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What do you predict as the fully diluted share count? The cd's were done at 793 million, that leaves the Series B's and C's.
wow, I would love to see what numbers you are using to say .003.
exactly, if they came out and said "Sales went down 200% this year" all the bashers would be saying "see this stock sucks!" but when sales are up, its a fluff PR
he doesn't have to mention it, the CD's were done at 793 million:
http://investorshub.advfn.com/boards/read_msg.asp?message_id=24780365
I have made decisions based off of less intel than that and been right. I've also made decisions based on more intel and been wrong. Either way, I won't feel bad about money being lost, far more important things than money are lost on a daily basis off of good faulty conclusions.
good post, one thing to add, in my honest opinion the dilutions were over at 793 million, see below post.
http://investorshub.advfn.com/boards/read_msg.asp?message_id=24780365
I definitely agree with you that we are accumulating. One of these days the 8k will come out, and the price will not come back down, not to these levels at least.
with the release of a positive hacketts 8k yes, without it I don't think so. Just my opinion.
all imo, not only is there no more dilution, I'm pretty sure it stayed at 793 million
http://investorshub.advfn.com/boards/read_msg.asp?message_id=24780365
here ya go, I broke it down on this post:
http://investorshub.advfn.com/boards/read_msg.asp?message_id=24782039
k, check it out. When the company was "bought" there were a number of assets that were "paid" for that really don't count, they just transfer over. If you had a balance of 1,000 dollars in your bank account and I paid for you $1,000 dollars for your "Account" we broke even. With that in mind:
CURRENT ASSETS: ............................................. (audited) (audited)
Cash and Cash Equivalents ................................. $ 678,608
Accounts Receivable ....................................... 38,124
Inventories ............................................... 1,817,653
Marketable Securities - Available for Sale ................ 1,934,373
Prepaid Expenses .......................................... 18,814
Deferred Taxes ............................................ 5,300
Refundable Income Tax ..................................... 86,685 0
----------- -----------
Total Current Assets .................................... $ 4,579,557
minus liabilities
CURRENT LIABILITIES:
Accounts Payable .......................................... $ 891,916
Accrued Liabilities ....................................... 118,822
Income Taxes Payable ...................................... 0 273
Current Portion of Long-Term Debt ......................... 211,132
----------- -----------
Total Current Liabilities ............................... $ 1,221,870
----------- -----------
OTHER LIABILITIES:
Long-Term Debt ............................................ $ 722,593
8% Debenture Issued to Stockholder ........................ 520,071
Deferred Tax Liability .................................... 251,397
----------- -----------
Total Other Liabilities ................................. $ 1,494,061
Now, take this assets difference.
4,579,557(hard assets) - 1,494,061 (hard liabilities)= 3,085,496
take this number and add it to what he expected to pay 3,700,000= 6,785,496.
You see, he "paid" that much, but a good portion was just a transfer on books, we received 3,085,496 in hard assets, his numbers all add up, no misleading.
I'm pretty sure we are done with dilution at this point.
http://investorshub.advfn.com/boards/read_msg.asp?message_id=24780365
IMO educated guesses are impossible until the release of the 8k. Thoughts?? well that has so many factors, pr no pr, dilution, i don't think any is left but you never know. with no pr or 8k I would expect the price to settle around .02, I think it will climb there without any dilution or pr and stay until something changes.
yeah, im in the southeast corner of arizona, about 3 1/2 hours away from phoeniz.
Check my earlier post, I'm pretty sure dilution was over at 793 million.
http://investorshub.advfn.com/boards/read_msg.asp?message_id=24780365
my theory, it makes me happy.
http://investorshub.advfn.com/boards/read_msg.asp?message_id=24780365
he owned half, he paid for the other half for the merger. What he does with this money has nothing to do with what we are talking about. You say he lied and told us the company was worth just under 4 million, I'm saying no, he said he is going to pay just under 4 million, he doesnt half to pay for the half he owned at the time. Show me where he stated the company's entire worth was 3.7 million, it doesn't say that in the july 13th release, it says what he was planning to pay to acquire it, two different things.
anytime gail, my troopies get back tonight from pass, so yeah that kills my study time til xmas lol.
