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I think Titans value increases with each milestone. I've heard Aidan Petrie of Ximedica refer to it as value jumps in the eyes of venture groups. I think TItan could sell this tommorow if they wanted. I think their would be a buyer for it. I don't think we'd be thrilled with the buyout price but I think they could do it. With each milestone, comes much greater value. I don't think we will see a 30-50X pps multiple but I think they will look to get up listed and then run it up to maybe $6 per share and sell around CE mark. At that point I think they will get a great value for it. A question I have for those more knowledgeable, if J and J/Medtronics, is really chomping at the bit to get into robotics and have done their due diligence with SPORT and ximedica, could they be more interested in acquiring SPORT prior to FDA submission with the thought that they could manage this process better?
Afterall, they have extensive experience and deep relationships with the FDA I would assume? Disclaimer: all of this is speculation. I have no idea what I'm talking about but it's fun to throw some of these ideas around. The great thing about this upcoming meeting is Ill be shocked if it's not "discussion worthy" one way or another. I personally think it's time to show Sport. They need to. Think about it, in probably 3-4 mos they will start training doctors on it if they haven't already. How much longer does it make sense to keep the cat in the bag?
You are probably right. However, the only way that would be acceptable is if they bring something big to the table such as revealing the robot, intent to uplist within a certain time frame, etc. That's why I like those questions. For me, even a non answer would be telling. They need more money. If they wont answer either of those two questions they have to know that would really hurt investor sentiment at this point and share price would be negatively affected, imo. Unless they couple that with some big news. I'm sure they are planning for this going into the meeting.
So it's your opinion. Thanks for clarifying that. I think you make an interesting point. One of the reasons that I'm invested in Titan is because I see it as an acquisition that will command way more money than it probably should. The reason that I believe that is because they are in a swiftly growing massive market with little competition currently. This market will be changing significantly over the next 5-10 years and as long as Titan has a heartbeat and viable product they should do quite well. There are major money players that HAVE to get a piece of this market. JNJ, Medtronic, Stryker to name a few. In addition, because of what it represents and changes in healthcare we are starting to see major tech companies (Google, Samsung) lining up to take their shot as well. Hospitals are moving to fewer, much larger health systems to increase their purchasing power. In order to adjust the Medtronics of the world are trying to be the one stop shop so to speak. Obviously none of them will fully get there but they can get pretty darn close. In order to do this you have to be a major player in the OR. Moving forward I fully believe you won't be a major player in the OR without a Robotics platform. Titan could be the right company at the right time......or so I really hope.
To ORreps point, I think they will look to get uplisted and get the price up some prior to selling. It makes it easier for these behemouth companies to justify spending in the billions of dollars. All imo.
Spider system, not trying to start anything. Just saying.
Why do you think that? Just your gut? Or have you heard some scuttlebutt?
What are your must have answered questions at the meeting? Unfortunately, I can't make it but thinking out loud they would be:
1. Based on the burn rate posted on the corporate presentation, you should be out of money by the end of the year. Is this the case? How would you plan to raise more money provided your timeline takes you to mid 2017?
2. Who is the Supplier of single use instrument designed to be used with SPORT that you just recently press released? If they don't answer, why would you not share this?
3. When will the SAIL training center begin training people?
4. Have any locations globally been identified as centers where intial trials will take place?
5. Has Titan considered acquiring any companies or IP to compliment their SPORT platform?
6. Have any acquisition attempts been made for TItan? (Just to see reaction to this one)
Any others that you would like to have answered?
I don't think they will state they are ahead of schedule at the meeting. I think they will show some type of video at the meeting. I think it will be another live procedure video but this time I think they will show a split screen at some point showing inside the patient and also a glimpse of the robot and console with Fowler working at it. I think it will be very strategic as to how much they show and what angles but I think they will give a peek. I do believe they are ahead of schedule but don't think it will be stated. I suspect we will start hearing some rumor mill stuff about placement of robots by the end of summer and I think Sept/October they will announce fully built units have been placed in multiple centers for trial. I also feel they probably already have one at SAIL.
