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He stays because he is a paid subcontractor of BT and it is his job to hang out on this board and others to sew doubt in the mind(s) of current and future investors. Really not much different than the rotten lobbyists who continue to do their thing to block us from getting the go ahead for VLN while another half a million people die needlessly. GIO is just several hundred rungs lower than them but equally as annoying....Highly recommend the block function to all as he likely just keeps on recycling the same old garbage regardless of companies progress.
This has always been a curiosity to me ......if we have a hemp strain that can reliably meet the required THC level 100% of the time thereby removing the risk of a "hot" crop to the grower. Why isn't it game set match for us. In other words why wouldn't our technology become the gold standard for growing hemp?
Nice find Shelby! Well fwiw I definitely view that video as capitulation by BT I mean there is simply no other way to interpit or spin it ...certainly seems to bode well for our next FDA review outcome I mean there are those who will follow along with BT's lead and stay smokers and those who will want to jump ship and quit all together with our VLN alternative that meets FDA's non addictive nicotine level specs lets not forget FDA and company have already spent 125 million vetting our product why would they not at least give it a chance. Who knows there may be yet another health development not yet discovered with vaping that could screw BT's vaping plans up too...so many possibilities so little time...... tick tick tick tick
Well Shelby certainly nothing that I approve of except moving our process through the FDA. What we've got here is a front row seat on watching what happens to a companies share price when their managements timing is off and/or when they get too aggressive.
1. Our Aurora Canibus warrants were poorly timed and just plain reckless to leave those hanging out there although they may pan out (I do have my doubts) given Auroras crashing stock price and our lock step linkage to their stomach churning daily stock price macerations (IE they go up we go up and vice versa) check it for yourself.... those warrants are the reason IMHO
2. The purchase of Panacea may ultimately be a good move (if I could have voted on it I would have said noway) but the timing was just inconceivable given the headwinds we were facing at the time and the dropping share price if they were hell bent on buying this outfit they should have phased it in over a longer period of time or walked away. Again more bad timing and reckless gambling IMHO....I hope I'm wrong but imagine the pressure on our stock price if they don't do well I shudder to think about it
3. Cliffs leaving was a big thing too which I have spoke ad-nauseam about already ...yet another massive timing error
I could go on but these glaring moves have not been missed by the street either and in a way I share your view about management but only with a slight twist and that is I wish that they would STOP doing things
Love this post! Personally I need about $2.75 SP to get even currently (20k plus underwater) ...you are telling my story with this investment but the passion and stories about your family (and probably friends too) really lays bare the real human reason that there needs to be a new way for people to wean off cigarettes.....as for why SP is at this level other than way back when we lost FDA director Gottileb?
1. Loss of 2 CEO's
2. Schedule delay in nicotine rule change by FDA
3. Overall collapse in the value of the Marijuana sector
4. 11 or 12 million or more (est) in losses associated with our warrants with Aurora Cannabis (ACB)
5. Announcement that we are buying Panacea Life Sciences for as much as 24 million (nice timing) NOT!
These are the obvious things that are weighing on share price and there are likely others like high short percentage and outright manipulations IMHO by MM for instance.
When we get our approval to not only sell but how we are allowed to advertise Moonlight (hopefully soon) from the FDA we should see a decent bump in SP in the short term (at least $1) but remember there is a lot of technical damage done to our SP as well as the things I listed above so it might take awhile to gain the full benefit of that development (assuming it happens) and I believe it will. However a recovery of the legal marijuana sector is the real elephant in the room and can't be overlooked what with our Panacea and Aurora exposure and recent announcements about company direction ...so when we see a recovery in that space our share price will be helped, god I hope so......all just my view GLTA
Thats nice info XTP ...can you provide a link I am having no luck turning that information up.....please?
Shhhhhhhhhhhhh! LOL GL
I don't want to jinx it (not that I could) but are you wondering about todays price action....don't wonder too long check out ACB (Aurora) for the last couple days ......I've been watching this relationship for quite awhile now and I am not wrong about this and at the same time I'm not too GD happy about it either the linkage to our share price is undeniable and rather obvious just Like Cliffs leaving was unfortunately they both happened at the same time and thats why I blame Cliffs horrible timing departure as a further aggravating factor ....anyone who saw that loss on last quarters balance sheet associated with our warrants at Aurora had their eyes opened wide...If they got a great CEO who knew how to stop spending money hand over fist they might turn it around but frankly I'm more interested in our CEO to be.
