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The assessment in your last post is spot on Gerry if you don't mind me saying.
Recent story from a UK newspaper for our US cousins.
ITM starting to get noticed in corridors of power.
The Star
Fuelling calls for greener future
Published Date: 07 October 2008
By Bob Rae
Sheffield could play an increasingly important role in a Government drive to make the most of alternative energy if local MP Clive Betts gets his way.
The Attercliffe MP is calling for a meeting between ministers responsible for renewable energy and local green energy experts.
Mr Betts made his call after visiting a research and development centre in his constituency, run by pioneering energy business ITM Power. The company has developed domestic scale equipment which can use cheap rate or green electricity – generated by wind or wave power – to split water into hydrogen and oxygen.
The hydrogen can then be used to fuel a car or to run a range of domestic appliances.
Mr Betts said: "At a time when minds are clearly focused on climate change and fuel, I am delighted that ITM have made a significant breakthrough in the potential for the cost-effective production and storage of hydrogen.
"As well as having both national and international potential, I will also be exploring the opportunities for maximising for the Sheffield economy.
"Sheffield has an enviable track record for technological innovation. However, too often the ability and capacity to exploit such innovation commercially has been exported from the city and, often, from the UK."
Mr Betts says he can see potential for ITM's technology to be linked to other local renewable energy developments and he wants those to be explored in talks involving ministers, ITM Power and other local companies.
In addition to creating a mock up of a home powered by hydrogen technology, ITM has also developed a modified car which can run off hydrogen, refuelled by a system that would fit in a domestic garage.
http://www.thestar.co.uk/business/Fuelling-calls-for--greener.4564193.jp
I think we can forget the Ecotricity link I speculated about yesterday. I've been reading Dale Vince's blog and he's not a great supporter of Hydrogen technologies. Unfortunately he's a battery/EV supporter so I doubt very much he would entertain anything from ITM. Oh well back to Ford then
It may be a long shot but possible and the reason isn't an obvious one in my mind.
ITM seem to prefer the small niche Green players rather than the big names. Bi-Fuel Ltd, Roush, HEC, REI, OK they have a couple of links with Boeing and US Navy but to me on the surface they don't appear to get very excited about these. [Whatever happened to the BOC link?]
Anyway if you check out http://www.ecotricity.co.uk and read about the company and the founder [Dale Vince OBE] you'll see that it started from absolutely nothing but one turbine and a farmers field around the mid 90s. This Dale chap seems to have been motivated by an environmental mission too. He was a Hippy/Traveler type by all accounts and reminds me of Mike Strizki in his passion.
I also really like the way the website uses language. Straight talking shooting from the hip without all the corporate up their own backsides bullshit. I particularly like the way they describe the lunacy of wind farm protesters. It's true these people really wind me up too as they just don't get it. They are the type that would soon complain when their lights no longer worked and that my dear friend is where we are heading. http://www.ecotricity.co.uk/projects/plan_shipdham.html
A very useful page on their current and future wind farm projects can be found here http://www.ecotricity.co.uk/wind-parks/ and they only have 30,000 customers at the moment.
As I say maybe a long shot buy they could have been introduced to ITM through the Roush/Ford Dagenham connection. As you normally say....we shall see.
Very interesting indeed Gerry.
Followed up on your findings. Ecotricity are an interesting outfit and the people behind the Dagenham turbines. Under your senario could it be Ecotricity that are assesing the combined HEC Genset and Electrolyser systems and not Ford? Now that would be exciting considering their other customers Co-op Bank, Sainsbury's, B&Q
http://www.ecotricity.co.uk/projects/Ford/plan_ford.html
Ford were obviously impressed and have expanded the project
http://www.environmentalleader.com/2008/04/04/ford-to-install-third-wind-turbine-at-uk-plant/
Thirdly check out the paragraph under the sub heading "Going Off Grid" in the below link.
Car giant Ford teamed up with Ecotricity to set up three wind turbines – visible from the motorway – at their manufacturing plant in Dagenham, London. “We set up an agreement whereby we buy the energy from them and pay a small oncost and they deal with the turbines,” says Ford’s Taylor. The contract has allowed them to make “significant” financial savings he added.
Meanwhile, Ford is looking at other ideas to source green energy for its plants, including using photovoltaics in SPAIN and buying energy abroad.
http://www.climatechangecorp.com/content.asp?ContentID=5434
OK probably means nothing but we see the Spanish link once again?