Good point IITF about accurate tweets, etc. There was no mention of Titan in the chat. Only loose criteria of what they are looking for in an acquisition. Still encouraging nonetheless!
What costs are too high? Cost of robot acquisition or cost of development?
I read through the Medtronic transcript as well. 7 million in free cash flow. Would like to avoid dilution of shareholders equities. And this from the CEO:
We continue to focus on executing on our three growth strategies: Therapy innovation, globalization and economic value.
Said, paraphrasing of course, that any mergers/acquisitions would satisfy at least one of these strategies. If it's 2 or all, even better. I think Titan would satisfy all 3 strategies.
I agree with you. I work in Philly area hospitals and there are people talking about and investing in it.
I confirmed that it it Microline and they are definitely WORLDWIDE. I agree that it is good to have a prestigious company such as these guys making products for titan. Keep this on the down low but a buddy of mine got some video of the presentation they gave to the Titan team.
That being said would you consider Microline to be 1st class? From the little bit(and this is a big qualifier) that I read that doesn't appear to be the case and would worry me a little bit. I think you lay out a very good point. it will be interesting to find out who this is. Has anyone emailed titan and asked the question? I would but no one ever gets back to me.
Thanks Scalpel. I appreciate the feedback. I wonder if Titan is going the reposable route or strictly one time use disposables and what the cost implications of this would be? Might be a brilliant idea as it could be a major revenue generator with infection control being so important.
Your point about not mentioning the partner because of fears that it mighty allow a potential buyer of Microline access to Titans IP is interesting. However, I don't know how much IP that they would be able to gather from this versus the patents that are already public. Also, I would hope the partnership would be established in a way that Titan would be protected in the event of a buyout. All that being said, you might be right.
If they go with a Microline instead of something that might be viewed as more strategic by partnering with an Ethicon or Covidien, why would they do this versus have Ximedica who has worked on design/development of Sport develop these "custom" instruments? The only answer I can come up with is speed to market. Perhaps Ximedica is overextended in the build of the prototypes and doesn't want to slow down the project by putting resources to the development Of the custom instruments? Any thoughts regarding this? I know it's hypothetical and really might be a waste of time but all we can do is speculate when they don't tell us who the worldwide supplier is. Speaking of that, if it is Microline, why not just announce it?
Questions for the surgeons and device reps - I noticed a couple things in the investor presentation relating to the recent news. I noticed under recurring revenue(page 8) it has sale of single use instruments listed. Then under page 10 under their tier strategy it lists Instrument development as the first step under tier 1. These are the curved dissector, hook cautery, needle driver and atraumatic forcep end effectors that are reusable. The last step in the development of sport if (Tier 3, last step) is Custom Instruments which is what they are referring to in their press release. Could be Microline, Ethicon, Applied and many others. I was under the impression that robotic surgery was mostly reusable. Is that not the case? Can you perform the majority of your surgerys with the reusable instrument end effectors listed above? Do you or have you used single use instruments in robotics? How often and what types of procedures? In your opinion, if they don't have these custom instruments available could they still bring sport into the trial phase without these single use tools? Does Intuitive have single use tools that you are currently utilizing?
Talk about a management team letting it's investors down
So true. It's all right there for you if you are able to open your eyes. All key players speaking the same language (Petrie/Hargrove/JJDC). I'm amazed that their are some people feel that Hargrove, etc. are incompetent. These are pretty intelligent guys. Although it can be frustrating, there is a reason that they aren't sending out press releases to artificially pump the stock. They also know how much cash they have on hand and how much it's gonna cost. Pretty sure they have all the money they need to accomplish their goals. Might they do another cash raise? Maybe. But I've seen enough to believe they have an end game in mind. The problem for investors, do you really want to be on the sidelines when they show this thing, start placing them in hospitals, or when the the "tech investors" start getting wind about the size of this market and Titans place in it? The stakes are high for all parties involved(j&j, Medtronic/Covidien, Intuitive, Stryker, Google,Samsung) and titan might hold all the cards. I believe, if they play their cards right, a bidding war will ensue and it will shock everyone. Maybe even suckitup. Haha. Is their potential for failure? Absolutely! But with each step starting with prototype feasability the risk diminishes. The biggest mistake Titan could make is if they take their eye off the development of Sport ball. Execute on design, put it in front of doctors like Daktari, Golf Pro, JUrology, Scalpel, let them drool and then sit back and let all the key players fight it out. All my opinion of course.
