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Viking
Bayer was there the day before I got there. Three people showed up and specifically they were auditing BIEL's quality control process. I asked Keith what the rest of that process looked like but I did not get an answer (I asked in email later). Both AW and KN were obviously frustrated (but in a jovial way) because they were just venting on how long it takes to actually start doing business with such a giant company. Wish I had an answer of when all of this will start because MHO is AW just needs to keep holding out a little bit longer before his cash-flow problem is fixed. Once that is fixed...well let's put it this way I am already starting to think about the additions I am going to do to my house.
No worries. I saw him inside their building one week ago today. Hopefully he is on his phone and PC hustling with his vast network so the pipeline is full once clearance comes.
For all that don't know or understand
Bioelectronics qualified for a new (2012 launch new) FDA program that is designed to fast track the approval process.
Here is the law if you care to read it or just read the wiki page
insert-text-here
Here is the information on the FDA's page explaining it:
insert-text-here
Here is the list of all the drugs granted approval as a result of this process:
insert-text-here
I mean seriously...read the companies, drugs and how few there really are. Our small little BIEL went in to a meeting with the FDA and they left with guidance to be on this list. This is a list of giants! And that is exactly what BIEL will be. If only I could convince my work place to give me BIEL shares instead of my 401k...
This is going to be a lot of fun!
My theory is all the smart people do nothing and since there is any news at all the MM’s make money off the swing traders by playing games. I can’t and never have been able to see level 2 but that’s my theory. Any time there is news there are swing traders and that is like a big kahuna burger for breakfast for the MM’s.
Yes - because he brought it straight from storage and where the assemblers work. However I have no clue of a phase-out process, status, plans to do it etc. I should have asked but did not. They might not segregate stock at all and let it fly but I really don't know.
My personal opinion of the tape is it is practical and the material is much softer but I see a dog bone. I thought if they removed the edge bone look and just made it straight like a bow-tie would be better. These look die cut so it is as easy as making a new die...cheap to do.
lol. That was funny Viking.
Sree did say it was custom developed. They are very mindful of not having issues with users taking the device off and ripping their hair etc. Pretty sweet...did it a few times myself and it is a world better than say a band-aid.
Srin
AW gave a few of the new boxes and the new tape but I can't figure out how to paste a picture on here. You will see what it looks like. Help!
Not that i am against sharing of such transformational information but since it is not my work I do not feel comfortable giving it to others. Contact Sree and maybe you will get it.
Then you will like this - Sree sent me his PhD dissertation just because I want to read it. Nothing to do with investing just enjoying the read about the technology that is going to help all of us. Only thing is it is over 400 pages!!! Geeeez
Can’t help but to feel sentimental about it. I told AW that I had to hand it to him and he stuck with it. I remember that Wall Street award too!
Yes I saw shipping and a peek at production. They were making product and shipping boxes. It’s normal operations for a small company but this difference is at any moment it can erupt and that can happen in more than one way. That office is gone and they upgrade quick. That’s the risk/reward in investing in something like this. The only thing is this one is a story for the ages...
That’s for sure. Cheers
I don’t know the answer to your first two questions but I do know that the result of the first May meeting was to fast track the approval through a new pre-submission process at the fda. I am certainly not an expert on the nomenclature or the fda process but some others on the board may be. I just know our paperwork is sitting at the fda office and to my understanding it could only mean we are waiting for someone there to pick up the job and put it through. Again, I am not certain but this is my understanding. They were pulled from boots online bc I believe with the NHS you have to either be on the shelves or behind the counter. They chose behind the counter and the result is the current business with b brain which is better imo. With b Braun we have more resources to roll out to other countries etc. I believe the rest of Europe with follow suit soon. So if we cheer for anything on that front cheer for b Braun and the total pathways program. More people using that pain management process equals more actipathes. This is what I understand happened. Sucks though because we were number one online. I could be mistaken about the specifics but this is my understanding.