The point of the post is two fold first the linkage between us and them is undeniable and secondly Cliffs decision to leave when he did was inexcusable unless he has the FDA deal in pocket I'd love to see him off the board ....He knew about the damage that had been done to that point by our association with Aurora not to mention his direct damage in the form of taking the CEO position and instantly blocking live questions from conference calls another wet blanket decision and then of all things quitting for some ridiculous position at Colonial Williamsburg, what a creep, if I ever didn't need somebody I'd call for him first thing. Cliff knew about it, I knew about it and the street knew too thus the tumble ....I mean I was live on the feed when the FDA announcement came in and we were halted and now we sit at this price level.......Theres a friggin reason but alas at the end of the day I am not selling I can't hell what's another 15 grand its only my retirement IRA GLTA
Of course
OK now what your saying is what I was saying to (EYE "NOT" ON THE PRIZE just kidding eye) which is what started this whole discussion and that was to get at the nuts and bolts and what Cliff actually did or did not suffer as a result of his stepping down. To be clear I asserted to EYE that Cliff sold or was relieved of at least 350k shares which I figured was due to non performance of his hiring contract.....EYE disagreed and said he didn't sell any and since I was weak in reading form 4's I reached out to the board for clarification and while it took a bit of effort I see that I was understanding things correctly all the time and he was incorrect in asserting that he did not give up those shares.....That being said I still hate him for costing me almost 15k in the last couple months....I was going to sell this late summer early fall and take a 6 or 7k loss but I decided not to because he threw his own money into it which demonstrated his conviction to me in the future success of the company after all he had been watching from one of the catbird seats on the BOD for 8 months. I certainly wish that I had sold because as Brooklyn says nothing has really changed as far as what is likely to happen with the FDA and us in general but if I had sold I would have been a buyer right here in this price point and especially the swoon to @.70
Thank you Atlanta1
Well I don't like your use of the word "bother" we should all be trying to get clarity on events that move the price of the stock thats what stock boards are for IMHO ...but thats fine.....I have acknowledged that I am not that great at reading form 4 and need to work on that and I will.
Question 1: If the 350000 shares were awarded to him as part of his compensation as new CEO why does he get to hang on to them after stepping down?
Question 2: Did he buy 100k shares in the open market with his own money (it looks like he may have) at least that was the assertion at that time and if so does he still own them?....It looks like he does according to the form 4?
check form 4
Tks for asking Brooklyn....If you watch the stock price upon Cliffs entry and exit it is quite clear that the market has an opinion about it the same as did I....First of all it was unexpected and delicious I mean the undertones were intoxicating to say the least given his former employment history and obvious relationships with BT it caused me (and many others I'm sure) to think that there could be something very big going on (such as an inside BT buyout for instance) my thoughts at the time were that as an insider of BT he was the perfect person to grease those wheels (based on price movement the street must have thought so to). There are many other reasons his entry as CEO was encouraging "I mean 20 years in the business is not chump change!" Anyway it was a watershed moment and IMHO the street liked it as did I....When he left for his self serving reason(s, (some that you listed) the stock price tanked) The pain on investors was so great that even mega tuff guys like you apparently were compelled to sell some or all of theirs positions and then of course Aurora ever in the back ground right on schedule with its nightmare which killed our balance sheet last quarter to the tune of 8 million plus if I've got my numbers straight. Let me circle the wagons here for a minute ...Cliff turned out to be a very horrible CEO and his actions contributed to a lot of harm to the stock price...all I ever wanted to know when I started this line of questioning "THANKS TO EYE ON THE PRIZES' ASSERTION THAT HE DIDN'T SELL HIS STAKE" was exactly what happened to his stake in the company both corporately and privately.
My point is that Cliffs behavior is highly suspect and untimely and at the very least inexcusably untimely and I don't swallow for a minute any of your potential reasons that you offered that would give him cause to change his mind so quickly ...leaving me and much worse "The street" wondering what he knows. He could have and should have waited until both FDA steps were completed. If he had such a weak conviction about leading this company then he never should have taken the helm. All I ever wanted to know was if he sold his shares or not if you know definitively whether he did please read form 4 and tell me what you make of it ...EYE says he didn't sell I say he did sell or was caused to sell 350000 shares IE sonwals post ref his hiring contract...As of the close yesterday I am down 22K and I don't want to lose the other 15K without knowing the details of why I decided to risk the rest of it and the basic answers to how Cliff was effected monetarily by his decision to walk out matter to me and the street....
