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good point.
yeah. don't sell. do you want more money? or less money?
if you want less money, just sell later and burn some of the money. don't sell now.
do you think it is possible that what the annual report said is true?
if it is true they are seeking to do a private placement, audited financials might be useful.
so while i think, as always, a buyout is possible, i dont think there is a clear indication that that is what is going on. there is a clear indication that there is another explanation for why they are offering an audited financial statement.
lets lock this up people. dont sell!
the company's book value has dramatically increased
by eliminating two thirds of their debt
i believe a private placement is forthcoming
that will involved a modest increase in the number of shares outstanding in exchange for an operating budget
this company will continue as a going concern
this is the only opportunity to invest in a publicly traded company in the nascent and eventually immense ac pre cooling market, a market that will no doubt eventually involved billions in sales
stick it out!
yeah, what win said
dont hold your breath
please dont anybody panic if short term predictions on the board dont come true. i think maybe someone made a somewhat reasonable inference about when the fins were coming? but i dont think they were promised to us at any particular time were they?
sooner or later, you will glad you held these shares
and i dont think anyone has the knowledge to be totally confident that it is gonna be sooner, but i think we can reasonably confident that eventually our day will come
dont be on the wrong side of a swing trade!
true that
we are both rational clear thinkers
that can tell the difference between knowledge
reasonable conjecture, and wildly optimistic baseless guessing
who agree that the long term prospects for this company remain good and the short term prospects remain uncertain
although lately they are looking maybe a little better
based on CEOs tight lipped confidence
i agree. hold for the good news and then hold some more for the some more good news. if this company can avoid going out of business, and seemingly it can, eventually it will be worth way way more than any short term pop we see here. so dont sell for beer money, or new truck money. wait for private island money.
thanks for catching my word sized dyslexia there
i bet everyone knows that conviction comes before sentencing
so i think that probably did not cause too much confusion when i switched those around by accident
well somebody (or some people) is eager to buy
and they are not on here saying why
so maybe they know something we dont
the upward move seems like a good sign
that whatever ben has cooking is real good news
i am not optimistic the financials are going to be rosy -
if there was a sale, or the debt was erased, i dont see why it woudl be a secret
but it looks like something good is going on
and just getting current, even if the fins are same old story, is a good thing i think
and they could come with forward looking statement re we think the levy debt is going away, we are planning a civil suit to recover five million and we know they have the money and are already sentenced about to be convicted to so the suit is lock or something like that
maybe they are not allowed to speculate on things like that, but i would think if they are clear no one can be sure but the plan to sue and have been advised they have a good chance to win that seems like something they ought to be able to say
so you are saying that part of the float is shares currently owned by levys, and these shares will be returned to GDGI's pool of authorized but unsold shares? interesting.
thanks worknhard
yeah, i encourage everyone to stay in this until GDGI makes a big sale or gets acquired and then stay in it some more
ac precooling is a real thing that people with businesses that use AC who would prefer to have more money instead of less money will want to have once people realize it is safe for their equipment
eventually, it will be a big thing, and this is the only publicly traded company in the ac precooling space
so whether or not y'all get disappointed in your own hype and over-confident guessing and tea leaf reading or not, sooner or perhaps later there is a very good chance this will work out well, especially when you consider the company is valued at around what a tradeable structure alone is worth
i think ben is not a typical CEO
in that he has neither a wall street financial nor legal background and he has had a tendency to say more than he should to individual stockholders and his lawyers have advised him to stop doing that
i dont think it particularly portends a buyout that a CEO should say i am not supposed to tell individual stockholders stuff cause i am not really qualified to assess what is material non public information or not
that is not to say there is no buyout, but just saying i am not supposed to be talking to invidual stockholders (he used to have a dedicated investor relations person who was presumably well versed in rules regarding material non public information) does not specifically portend a buyout; just good judgement
well, i dont have a particularly well informed opinion about that, but i have mentioned before that it costs almost 1 million just to take get a company SEC legal to trade over the counter. if a company in the pre cooling space wanted to go public, buying GDGI would give them the structure and some name recognition and trademarks and possibly useful patents. then, if i understand correctly, we would have shares of a new company. they could dilute and pay themselves and screw us a bit, but if they were not intereted in makign a bad name for themselves as a stock, i think a company that was in the ac or precool space buying GDGI would be a very good thing. they would have our stuff and their existing abilities and a platform to raise capital with reasonable dilution. i think it could be very good. i dont see any particular indication of it happening, but our price is ridiculously low, so i think it could be a potentially attractive opportunity and if i saw signs that it was a specific possibility i woudl find that very encouraging.
