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Thank you for posting these FACTS
And taking the time and initiative to make the contact.
Maybe it could be said another way too
Since we released, we don't want to hear about facts that may not support theories of returning Billions, especially if we made the decision to sell our WMiH shares. Just another way of saying what you keep posting IMO
Facts count
I noticed you removed your Mother Load post so you must know the facts about the Goldman Sachs issued GSMAP securities
Suggest you look up GSAMP Trust
Goldman Sachs issued these securities long before the seizure of WAMU and long before the resulting Global Settlement Agreement
Mother load LOL, GSMAP was Goldman Sachs eom
The question is if you released
Isn't worthwhile to consider posts from posters with specific experience and expertise even if the opinions differ from the latest theory about hidden billions to be returned to our escrow accounts. Especially since every such theory has failed to produce any cash. IMO it is interesting and valuable to consider both sides of these theories.
Agreed! just plain language no interpretation needed
Escrow holders are not a beneficiary of the settlement plain and simple.
Dude prepare for disappointment again
Retained interests, if any were recorded on the Balance sheet, and sold to JPM with all the other assets. There was no escrow representation as a party to the settlement. Why, because we have no ownership in the MBS secured by the Trust assets, and no related claims. When you receive the Court required notification, then you can get excited. Time is certain to be the great reveal, as usual. GLTY
Bob DB sued for Repurchase Obligation Money
The MBS investors in the assets of the DB trusts would have had the benefit of poorly underwritten credit loans that defaulted being repurchased by the Originator/Securitizer in this case A WAMU entity, if it had not been for the BK. So, DB sued both deep pocket JPM and the FDICR holding 2.7 BIL of assets for some relief, and what they got is an allowed unsecured claim against the remaining FDICR assets. Who knows what that will turn out to be worth. As escrow holders, we were not a party to any of the suits or the settlement, but the reduction of the receivers assets, and the increase in unsecured claims against the receiver is the result.
Net result of Settlement reduces FDICR assets
As of eoy 2015 FDICR had 2,756 Bil assets offset by 6.077Bil of WMB Sr Debt, 7.2mil of Admin liability and 19.25mil of unsecured claims. Now, the FDICR will pay JPM 645 mil, reducing assets available to 2.1Bil, and allow another 3 Bil of unsecured claims from the DB Trusts. Any actual payments made by the FDICR to the Trusts will be made proportionally with the other unsecured claims. The DB trusts will be responsible for the allocation and payment of any payments made to the Trust MBS investors. Again, the Settlement reduces the receivers assets, and increases unsecured claims to the remaining assets, The settlement will to some as of yet determined extent, reimburse MBS investors for repurchase obligations for faulty credit loans included in MBS securities by WAMU entities prior to the BK. Potentially positive for specific MBS investors but not related to our escrows.
Read 4.07 of the settlement agreement
4.07 No Third Party Beneficiaries. "There are no third party beneficiaries of this Settlement Agreement."
In addition to JPM receiving 645 million, the DB claim of over 3 billion against the FDICR is allowed to remain
There is no evidence to support any benefit to our escrows from the settlement imo.
Cusip 92936PAB67
I have been receiving cash for these regularly, Fidelity says the payments are partial call interest and separately, partial redemption payouts.
"Certificate of mailing/electronic service"
Remember the Judge required notification so if you have not received any soon, you will know the truth and that is, the settlement has nothing to do with our escrows.
Any % of Zero equals Zero lol, eom
Made perfect sense to me too. eom
From the WMI PIERS prospectus
" a preferred security issued by Washington Mutual Capital Trust 2001,(the "Trust"), having a stated liquidation amount of $50, representing an undivided beneficial interest in the assets of the Trust, which assets consist solely of subordinated debentures issued by Washington Mutual, Inc. each of which has a principal amount at maturity of $50, a stated maturity of July 1, 2042 and, at any time, an accreted value as described in the prospectus".........
The key statement is about the Trust assets being only paper issued by WMI
No need to argue!
Especially about your conclusions concerning the use of a SPE, and the meaning of "Considerable Assets" shown on a WAMU CSB. I have no need to convince you to change your opinions. Now, that is a Fact. Time will tell. Namaste!
Any retained interests were booked on Balance Sheet
Only to be seized and sold period! If you believe in speculation about assets coming to us from the DB settlement that's your prerogative. It shouldn't be long to find out.GLTY
Olti, we will see soon who is correct
I am confident my opinion is correct that there will be nothing coming to us related to the DB settlement, but I understand your hopeful speculation. GLTY
MBS documentation showing WAMU as the issuer
Doesn't necessarily mean that a tranche or strip was held by the issuer, but if a piece was retained, it would be accounted for on the balance sheet as a held for investment asset, and so would have ended up with JPM in the purchase transaction.
MBS issuers not Required to retain a position
MBS and ABS are structured in a variety of ways, with different types of assets. Position/ tranches of private issues are usually the higher risk layers of the MBS structure that issuers choose to retain. There is no requirement to do so. I realize that we all have opinions about what has occurred in this BK and what is likely to happen next. Opinions are all interesting and add value to the discussion, but opinions based on specific experience in the complex mortgage market are most likely to predict future results. It probably won't be long for this latest Theory/Speculation, to be proven false as usual IMO.
MBS investors own the assets held in DB trusts
The MBS investor asset owners have been receiving the P@I , from the underlying loan payments collected in the loan servicing process minus the servicing fee according to the MBS contract. The DB case is about who is responsible for repurchase obligations on defaulted loans, that caused reductions in expected investor yields. There is not a pile of money collected but never remitted to the owners of the MBS. The case has nothing to do with our escrows. iMO based on decades of specific experiece. Should be obvious soon.