What say you B?
Thank you Atlanta ....common board lets keep chipping away ...the fog of war must be cleared away and this particular "fogbank" matters since it was so bizarre....I'm a simple man I want simple things...truthful simple things and so does the street....snooze time is over
Okay now the board can see a nice example (like back in the old days) how we work together to try and answer questions Thank you sonwal!.....my observation on form 4 was that 350000 shares went away and yes I heard the rumor that he had bought 100K in the open market shortly after he became CEO and the form 4 seemed to confirm that. When he became CEO and made his remarks as he did (this summer) I was thinking about selling at least half my position but then he throws down in the open market with his own $ for 100k shares ....that stopped me from exiting the trade and convinced me that Cliff wanted to do something for all of the hurt and harm from tobacco that he helped cause during his tenure at BT then the ridiculous shit show started after bouncing off the $2.40ties in Sept I believe it was .....the chart and the street weighs in from there and its a textbook case of what happens when bad moves are made ....Did mention I really hate him for what he did to us? Inexcusable but I digress ....your post doesn't clear it all up but it sure helps tks again!
Why do you think I keep pushing for the answer to whether Cliff sold or not......IT MATTERS!!!!
Well I felt that when I read the Benificial ownership change form 4 that it looked like the impossible Quizling and former fearless useless leader "Cliff Fleet" bailed on at least 350000 of his shares..... then on 1/09/2020 the Ihub poster "Eye On The Prize" stated that Cliff and company did not sell their shares which was contrary to what I thought I understood from the form...see post #50283....ever since then I have tried to get confirmation if this was true or false with no success.....I'm waiting for a call from IR but of course nothing yet
Sooo "Eye on the prize" what say you are you sticking by your post or what?
Also anyone who knows the answer please respond to make sure I'm not misreading the form and yes Alanta1 I have got a burr on my saddle about 22K of them as a matter of fact and that would just to get back to even say nothing of a gain after 4 blanking years .....pissed ...you better believe it!!!! at least Aurora bounced a little today after their news common board who cares to step up
And trust me I'm not a short
Well Aurora Canibus did the same but there is a little good news there this morning so I think they may bounce and maybe take off a little pressure but other than the obvious technical damage to xxii it makes no sense to me about the price behavior ..... basically we win or lose on this FDA approval but it is disconcerting that the heavies on this board will not respond to my one biggest question which is ......Did Cliff Fleet & company sell there shares when they left there positions I guess I'll call corporate and find out for myself
In my life mostly everybody that smoked cigarettes that I've ever known and that includes me of course wants to quit smoking they are well aware of all of the negative health effects especially the coughing and shortness of breath or just overall feeling lousy and stinky, however nicotine is such a powerful drug many just can't do it so there they are stuck with the coffin nails always at the ready. Like I've said before if an individual could smoke their way to quitting that is extremely powerful and that option alone should really light the demand for our low nicotine choice plus if they taste just as good all the better. If it goes like Brooklyn suggests then of course we're in for a real rocket ride.
Yes thats right sonwal and in addition and perhaps even more revealing was this little comment Zeller made and he was referring to our recently approved for sale Moonlight products.....HELLO??????
“(This authorization) represents the first product to successfully demonstrate the potential for these types of tobacco products to help reduce nicotine dependence among addicted smokers,” said Mitch Zeller, director of the FDA Center for Tobacco Products.
Well sonwal your point is well taken but the larger point was that with their sinking stock price we are going to feel more pressure from their continuing swoon, although it won't matter if we get the OK from the FDA which as I read the tea leaves "We will" .....As far as the warrant price I don't know that but certainly its way above current levels or we would have sold long ago...at this point unless Aurora assumes room temperature which they easily could given present condition of that space and their ridiculous debt it might be a nice little gift in the distant future.
By the way there is news out this morning.....better than a sharp stick in the eye if fact I quite like the news her contacts and experience will be handy some day I would speculate
https://ir.xxiicentury.com/news-media/press-releases/detail/381/22nd-century-group-appoints-new-director-and-new-chairman
By the way I'm still waiting for a heavyweight or a lightweight on the board to say definitively whether or not former fearless leader Cliff Fleet and company sold any or all of their shares or not, so far................. CRICKETS I say they did and I want to be wrong about this ANYONE???????????
