly unlikely that Megas is going to spend a half a million on a new shell.
And even if he did do a reverse merger, he'd have to file an S-4 with the SEC to get your shares to trade. For whatever reason, he doesn't seem to be that interested in disclosing BCIT's financials.
No. Only Classes 4, 5, and 6 received shares in the new Corus entity.
The old equity was Class 8.
I'm definitely here for a BCIT discussion.
But if Megas isn't going to file a 10-12G, there isn't really anything else to discuss.
His nationality has no bearing on how a stock comes to be publicly traded.
Nope. I don't need to talk to him. I know the process by which a company gets its shares to trade publicly.
He's good at running a Chinese fire drill, but that's about it.
The hearing from the 16th was solely to entertain the motion on the part of the TOPrS to dismiss the FDIC's legal attempts to leapfrog from being a Class 5 claim to being a Class 3 claim.
It had nothing to do with the old cancelled equity.
The only thing Megas could possibly do to help you guys would be to file a 10-12G.
And he ain't gonna do it.
Yeah, if the day ever comes where they file a 10-12G.
I wouldn't count on it though.
If Megas filed a 10-12G and cleaned up the mess he left at DTCC, brokers would accept certificates and it would trade again.
It's all up to Megas.
I've been saying all along that the only path for BCIT to take, if they want to trade again, is to get a 10-12G filed with the SEC.
But they don't seem to be interested in filing.
Yet another example of the necessity of a 10-12G for BCIT if they're to ever trade again.