I believe we are done with the CD's:
http://investorshub.advfn.com/boards/read_msg.asp?message_id=24780365
O.K., I won't debate the whole KK wife thing, thats jacked up and the good ol boy network paid out good for them. But as for the wisebuys deal, we didnt pay twice as much as agreed, TS owned half already, he isn't going to pay them for his half, which is why we paid only half, for the part that other people owned.
I have spent alot of time reading, and talking to some people in private messages to make sure my math is correct before posting this. This is all my opinion, but I believe the CD deal is completely done and here is why. The first part explains why they are done, the second part explains why so few were left.
1) From the 10QSB "While the debentures are subject to restrictions on conversion, upon default the holders of the debentures could convert such debentures into approximately 43,975,391 shares based on the market price on September 30, 2007. Such issuances would reduce the percentage of ownership of our existing common stockholders and could, among other things, depress the price of our common stock. This result could detrimentally affect our ability to raise additional
equity capital. In addition, the sale of these additional shares of common stock may cause the market price of our stock to decrease.
The price on 30Sep07 was .031. meaning they were paying off the equivalent of $1,363,237. $1,363,237/.031=43,975,391 (I can't speculate on conversion ratios, I am sure they converted at a discount and it was a smaller amount, but for the simplicity in the math involved we will go with straight conversion.) The dilution that took place on 16Nov07 was 61,885,554. The price on 16Nov07 was .022. 1,363,237/.022=61,965,318. A difference of 100,000 is close enough when dealing with tenths/hundreths of a penny for conversion rates.
How did we get this low on CD's?
2) From the 10QSB "On September 18, 2007, the Hacketts Merger Agreement was amended (the "Stock Purchase Agreement Amendment") to reduce the up-front payment to $1,500,000 and to add an additional future payment of $500,000 due at month fifteen. In addition as part of the closing the Company repaid in full a loan of approximately $494,000. This transaction closed on November 7, 2007."
One of three things happened here.
a) TS paid off a loan that the company owed, one that would have transeffered with the company.
b) TS at the last second on 07Nov07 said sure, I'll pay you $494,000 extra for your company, even though we have been talking $6,000,000 this entire time.
c) Hacketts guys noticed that crappy conversion rate rate and said heck no, pay that off somehow/someway or restructure the conversion rate before we come over.
I think it is option number C. Regardless, we know that TS's accountants computed 43 million of O/S left based on the 30Sep07 rate, we know that number matches the 16Nov07 rate almost perfectly. We have alot of smart people on this board that did alot of number crunching after the 10Q was released on 14Nov07. We have know idea of what transactions happened after 30Sep07 that they didn't need to know about. TS doesn't have to tell us until the next 10Q that the debt was restructured/paid off, he did however hint to that fact with a statement of how many O/S shares were left. Why would he do this? Who knows, maybe he wants his friends to be able to load up while they can.
BTW, this also explains the reverse trend without news, no more shares being spilt into the marketplace.
I stated it poorly, what I meant is that a Reverse or forward split/dilution by other parties do not effect the conversion formula. meaning it is worth 3.3 million worth of common whether there are 1 million O/S or 1 billion O/S.
hes saying that 721,800 series C shares are worth 3.3 million dollars not common shares. i.e. 3.3 million dollars divided by share price equals number of common to convert to.
721,800 * 4.70 (price per share of preferred C)=$3,392,460
you then take this amount divided by pps for number of shares it can dilute, see it's variable not fixed.
3,392,460/.015 todays value=226,164,000 shares or
3,392,460/1 (some day if its worth a dollar)=3,392,460 shares
but, this conversion is fixed in the fact that dilution doesnt affect it since they are preferred.
It's all good, they won't convert imo, and I think the CD's are done based on my earlier post, have a look at it if you would, check my math and theory, you seem really good with numbers.
http://investorshub.advfn.com/boards/read_msg.asp?message_id=24773713
OT; Don't hate us sidewalk drills lol, I have a 1:90 ratio right now lol, that means 90 veterans day passes, 90 thanksgiving passes, and 90 xmas leave forms lmao. Lets not forget the LES's, risk assessments, and itineraries that have to accompany each one!
My take on the CD's, why I think they are done.
