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thanks, maybe that's what they were talking about when the judge refused to pierce the corporate veil that shielded all those non banking subs from the BK cases. ..must be a lot of value that has built up since 2008 that hasn't made it our way yet. jmo
thanks..Happy Thanksgiving to you and all
wouldn't all of WMI's(holding company)assets be transferred to WMIH(the reorganized holding company now d/b/a COOP)? If so then COOP IS a monster and we haven't been told yet. This was a reorg, not a chapter 7 liquidation, where anything left over after paying ALL debts, goes to equity. yea or nay
...maybe that's where the 299billion the FDIC referenced in 2015 went to..
Does anyone know how many, if any, wamu originated mortgages were being serviced by Nationstar at the time of the BK filing and did they move to JPMC as part of what JPMC "bought"?
thanks for your well wishes
exactly; first you create NEW shares for a company who, admittedly, at the time, had no business, real business plan, or guidance going forward. Or did they? Completely flies in the face of logic, and then turns around and R/S the 3.5 billion NEW shares(dastardly). Usually a company will decrease its share count in order to attract new investors. Not so here because their intent was to screw us(legacy wamu shareholders) at all cost it seems. jmo
one problem is that wmih was awarded to us with zero guidance and no business plan. when there was a business plan, it almost immediately did a reverse split(unfair and unreasonable), which in turn resulted in a 12 times reduction in forward looking upside potential. I doubt you'll find ANYONE on this site who sees we are being treated fair and reasonable, or, for that matter ever have so far in this mess.
yeah, I remember being told F&R(a legal standard)and currently we are a far cry from that. We signed releases to participate in the settlement, not to be screwed by the very people who had to make a deal in order to keep from defending their actions in court. So, you think it's a conspiracy between the PIERS, the judge, and all other players that AREN'T the settling common shareholders, which will be the ONLY class that ends up UNFAIR & UNREASONABLE. Not buying it. JMO
No, you clearly read and decide how you're gonna digest it. Like I said, we can ALL believe we choose to believe, even you. I'm not really sure which "crew" you are alluding to, as I'm just me and not part of any "crew", what ever that means.
I'll "get over it", when it's over and right now, it's not over. YET.
If you're right, I'd expect, in short order, the filing of a huge class action lawsuit, with the vast majority of discovery already done. jmo
Nope, we ALL can believe what we wish based on what line we buy into. My contention is real simple; Where is the 299 billion of WAMU assets, with zero estimated expenses the FDIC referenced in a Quarterly report to their own BOSSES. Why is that so easy for you to immediately ignore? You may be right, I honestly don't know, but common sense tells me we did not settle for 0 return, and barring some incredible increase in COOP value, the awarded COOP shares are no where close to F&R. PIERS made a deal where they received a huge return even considering their apparently planned malfeasance. Before that deal(POR6) we were doomed to zero. Now, we're not...supposedly. If they had 299 billion in 2015, surely they still have at least 10 billion left, again, where'd it go? It's a fair question, and I don't think you have THE answer.jmo
..have I read the redactions? No, have you? If so, maybe acknowledge that you have access to what is hidden beneath the redactions and I'm all ears and eyes. Is that the case? You have INSIDE info, and know for positive, what all IS redacted?! If not, then you are no different than other prognosticators who have an opposite take from yours. we'll all see soon enough I reckon. jmo
if everyone goes home now, who will you have to try to bum out?
..so you're saying HM has the ability to read through and accurately, negatively, assess the redacted material.? kind of like the FDIC acknowledging 299 billion wamu assets in the 3rd quarter of 2015, and insisting all on his/her own, deciding it's not or never was really there. I submit that the information would not have shown up on an internal quarterly report to the board if it wasn't really there. particularly AFTER the majority of the creditor debt had been paid in 2014. … why would so much still be there in 2015?. but, they are the receiver, after all. jmo
I thought it was capped around 10.38/share or thereabout, but I received more than that overall. I guess it would depend on when they were acquired and at what price. I bought mine at the end when it looked like equity was gonna be left out of the GSA. ...then Nate Thoma and COLORABLE claims.
thanks
and your class 17 in the 3rd?
were the piers considered in the variable class?
the first one I think it was toward the end, I'd have to relook at it.
