Register for free to join our community of investors and share your ideas. You will also get access to streaming quotes, interactive charts, trades, portfolio, live options flow and more tools.
Register for free to join our community of investors and share your ideas. You will also get access to streaming quotes, interactive charts, trades, portfolio, live options flow and more tools.
Certainly has the raging part down hasnt he.
Only 8+/- more days until the next PR, I can hardly wait. Do you think our new 'secretary':) can lead us to the promised land? (s'ok, thats rhetorical).
OT, check out EPYR. Theyre applying for a share float of 1 billion, even though they only have 32mill O/S right now? Planning ahead? Or something coming up?
Latest news:
http://www.pinksheets.com/quote/news.jsp?url=fis_story.asp%3Ftextpath%3D%5C2004%5C12%5C02%5CEDGARNew...
Not sure why they are applying for a 1 billion share float when they only have 32 mill O/S? Something big coming up? be better to boost the price first.
Hmm, looks like someone is on a venting tirade?
Good products with lots of potential. And now they have those rocket scientists working for them! I picked up on a analyst recommendation giving a target of $15 in one year. Reasonable share count, books look ok, timing seems right. I guess all that remains is to finalize the product line and hope everyone picks up on the need for its use.
I, for one, would love to hear an opinion from someone who has not been subject to the negetivity of this board (not that Im saying any of your opinions are incorrect), even if all we get is a good laugh. Sometimes an outside opinion gives an objectivity that none of us can provide. It would be interesting to hear just what new potential investors are thinking about what is going on. If anyone is going to get us out of this mess it will be the new blood.
You could be right, that's just the latest number I was able to find. Point is, that companies 'restructure' their shares in order to push the share price up, usually to well over $1. It opens up a lot more financing avenues. At 1/2 cent a share right now, they'd have to do a 1 for 200 to get to a buck, which is not a very practical number when you consider they would be left with 190,000 shares outstanding (not to mention it would really soak the present shareholders if the price ran down again, which it often does). Their best bet is to run the price to 10 cents or so and do a 1 for 10 (or even 20). Makes the share price look good (at $1-$2), isnt too hard on present shareholders, and still leaves them with a respectable 1.9-3.8 mill shares O/S. That considered, the run fron 1/2 cent to 10 cents is where the money is to be made right now. JMO. (and remember, this company has 'restructured' twice already. It makes you look like a money pit if you do it too many times in a short period).
I thought LB had a Ferrari :)
Newer news than the above. Oct 12, 2004 I believe.
Empyrean Communications Inc., Houston
Robert L. Lee, 713/260-7236
Empyrean Communications Inc. (OTCBB:EPYR) announced the appraisal for the building under consideration for purchase has been delayed due to the four severe hurricanes that occurred in Florida. It will now be about another three weeks before this appraisal will be available for review.
A decision has been taken to call for a special shareholders meeting to consider and approve (a) a restructuring of the authorized stock of the corporation and (b) a name change for the corporation to reflect the recently formulated corporate development plans.
Will be interesting to see how they are going to 'restructure' the shares considering they only have 21 mill outstanding right now. If theyre going for a more repectable stock price, then based on todays quote they would have to do a 1 for 250 reverse split. That would only leave them with 84000 O/S shares! Not likely. They would most likely have to pump the price up to about a dime and do a 1 for 10. We'll see.
Anybody got a notice for the meeting yet? Me neither. Hmm.
Nice to see a board on this one, Ive been following it for over 3 years now. They've had a case of bad luck so far - right products at the wrong time. They need to define themselves and get on a project soon. I believe the basalt fibre thing is on the back burner. They had a merger fall through a few months ago and announced they were changing their business direction. O/s shares are in good standing. Screams buy at the moment, but probably for 1-2 year term, and if they dont get something going soon they could turn into another bulliten board scammer, pawning off shares and not really accomplishing anything but lining their pockets. I bought way back before the tech crash. They owned a network of OC-92 hi speed network backbone fibre but the crash took care of that idea. I think they still own it. Not much happened in the last couple of years, a couple of share consolidations (reverse split) to sit in good shape there, but having no ongoing business put the share price into the toilet. Love to see them get out of it.
