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Fair valuation is $1,30, that's the best estimate there is. I'd call it generous.
Common sense.
"If we could get the fair valuation, SIAF is $70 right now. What are we missing?!"
Yes, time will tell.
A lot of words put in my mouth. Try to quote the things I say.
Anyways little point to argue further, I have said what I came to say, that's the end of it. You will keep your facts, I rely on different kind of evidence.
It always comes down to this, stock goes down but we should look at the "facts" which support alternative reality where this stock would go up.
The facts don't apply in reality. They are more or less fed facts and we have a long track record already that they can't be trusted.
Even valid information does not turn into stock holders favor as expected, the company will make the goodies disappear.
So many bad experiences and people still want to believe this time it's different. The only selling argument for this stock is that it is "cheap". I'd filter all evaluations by the company and take a good look at the company what it really is.
How do separate small cattle farms qualify as part of a stock company?
SIAF should be about the aquafarms. There was just a magic trick, most of them vanished into TRW. But you will get paid, right? Or maybe not?
It's just a mess of cross owned partnerships, scattered, complex and complicated. It doesn't produce any profit. Management not trustworthy. These are fundamental basic FACTS that everyone must admit. Building on those will be very difficult.
The huge mistake is to fall for these company/ownership games. At that moment one is in Solomon's net, one has stopped receiving real world signals and they are now replaced by stories with a rainbow at the end. On some level they all make sense, they might even sound clever. But nothing good materializes out of them. These stories let people believe that regardless of any farming success or real world results, there will be a mystical and epic turn in the course of this company because there is value some elsewhere. They are just distractions and allow SIAF to claim success is behind the corner, yet having no success at the mother company whatsoever.
Fiddling the companies around is not the answer to the problems. If they were really competent farmers they'd be focused on farming and do their job. They would be talking about shrimps and prawns and customers. Not this company structure jibberish.
I believe when the true farming capabilities will eventually be revealed it will a sad day to many.
Next reverse split coming. I agree with your view, there's little evidence anything else being true. Do not invest in this, you will lose money, it is as simple as that.
"Back in 2010 there was some 60m shares altogether and now they have done a reverse split 10 to 1 and we are back at the same amount of shares almost? smile the only constant is that solomon never stopped printing new shares in the basement its just the cover lies that has been warped...."
Busted? So far only thing proven is that the company exists and that I have not questioned.
Yes it shows now, didn't come up without the "-" in between. Just $630,99 for the report and we will know a lot more.
Contact Dun&Bradstreet. I would if I had stock. Easy way to prove me wrong.
Link please. I saw 3 companies with search, none of them Tri Way.
If it looks like a fish, smells like fish, it's a fish.
Looks like the tricycle business is strong in Hong Kong as well.
Contact Dun&Bradstreet. This should be relatively easy to verify whether it's true or not. I can tell you I will be totally amazed and stand corrected if it turns out the company has highest 5A1 rating. My guess is they have not evaluated this company at all.
Now we can truly put a fact against fact.
I searched Dun&Bradstreet database. Country China, keywoard Tri Way. 10 comapanies show up. Surprise, surprise, no "Tri Way industries".
https://businesscredit.dnb.com/intl-search/?country=CN&recaptcha=&api_key=5ZQdbHqkcAFmbERsDp2kIim0edSV7oMb&companyName=tri+way
Once again, believing info fromthe company gets us in a funny situation. You didn't get suspicious at all with all the hugely successful companies in the world, this carve out stock down the drain shrimp farm gets 5A1 top of the top rating and 9/10 in risk evaluation??? :D
What does it mean that Sino Agro owns 36% of this company?
Tri Way is just the same quiet bunch of locations that has been used as front for this operation since the beginning. We are supposed to believe that "Tri Way industries" has gained some magical powers, it will be listed in Hong Kong stock market and it has lots of cash now.
This is the latest illusion sold to the shareholders.
I guess it is a fact that Siaf owns 36%.
Anyway, I don't see it being meaningful to the share holder, it's just juggling about the same assets, it does not create any real value.
