What if RRR is on the Priority List...?

Let's say there's two ways to Re-cap, Relist, Release the GSE's: 1) Immediately, loudly with a bang, and 2) Slowly, quietly, without much if any fanfare.

#1 - With a Bang: hardly anyone is paying any attention to the GSE's in conservatorship. As if these companies have been largely written off by the investing public. If the Government were to RRR in a sudden immediate fashion, the stock price would skyrocket. This immediately becomes news for the business pundits and the investing public, catapulting the GSE's into high profile. This scenario would most likely lead to a series of questions, such as:

a) Why were the GSE's in conservatorship
b) What's a conservatorship
c) Why were they held in conservatorship for so long
d) Did they really need to be put into conservatorship ( losing money, but not insolvent )
e) If the GSE's were in trouble from holding subprime mortgages, why were they immediately forced to buy up more subprime mortgages once they were forced into conservatorship
f) If conservatorship if supposed to financially rehabilitate the GSE's, why did the Government siphon off all of the profits for the last 15 years.
g) If the conservatorship is legitimate why is the Government frustrating discovery in the court cases ( the 11,000 - 12,000 documents )
....and so on.

The point being: an immediate and sudden RRR would attract a lot of unwanted attention to the Government's wrongdoing.

On the other hand:

#2 - Slowly, Quietly, without Fanfare: What might this look like? Sort of like how things have been going since last November? - steady but significant and discernable increase in the stock prices, consistent and sustained increase in the trading volume. Significant market activity trending to a substantial increase in the market value of the GSE's, but regardless STILL not enough to merit even the slightest mention by the business reporting community. A calculated and orchestrated raise in price of Fannie and Freddie stock, to the extent that upon Re-cap, Relist and Release the stock prices pop, but don't explode, and don't attract as much unwanted attention.

Part of my frustration has been an inability to determine who ( besides us ) is accumulating FNMA and FMCC. With this price and volume increase it's hard to believe that there isn't somebody buying it up, rather than Shortie and other sundry market manipulators ying-yanging the stock price for short term profits. But who?

It's been a great few months for my position. I hold FMCC in four accounts and finally, last week, ALL of those positions are back in the black after the beating we took post-Collins / SCOTUS decision. Starting to think that this time could be for real.

GLTA

Double-Edged Sword....

If the Government files an appeal ( presumably seeking to reduce if not void the judgement ), then won't My Cousin Hammy counter-appeal seeking higher damages ( and presumably seeking to include Fannie commons in the judgement - I would )...?

Wouldn't that be a laugh if the award came back higher...

Post a Bond...?

So, if the Govt. appeals, will they have to post a bond...? I'm assuming they'd be paying interest on the judgement for the duration

Hopefully the interest is accruing on the judgement

Thank you for that,

I did have a look at the most recently available 10K's and missed the reference to Ackman's holdings.

Hello FOFreddie,

Yes I'm having nothing but trouble finding out who's been accumulating GSE commons. The best website I used to reference was CNN business, it had a great set up showing institutional and individual owners of large positions. They changed it and as far as I know that format no longer exists. Yahoo Finance, Nasdaq sites et al, show only a pittance:

https://www.nasdaq.com/market-activity/stocks/fnma/institutional-holdings

https://finance.yahoo.com/quote/FNMA/holders/

Bill Ackman isn't even listed as a major shareholder. I have more shares of FMCC than many of the entities listed on those sites, and I bet the same can be said for many of us here on the board. Besides the sustained increase in the price of GSE shares the daily trading volume has gone up and stayed up as well. Hard to say what this means exactly is difficult without knowing is this activity due to accumulation or just more manipulation, somebody bought a bunch of GSE stock cheap and is goose-ing the stock price to make their balance sheet look good. The new higher trading range is a mystery also, the stock prices aren't really moving up or down a lot - they've gone up and stayed up, but aren't really moving up any higher.

????

All I can say with relative certainty is: I know who's not selling: me, You, and a bunch of these other guys on here. I have a pile of Freddie commons, and I'd buy more but not at these prices.

Good luck everybody, enjoy your weekend.