Sorry, I keep trying to think of this logically. And I guess it all depends on what you consider a big time investor. I personally would not throw $6 grand at something that is 3 cents. And if you go into smaller lots, commissions eat up your profits. Even at an $8 commission ($16 to buy and sell) thats 34% the stock must go up just for you to break even (and most commissions arent that low).
On the other hand, if you go 100's of thousands of shares, and we factor in what many have suggested (the corporates artificially holding the stock price down so no one else can get out), your chances of making money are slim as well. If you bought exactly at .025 and sold for exactly .035 (and remember, you are trying to sell 100's of 1000's of shares AGAINST the wishes of the corporates - as some suggest (there are only so many buyers out there)) you could make 1 or 2 grand, minus commissions. But also keep in mind the position this company is in at this point of time, potentially on the verge of becoming 'less' than a penny stock. Are you willing to throw $6 grand at it? Im not. I also cant see consultants signing on, for shares as compensation, if this stock is truly heading towards a .00x price. The only logic to that is if they are looking for a tax loss. I do believe this stock will rise yet, even if it is for one last gasp before it dies. Be ready to take the money and run.
I appreciate your opinion in this trainz, and all others who comment. If the only thing we all get out of this is knowledge and experience, then every opinion counts.
I also agree whole heartedly with your last comments, what a waste. What will be worse is, another party will likely make something out of the technology some years down the road after we all have lost our investment. What a waste.
Looks quite right although I can never imagine who's doing the buying? Investors often forget that the selling/dumping of shares is only one side of a trade, someone has to buy them. I cant believe there are that many 'uninformed, smalltime, patsy investors' out there who are buying enough to support that kind of volume. Someone big has got to be buying too.
Know any good sites that show trade depth and statistics? The one I used to use shut down.
These are the exercise prices I was referring to. See document: http://www.secinfo.com/d12TC3.1HEc.htm#1stPage.
"Warrants to purchase 12,000,000 shares of Common Stock
exercisable at $0.03 to $.10 per share through April 2006.
Also from same document:
"We cannot predict the actual number of shares of Common Stock that will
be issued pursuant to the Standby Equity Distribution Agreement, in part,
because the purchase price of the shares will fluctuate based on prevailing
market conditions and we have not determined the total amount of advances we
intend to draw. Nonetheless, we can estimate the number of shares of our Common
Stock that will be issued using certain assumptions. Assuming we drew down the
entire $5,000,000 available under the standby equity distribution in a single
advance (which is not permitted under the terms of the Standby Equity
Distribution Agreement) and the purchase price was equal to $0.03 per share ,
then we would issue 172,000,000 shares of our Common Stock to Cornell. These
shares would then represent 59.5% of our outstanding Common Stock upon issuance.
The Company is registering 172,000,000 shares of Common Stock for the sale under
the Standby Equity Distribution Agreement. Since the number of shares we are
registering is an approximation and depending on our market price, there could
be an insufficient number of shares to fully utilize the equity line of credit
and we may be required register additional shares of Common Stock."
Note they are only registering 172 mil shares (which is still too much for my liking but what can you do), assuming that the share price will rise in the future. So once again, the actual ability of this company to pull out a 'performance' and move forward, will determine the amount of dilution we are subject to. I cant help but think that the consultants and lenders would not be content enough to dump their shares at 3 cents. IMO there will be some movement in the stock price this year, how much I cannot guess.