AZ, didn't you mention once that you hold class 17 holdings? I noticed they referenced class 17b in the filings, so how did you fare in that regard?
I'm in at the same pps as Willingham and for me to just break even at this point would require a coop share price of a bit over 30 bucks per share, so, knowing all we think we know, we're a good long way from either and or, fair and reasonable. jmo
...you mean another source like COOP or, the FDIC, who in 2015 acknowledged 299 billion in wamu assets? where did it go?
agreed
..well, the PIERS have already won and they were hybrid equity/creditor, but 3 1/2 times ROI and NOT having to defend your actions in court..priceless. would have been the sole winner if POR 6 had happened, and it didn't. jmo
So when the PAA b/t JPMC & FDIC completed in 2014, would that be a process where money changed hands, from JPMC to FDIC? If so, that would then coincide with the FDIC reporting to the board(their own board) in 2015 that they(fdic) had 299 billion(their words, not mine) AND zero estimated expenses(again, their words, not mine) to the fund.
I don't know how to ignore that. It's too significant to ignore. IMO
..I don't see ANY mention of Asset Backed Securities. A different class where it's not dependent on people faithfully keeping up with their mortgage payments.
Do you really think that an over century old financial institution, 6th largest banking operation in the US at the time, didn't have securitized capital in their Holding Company piggy bank, absolutely outside the jurisdiction of the bankruptcy. Come on, man.
..different world, market wasn't open to everybody, no debit cards(supplied by govt), just cash and what legitimate credit you had based on sound principles..your actual credit history.jmo
..good, decent guy at the right time in our history.jmo
...here is the operative part of that entire press release as it relates to us;
dude, if it was there in 2015, with "..zero expected expenses.." I reckon it's still there. It didn't go poof. So you figure that was just some error. It was a SPECIFIC FOOTNOTE, I expect to inform the intended consumers of the report. The point is, it is on the public record as being there 3 1/2 years after emergence from bankruptcy and just about, if not all creditors had already been paid. lastly, I wouldn't be trusting the word of some anonymous, unaccountable, government bureaucrat either. they tell you what they are told to tell you. FACT jmo
I think to some extent safe harbor are assets(subs, ALL non banking assets, etc.) on the "other" side of the corporate veil, which by the way rarely if ever gets pierced, due largely to the fact they are publicly traded companies, such as this one. ..and it wasn't pierced here either. jmo
oh yeah, did you get the link? or, did I get that from the wrong source?
right the unreleased FDIC web site is the wrong place to look for info! good one
you're welcome. that's an awful large number to not have an explanation for. if it were 299 million, then no big deal, but, 299 billion, particularly in that time frame, that's a big deal.
it was up to date when it was reported 4 years ago. where would it gone in the interim?
you seem to be pretty knowledgeable, why do you think the FDIC would still be reporting to their BOD 4 years after emergence from BK; "Excludes WAMU with total assets of $299 billion and zero estimated losses to the DIF"?
Thanks. I'm still trying to figure out why they(fdic)would have that statement "Excludes WAMU with total assets of $299 billion and zero estimated losses to the DIF" in their quarterly reports as late as late as 2015. Gotta admit it's a pretty definitive statement. This is a report to FDIC board. ...seems like most creditors would have been satisfied by then. Anyway, have a great day.
just wondering. from the wording in the report, it would seem that the wamu assets were segregated in FDIC quarterly reports. So when the FDIC gets released does that somehow find its way into our accounts?
Az, how do you predict the class specific escrow markers will be replaced by value? Also, can you think of any reason the FDIC as late as the 3rd quarter of 2015 would still be referencing 299bn in WAMU assets with zero estimated losses to the DIF.