Hello FOFreddie,

Yes I'm having nothing but trouble finding out who's been accumulating GSE commons. The best website I used to reference was CNN business, it had a great set up showing institutional and individual owners of large positions. They changed it and as far as I know that format no longer exists. Yahoo Finance, Nasdaq sites et al, show only a pittance:

https://www.nasdaq.com/market-activity/stocks/fnma/institutional-holdings

https://finance.yahoo.com/quote/FNMA/holders/

Bill Ackman isn't even listed as a major shareholder. I have more shares of FMCC than many of the entities listed on those sites, and I bet the same can be said for many of us here on the board. Besides the sustained increase in the price of GSE shares the daily trading volume has gone up and stayed up as well. Hard to say what this means exactly is difficult without knowing is this activity due to accumulation or just more manipulation, somebody bought a bunch of GSE stock cheap and is goose-ing the stock price to make their balance sheet look good. The new higher trading range is a mystery also, the stock prices aren't really moving up or down a lot - they've gone up and stayed up, but aren't really moving up any higher.

????

All I can say with relative certainty is: I know who's not selling: me, You, and a bunch of these other guys on here. I have a pile of Freddie commons, and I'd buy more but not at these prices.

Good luck everybody, enjoy your weekend.

Huh.....

I looked it up on the SEC website and it appears as if you're right. An SEC news release references a rule change scheduled to take effect in December 2024 but such rule change does not appear to affect the status of reporting requirements, more the timing of reporting.

https://www.sec.gov/news/press-release/2023-219

Who's Buying / Who Owns Fannie Freddie commons -

Good Morning everybody, lately I have searched repeatedly attempting to find out who's been buying up Fannie and Freddie common stock, without any luck identifying any person or entity who might be accumulating so much GSE common stock as to have raised and sustained the current market prices starting around November of last year. Today I had a look at the Fannie 10K from 2023 and the Freddie 10K from 2022 and came across an interesting tidbit which might shed some light on why we can't determine who's been buying us GSE common stock - check it out:

From Freddie Form 10K 2022, page 272:

Pershing Square Capital Management, L.P., PS Management GP, LLC, and William A. Ackman ("Pershing") have filed certain reports on Schedule 13D, the latest of which
was filed on March 31, 2014. In that report, Pershing reported a beneficial ownership percentage calculation of 9.78%, based solely on the 650,039,533 shares of our
common stock outstanding as reported in our Annual Report on Form 10-K filed on February 27, 2014, and excluding the shares issuable to Treasury pursuant to the
Warrant. The Schedule 13D indicated that Pershing also had additional economic exposure to approximately 8,434,958 notional shares of common stock, bringing the total
aggregate economic exposure on the date of that filing to 72,010,523 shares of common stock (approximately 11.08% of the outstanding common stock). In that filing,
Pershing indicated that because it believes our common stock is not a voting security, it had determined not to file future reports on Schedule 13D. We do not know
Pershing's current beneficial ownership of our common stock.

https://otp.investis.com/clients/us/federal_homeloan/SEC/sec-show.aspx?FilingId=16421835&Cik=0001026214&Type=PDF&hasPdf=1

From Investopedia:
What Is Schedule 13D?
Schedule 13D is a form that must be filed with the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC) when a person or group acquires more than 5% of a voting class of a company's equity shares. Schedule 13D must be filed within 10 days of the filer reaching a 5% stake. Schedule 13D is also known as a "beneficial ownership report."

So it looks like since GSE common shareholders have suspended voting rights, large holders of GSE common stock are not required to disclose their holding via Schedule 13D. To me this explains a lot. GLTA

Hey Guys, anyone see this.....?

Warren Buffett’s Berkshire keeps new stock pick secret — again. Here’s what it means
https://www.cnbc.com/2024/02/18/buffetts-berkshire-keeps-new-stock-pick-secret-again-what-it-means.html

Berkshire Hathaway’s Mystery Stock Purchase May Be Revealed Today
https://www.barrons.com/articles/warren-buffett-berkshire-hathaway-stock-purchase-431172f6

I can't read the entire articles because I'm not a subscriber. You have to wonder though - the trading volume and the stock prices for Fannie and Freddie have gone way up. No insider stock purchase search that I have conducted shows any individual or entity accumulating millions of shares of The GSE's. Both the increase in stock prices and volume suggest ( to me ) somebody's accumulating shares, rather than the usual price manipulation ying - yanging to which we accustomed.

Makes you wonder don't it?