They have to be going. If not in an official capacity, I'm sure they will be at it. I could see a behind the scenes peak for certain doctors and/or investors. I didn't think an exhibitor list was out for this years yet. I will keep an eye out. I think the MedTech conference is coming up in May. That's another one we should keep an eye on. Any others?
Good point. Is their any chance that the big reveal comes at the SAGES conference?
Ignore Feature - I wanted to highlight a feature of every board. There is an ignore member feature that you can use. It's very helpful. You just click on the members name and click on Ignore on the left hand side. If you have a change of heart you can always click off of the ignore feature. It can come in handy and will likely make your reading more enjoyable if you don't like what a certain poster has to say.
they don't have to worry about anything but executing on the robot everything else will take care of itself in short order. If you don't believe than I've got some electornic cigarettes that I'll sell you.
Also to your point, JUNE 2014 Joe Talarico, VP of New Business Development resigns. Interesting timeline for sure and read the JJDC website. Check out the Verbiage they use regarding investment decisions and who they invest in. Great find IITF btw.
Keep in mind, in their investor Conf call, I believe it was the CEO of J & J who stated something to the effect that it was their goal to identify company's early in the game where they would be able to spend less. This would allow them to make more acquisition and increasing their chances of hitting on something. Totally paraphrasing, btw. This would jive with OR Rep saying they buy companies and then screw them up. Maybe they are looking at another way of doing acquisitions that could ultimately benefit titan.
Adrock- thanks for sharing. First of all, can't believe I'm saying this but I think LTG is absolutely right. This is great news for all involved. Legitimizes our investment even more. When big tech wants into a market they bring huge money with them and they have to see a huge opportunity. Look at what these guys pay for some of the apps that they acquire that won't equal a quarter of the revenue Sport will generate one day. I did a patent search for Robots and Samsung has a ton of patents. So now you have Samsung and Google. Who's next, Apple maybe? I know the Samsung stuff has been poopooed in the past but I just see it as another potential investor with deep pockets. Where I disagree with LTG is Ethicon being out. I could see now more than ever them acquiring Titan. It might accelerate them and Google becoming players in the Robotics market. It gets them in the game. Consider this? Why does Ethicon partner up with a Google? They are a monster in surgery/healthcare and they bring in a relative novice to help. Why do you think this is? I think they see a huge opportunity and they understand that the climate is changing. I found it interesting that Aidan Petrie of Ximedica has spent a lot of time both at CES and lecturing on tech sector getting into healthcare. What does Covidien do now? They have to have an answer. Execute on development, get it close to market and let the bidding begin.
If I had to guess Rocko Taco and Katalyst89 tried to insert themselves onto the board of directors and Titan responded with this. I also think they probably used their member board names instead of their real names when they sent the letter.
Wait till you see how quickly Ximedica executes compared to the Operations/Regulatory people of that other company who's building the dust collector. We are now in a period where you will see a huge difference in execution.
Lefty used the analogy that this milestone was like the first domino falling and I couldn't agree more. I am really pumped and feel like this is the start of some meaningful progress. I don't want to jinx things but feel that communication might happen a little more frequently now as moving forward it will become more and more difficult to keep certain aspects of the sport secret. For people smarter than me(probably most of the board members), what are the next steps? I'd love to see a press release explaining that in a little more detail in the coming weeks. I think I'll send Hargrove a message asking for that. Can't hurt. If I understand it correctly now we build multiple prototypes for for feasability testing in humans? I assume they will use some in gyno, uro, general etc? Any idea how many prototypes they will build? I would think this will give them a basis for planning how they would want to approach human clinical trials? I also think this will help in planning downstream mass manufacturing planning through Ximedica. I think it's a huge positive that Ximedica is going to be the manufacturer. They see this project everyday and it had to be a huge commitment to take on manufacturing responsibilities. I'm sure you don't just start building a surgical robot just like it's any other medical device. They had to put enormous resources in place to take that on. It's another big reason I feel confident about Titan. Ximedica must see enourmous upside potential and I'll be so does Paul Laviolette and his group.