Repurchase Obligations are Liabilities not Assets
Your wasting time hoping for Assets for escrows that don't exist. Based on the ruling, JPM was correct a significant amount will be paid to JPM, nothing for escrows!
JPM bought all assets including servicing rights
Any retained portion, tranche's, of MBS would have been on the WAMU balance sheet and were purchased by JPM just like all the other assets. All of this has been fully disclosed and now ancient history. There are no hidden assets for escrows from the DB trusts. Wait and see, it won't be much longer.
DB case and hearing not related to escrows
There are no assets in safe harbor waiting to be discovered. We will not be served with any notices concerning the DB case because we have no connection with assets involved with the trusts, which were sold to investors and or held on the WAMU balance sheet and purchased by JPM. Theories associated with this case will be proven wrong just like all the previous theories. Next!
Facts and years of specific experience count
Theories that fail time after time year after year are sad and pathetic. Why not accept the truth. What has happened and what has not is self evident, and obvious, not "funny".
Safe Harbor as you explain is absolutely correct
There is no evidence of any assets in safe harbor coming back to our escrow accounts. Look to the WMILT disclosures to estimate potential escrow returns. That is all there is.
Excitement is not Warranted, as usual
The quote is obviously stating what it isn't, it's not a warrant!
IMO the conclusions reached are entirely false eom
Purchase of JPM stock back in 2008, a good hedge
When the " Purchase" by JPM happened back in 2008, I was unfortunately still a large holder of WAMU stock, but I was lucky to have a pretty good knowledge of WAMU and I estimated a large write down to their mortgage loan portfolio and large repurchase obligations that would be coming and it still seemed that JPM was getting a hell of a deal. Having retired from JPM, I had a good bit of JPM stock but on 9/15/ 2008, I bought another large block as a hedge against my losses in WAMU. The JPM share price at that time was 37.00. JPM closed today at 91.01 and it has a quarterly dividend of .48 per share. When we sold The Dime Savings Bank to WAMU, I never imagined that what has happened was even a remote possibility but we all know it did in a remarkable series of events. Reality is real and when you realize, in my case, I was wrong to stay in WAMU to long, well you have to make a new plan. Since I was fortunate enough to have a diversified asset portfolio I had the cash to execute the Hedge strategy and it has worked out very well. The point is the market has no mercy and Fair and Reasonable is a legally defined term that most of us agreed to in this case. The overall market has moved up incredibly in the last twelve months particularly since the Election. I hope many of the WMIH holders have not missed the opportunities available in the Stock market by obsessing on the WAMU tragedy. It's not to late IMO. GLTA
Opinions
Positive opinions about hidden Billions for escrow have been wrong every time without exception. I know, there is still time and hope, for some springs eternal despite what has happened and continues, so we must wait for the final outcome. Meanwhile the average number of posts on the WAMU boards will continue to drop as most visit and read the same old speculations less and less.
19 million cash distribution to tranche 4
3.8 mil to Senior Floating Rate Claims
14.6 mil to PIERS Claims
0.4 mil to General Unsecured Claims
From WMI Liquidating Trust Disbursement check letter
'" You are receiving the enclosed distribution on account of either (1) the proof of claim that you filed in the jointly administered bankruptcy cases of WMI Investment Corp. and Washington Mutual, inc. (collectively, the "Debtors "), Chapter 11 Case No. 08-12228-MFW, or (11) the claim that the Debtors listed as due and owing to you in their schedules filed with the United States Bankruptcy Court, District of Delaware (the Bankruptcy Court), or your Liquidating Trust Interest from WMI Liquidating Trust related to (1) or (11) above."
Nothing new
Checking the forum for the first time this year I find nothing new, just the same old obsession with JPM and events that occurred years ago. Also note the relative absence of past posters on both sides of the escrow unicorn theories. Perhaps the inevitability of an end without escrow billions is slowly becoming a realization to most. Of course, I realize that most is not all, and new theories will continue until the very end IMO I hope 2017 brings some progress to WMIH and the utilization of the NOLs and a resulting improvement in the value of our shares. Good luck, and good health to all in 2017.
BK is correct
The possibility for us to receive cash to our escrow accounts has nothing whatsoever to do with WMIH and is dependent totally on the disclosed amounts available in the WMILT, and their disbursement according to the disclosed and agreed upon waterfall sequence. Every alternate theory concerning life changing escrow recoveries has failed only to be replaced by another one over and over for years now with no results. I expect this will continue until the very end IMO
LOL we agree, it's over sooner than later eom
Simple voodoo
What has happened and what is happening matches what has been written and agreed to
Bob, No legal challenge because No Issue
If there was evidence of undisclosed assets leading parties in interest would demand a disclosure. Their is no evidence, and no expectations of any missing assets so there is No Issue to litigate. IMO
Suggest you read Evintos post 466369
Excellent summary of LT QSR material facts about real assets and claims outstanding with key dates indicating the liquidation process is moving along as planed and agreed to by all parties in interest. No surprises, nothing hidden IMO
Agreed no one can stop the Dream
But, the fact is none of the Dreams have come true yet. IMO, eight years of disclosures, and the fact that no party in interest has demonstrated any interest in finding any missing assets, logically indicates there are none. But, no one can stop someone else from dreaming I guess until the very end. The arguments are interesting if irrational IMO. Live and let live, the end is coming soon enough.