Hydrogen Engine Center Delivers Generator Set to ITM Power
Delivery Marks Milestone in Collaboration for Turn-key Hydrogen-Fueled System
ALGONA, Iowa--(BUSINESS WIRE)--Hydrogen Engine Center, Inc., (OTC BB: HYEG) (HEC) developer of systems and processes used in the design, manufacture and distribution of alternative fuel internal combustion engines, engine controls and generator systems, has announced the delivery of an 8kW hydrogen-fueled generator set to ITM Power Plc (ITM) for demonstration purposes in the United Kingdom. The delivery of the unit which has been developed and is sized to be suitable for use in conjunction with the ITM electrolyzer based ‘10kW Home refueling Unit’ marks a significant milestone in the Memorandum of Understanding (MOU) between HEC and ITM.
According to the MOU, both parties intend to develop non-polluting grid-independent power systems utilizing HEC’s hydrogen-fueled electrical generator set and engine controller along with ITM’s low cost electrolyzer technology. This system could essentially provide the technology and equipment necessary to operate on renewable energies such as wind and/or solar power.
Ted Hollinger, President and CEO of Hydrogen Engine Center, said, “The delivery of the generator to ITM Power shows evident progress in our joint goal toward producing carbon-free turn-key systems. With the successful testing of our generator set with ITM’s electrolyzer technology, we intend to progress into further discussions with ITM regarding commercialization of the system.”
HEC expects to receive an electrolyzer from ITM on completion of the current ITM development program. Upon receipt of that unit, HEC will begin conducting trial testing on the combined generator-electrolyzer system. ITM will also be conducting trial testing on a similar system. Data collected from both trials will be gathered and analyzed to better determine potential commercialization avenues for the system. Potential markets for these systems may include cell phone towers along with small renewable energy systems (power range up to 30kW), such as wind and solar applications. In addition to those markets, consumers may also see these systems commercialized globally for small business applications and home use. The intent is to increase the system’s capabilities over time to include larger industrial applications (power range between 30kW and 100kW).
Jim Heathcote, CEO of ITM, said, “We have anticipated receiving this unit and we believe that this combination of technologies is highly complementary.”
About ITM Power Plc:
ITM Power Plc believes it has developed and patented the keys to revolutionise the hydrogen economy and is set to become one of the UK’s leading innovators within the alternative energy sources industry. www.itm-power.com
ITM Power is quoted on the London Stock Exchange’s Alternative Investment Market (AIM) under the ticker symbol “ITM”.
http://www.hydrogenenginecenter.com/userdocs/ITM_Shipment_FINAL_091108.pdf
To clarify basbas's previous post to any readers not aware of what he's referring to [6 Green Boxes] story posted below.
September 10, 2008
ITM Power Is Testing Home Refuelling Electrolyser Units And Hopes To Begin Shipments To Partners Soon
By Rue Swabey
Aim-traded fuel cell company ITM Power is struggling to convince investors that it can commercialise its hydrogen technology. In April the company announced an agreement with automotive engineering company Roush Technologies which involved trialling hydrogen-powered vehicles in the UK. Roush will modify existing vehicles to run on hydrogen and also research new types of hydrogen power units. Shortly after the announcement, in July, ITM Power gave a demonstration of its home refuelling system, and its hydrogen petrol bi-fuel vehicle, to journalists and trade customers.
ITM Power, which has developed a low-cost membrane for its fuel-cell stake and electrolyser that eliminates the need for expensive platinum, has attracted a big institutional following. While sentiment was high (the shares reached a high of 351p in 2006), the company was able to tap the market and it now has £26.9 million on the balance sheet, equivalent to four years cash burn. But sentiment turned in January when management revealed problems with the manufacturing of ITM’s 10kW home refuelling unit. That resulted in a further delay to the long-awaited demonstration which only took place six months later.
Although these problems have been addressed, the market is still nervous and ITM Power’s share price has slid from 114p in January to 47.5p today. ITM Power is not the only fuel cell company to have lost value, and other companies, such as Acta and Voller Energy Group are down sharply as investors grow impatient with the inevitable delays in commercialising fuel cell technology. ITM posted a £4 million loss for the year ended 30 April 2008, up from the £2.7 million loss booked a year ago. And management is guiding for an increase in operating costs in 2009, given recent hires and an increase in engineering development work.
In addition to the Roush partnership, ITM Power also has an agreement with the United States Naval Undersea Warfare Centre to help develop advanced power systems for unmanned undersea vehicle applications. While there are no revenues attached to the agreement, the interest of the US Navy underscores the technology’s potential.
ITM Power is currently constructing six home refuelling electrolyser units for internal testing at its production facility in Sheffield. It is a complex process as it involves components from numerous suppliers and safety requirements need to be met. Once the units have been tested internally, ITM will be in a position to book orders from partners for demonstration and testing.