The cardinal mistake is to believe the "FACTS" company dishes out.
They are thinking about dividend and share buy backs for a fact.
A real world materialized fact is that never during the "good years" shareholders got dividend and as we speak the stock is actually diluted.
So we should talk about the "FACTS". Which facts? The ones give comfort and warm fuzzy feeling, or the facts that apply in the real world?
Best technology? They can't grow prawns adult. They have no proof of significant production. They don't have money, can't get loan and nobody trusts them. There is nothing to sell.
New one! Mega loan! :D Now we have Mega farm, Mega deal, Mega loan. None of them have actually happened as one might expect.
Well.. The stock value crash has happened and it's kinda "Mega". :D
They can't grow prawns adult under a roof at all. According to one board member Solomon himself confessed this (accidentally?) when making excuses for bad results. It's posted here in the talks with Solomon, go look it up. Hilarious.
It gives an idea where this company is at.
"there's no harvest, no customers, no named customers, only CAPITAL AWARD THE TAX FREE BALIZE COMPANY and nothing else. then there's the busted megafarm that they don't own unless you count the CJV assets that aren't technically owned as EQUITY by slide-o agro foods gosh jeez wonder why the stock isn't lower? no worries - it will be indeed be lower. anyone know what a commercial prawn harvest of several metric tons looks like? no way these guys are producing even ONE metric ton - a year -"
I'm not sitting on any fence, my feet are on the ground. The quality of the management is already enough reason for me not to invest, as a general rule company needs to have trustworthy intelligent management. It doesn't -
don't touch it.
SIAF is always marketed as "cheap", that's why one should buy it. How that has worked for people who have been investing in it?
I don't know what people have exactly observed over there, and I don't know these "professionals", obviously they have had bad judgement.
Regarding TRW, I wouldn't believe anything about it's substance without seeing with my own eyes. For me it's just continuation to the old storytelling tradition. SIAF history is full of big numbers and big promises. The reality is exact opposite, no money, stock down, company scaling down, don't even seem to get a loan.
If you cut my arm off and after the procedure you tell me that now I own 36% of my arm, what has materialized?
How's this good for me?
We have absolutely no idea what TRW is worth. The only way to really KNOW about SIAF TRW etc. would be to fly there, stay at the aquafarm facilities long time, observe produced amounts, identify clients etc. My hunch is that basically there is no commercially significant production. That's why the stock has plummeted down, that's why there's no money, that's why everything needs to be complicated and camouflaged, that's why there's a lot of explanations, delays and difficulties.. They are dancing around that fact, that makes all the seemingly irrational moves by the company very rational. It's a battle against time and the inevitable, it's keeping up the appearances.
Stock value, downward trend and the company are a logical match. If things don't change at SIAF (why would they?) downward trend will most likely continue. The only driving force up has been for long just speculation and manipulation. Is it worth it to be part of it, why not just sell? And concentrate on better things in life and investing. This can still go down a lot.
My facts are from the real life observations and things that have materialized (or not) with this company. For several months I have gone by these and they have not failed me. I have said many times you can't go by the bookkeeping or management's stories with this company. Only materialized actions matter. What has materialized lately?
At the same time everything is getting very complex and complicated when it comes to corporate structure and money.
I don't own SIAF stock, I never have and never will. I once looked into this and came to the conclusion that it's not real. I kept on following because I knew this was going to become something interestingly weird. Since then everything has convinced me I was right initially.
I hope you get your dividend, that would change everything. I'm just saying it doesn't seem likely. And I don't say it to rub it on anyone's face, just to warn newcomers.
None of them will come.
This is just rubbish to float a dead stock alive.
Sino is carving out it's own body parts to survive, has nothing to show in terms of success neither in just cultivation point of view nor in terms of financial success.
It is totally delusional that they would get some big deals abroad. 99% of farms in India are more successful than Sino, would Sino go there teach how to fail? Absurd.
Mega deal in India. :D
Another bait for the stupid.
Go buy this stock on monday, there will be a mega deal soon!!! :D
It's actually quite serious and sad matter that investors are fooled like this...