Tread carefully Gamood. These things take lots of positives to get off the ground. Tons of shares out there too. Good side of that is they will need to push the price to .05+ before they can consolidate (1 for 20 seems likely) so there is lots of room for profit right now. If it doesnt pan out it will come crashing down even faster though. Be prepared to get out fast. Remember the 'buy on speculation, sell on confirmation' rule. Right now the 'speculation' seems to be building, but the math says they cannot hold a higher price without humongous revenues or a reverse split.
What? The 1 for 50 reverse split?
Hmm, an exercise price of 6 cents. Can we hope for that?
Well isnt that convienient. Transferred from LB eh! Do you suppose BJ'll cancel them, or sell them on LB's hehalf? Perhaps this leads to a PR we'd all like to hear? Or maybe Hasher can elaborate on a conclusion to the preceedings of LB's deposition? I cant wait to hear BJW's explanation for this one.
I was just looking back on the PR's and noted a couple of things. They seem to come out in 2-4 weeks periods so we're not due for about another 10 days yet (assuming weve missed the 2 week occurrence). Anybody wanna suggest what they'll spew this time? Or, what could they possibly spew that would be considered concrete?
For some reason I keep looking at the one about LB locking up 27 mill shares. It finally dawned on me that one of the criteria I use when reviewing a stock is that they have less than 20 mill shares O/S. Someone reading that PR and seeing a 'FORMER' CEO holding 27 million will be scared off rather quickly wondering how many shares are really out there if one guy holds 27 mill.
Further to that, and I think this may have been mentioned before, the only real hope this company has, is for LB to be convicted, and his shares, plus another (say) 40 mill (that he issued to 'consultants') get cancelled (and Im guessing the 'consultants' dont own their shares anymore so that wont be happening), leaving the company with a reasonable share count to work with. This would be an unprecidented situation (to my knowlege) should it happen so Im not holding my breath.
Oh well, back to sleep to dream another dream of success.
(PS, Hasher, whats up with the news you suggested may happen?)
No hard feelings here. Twas fun in the absence of any PTI news.
Thanks gamood.
Am now. Just picked up on it on a recommendation. Bought in at 2.38. Whats with the news yesterday. Good news and the stock tanks? Something I dont know?
Too quiet. I only watch 2 boards here and they are both dead for a week now.
Good to see someone still alive here.
I know you probably cant answer but I'll ask anyway - Care to elaborate on what 'revealing' means?
What do you suppose the chances are of the company coming out in any sort of good shape from the case? Cant we just throw LB where he belongs and start anew? Oh yeah thats what BJW says we are doing. Lets get going BJ! I cant wait to be rich!
zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz...
Been lookin at VNTB. I did follow this a year or so ago. It was promising at 3 cents but is currectly far below that. Big longshot now Id have to say. Just didnt seem to take off.
You got that right, the time is now! They need some sort of action while everyone is still thinking about the hurricanes. The kettle is hot.
Glad to see the trading stabilize. Guess I got in a couple of days too early.
VNTB looks intersting but hard to find info that is recent. O/S shares are dated from 2001 with a 1 for 100 reverse split pending? Ive seen numbers at only 500000+ shares outstanding, seems a little hard to believe considering the share price. Would be nice to know where things stand right now. The name sounds farmiliar to me, I think I followed this before.
750million "AUTHORIZED"!!! Not actually issued and out there yet. In the life of this company there are only 100 million (plus a few) actually issued. Since when, 1996 I believe. So thats 100 million divided by 8 years = 12.5 million per year, times an average price of 30 cents over the years(anybody wanna guess on this) = $3.75 million per year divided by how many parties (LB, AS, WM, BW, engineers, research companies, other developers, etc)so thats 6 parties, minimum, = $625,000 a year, per party, MINUS EXPENSES! Yes they do have expenses (it costs money just to issue the shares! Have an office, pay the power bill). And seriously thats probably high. But I guess if someone paid me that to put up some phoney PR's and pay the bills I wouldnt complain. But with a little bit of effort they could have had millions. The original analyst report in 2001 called for a price of $18/share by end of 2006. So LB's 27million shares alone could have been worth $486million. Some analysts were calling for $100/share. You'd have to be some kind of idiot to turn that down.