Management expects to demonstrate a refuelling system for commercial vehicles, fork lift trucks and local public transport, in the coming months. In addition to the residential and commercial refuelling systems the company is working on other applications such as hydrogen homes. It is developing a 10kW system that could be used in the home to supply hydrogen to a gas boiler, to a cooker and a small fuel cell. ITM has an agreement with Renewable Energy International (REI) to work on solar hydrogen homes. REI has built the world’s first hydrogen home in the US, and is building a second home in the Cayman Islands.
ITM Power is also developing a small electrolyser which it calls “the chip”. This 1-3kW system has the potential to generate hydrogen on-site for industrial processes. Jim Heathcote, ITM Power’s chief executive, points out that the development is customer-led, and underscores the potential to generate cash flow for the company while more complex applications are being developed and commercialised. If ITM Power is able to move into the delivered bottled hydrogen market, which is worth US$2 billion annually, it would provide much comfort to shareholders and take some pressure of the share price. However in the short-term the market will be waiting for the results of the electrolyser tests.
Excellent point Gerry. When the sp shows strain, emotions take over and one begins to question "Am I doing the right thing being invested in this company" I'm as guilty of this as anyone recently.
However, as you say logic without emotion says nothing negative has occurred. In fact all things being equal, logic says development of the technology will have progressed even further since the last announcement and moved us ever nearer to potential cash generation.
It's so difficult in markets like these to detach and not be emotionally involved. It's easy to become convinced the market knows more than we do personally. In ITM's case I believe you're correct in that the opposite is nearer the truth. ITM is still an unknown or unbelieved or a combination of both.
TT - I feel your pain with your recent loss and I understand how you don't want to repeat the experience. I've been thinking about my .com losses once again this week. Fear breeds fear. I'm trying to keep the faith even though at times that little emotional voice gets the upper hand. Going on holiday the end of this week so will try to relax. What a roller coaster this game is.
LOL... I can see why you thought that was what I was getting at. No I was referring to the facial expression I make when you speculate on the potential size of the markets that ITM's technologies could address. I like Pear drops but the first suck is sometimes a little too much to handle
Wish you wouldn't do posts like your last one Gerry. It makes my mouth go the same as when sucking a pear drop and my eyes turn into Xs
In answer to your question to basbas, if you cast your mind back to this news story I'd say the answer is a firm yes.
'There's a general acceptance that in the early stages of the technology it will be attractive for logistical and support reasons on fleets of vehicles which return to the same depot every night,' said Roush's Adrian Graves
Graves confirmed they are also working with an unnamed global manufacturer of commercial vehicles that has a facility in Essex (Ford's Dagenham plant would seem to fit the bill]
http://www.theengineer.co.uk/Articles/305707/Top+marques.htm
knowtechtrading - Welcome.
It's all between the lines as usual... How do you do that Gerry LOL
If you are even close to being right on this point then forget booking the top table....we can even forget the idea of booking the function room, we'll just take over the entire Hotel for the evening ok
I'm only swing trading 10% remember, therefore personally the risk is acceptable if I miss major news breaking while out. I understand your comment on how a wrongly timed 10,000 sell can start an avalanche if several are playing the game at the same time. However if you are playing as a true ITM LTH and are fully committed to buying back in at the opposite end then it all balances out evntually. As I said until we see cash on the table deals, shorters are unfortunately going to control the SP movements.
As much as I agree that all shorters should be shot at dawn, why sit back and let them be the only one's to profit while we true believers just sit and wait for the value to be recognised? That day will of course soon arrive but after 3 years of loyalty it's a bit of a wind up seeing the system benefiting the vultures rather than the loyal.
PS. I maybe would have won the bet but as I said earlier how would I have secured my winnings? Even halala whiskey wouldn't have made it here. Unless your version of halala whiskey is a bottle of cold Liptons sugar minted tea??? Nice, that always makes me want to party big time.
A very steady set of results and happy to hold. However, until we get a concrete sign of a real commercial {$} deal then it looks like the shorters will remain in control and keep us swinging between 40p - 60p.
On this note I'm kicking myself this morning as I had my finger hovering over the sell button @ 60p [playing with 10% of my long term holding LTH]..... but hesitated missed the chance and sold at 55p instead. Still, we are continuing to fall as I type so will buy back in when we hit the mid to low 40's. Might as well have some fun while we wait for the big fireworks to arrive.
LOL, yes of course I remember. Mr Holmes would be proud of you.
I'd just like to highlight one other sentence from the 2004 h2fc link in your previous post Gerry.