There will be no 100 million loan that's for sure, that's seriously a lot of money. It will never ever in a million years be given to a "carve out spin off" company who has Soloman anywhere near the steering wheel.
And what a bummer, because there will be no loan everything else on the list that would have been meaningful and good for the shareholders collapses. You can blame the bank when the time comes.
But actually everything collapsed already long time ago.
TRW = same facility that has been used as front since the beginning. Now they only own 1/3 of it. Or who knows. Haven't seen any production there, they should name it the hobby farm. I think they really owned that one, the other locations they have not claimed to have owned
The real hard facts:
-There's no money
-Incredibly difficult to get a loan.
-Definitely no dividend.
-Claimed hundreds of millions in profit have vanished, nothing to show for them.
-Facilities are the same old or low tech under construction cheap ones.
-There seems to be no active farming, no piles of boxes of shrimp, no trucks lining at the shipping and receiving.
-Office sites look empty, probably not theirs really.
-You never see CEO with a client. You see him a lot with the true clients though, them being the investors.
-You never see anybody with a customer.
-CEO admitted after all these years they can't grow prawns adult.
-Scattered small cattle barns are not stock company business, compost at the back should not be called Fertilizing Company Ltd.
-Complex corporate structure built for confusion and smokescreen
-Delays, changes to plans, excuses, complications.
-Stock has plummeted.
-Trust has plummeted.
How many red flags do you need?
This is the whole purpose of this company! What did you expect? They stop printing stocks and they have no business left, only some cows in scattered few barns and ponds where prawns don't grow adult, that's hardly a way to make even small money. But add some fantastic paperwork and some people do believe it's a business.
So sweet that you still believe..
If this was an honest company it would get its own loans. They claim they have made hundreds of millions in just profits, they have extremely low tech empty looking facilities that cost next to nothing. It is very obvious that there has been no turnover or profits which they have claimed to have made.
Now they are in a spot where through subsidiary company (for the sake of everything to be difficult to verify) these guys claim that they have gotten a loan. Woohoo. And this is supposed to save what? They can't even grow prawns. This is so sad scam, i can't believe people still count numbers and read reports, it's far beyond the point you can believe any reports. There's no real investments and no real profits. It's just a scam on paper. You just have to use your own eyes and common sense. These guys have couple of low tech facilities and allegedly some barns. LOL. That's nothing. And they can't grow prawns.
It's done, the end will come soon.
Have people not lost enough money already? Why analyze this company like it's for real?
Amazing scam, was laughing with tears in my eyes reading this stuff. The loans are a mess with so many steps and difficulties, it is obvious that he guy is just lying. He can't get a loan. I wouldn't loan Solomon $5, how on earth would anyone associated with him get a 100 000 000 loan? Will never happen. Everything else is just a similar mess. Cross owned companies allow a lot of explanations why there is no money, why it seems that there's no business. Truth is of course: there is no business. It's just a scam with couple of pond and barn pics.
The most hilarious thing was that he admits that they can't even get the prawns to grow! OMG they deal with something like this after many years of experience and have reported hundreds of millions sales.. This if anything confirms it's just a scam. These guys have some kind of hobby farm, they are not good at their hobby. The real skill is in faking a corporate that does not exist.
I think the puppet should be played upside down like that, money falling from the pockets and it should be called "Mr. Shareholder".
I think SIAF has shown it's potential already. Folks here still believe the numbers they display? P/B under 0.1? P/E under 1? And the company is in desperate need of a loan and has very hard time getting one. Hahaha. 1+1=2. Don't have money, don't make any money = need loan but difficult to get. They will make some crappy concrete pond for 10k dollars with the loan money and rest disappears. Post pics of the pond in the internet and people here go bananas. Wow, progress, one pond, looks like worth 100 million and probably produces a trillion every year. And then stock gets diluted, no dividend, no megafarm, and soon they will need a loan again.
So the new stock is for the Sino Agro personel, they sell them because this is the only means of income. I think after they have sold the stock it will hit rock bottom because of the dilution and the selling activity.