NYSE Listing Requirements - $4.00 / share etc.

https://venturelawcorp.com/listing-requirements-of-the-new-york-stock-exchange/

Here's a link showing the metrics required for the GSE's to get listed on the NYSE. I could not find any information regarding Listing vs. Re-Listing requirements, if there's any distinction to be made.

Eyeballing these criteria it looks like we're good except for the $4.00 per share part.

I bet some of you guys know this stuff chapter and verse, but it seems like there's not been much discussion on the board regarding the specifics to get re-listed, so I went looking and found this, thought I'd share.

GLTA

My FMCC pps just went above my cost average....

for the first time since Collins

Have to see how long it stays there. One thing's for certain, I'll know that we've won and we're done when Freddie pays me a dividend.

Good day today.

Happy New Year Everybody....!

With the exception of:

a) the right to buy
b) the right to sell
c) most importantly - the right to own.

First last and always, the right to own property, and the rights associated with property ownership are fundamental to a free society.
This is why ultimately Fannie and Freddie shareholders will prevail.

Not a matter of IF.....

......a matter of Quando Quando Quando

Up 5%....

I'll take that any day, Slow Bro

I couldn't speak to that, but

I have thought that the GSE's could re-capitalize through surreptitiously buying back their own common stock on the open market ( 1,000,000's of shares at current prices ), then recap release and re-listing the common shares, which would then cause the value of those bought back shares ( all shares, that is ) to skyrocket and thus re-capitalizing the companies.

What if Lamgirth is waiting

for his 2nd mortgage to go through, so that he can buy a boatload of Fannie & Freddie commons.....then issue a smackdown verdict in favor of the shareholders?
Why can't it be like that?

We all know how corrupt this whole conservatorship happens to be, and the people who instituted and perpetuate it. I just wish these clowns would be more smart with their corruption and make us all a boatload of $$$

Looks like Deja Vu all over again.....

First the GSE's caused the financial crisis and housing meltdown by providing mortgages to minorities who were unable to afford them ( the promulgated false narrative ) and now they're being directed to provide mortgages to minorities who are unable to afford them (otherwise).

Great letter though, almost restores a little faith in our government. Almost.

Been waiting for commons to go lower

.....so I can add to my positions. Seems like lately the shorters and manipulators have lost their appetite for toying with the GSE commons - the prices aren't getting whipsawed like they used to.

I did.....

Rounded out the position in one of my accounts. Placed an array of descending low-ball limit orders. Waiting for the manipulators to really drive down the price before I start serious loading.

https://www.sec.gov/news/press/2011/2011-267.htm

https://www.chron.com/business/article/sec-charges-ex-fannie-freddie-ceos-with-fraud-2407249.php

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-freddie-mac-lawsuit/ex-freddie-mac-executives-settle-sec-fraud-lawsuit-idUSKBN0N520920150414

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-sec-fanniemae-mudd-exclusive/former-fannie-mae-ceo-settles-crisis-related-lawsuit-with-sec-idUSKCN10X1ZI

Well....sort of....

Fannie CEO Daniel Mudd and Freddie CEO Richard Syron were charged with fraud by the SEC in December 2011. Mudd settled in August 2016 and Syron settled in April 2015.

My low-ball orders

for FMCC filled yesterday and today, picked up a few thousand more shares. Will be placing some more low-ball limit orders tomorrow. The lower the price the more I buy. Have faith and do not doubt.

ugh

Eventually the financial media

will have to recognize and report on the massive increase in the prices of FNMA and FMCC. The higher the stock prices go the more enticing the story becomes. Once this starts to get some media attention then the whole story of the conservatorship will become more newsworthy and begin to be told, and once that happens public opinion will begin to side with the shareholders.

Congratulations everyone......

Long overdue. On to the next case....

Two words.....


......that should never be in the same sentence together:

"Crypto" and "Bank"

Great Letter - Send a copy to "American Greed"

Kurtis Productions:

https://www.kurtis.com/

https://www.kurtis.com/portfolio

https://www.kurtis.com/team

Mike West seems to be the best contact person. Or, heck, copy them all

I see your point but respectfully disagree...