Under "H2FC's View" subheading towards the end of the article we get :-
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Expect the PEM "establishment" to try to ignore ITM for as long as it can, then try to talk it down.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I believe we have passed through the "ignore" stage and have now entered the "talk it down" phase.
So, we have a little time remaining to top up our positions before we hit the last pattern of behaviour "capitulation & resignation".
Gerry
Played the video over and over to a couple of the guys at work today....Both were of the opinion that he did say "In a years time". Well spotted and I'm happy to be in the minority.
As someone pointed out on the other board, did you also notice the large military truck parked outside the Roush workshop doors at the start of the video and half way through? OB trial maybe?
Interesting Gerry but I'm not sure if I interpreted what he said the exact same way as yourself. I transcribed word for word what he said and I think it could mean something else. However the stutter in the second part could be a give away. First the transcript.
"and it will be the same infrastructure that we are putting in that will come later for the FC obviously. Urm, these vehicles are available today [this is the point he gestures looking over his shoulder at the Transit] This one will be available in August [08?] but they're available today. The FC will be in (?) years time [To my ear he misses out "a" i.e "in a years time"? "in years time" could just be a manner of speech meaning in many years time when FC's do become cheaper?]
However the next part a few seconds later when he stutters* a little is curious and you might be on to something there :-
"as it will be for the FC vehicle that's going to come along lat*[er] years late to come"
basbas, BABBO get the video on your computer before it's re-edited as we need a third and fourth opinion. The highest vote wins
ps. As Gerry points out the video is badly edited towards the end with a silent repeat segment running on. If someone has a family member with lip reading abilities we might uncover a snippet or two
Thanks for the breakdown, pretty incredible figures.
Here in Saudi 91 octane is 45 Halala a litre which works out to be around 46 cents a gallon [annoying eh?]
Thailand is slightly more expensive than the States Premium gas at around $4.75 a gallon
Gerry, maybe interesting for USA readers to understand what's going on at the pumps in the UK. It has just been predicted that UK gas prices are likely to hit around $3 A LITRE !! NOT GALLON !! by the end of the year. Oh how we long for a USA $4 gallon in dear old Blighty. The need for ITM's piece of plastic has never been greater.
http://money.uk.msn.com/investing/news/article.aspx?cp-documentid=8854580
No prob Gerry.
Now this one is current and most interesting indeed... Ford????
"ITM has already been approached by a major American car manufacturer about licensing its technology, but said it intends to keep the technology in-house until ready to commercially produce it."
http://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/news/Firm-unveils-hydrogen-solution-to.4274009.jp
So within the next 6 to 12 months we should see a major licensing deal?
Gerry
You've made a mistake posting the Yorkshire Forward Grant info.
This is from 29th July 2005.
If you go back to the link today you'll notice the date has now changed to the 10th of July.....bad design of that website as I've seen others fooled by this before.
My advice is always double check Pork Belly's submissions. He isn't being malicious but he does have a habit of posting old news as new.
http://www.itm-power.com/news/11.pdf
basbas you're probably correct thinking about it, especially now G has just turned up. OK I'll see how much of it I can stand and will then retreat gracefully back here if it all gets too much.
It seems the ITV evening news coverage was better than the BBC's earlier attempts. Unfortunately the ITV.com video clip won't play unless you are resident in the UK. More professional seems to be the general consensus. Did any of you guys manage to see it?
basbas - Not to the known clowns, no of course not, but would be good to provide a helping hand to new arrivals who are genuinely interested. One or two arrived today so would be a real shame to have them frightened off by the morons.
Gerry - yes I noticed that yesterday but only happened to me when I tried to access the IH charts.
I thinks it's going to be a long week correcting all the inaccuracies that are emerging on the other boards...Arrrrrr if I hear another ref to the Hindenburg I'll I'll I'll - I was going to say explode er lose my faith in human intelligence
In general a good start to the PR if not a little disappointing SP reaction....still early days I suppose. Couple of links that cover the story admirably.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-1033683/Fill-car--home-hydrogen-fuel-station.html
http://www.thestar.co.uk/news/Firm-paves-way-for-alternative.4268876.jp
Hi Guys good to see you all here. Lets do our best to enlighten our American friends of the amazing opportunities presented by ITM. Last five top ups were @
27 Feb 69p.
28 Feb 72p.
06 May 46p.
24 Jun 46.5p.
30 Jun 54p.
Now have an average of 97p. Won't be long basbas before even your wife and children love you again. SP following a similar pattern to Friday and Monday. Lazy morning - exciting afternoon. Expecting some fiz towards the close today.
Regards Conno