please let me know of any other recent issues that i have overlooked. havent made the time to follow closely lately
well..i am a big fan of occam's razor
so i like the simplest explanation the best
quote seems like it would be a page to get price quotes maybe?
clima ideal has apparently not paid their web hosting bill on time
which is not encouraging, but i am pretty sure they are actually a big ac distributor and failing to pay a bill on time in costa rica does not necessarily mean disaster
i dont think a new page that is entitled quote is a really reliable sign of a buyout though anymore than i would think the disposition of entrails of road kill reveal our company's future
a lot of speculation i have read has proven to be pretty speculative
regarding the sentencing, was very dubious about getting the big money, although confidend the debt would be relieved
the research on this board has begun to sway me, and i think we have a shot at the big money, but someone here opined that, there being lawyers with billing rates involved, that could take some time to work out
i would think if the SEC was gonna give it to GDGI, they should do so, but government does not always work the way i think it should
i will be a little surprised if the money comes very soon
a little surprised if the debt forgiveness does not
but i am prepared for good news, sooner or later
i think it would be wise to be psyschologicallly prepeared for good news NOT to arrive very speedily, even the debt forgiveness
although it seems like the CEO thinks something good will come of htis in the short term, having said he will tell us something good after sentencing
still, while i do not distrust him, in the past his optimism about the timing of news has not always been well grounded
i remain of the opinion that while the long term is rosy, the short run is quite hazy and over confidence in the short term results may lead to sufficient disappointment for some to trigger mild selling with all the potential buyers already as loaded as they can be
so maybe dry out some powder and be prepared to either celebrate good news without selling (cause if we get some good news ,better news will surely follow within the year) or celebrate a momentary mild sell off with buying
yeah buddy! hold or buy
don't sell
the 5 million is possible, the 2 million is close to certain
and we are the only publicly traded company in a market segment that is sure to grow, and grow abruptly when it catches on
lask is the only person around who does not hold some well justified hope for GDGI
and lask seems to f all about GDGI other than its listing status and share structure
which, if i understand correctly from other posters, is not that bad at all for a penny
c'mon - the CEO has a day job - the company has expected money at any moment for months, but since the levy's have been gone, have they diluted? not a single share. they downsized their facilities and cut their staff and the CEO GOT A DAY JOB
show me another penny stock that has done that! clearly not a fraud of any sort. lask obviously did not know what she is talking about, except that she probably knew/thought if she could scare a couple people out of GDGI they might look at her other posts and jump into whatever dubious long shot she is betting on
my perilous flirtation with the tu quoque fallacy
the tu quoque fallacy, or "you too" fallacy
asserts that if a person (or person) fail to act in a consistent matter with their stated position, that stated position is wrong,
as my own post urging people to examine wikipedias excellent list of fallacies has just reminded me
now, i did not exactly say that failure to buy demonstrates that 5 million is not really coming... but i did veer perilously close to that fallacious position
and to be sure, just because people are not acting on their confidence that 5 million is forthcoming in 6 weeks does not mean we can know that will not happen
nor did i say i did. i meant to suggest that people were perhaps somewhat insincere in representing their confidence
however, there is the factor, as i myself have acknowledged, that most of the long longs have loaded and loaded and reloaded as the price failed to rise and occasionally dropped. so it is not a very powerful example of cognitive dissonance when people here believe 5 million is a sure thing and yet do not buy
and furthermore, people like megaladon are buying!
so whats up sellers? hold!
also, if anyone else would care to stand on the shoulders of giants, there is plenty of room
if you are a fox news fan, this will either spoil it for you, or provide you a fun new game. pretty much every sentence uttered on that channel can be categorized as one or more of the following types of fallacies
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fallacies
that's what i'm talking about!
good on yah
now the rest of you, take note...