Very clever question...
AW was vegan for a long time and as I understand he goes back and forth with it. Your answer is two because he broke the streak of all vegan for whatever length of time.
Give it time Steve :)
Soon it will be T-bones!
I think even some long term investors read words on a page and trade stock prices you see on the internet and not realize that there are real human beings that make it all happen. It wasn't that hard to get a meeting. Just a short introduction about me and what I hope to accomplish (in email) and he said yes...so why not?! Just thinking if I asked them to all get together so I can take a group selfie to prove to people on the internet that I don't know that I was really there. They would think what kind of dude is this??
My opinion - Andy would not do this. However a dollar? I mean that would be hard to turn down but I don't believe Pharma would do this so quickly. Andy has worked too long and too hard just to hand this over for cash - even if it is a lot of cash. There is a sentimental feeling with plucking the fruits of your labor rather than selling the recipe to make the seeds.
Someone said 18 cents - well I don’t know about that but who knows what happens if cleared in the US. I mean if any of the big guys get wind and bring maybe $50M to the table then sure maybe 18 cents based on future earnings. I doubt it though, we could only be so lucky and if they brought that kind of money they may want a share of the company and I will bet my house AW never does that.
My opinion - at least a penny maybe two
As deals get made I bet we see these step function increases after the short term swing traders and MM’s get done.
Find out how many people in Sweden have the same procedures as in the UK under Total Pathways and multiply that yearly number by two for min amount of actipathes in Sweden. Multiply by 8 for max amount, so pick four and there you go.
The b Braun total pathways product will eventually encompass all of the EU so do the math. Only thing is...do you have the patience?
I met with Andy, Keith, Sree and John (engineering and development). They were very welcoming and interested in my ideas and thoughts. It all felt like a once in a lifetime experience to go to a small company and literally know that the entire pain management market can be turned upside down with this product.
Hurry up and get there soon if you decide to go. They might be extremely busy in the near future.
Serious respect for AW. I know a lot of longs were frustrated that we had to wait this long but the potential is worth a hell of a lot more than ten years of waiting. None of this is possible without his many years and weekends of tenacity.
I won't say too much as we had private discussions but the theme is we know most of what I talked about with them anyway.
I had a hard time believing how much of a powder keg this tech could be and what I walked away with is it is an entire damn ship of gunpowder! The applications beyond pain - tinnitus, overactive bladder, migraine etc the research muscle is through the roof and the pipeline of various applications is enormous. Just the Actipatch alone can be marketed a million different ways.
FDA - should have happened already...our day will come. It will give us a hunting license to go after any application we want. IMO - don't magically expect millions in sales the next Q numbers, they have under 20 people! Give it time. We know the story, share price skyrockets then it slams back 50% then numbers come and 50% more leave...blah blah blah. The difference is now Wall Street could see it and send some cash.
My main question - how do we sell all of this and what method? That's why Keith is the greatest thing to happen recently. Very well connected, motivated and driven. It won't be easy but going through various big pharma programs as a piece of the program is best. Mass education is needed at the doctor level and the quickest way is get the thing on as many people as possible the the results will be overwhelming that it works and the sales follow suit. Consumer shelves model? Not many buy it unless they know what it is, we will get there...
Biggest problem is cash, we all know it. My feeling is once FDA broad clearance then hopefully we get a huge investment from a customer and payoff all the development debt and hire people.
SEC? Don't worry about it the whole thing is ridiculous. Andy spoke in detail about it and he will conquer it. I see zero barrier with this topic. Andy won't let the SEC jerk him around - serious props to him because one thing he is TOUGH.
Bayer? Moving forward...slowly. IMO - our day will come
When are we profitable? I have my opinions. Personally, you would have to be insane or not know what you have to sell any piece of this gold mine.
