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just watched the conference call replay (on their web site).
good to see revenues at last and to get the full run down on the Sines project and phases. makes the 500MW project possible IMHO so long as their partners deliver.
Seems they are being cautious - unlike an American h2 company CEO/CFO pair.
Hopefully the IRA/45V rule changes will enable them to enter the US market although their small project strategy will need to break out into larger sites (I think this was their planned approach anyway)
bought a lot much higher so glad o see them getting some traction with SP and may add to average down.
no mention where they are going to source the electricity to drive the SOC electrolysers.
I thought refineries were consumers of electricity .
If this is to really decarbonize their plants they need MCFC cells like FCEL has to remove the carbon.
No dates or numbers - a nothing burger
Oh and PLUG is up more then Bloom on this no news
they ought to do monthly production numbers like all other vehicle manufacturers. Quarterly at a minimum and within 2 days of the end of period.
Currently they expect to make 350 FCEV this year essentially one a day - this I hop can be increased but they haven't specified the supply chain constraint. They certanly have orders for most of these vehicles so that isn’t holding them up
its not meant to stop the bleeding, or be a puff piece.
its an educational webinar for people considering temporary fueling solutions as they trial things like Hydrogen FCEV like Nikola, Hyundai and others. Installing a LH2 system for a fleet of say 50 trucks is a risky endeavor until hey are established. It will also take time so us the mobile refueler as you build up your fleet.
would be interesting to know what Biagi ’s strategy is here.
It could move the needle though if you find the little tit bit of information that contradicts the Andy/Paul/Sanjay standard text for Hydrogen refueling numbers. I would tend to believe these guys.
I’m sure PLUG will take the FCEVs eventually (by end 2025).
The Arizona hub is owned by fortisque but i think the liquefaction was already ordered and will be supplied if fortesque continues
Nikola have already had some hydrogen from PLUGs Georgia plant (gaseous) but with focus on west coast would expect the, to wait until Texas is built (mid 2024). Like so many plans everything is slipping 12-18 months due to delays on tax credits and uncertainty as to if they apply even
They have access to $1bn via an ATM. That will last through 2024 but if they get the DOE loan (in Q3) eye won’t need it all.
So valid to remove going concern, I’m sure the accountants and attorneys were consulted as well.
They have taken $300m from ATM already which they got a legal opinion on as it seemed too fast according to the rules for the ATM and that should last them 3 months or more.
An interesting call with delays from customers who can’t secure hydrogen or can’t get FID until the IRA 45V credits are changed. Hence huge inventory still. Hydrogen is now more plentiful but demand increasing daily
Plug reported last night and had call
This morning
Up 10% on going concern removed beat on revenues and discussion on inventory and project financing along with their cutbacks
surprisingly little action after hours
looks like revenue of $220m beating revised estimates
goodwill hit of nearly $300m
so agree it will all be about the future, Q1 2/3rds of the way , I doubt we will see real improvement in margins until Q2
Impacting 2024 numbers cf 2023:
Price increase
cost of fuel much lower due to Georgia/Temmesse and loewr nat gas prices
Staff cuts
Going concern removed
Hope we get an idea on inventory - when will the $960M be shipping?
pleased stock isn't moving either way on the 10k, may mean we only move 10-15%
10K is out
https://d18rn0p25nwr6d.cloudfront.net/CIK-0001093691/f930363c-1c8f-480e-9804-4394c8357275.pdf
Had $135m cash at end of year
$891m revenues
$507m loss on revenues
will leave rest to you to read…but…
Hmmm
isnt earnings per share worked out on the average count for the period under review (Q4 in this case)?
of course the analysts models may not be that clever so there could be an element of more shares so lower eps
for once Zachs are bullish for the report tomorrow
suggesting loss of 0.42 per share compared to estimate of .57
https://www.zacks.com/stock/news/2233724/why-plug-power-plug-might-surprise-this-earnings-season?art_rec=quote-stock_overview-zacks_news-ID01-txt-2233724
Hi WTM
My reply got lost in the web site fiasco today
I’m trying to find the authorized share count to see how many they could issue
This filing makes a lot of sense and just gives them the same powers other companies that are not registered in Ireland have
They need the ability to sell shares when necessary and with the big contract may need to sell big numbers at times
Hopefully we get more details at the earnings call
Sanjay has been demoted (well responsibilities removed) but does still hold the “Strategy officer” title which he has failed with as he had no contingencies in his plans.
I am sayingPaul. should resign - fall on his sword. The board should. have fired him years ago.