Well unfortunately the warrants that we hold are a two edged sword and they cut both ways and what with the current crash of the Mary Jane space in general and Aurora's very large financial problems IE ($800 million plus in debt WOW!) our warrants which once showed a fat gain now show a fat loss ($8 million plus) as of the last reading of our most recent quarterly report). On 6/3/2019 Auroras stock price was $7.16 it closed last Friday at $1.63 and the swoon is not over. My best guess is that we will realize yet another 5 or 6 million in paper losses on our balance sheet directly associated with our Aurora warrants. Auroras stock has crashed and the value of our warrants right along with them its not impossible for the situation to reverse but the timing is incredibly bad and Cliff Fleet knew all of this when he decided to desert his position and take his new hotsy totsy Colonial Williamsburg position (this is one of several reasons why I hate him he should have waited until after we got the second FDA approval to make his move).... at this point we can only hope he knows something that we don't as far as the FDA goes ....I mean you can't make this stuff up! This is why I have been hollering for someone in the know to say definitively if Fleet and company sold their stock positions or not but so far CRICKETS my read is that they did sell.........
Thanks for the name plug frankly centrist voters are so used to winning in that arena these days that XXII is kinda sticking out like a sore thumb......YAH THINK??? and my particular paper sore thumb is -$21K american..... trust me I'm pissed just glad I pounced on apple and swks this summer when wall street was throwing those away like they were nothing during the China frenzy and to be honest if I weren't locked down for the count here and knew what I believe I know and had some mad money to invest I would put some money into this name right about at these levels but I can't take any more risk
Oh there's been plenty of action just not the right kind hence the share price and don't under estimate the damage of those G-----d Aurora warrants that nobody wants to talk about .....I realize they may be valuable someday I just hope the idiots don't go tits up in the mean time, another piss poor management decision which I was totally against and told them so having watched how fast the pot mania materialized and seen a boom/bust cycle or two in my time.... management got way out over their skis, we should have taken the money and ran from those schlubs but they wanted to pump up their fricken balance sheet on our dollar and risk... short term gain with long term risks which have now come home to roost along with the snails pace of getting BOTH of our applications approved by the FDA add 2 MIA CEO's (especially Cliff) with his resume to die for) I for one would love to suggest a place for him to put his "Old Williamsburg decision) he had an obligation to shareholders and he didn't keep it add a lead council to the mix and we have got some serious problems .....Wallstreet hates uncertainty and these numbskulls have driven us up hard into an all or nothing corner... but if I had to pick just one of them who carries 90% of the blame that would be Cliff Fleet and I hate his guts for what he did to us.......ask me how I really feel I've only just begun
Well there is progress albeit $painfully slow but Zeller noted that in the various interviews its clear he wants to do it.
I know that when I looked at that video you refer to I was stunned and it is clear that Mitch approves of low nicotine he is definitely talking about xxii and he has come to realize that things don't move very quickly at the FDA. A bit more digging into other adjacent videos on U Tube seems to cement this view. He definitely doesn't like cigarettes and makes a point of shining light on nicotine.
Thanks for explaining about the warrants Brooklyn all I know is the time for a low nicotine choice is long overdue the market will catch on sooner or later.
Interesting I thought they did sell their shares gonna have to study up on reading those 4-K forms but your post gives reason for recent price action it certainly is frustrating on the background of a roaring market when I have investments like apple and others the to watch this company sit here week after week like it was chopped liver although I would admit that between management changes and the shellacking from our Aurora Canibus warrants its no surprise ....It certainly seems a no brainer that we will receive the permission from the FDA to at least be able to say our cigarettes "contain 95% less nicotine" on our packaging... after all it is the truth, and then the millions of test cigs used by the NIH and others the positive test results on our low nicotine cigarettes on and on and on. I used to smoke when I was young and lt was about impossible to break the grip of nicotine, I would have loved to have been able to smoke my way to quitting but that wasn't a choice back then. Long suffering here, 20K underwater like many but still believe in the benefits. Recommend all go on FDA sight and post a poignant story/comment about their personal friends/family horrors loved ones they have lost etc of high nicotine cigarettes..... I did.