Regardless of the math that myself or that other people have done which is extraordinary, after a day of being the Drill Sergeant on duty over a holiday and having alot of time to read through the 10QSB here are the highlights:
While the debentures are subject to restrictions on conversion, upon default the holders of the debentures could convert such debentures into approximately 43,975,391 shares based on the market price on September 30, 2007. Such issuances would reduce the percentage of ownership of our existing common
stockholders and could, among other things, depress the price of our common stock. This result could detrimentally affect our ability to raise additional equity capital. In addition, the sale of these additional shares of common stock may cause the market price of our stock to decrease.
The price on 30Sep07 was .031 a share. If you calculate the CD's converted on 16NOV07 the price was .022 a share which would change the numbers converted from 43,975,391 predicted on 30sep07 to almost 62,000,000 shares added. Regardless of all of the unconverted .001 and everything else, the accountants filing the 10QSB knew all of the numbers. After they crunched the numbers they came out with the above 43,975,391 left to be converted at the 30SEP07 rate, if you take it down to the 16NOV07 rate(the day they were converted) accounts for 100% of the remaining debentures.
Alabama here, so it may be a race lol. It's just so close to the remaining amount of the legacy debt, it would be really nice if it was.
Someone smarter than me help me out on this one. Did anyone ever figure out which loan SWVC paid off as part of the agreement of the Hackett's merger? Quote from note 9 10QSB:
In addition as part of the closing the Company repaid in full a loan of approximately $494,000. This transaction closed on November 7, 2007.
I may be hoping for a CD pay-off, that would be too good to be true, but its the only loan that I can think of that still existed on November 7, 2007.
It could be this, we know the highgate portion was paid off and these were all CD's:
On July 1, 2007, Seaway Capital, Inc. acquired GreenShift's entire controlling stake in GS Carbon Corporation in return for the assumption of $498,074 legacy debt and $1,117,719 Highgate debt.
appreciate it, I'm new at this. I just enjoy wasting hours of my life I will never get back to try to understand it :). If it ever pays off it will all be worth it, thanks bud.
No its not done, it was a requirement for the 8-k which he originally thought was due 4 days after the close. When his lawyer told him that it was due 70 days instead of 4(its actually 75 days, thanks Xeller8 for that info) he went ahead and completed the merger, the audit will be complete before the 8-k is released.
Your numbers actually sound pretty good. Don't forget the biggest possible jump, the audit. TS has already said their expansion plans will be based off of the Hackett's model, depending on how high the earnings are from the audit, that will set our new market cap.
I like this part:
As part of the WiseBuys transaction, the Company also now controls the Seaway Valley Fund, LLC (the “Fund”), which generated net earnings of approximately $2.0 million and $1.2 million in 2006 and 2007, respectively. The Fund, which was formed in July 2003, buys and sells securities of primarily publicly traded companies. We expect to continue the activities of the Fund and may seek to raise additional capital into the Fund through an offering of limited partnership interests in 2008.
We are a publicly traded company, that would be awesome if we SVF (which TS owns) bought the shares. TS would have basically taken a loan from himself, alot better for capital then lets say, Cornell, good move TS.
I may jinx my lucky guess from 18 NOV 07 but:
http://investorshub.advfn.com/boards/read_msg.asp?message_id=24638905
I'm not sure, I think so, but I don't trade enough to come close to it.
Banc of America Investments, if you have over $25,000 in your checking/savings account online trades are free.
he means ihub jail lol. If you post stuff your not suppose to, i.e. personal attacks, they put you in "jail" for a specified amount of time, meaning you can only post on the jail board.
but they need to do it after dropping to .01 so my order can get filled, the wife changed the password on the online services, but I found out I could still place an order via phone :).
darn you and your research, can't you just read the board like everybody else and take their word for it and get my mad when someone else's research is wrong lmao. Kudo's, I don't feel too bad though if TS was wrong as well. :)
YEAH BABY!!!! 70 days Xeller!! haha j/k lucky guess on my part, no way I was going to search through all of the old emails, thanks AP.
go through some of my previous posts, they have future pps calculations and calculations with my predictions of the CD. They may be wrong, but I tried, picked the 10q apart for quite awhile and Dr. Graham ended with similar results. The future pps calculations have two main variables that can make them change drastically, the multiplier and the net income.