No CFO should survive the latest ATM debacle.
As for Sanjay, he was given far too much responsibility and Andy listened to him without question - and still does.
He is now responsible for making electrolysers and I think Cryo equipment. but not the building and operation of the H2 plants. The delays on STAMP, Georgia, Brookfield (cancelled), CA, Graham TX are the reason we are where we are since no savings in H2 costs shipped to customers were realized in 2022 or 2023 which was part of the strategic plan.
I have stated many time Andy needs to be moved out of CEO role but he has too many contacts in the industry and government to be fired completely.
yes nice action bouncing off the 200 DMA
Will no doubt find more out on their earnings call next week. will be interesting to see how their current projects will fair given the massive inventory required for the new one.
The fiasco over the ATM implementation certainly should lead to Paul M resigning. It is all the CFO’s business to handle that properly and getting a legal opinion as to whether the shares are legally registered (because they used the ATM faster than allowed) is the nail in his coffin IMHO
surprised the share price isnt much lower today.
If the $302m was raised to give us the cash to last through say end Q2 or Q3 then it may have been worth it. we will find out Friday. As the price will fall on the margin/loss for Q4 numbers hey raised the cash with higher price - and the market seemed to absorb the $11m a day.
good example of Oil and gas companies trying to live off government subsidies.
you would think they could survive without handouts…
not sure this is news Jack. just restating what is generally known.
However government subsidies are still being paid to oil and gas companies so why would they stop to Hydrogen companies in the future?
The “produce at the point of consumption” will gradually reduce but may influence a number of FID this year. As electrolyser costs fall, and technology makes production on site in smaller quantities easier adoption for transportation (of all types) will be more economical. I am wondering if the Ford and Uline deals included on site electrlyzers.
IMHO the one area of costs I'm not sure is being addressed is the storage and dispensing costs I see a fragmented market of standards which will stop economies of scale reducing costs.
you mean $5BILLION revenues dont you?
How long do you expect installing an 18,000 gallon tank and associated infrastructure to take.
From what we have seen there is a lead time in making the tanks, they seem to be very popular.
They go out of their way to promote everything (for one of 4 distribution centers) to be ready this year which is good news for shareholders
How can another multi-million material handling contract ( the second in a week) be like Mulag, Gaussin etc where nothing came of them so far?
I often wonder if people who post links to stocktwits without any context are just promoting their own posts there.
however that link disclosed a link to an article about Turin airport who seem to be installing (or planning to) a tri-generation MCFC and a SOFC system. No mention of the supplier but there is only one.
Turin goes green
did you read the seeking alpha article about the recurring revenues? - they could be loss making due to the expense of maintaining the sureSource3000 systems.
certainly not 50% margin
do you answer any questions asked?
as I suspected - small dividend (0.04) to help support the price reaction!
Why do you think revenues from generation of $15M per quarter is good?
The other companies FCEL gets grouped with are doing close to $1Bn a year revenues. so $60M a year from one line of business is hardly worth talking about - and is it profitable? (See seekingalpha article for details). Their other lines of business are hardly doing any new business so I guess thats why you can focus on it.
FCEL is NOT a hydrogen producing company - they have one site that makes hydrogen and a couple of laboratory/pilots - they do have technology rated the most efficient but no one is buying it and they are hardly making any - with annual capacity of 40MW a year
PLUG is making 120 MW a month, 1.5GW a year, of electrolyzers for green hydrogen we may well hear they will ramp up to 2.5 GW by the end of this year to meet demand
As everyone else ramps up FCEL is left behind, yes they have great POTENTIAL as they have good products but no marketing and no salesforce
Product Price Place Promotion. I think they score 1 for 4
not sure this is lame news at all
Ford or Tesla?
2 Liquid hydrogen tanks (with all he BOP that surrounds them) , 10 dispensers - most sites have 2.
Surprised there isn’t an electrolyzer included to generate the H2 on site not rely on delivery.
you dont know me and I have been invested in FCEL for a long time - yes a bag holder through 20+
All I do is question the company’s marketing - they dont seem to do much at all. what is the target market for tri-generation?
In my last response I asked what California wants with even more water? Many people can use bio gas to generate energy, is the added cost of tri-generation economic for the hydrogen and water produced? Given their current sales I would suggest it is not.
You mention tri-generation being more affordable - what numbers do you have to back that up and more affordable than what?
Try reading again and answering questions I have asked.
Mention Nat gas (with bio gas) in second paragraph as that is FCEL’s core business.