there is a solid reason to be optimistic that this company is going to get 5 million dollars (in addition to getting 2 million in debt wiped out for "services" that constituted criminal fraud and hence do not have to be paid for)
that reason is: the govt seized 15 million dollars from the levys in assest forfeiture for stock fraud
the government ruled that the levys harmed gdgi to the tune of 5.1 million dollars
so the rest of you: stop selling!
i guess part of why we are not seeing a price rise is, as i have acknowledged, over exposure on the part of all the confident long longs makes them reluctant to buy more of this gem even though many are very confident money is coming in a big way in 6 weeks - and by a big way, i mean a net increase of SEVEN MILLION DOLLARS !!!! (2 million debt forgiveness plus 5 million damages)
a guide to clear reasoning
a friend of mine once pointed to this wikipedia article
and i think it is just superb. it is a list of fallacies
which is to say misleading types of arugments
very educational...standing on the shoulders of giants...the greek rhetoricians had some powerful and illuminating thoughts
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fallacies
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fallacy
among them is the ad hominem fallacy
or "to the man"
this is when rather than addressing the merits of an argument, a counter arugment (or a weak attempt to make one) relies on a personal attack - not addressing the merits of the argument but rather casting doubt on the competency or veracity of the person making it. from beyond the grave, the greeks urge us to think about the particulars of what is being said, not who is saying it.
as the saying goes, even a stopped clock is right twice a day. this is, i believe, why personal attacks are not allowed on this board; they are fallacious and as such, a waste of time. a post does not have to be crude or mean spirited, it just has to be ad hominen to qualify for removal.
that is why when you look at post #19414
you will see that it is a response to a deleted post
everyone, including me, can benefit from learning about or reviewing this powerful knowledge about fallacies
i am going to read it again myself now
and stop selling and start buying, cause as megaladon has clearly explained, 15 million has been seized, 5 million in damages were done, the money is there for the taking and sooner or later, GDGI is quite likely to get it back!
i understand why nobody else wants to buy in
i said "if y'all are so sure"
not if every other investor in the world is so sure
and i specifically addressed the fact (which would contraindicate the price rise that i think it is odd we are not seeing, given opinions stated here) that pretty much everyone who is a long long on this board (me included) bought how much they were comfortable with, thought it would go up pretty soon, were surprised to see it go down but were still confident, and bought some more, several times even, and now feel over exposed
despite that, if i were confident (instead of now, mildly optimistic, thanks to Megaladon's excellent post) i would dig deeper and buy some more some how, or convince a friend of this excellent opportunity
i sincerely, not just as a sarcastic challenge, suggest that if yall beleive 5 million in october is a sure thing in october, that you dry out some powder and buy some. 6 weeks is not a long time, and others may follow my advice and beat you to it. if people here really believe 5 million is coming for sure, these prices may not last
really exhausting posting on this board sometimes given i find myself having to explain things twice so often
reading comprehension - not just for high school honors students - a valuable skill for a lifetime
i agree
quite reasonable
those here who are confident in this fairly reasonable proposition that either the money is coming now or the money is coming reasonably soon might want to load up some more even though they are all tapped out
there is usually a way to scrounge up a little more money
well done sir!
thanks for the info
very encouraging to know the govt has 15 million they seized from the levys
maybe the trial did not specify the amount of damages to the other companies? in which case, specifying the damages to GDGI and not the others suggests that GDGI is the one most likely to be compensated and it is not so likely that the other potential competing claims on the money will interfere with GDGI collecting
in that case
i agree it is possible or i would even say quite likely that GDGI will be able to get some or all of that money and even that it will simply be awarded to them at sentencing
however, i do not agree that it is a certainty or that it will necessarily happen at sentencing
it could take a while
i am gnosis
i am the voice of reason
i have spoken
he said, with maximum pomposity
later for youse
so does that necessarily mean that there is 5 million dollars anywhere for us to get?
we also need to see that they money is either in the levys hands or the governments, and that the sum of the govt/levy holdings is enough to compensate both GDGI victims and the other victims
right?