My recommendation - if you want to know more call them. But don't act like an investor trying to make a quick buck, you will get what you paid for. These are very respectful accommodating people and they will talk to you. But don't go try and do their jobs for them, just do DD and intelligent questions that won't put them in a corner. Don't ask about numbers or timing just learn about the facts and what is developing then go do your own valuation. They don't know the exact value either but the more you know the better you can make your own value calculation.
Glad I went - they even made me lunch! Friday is burger and dog day if you go!
China Cat
I have a meeting with them tomorrow.
Someone please help me understand - aren’t we suppose to be on the shelves at Boots Pharmacy in the UK? Why can’t I find the Actipatch anywhere on their website? Am I missing something?
TruthBeSaid - I read your private comment. Please private message me an email address. I cannot respond here.
Thank you
Investor meeting request accepted
Andy accepted my request to meet with him at his office next week. I believe Keith will also be in attendance. I gave him a couple of topics I would like to discuss and he accepted the invite so hopefully we have an insightful conversation. Most of my questions are around after we have broad clearance how are they going to market themselves. I want to get their long term sense of how they will do this. Right now is the distributor model and I am curious about taking the semiconductor model and just sell the core IP tech and have the customer (Braun or bayer for example) make the housing, branding and market it. They are small so they have little marketing budget and I think some of those guys help is imperative but maybe I am wrong. Should be fun. I am making the drive down from Philly.
I am also very interested in seeing if he envisions a path to the nasdaq or something like that but I know he is just concerned with sales, partnerships and profit. The rest of the dominos fall when that happens.
I will let the group know my two cents in a couple of weeks.
Stocky! 10 years here.
I still can’t believe they overcame all the years of FDA bs and haters. Shorts made a ton on this stock over the years but shorts can’t make squat without buyers...we bet that the buyers will conquer bc the technology is that revolutionary. Now the FDA says basically “don’t bother coming to the meeting, you’re straight, submit and wait.” However we will need to execute with the sales and a huge partner will help and once all that happens and we get off the OTC markets then maybe I consider selling one share...
Toohot
Long here, I just don’t think they have the cash to do it...yet. It’s all part of the “loop” we are in. News is great to move the stock needle but until we have sales and strong margin, which we do have solid margin on the goods sold, we won’t get to a better exchange. Also, IMO, we don’t get to a better exchange without s buyback. The shares will have to be consolidated so maybe a combo of r/s and buyback? We need to get off the OTC so MM cannot do whatever they want. Our day with come!
DB
Really well thought out and communicated. You just explained my thoughts over all of these years as well. I especially like your compliment to Andy. He really has been a relentless fighter and us longs knew he was right. Frustrating - yes but better for us in the end - I believe so.
Cheers
DB
I know, you are completely right. I checked mid cap med device cos market value and not many make money at all. I am assuming the worse but profits are king.
This is going to take time. I have been waiting for many years but full clearance is in sight now. Full clearance still means they have to make profit. When you read previous financials the margin is solid but sales are low because the marketing explosion has not happened yet. We need the help of a large company and the deals with the UK and Bayer help with that. That news is still very short term thinking. The amount of applications possible with the technology are what make this company possibly worth billions. There will still be a few day trader swings up and down that will happen but if you study across several years and consider actual company valuation the baseline increases because more small investors actually study and put their future in BIE
Nope it’s number 3 - I have bought very high years ago but over time and specifically nov of 2017 bought a huge number and my average is very low as a result.