Or here's another idea. Drive the stock price to $1, issue 5million shares in a private placement, and bam, theres that financing deal that they just made, but now its owned by PWTC instead of someone else. Build the prototype, issue more shares, at probably more than $1 now, and build your own damn production facility. Now 100% of the profits are owned by PWTC. This is probably what the analysts saw when they first issued their forcasts. Takes some kind of idiot to screw that up (I know, dont answer that).
But anyway, Im tired of doing the math for all of you so Im off for tonight. See you tomorrow for another exciting episode of AS the Battery Cranks. :)
"it would almost be impossible to push this thing anywhere near 1.00, at the current state of development".
You forget this company once sold for $2 a share, with the same BS(?) stories coming out. That is why I say they need something concrete to occur if they really want to capitalize on share dumping.
"if they drive the price past .04 cents they get the stock thrown right back at them"
How do you figure 'right back at them'? Once new stock is issued the company doesnt buy it back on trades, it is bought by other investors.
"The principals have hundreds of millions of shares available, that they can dump at .03+ cents, for huge money in their pockets"
100million x 3.5 cents = $3.5 million, divided by how many parties? Hardly big bucks. 100million shares at $1 = $100million - now thats big bucks. But I guess if its free money...although it is costing them something to duck and cover their asses all the time eh?
"why let it get too high and let others have a chance of dumping."
Because 'other' shareholders coming and going is what drives stock prices up. There is always someone who thinks a stock is worth more than it is now. But if you suppress it on purpose, then you never have that opprotunity. All they have to do is hold off on dumping and they will see what happens.
In the end Hasher, I just think these guys are missing out on the bigger opprotunity.
I still fail to see the logic of keeping the price low. Every book Ive read on stock promotions depicts the promoter pushing prices up by creating a false euphoria. The promoter knows when things are going to happen and therefore has the control to know when and how much to buy and sell. (Yes they do 'play' the stock as opposed to just dumping). The higher a stock price goes, the more investors you get jumping on the bandwagon, willing to pay any price to get in on the action. Since the promoter has control on when the promotion stops as well, he can be fully liquidated, thereby leaving shareholders holding the bag when the bottom falls out.
Why do the PWTC chimps continue to be happy selling stock for 3 cents when they could easily push it to $1 and make 30 times more cash (if they really are just dumping)? They do not seem to know how to run a promotion (ie: keeping their shares on the side until the price rises). A real promoter does not care who else makes money, just that they do themselves. Or, this is not a promotion at all, just businessmen who havent got a clue.?
The trades at 2.5 cents have been minimal in volume. Only 17500 shares total today. The ask has now changed to .05 (depending on which board you watch), which is high and the spread is wide at the moment. A few trades at the ask may start a upward drive. Keep in mind also that few investors actually read OTC stock news EVERYday like we do. It will take some time for the news to filter down and people to react. Also keep in mind that, as hasher continues to remind us, that this could all be bogus, again. Serious upward motion will probably not occur until something solid happens, like an actual prototype. Long way to go yet.
Not worried yet. I just didnt expect such a drop. I buy companies with the intention of holding for at least a year so Im in for the longer run.
Hmm, good thing we hired that patent lawyer to be CEO eh? Perhaps some movement afterall?
Hasher, dont quite follow what this has to do with LB's case anymore. Company's trying to move ahead. If LB ends up in jail, then we can leave him behind for good. Im thinking this is why he locked up those shares - to protect them when he's in the big house.
And dont worry that the patent is 'pending'. Most companies products are on the market long before a patent is ever granted. Cumon, you cant possible tell me you have never bought a product that says 'patent pending' on it?
hockeydoc5 - the 'issues' seem to be clearing up.
Anyway, long way to go yet. And if this company's history is any indication, the fun is just begining.