Fellas, it looks like the Jester showed up today to entertain us. 8 PRs since November and the stock is down 26%. It looks like despite all that "communication" somebody(all that smart money) is questioning their investment. Now carry on and continue to make us all laugh asshat.
Honeycomb/none65 please no pumping of other stocks on this board. I removed your posts because it's a Titan board. I think that occasionally, when things are slow, that it's not out of the question to suggest some other stocks if board members are ok with it and it's presented in the right way. However, to just show up on the board is blatant pumping and off topic.
If it's better technology charge more. Apple made a decision a couple years ago that theirs was a premium brand to the Samsungs of the world and that they wouldn't lower their prices in order to better compete with lower cost phones. It was a great move. obviously, not for us consumers but a good business decision. Please note this isn't meant to be an argument for the iPhone over Samsung or the other droid platforms.(I understand that people are passionate on both sides of this). Just an example. Every dollar counts. Better to be a little high and have the ability to pull back if the market isn't having it.
This is something I'm in complete agreement with. Land this milestone everything else will, in all likelihood, fall in place. Don't and then uh oh. I'm not an engineer but I would think user interface and finishing the console are not small steps that come together within a months time, neither is infection prevention measures. Wouldn't these things need to be in place to demonstrate prototype feasibility?
Point of Return - what is your take on the way this has played out? Did you forsee any of this based off your conversations with Hargrove and Fowler? Your last article indicated they saw the need for more transparency in regards to shareholders. Its disappointing but when I try to understand the philosophy of management I have to think this is more than incompetency. It is too consistent to be just incompetency, especially with how much the disappointment has been communicated to them from investors. We would all love to know their true reasons. Here's to hoping that it's the right approach for great reasons. It definitely makes it very hard to be a long shareholder when hope is what your working off of. Still Long and Strong.
Honestly guy. We are DONE discussing the other company. Do you honestly believe everything you read? Go pick 10-15 surgeons and talk to them and don't trust the company. I've seen many companies try to force feed "data" to justify a product. It's usually done very late in the game when questions persist. Sound familiar? TRXC is a company/product very easy for me to understand. Believe me, when I say this, most other companies aren't as clear to me. They are clearly a company that is 5 years too late introducing this product. If they would have had it 5 years earlier it might have been widely used but surgeons are looking for more now. This isn't evolving technology but a (I guess) cool twist on existing technology. The only problem with that is hospital arent paying for neat-to-haves anymore.
One other thing, I will not let these nonsense conversations about your dust collector happen on the Titan board anymore. We've given you a lot of latitude but as I said before it's getting old.
Nice Ski Trip
Wow. Is this the best they can deliver in terms of news? These guys are unbelievable. 3 months after they drop a bomb on us this is the first public communication with shareholders? First of all, nice find IITF. Guy is a machine. Secondly, I hope they actually have something solid tomorrow. I'm long and trying to be strong. I love the technology, Fowler, and Ximedica but everything else leaves me scratching my head a little bit.
The funny thing is they just went short on a PFIC.....looks like jokes on them.
Nice day today. Finally something to talk about. Here's to hoping we start to see much greater volume and a good surprise. Eagerly awaiting the feb 12th financials and MD&A and the news that Flenderson has alluded to based off his conversations with Randall. Long and Strong!
Longterm... I've warned you in the past and now I've had to come down on you. I've removed your post because we aren't talking about that other company on this board. The pumping will not be tolerated. This is a good time for Titan discussion to take place. I won't have it interrupted by the bickering that will take place because of your off topic comments. Feel free to talk about Titan but you know where the line is.
Sounds like Feb. 12th will be the date or sometime around there.
Thanks for sharing. Makes total sense IMO.