as far as i know, you cannot squeeze blood out of a stone
it has been a while since i read the original documents
i know in light of what i read, i did not find board posters' assertions that an award of 5 million was certain
if all yall are so sure, i dont get how the share price can be this low
if i am remembering correctly, although whatever particular documents you are referring to may be exclusively about GDGI, the levys definitely had other victims
i dont recall at all if the documents specified how much was successfully seized from them. does anyone know that?
is there any reason to think 100% of what was seized would go to gdgi victims and none to the others? is there more than 5 mill seized? is that money the levys owe the SEC, or money the SEC actually go? do the levys have any monehy left for GDGI to sue them directly? i forget if i knew the answers or what they were. i just remember i was not convinced we were necessarliy getting a bucket of money beyond the debt being eliminated.
i know they took pains to hide some of their assets. i know some were found. i know they spent a lot of money on a lavish lifestyle too.
if indeed it is a sure thing that GDGI gets 5 million in 6 weeks,
and the debt goes away too, leaving only .8 in debt, that is 4 million in cash between what, 250 million shares?
so the book value of just the cash asset net of the small remaining debt and nothing else at all would be .016, a 5x multiple
so what are you waiting for? i think it might be a good idea to sell a kidney or borrow from the mob or worse yet credit card companies or payday loan sharks and buy some more stock if you think that is really true and certain.
just having 2 million in debt go away (or be certain to eventually go away once the levys are in jail and gdgi has money to do some court proceedings if that is what it takes) is pretty damn good regardless of whether we get the 5 million or not
and i would say the we that get 5 million are NOT defined as the company or current shareholders because if you bought after the levys quit messing around, like if you bought under 10 cents a share or so, you are not a victim
investors who held stock during the fraud are the victims
that would be the insiders and those of stockholderes who have been around for a long time
do i want the money that i was defrauded of by the levys to be paid to the company and split among current shareholders some of who bought after the fraud was done and are that are in no way victims and you can see have sort of benefited (from what we all hope is a temporary price cut and opportunity to get in cheap) ...
well, more than i want nothing at all, but rather clearly, it is in the interest of the ACTUAL victims of the levy fraud, some of whom have already sold, that any damages go to the shareholders of the time, not the company or just the current shareholders
but justice is blind and apparently pretty often drunk, so who knows
i think we are looking at pennies
but whether it is before too long or not depends maybe on how patient you are. a year ago i was thinking around now would be too long. a major shareholder on this board said he thought end of july would be too long shortly after the mr texas post. luckily for those us longs in the a man sense, or long longs as i would say in a attempt to achieve brevity and clarity in one swell foop, he has stuck around and continues to try to cheer up fellow shareholders with his unrelenting optimism. (unless you are one who is hoping to buy back in at a lower price)
i urge everyone to take what comfort they feel they must in happy thoughts of relatively near term results (a quick sale after the test is completed, the near certainty* of a 2.2 million dollar debt reduction (!!!!) when the levys are sentenced, the long shot possibility of damages awarded) but i dont think these notions are attracting new buyers. i council you to consider this advice: don't hold these notions so dear that if they prove to be erroneous, you disappoint yourself into selling this year.
sooner or later, and quite possibly later, this stock is going to go way up from where it is now. ac precooling is proven to work and EPA and Tulane and top tech school mud (that just won an award for being affordable yay what exciting news) have all endorsed GDGI's product specifically. even if they somehow continue to fail to sell their own product, they are the only publicly traded company in the market and if they dont succeed on their own, sooner or later they will at least get bought for quite a bit more than they are costing right now.
*no way GDGI is every having to pay that money. whether they have to have a cash surplus to formalize the debt reduction with a civil suit against a convicted fraudster to eliminate the debt, or more likely the SEC does it for them, i am not entirely sure. but levys in jail are not winning a lawsuit to collect that money. no way, no day.
i agree that we might not hear anything right away, but not because they cant manufacture without money. if that were the case and we were dependent on getting money from the SEC i would be very worried, but they have a company that will lend purchasers money to buy this, so i would think they would not have too much trouble getting a short term bridge loan for manufacture for a confirmed order. but testing is not equal to sale. testing completed means sale finalization begins, and the client in question being from central america and being a govt institution, that can be a slow process, right?