7 cent close! What up? Either we're already dead or those buying at this price will make a fortune.
Anyone want to disseminate this story?
http://www.globeinvestor.com/servlet/WireFeedRedirect?cf=GlobeInvestor/config&vg=BigAdVariableGe...
I dont know how they are going to 'restructure the authorized stock' considering they only have 22 million shares O/S. Certainly the price needs help at .005 (to secure financing), but even if they do a 1 for 10, that only pushes the price to 5 cents. they would have to do a 1 for 100 to make the price make any sense (1 for 200 really)but that would leave them with 220,000 shares (110,000 shares)?
I still think this one is very promising.
I get a kick out of the bid and ask after the market close. Wall Street City has PWTC bid 1 cent, ask 1.04 (wouldnt that be nice). I know, its just traders pulling their orders off the board at the end of the day. Had a stock once that was trading at $4 and when the markets closed the ask would go to over $1000!
PS to all - Wall Street City is shutting down as of Nov 1. Another good site down the toilet. They provide a link to a new site but you have to register and no doubt pay up if you want any info! I havent been able to figure out how to get into the site yet.
Isnt that always the way though, looks good on paper. I have a few friends who are day traders, none of them are rich. As you say there are certainly many stocks who you could apply this practice to. I dont even see having the cash up front as being a problem, its more just the guts.
I dont see pwtc as having a consistent enough volume to do this on a regular basis, at least not at this point in its life. You really would have to trade 50000 share minimum to make a go of it and the trades would have to be at the bid and ask. large volume is great but if most trades are in the middle, youre screwed. In the last month there were 9 days with volume below 100000, unlikely you would be able to buy or sell 50-100 thousand shares all yourself. And if you get caught selling/buying on more that one day, you get dinged by multiple commissions (at least I do). If hasher's outlook is correct, this thing will die off soon and you risk getting stuck with a load. @ $1200 profit a month (based on 100000 share trades), one would have to trade sucessfully 2 1/2 times first off to ensure that your 'play' money is covered in event of the company going bust (5 times if you go 50000 share at a time). There appear to be opprotunities to do it more than once a month but the volume is not consistent. One thing LB must do is be creative with his selling points so that it keeps the rest of the market off track.
I also have to keep in mind that if my trading pattern is too often, the government will brand me a 'trader' instead of an investor and I will lose all my tax breaks. I may decide to go that way one day but not right now.
Glad to see you actually did an exercise at one point. Many friends have asked me to teach them about the markets. The first thing I do is give them some 'homework' in the form of stocks to watch, and then report back to me. No one can be bothered to do the work. You really have to understand the way things work before you go out and blow a bundle on the latest hot tip. Ive been in the markets for 10 years now, have made lots and lost lots, but mostly just learned lessons.
Probably more lucky than astute. I just saw an opprotunity, threw up and order and got a hit. Cant say Ive heard of thet type of financing before. Why would they sell at such a low price? Could have got 30 or 40 cents I think.
I guess Im bored too. I did the math according to hashers post #6967. Even buying and selling 100000 shares at a time, monthly, between 2.5 and 3.5 (if one could hit those targets exactly every time), you could net about $1200 a month (CDN$, since thats where I am). Good work if you could get it. Would take me about 12 straight months of trading to get my initial investment back and from what ive heard im not in bad shape compared to some people. But Im not that brave so I guess Im in it for the long run (into the ground). I trust youve been hearing the sarchasm in my latest posts eh?
Let's hope so, I grabbed some more at .20. Now, off to the races? I dont see it dropping more than this. If it is a true stock promotion then the drop is to let the promoter (and friends) in at cheap prices. Hard to get volume history on this one to substanciate that. If it is a legit company and product, then the news will drive it.
There's the 2.5 cent mark. Buying time? But no takers? Only 1 trade and that at the ask. Hmm, what does it mean. LB and BW taking a pay cut today?