I am another ten year investor and I will share that I was down every single day until the recent run up from the trip zeroes. I never sold one share because I see this monster potential. Try and focus on the fact that we are gaining more approvals and sales avenues and are still only valued as an 8-figure company. And I say “only!” I am way up now but I know the pain of seeing a virtual red figure in my investment. Patience will win but as we all know patience can be a b*tch. Stay strong friends
Exactly correct Blatch
I am in the ten year camp too. This core technology can create true disruption in the market. I have seen a million people fly in and out of this stock and all they are doing is trading a stock symbol. They have little to zero knowledge of what is actually going on. BIEL keeps their cards close to their chests and I will admit a little more loose with news would help us investors but it hurts them as a company - why would you divulge anything when you know you are holding a potential true pain relief game changer? People scream about the number of outstanding shares but us longs know that they did not go to banks for capital. Why? I can't answer for sure but what I see is they bet on themselves by printing more shares because when they release all of this once-in-a-lifetime products they don't want to turn around and give the money right back to someone else. I really applaud Andy for doing this even though it was agonizing seeing your share value drop all the time due to dilution across ten years...the newcomers have no clue to this stuff, the haters are just bored and need to find something better to do with themselves.
I admit that yesterday was a worry to me when we hit 0.0025 but the rebound on much lower volume closed in the low 0.003's. That told everyone that the longs hold and were smart to buy more. Everyone else panicked and left. I have seen this story probably 30 times in my ten years and that is not an exaggeration.
I hardly ever post but hopefully this helps newcomers understand the past and decide if they invest long term or not.
Best of luck. This stock was always my "moonshot" and that moon is not so far away anymore...
DB you are right, happened sooo many times before. The swing traders see a good thing and come in and then take profits, but they have no skin in the long term game. It's not like these meetings and sales deals are not true anymore...the stock market is funny sometimes. People forget that there is a real company doing business and it's not just watching an ETrade screen move numbers up and down.
Get the short term thrill seekers out and the solid money stays. All of this will happen again and again and again until BIEL becomes the multi-billion dollar company they are destined to be and these small time players cant move the stock this much.
It is a repeat but this time the news is linked to many different news sources so now more people will read it
I am one of the original investors with BIEL and today’s public news, that you can find anywhere, is the biggest news they released since the FDA approved knee and foot Feb 2017.
Last few days the total amount of money traded trended up faster than ever before. Today’s news is going to get a strong response from a lot of people that have no idea who bioelectronics even is as a company.
Art,
Ten year investor here.
I completely agree with your vision on what this is going to do. In the past, we had great news and a spike then a quick run back down to the original position. The difference here is we are much further along in the various opportunities and years ago we did not have the NHS/B Braun deal to hang our hat on. It is different now, the FDA is actually listening and not giving us the political BS run around when we are holding strong data.
After ten years I am finally way up in this stock but it is not a measure how much someone is up it is a measure on what you think this company could become. There are countless mid-cap multi-billion dollar drug manufacturing companies that turn ZERO profit. Our little engine that could, can turn a profit right now!
Like always with BIEL...patience patience patience. If you play your cards right even the new investors can walk away with very nice returns. And I am talking about not how many percent up you could be I am talking about how many times you doubled.
This is the first time I am posting here but I have been a BIEL investor for a very very long time, since 2008.
So cool to hear from the long timers coming out now. You can see it reading these boards. They have finally gotten a handle on the R+D side and now those opportunities in the pipeline rival multi-billion dollar corps. The sales side is starting to turn around and now this is just Niagara Falls trying to be collected in a five gallon bucket.
If you jump in and out of this stock that’s fine. I bet on the tech in 2008 and I am happy to say that the old timers were right! That feels so good to say bc for most of that time I was down MAJOR. Now, I am fully loaded with a boat load of shares and every day it goes up. The word is finally out and the amount of BIEL share holders in a few months might break the server that supports this chat board.
I honestly think the market will think this is a $1-2 billion dollar company. That means a nickel or a dime a share.
Good news from the FDA next month might get us out of the small player OTC fund traders and on to the real players trading the big exchanges.
This stock is now very sentimental to me. I thought the red tape of the fda would have killed them years ago and would have had to file for bankruptcy. I can’t believe they got through with the feb 2017 ruling. When that happened I knew one day it would happen and that day is here!
All the best to you BIEL old timers and best of luck to the new guys. It would be insane to me to sell one freakin share anything below at least two pennies.
Do your own DD
Thank you Mr. Whelan for not giving up