i still believe patience will be rewarded
but i think it will take more patience than i had planned
i agree. debt is going away for sure. 2 million dollar balance sheet improvement. nothing to sneeze at! as for the speculation that they will get damages passed along from the forfeiture - is it even certain that the Levy's had significant unhidden assets to seize? even if they did, and even if the SEC as inclined to pay them out, there were other levy victims (dissolved companies i believe, but still the stockholders were victims) and current shareholders are not victimms of the levys, shareholders of the day are.
i would love to see damages, and i think there is a slim chance, but by getting people's hopes up about that you are accomplishing very little about the PPS in teh short term (stopping selling, but clearly not inducing big buying pressure) and if people are once again disappointed by the rosy projections of board members here, there may be another avalanche of selling. this may take more patience than any of us would like to think, but the CEO has a day job and the company can perhaps hang in there until they finally close a sale, or if nothing else, a competitor proves their own product and takes over this company just for the share structure and the recognized brand in the market. i sure am not gonna sell this for .003 or whatever. there is still upside potential even for a reasonable pessimist, and the downside, from my point of view, is not so huge.
"yeah! some people on this board
are trying to manipulate others
to drive stock prices down for emotional
reasons or whatever and such actions
are the height of wickedness
and they should not be listened to
just because they are mad they made bad
investment decisions doesnt mean the rest of us should suffer
bargle bargle bargel harumph etc"
or something to that effect.
of course that was not an actual quote of a man,
it was a paraphrase of some accusations once
leveled against me by a man who i will not name
it is more ironic
than rain on your wedding day
which is setting the bar pretty low for irony
but whatevs
kids today
har har
yeah buddy
i am waiting patiently
as an infant
one with the dusty earth
desiring nothing but a belly full of rice
but a big mountain of cash
from holding GDGI past its first run ups
when it finally makes a sale or announces the levy debt is eliminated
on to when it becomes a solid market force
is ok with me too
i agree
everyone is astounded that it is taking so long for this to catch on, but listen to the HVAC man
it is a conservative profession
change will be very slow until a tipping point is reached
and then the market will explode and GDGI will have a part of it and is currently the only publicly traded option for entry into this field of investment
even if they dont get money and pay off the 800k
it takes more than that to create the legal structures of a publicly traded company
a company with nothing at all but a SEC approved legal structure for trading and 800k in debt has a positive asset value
sometimes you make some good points
information should perhaps be in quotation marks
misinformation would be a more accurate description
in the context of investing, being long means either
1) buying shares of a stock based on the expectation that a stock will go up
2) buying call options or selling put options
it is true that in the capital gains context, long term gains are those for assets held over a year
but when speaking about investing, to be a "long" only means you are not a "short", it does not say anything about your time horizon
that is why i describe myself as a "long long"
and i once got a lollipop from the school nurse after i skinned my knee in kindergarten, so clearly, i know what i am talking about when it comes to communication and my opinion should be given great weight
but if you dont trust me
http://www.investopedia.com/terms/l/long.asp
for those of you who have been around planet earth
you certainly know that small caps are volatile than large caps, right?
so when the market is moving up, small caps move up more
when the market is moving down, small caps move down more
it would be just super if small caps move up more than large caps when the market is moving up, and then move up some more when large caps move down, but they do not generally move in opposite directions - they move in the same direction and different speeds
if you doubt it, you can see this by comparing the russel 2000 small cap index to the dow or the nasdaq or the s&p over various periods of time. the pattern holds pretty consistently
micro caps are of course even more extreme than small caps in their volatlity
you also know that when the market is moving down, there is a "flight to quality" in which investors move out of more speculative investments towards blue chip type stocks for their greater stability
or maybe you have been around but you dont know this and you think the opposite thing. you can take a look at charts of major indexes and figure out which statements are accurate and which are not.