Assuming that anyone or entity who could effectively loot F'n'F again would be willing and able to do so: the best way to loot the twins is to purchase them outright on the open market for $. 41 / share. Clean, legal, deal of the millenium. Boom. If the government wanted to easily recapitalize The Twins: allow ( or require ) Fannie and Freddie to surreptitiously accumulate millions of shares of common stock at the current price, then recap, release, relist. Stock price goes from $ .41 / to God Only Knows how high - at least $100. Can't provide chapter and verse at the moment, but I recall that HERA allows for Fannie and Freddie to buy their own shares if Treasury permits.

And then: there's much more at stake than a bunch of guys on a message board making a ton of dough on a stock trade. If this Conservatorship / Bailout B.S. isn't overturned, we're all screwed, the Government then has a working model to seize any privately owned company.

If I were a condescending self-righteous incompetent profligate bureaucrat I'd probably target all Gas and Electric Utility stocks for confiscation as the next order of business, seeing how utilities have a government sanctioned structural monopoly already and are highly regulated by the government.

So all that is really needed is for enough people such as Bernie, A.O.C., Ilhan, Elizabeth Warren et al to get enough power and decide to re-make the American economy, and they have a successful model at their disposal.

So this is why I keep buying, because failure to free Fannie and Freddie is not an option and I'm certain that this fight will be won.

Said another way: doing the right thing for the right reason and making a ton of money doing so.

BOOM!! Great time to load up!!

Will only be better if the price goes lower, and when it does, I'll be buying more!!

FNMA shares outstanding....

1.158 billion shares outstanding...

https://ycharts.com/companies/FNMA/shares_outstanding

58.8 billion / 1.158 billion = $50.77 per share vs. $ .41 per share

Got my order in @ $.42

Wash Rule cont......

From Investopedia:

https://www.investopedia.com/terms/w/washsalerule.asp#:~:text=The%20wash%2Dsale%20rule%20states,the%20same%20or%20similar%20investment.

• A wash sale occurs when an investor closes out a position at a loss and buys the same security (or a substantially similar one) within the 61-day wash sale period.

• How Do I Know If a Security Is Substantially Identical?
•
• Unfortunately, the IRS does not specifically define what the term substantially identical means. It does provide guidance in Publication 550, however. For example, a company involved in a reorganization will likely be considered to have substantially identical securities to those of the new company. The IRS states that investors must rely on their own judgment and the advice of professionals to determine substantially identical securities.

Key phrase being: "Substantially Identical"

The purpose of my original post, responding to Commander's post suggesting that there was an exchange of Fannie for Freddie or vice versa for tax purposes, was to raise the question of whether their might be another reason (other than for tax purposes, due to my understanding of the wash rule). What might that other reason(s) be? Anyone?

If memory serves me correctly, did not a similar pair of transactions take place during the most recent Lambreth trial? Large volume of Fannie sold and Freddie bought, in virtually equal quantities?

Sold one, Bought the other....?

If for tax write-off purposes, what about the "wash rule"..?

Got my "buy" order du jour in

Didn't execute, guess it was too low-ball. Lowered the bid for the next trading day. Always a little bit of a challenge to hit the rock bottom price, but absolutely buy on the down days.

Furthermore.....

HERA never completely deprived shareholders of ALL of their rights - we retained (and still have):

a) the right to purchase FnF shares

b) the right to sell FnF shares

c) the right to own FnF shares

The basic and fundamental Right to Ownership is the basis from which all other rights are derived. We were never (and are not) deprived of this right. The government has structured the Conservatorship to deprive shareholders of all economic benefits of ownership, but hey, you can keep the title.

I disagree....

I think the courts are the only chance we have for recap, release, re-list, reimbursement and damages. If we are relying on Congress to do anything on our behalf we will all get nothing.

Just have to keep hammering away in the courts. Eventually we will see some success. In the meantime keep accumulating.

Good Luck Everybody

"Public Interest"

Using that justification the Government can do just about anything to anyone. Just like anyone who criticizes a totalitarian regime is an "enemy of the state".

I'm hoping that the Plaintiffs can present evidence regarding the extent to which the FHFA has gone to suppress evidence in all of these trials. We are all familiar with the tens of thousands of documents which have been excluded under the pretense of "executive privilege" or releasing this information will collapse the financial system. In this trial evidence has been disallowed. Despite the fact that evidence has been suppressed, I think it might be helpful for the jury to know how far the Defendants have gone to conceal the truth about the Conservatorship and NWS. Maybe in the closing arguments.