Tell me where Toyota can use tri generation instead of other hydrogen generation solutions (if they seek hydrogen at these new locations) and how tri generation is more economical.
Why are there no other sites in progress?
Current pipeline is extremely short, Exxon and May be 2 sites in the USA.
but it would provide the resistance to selling.
what are they going to spend their profits on?
Not saying its a dividend play, but to start like META would help maintain the price movement upwards IMHO.
When will NVDA start issuing a dividend?
Any chance it will be announced/started this ER?
Yes, biogas can be used to create energy - you don't need tri-generation and all the delays that had. Can they deliver Tri-generation in the same timeline as a standalone SureSource 3000? What is the value to California for tri-generation? There are cheaper ways to generate water (which they dont need now) and energy and Hydrogen. Toyota was IMHO unique in needing all three and certainly FCEL deserve the awards they got for it.
just use MCFC and get your electricity from Nat gas / Bio Gas etc. thats been FCELs business for years and they seem to have stopped selling it. Any news from Malaysia yet? Any new installations in Korea?
In the USA there are too many influencers and no strong leadership to get hydrogen production ramped up just look at PLUG and the status of the 45V “incentives”. Hopefully FCEL are just focused on the nuclear/pink hydrogen opportunity as their solution best fits that, but should by now have a pilot in place.
At the moment Ballard has the cleanest business strategy although they need more, cheaper, H2 available so customers can commit the size of roll out they need for coach, buses, trains. At least they arent trying to solve the H2 shortage themselves...
It is the port authority not Toyota that would be buying any subsequent tri-generation systems, Toyota have all the water they need to wash their car imports and hydrogen to fill their imported Mirais for now.
not sure trigeneration is the right solution to generate volume hydrogen. For trucks the filling stations are outside of the ports - I suspect the port authority needs them to spend as little time on their land as possible. So who is FCEL trying to sell SOFC systems to in California? anywhere for that matter.
FCEL is NOT currently a hydrogen company - yes they have tri-generation and a pilot SOFC. they are an energy company that actually uses natural gas to make energy. they are trying to ride the wave that relates fuel cell to hydrogen but they and Bloom really are not hydrogen companies yet.
But they did liquid hydrogen from Tennessee before they shut it down for servicing and improvements.
Georgia is the news for liquid
you would think they would use the proper logo for PLUG Power as well
older (2021) PR about the Sines projects
gets a bit confusing with various acronyms
https://ir.fusion-fuel.eu/news-releases/news-release-details/fusion-fuel-green-presents-sines-green-hydrogen-valley-alliance
certainly going to get attention, I hope they get financing lined up now. Reading the company PR they had almost given up on this coming through so they have lots of other projects in progress as well.
650MW is HUGE, something like 170 TPD to use the measure PLUG likes to use
10 times bigger than Georgia
Yes I am in Linde as well but not APD. Wish I could invest in Bosche.
just bought NKLA leaps as I suspect they have a lot of good news to come with their earnings - lots of orders and shipments this year. even though they may need more capital before they break even.
PLUG as we know will post record results for Q4 but the wrong sort of records. At least it wont be negative revenues again - unless Walmart have been given their warrants as well.
so holding off adding PLUG until we see earnings and the revised business model and cash flow requirements with or without the DOE loan.
I see Blooms CFO is leaving may be they will recruit Paul M. CFOs seem hard to find in the clean energy business.
but they fell 20-25% a week ago….
so i is wolfpack hit piece claiming their AI “claims” are all lipstick on a pig and they haven't changed anything over the last few years, in fact no R&D spend at all
hopefully company responds
https://wolfpackresearch.com/research/inod/
tryig to find news to explain the 20% drop - any one know?
good to see Lhyfe on the list, but I thought Acciona was on an earlier list as well?
May be there is a separate grant more for the renewable electricity generation feeding the electrolysers?
Also nice to see Fusion Fuel supporting the small guys….
Europe seem to be far more along the financing path than the USA still squabbling over the 45 V numbers and rules.
need an update on their plans to take to production and volumes.
will VW announce a car/model/year iteration of current model using the QS batteries?
is there enough $$ to build production facilities, or will VW finance them?
not sure there are DOE loans for building trucks - the federal and state subsidies help the buyers pay for them though (so they cld raise the selling price to get more margin . the factory itself is completed so unless they can get a retroactive loan to pay for that I think it is a straight up financial management task.
hence they need to appoint a CFO ASAP. some threads on Stocktwits seem to imply the announcement is being held back. cant think why though.