but since almost no one but long longs are holding GDGI, and since almost no one but long longs are buying more GDGI, i would not expect much correlation with market moves in the larger market
it could even be the case that GDGI longs flee the falling larger market and put the liquidity they create into GDGI, in a scenario contrary to the obvious and enduring broader trends of the market
i tried to get some lawyers i know to comment
very responsible folk. outside their area, so no comment
to get a good answer, we might need a lawyer with a securities fraud practice
perhaps the guy who has the website about how he gets money for stockholder victims would advise us, or leap into action starting a class action suit
great work with the info on victim compensation wise
the possibility of a civil suit to recover damages is good
kinda knew that, but nice to have confirmation
for the board
i think a civil suit would be against the Levys who may have been rendered judgement proof (broke) either by forfeiture of everything they had or by their scurrilous practice of hiding assets through money launderers, what little they have left if anyhing may be hidden. maybe you can make a civil suit against the SEC to demand they pay out forfeit assets, but they probably take that into account when they decide what course to take: either they decide to give it on their own, or they know you can't make them ,would be my guess.
FTC and FBI paying compensation for forfeiture also good
but what would really be stellar is a very similar example
can someone find a case where the SEC collected forfeit assets from a fraudster operating on an OTC stock and then those were paid to the company or i think more likely the stockholders at the time of the fraud? pretty sure they do pay out forfeit assets to victimms sometimes, but have they done it for OTC stocks? i dont see why they would not, except that they hold us in scorn and have a caveat emptor attitude towards pennies to some degree, their resources being somewhat stretched and with plenty to sort out for the big companies. i would like to think otc forfeiture goes out to otc victims, but i am not confident of that.
that would be extremely encouraging and a perfect example if there is a case of OTC fraud, forfeiture, and compensation
do you think people who sold all their shares last december
after seeing share value plummet as a result of the fraud
would agree?
repeating the information that GDGI has been endorsed by a top tech school, something that i do myself, and saying these are things we know and have known for some time that make us optimistic about GDGI is quite different from saying that a school that has universally been recognized as one of the best for decades getting yet another source recognizing it, not as top school all around, but a top value, is great news for the stock.
the Harvey Mudd endorsement is not at new news for GDGI, but it is a good thing about the company as i have repeatedly noted.
Harvey Mudd itself being recognized as a good value in terms of how much you pay to go there and the economic success of graduates is not great news for GDGI. it is not even news for GDGI at all. the school has been recognized as a top school for decades. yet another source recognizing what everyone else has already decided about a school that gave GDGIs technology an award several years ago is not great news for GDGI. that is just plain silly.
finding out that some not huge website is selling the residential product is also not a big deal. amazon is still selling it. lots of websites were and i hope still are selling the residential product, which is no longer their focus. the commerical unit costs about 100 times as much.
if you are trying to impress people by saying the product is distributed on the internet, i think you are going to fail to impress people and suggest to them that if you are clutching at straws like that, the stock must not amount to much, which i think is a false impression.
once again here are the actual good things that are meaningful
1) GDGI is the only publicly traded company that focuses on ac precooling, and hence the only pure play for ac precooling that a retail investor can make
2) they are the only ac precooling company with an EPA endorsement, and also have endorsements for top tech school harvey mudd and from tulane U
3) they have a history of sales of both commerical and residential product (res had a nevada utilty rebate program too) and they have a satisfied customer as far north as mid illinois where ac is not in year round demand (a municipal government that installed one on their firehouse has confirmed that it is working well
4) they have not diluted for a year and the CEO has chosen to take a second job rather than dilute and pay himself at stockholders expense and management still owns 30% or more of the company so their interests are closely allied with those of shareholders
those are REAL good things
perhaps i give up
i am not trying to minimize GDGIs positive future
i am in favor of accurately representing GDGIs positive future in a way that reasonable people can recognize is real and not vapid
i mis-spoke when i said low dilution
you are both correct that no dilution (for over a year)
is accurate. sorry about that. thanks for correcting me.
i expect if there every is any dilution, it will be to foster sales growth, not line the pockets of management
i am also not trying and hopelessly failing to exaggerate GDGIs future by saying things like forbes recognizing what has been widely recognized for years (Harvey Mudd is a very good school) is a great news for GDGI, or look someone is selling the residential product that is no longer their focus and acutally has it in stock so that is great news and some kind of big deal, or, having announced that they have an authorized dealer program, we have been able to find one authorized dealer so that is big news
perhaps you will join me in not saying things that are obviously silly, thus avoiding the risk of creating the impression that GDGI is a silly stock with silly stockholders